China Coronavirus

[Angelo]

Life can be very long, short is 38, the age a very good club mate of mine that died recently. Angelo, you are full of shit and a reincarnation of the WUM's we've had on here for years

The narrative of what you said is that its ok for people who are young, fit and healthy to die providing its not from Covid?

There are huge negative consequences of lockdowns and restrictions, we saw rises in cases of domestic violence during the first lockdown, mental health issues are almost certain to become a bigger issue with it, the economic issues it brings, the threat to people's livelihoods, jobs, ability to provide for their families, the social isolation people who live alone or elderly people feel.

At what point do we focus on the above? At what point do we look at the latest data and trends being reported on covid, a plumetting fatality, rate, the underlying health conditions the vast majority of people who die from it have, the median and mean age of those who die and what their life expectancy would be.

Some of you are so entrenched into your thinking that you are completely unwilling to look at the big picture?

I could be petty like you and say that you guys are happy to see domestic violence and suicide rise because of what you are are advocating.

[Milltown Row2]

Sid do you believe the rising cases is down to the GAA? If you do then you can be put in the same bracket as Poots, if on the other hand you believe it's not helped the rise of cases alongside wet bars being opened, colleges reopened schools reopened other close contact services reopened then you are not the same as Poots.

All these factors, and forgetting what's happening across the world, the North's rise in case is down to the general public being complacent and not following simple guidelines.

The reason it spreads is because people are not social distancing they are not using sanitizer or washing hands. Even ones that have been in known contact with someone who's been positive haven't isolated!

I was at club games in Antrim and what happened at the pitch and after the games was brilliant, what happened after they left the pitch becomes an individual decision to break the rules, the pubs that allowed it to happen broke the rules. If there was rule breaks at the ground then yes blame that county board, there are 32 county boards, how many broke guidelines?

The GAA is undoubtedly a contributor to increased spread

It helped to spread complacency in society as a whole, and that came right from the top and spread downwards through the organisation

In a similar way to how the Clifden golf jolly generated such anger - and rightly so - because it showed that people with high profile positions in politics and the judiciary believed there was one rule for them and one rule for others, the GAA, the most important civil society organisation in the country, cocked a snook at the regulations in a very public and high handed way

The GAA has a position of immense influence and authority in Irish society, a unique position actually, it permeates every parish in the country, one might say it is the glue that holds Irish society together

Therefore it had a special responsibility to publicly adhere to restrictions and be seen to fully behind them

It didn't do that, it took the piss

For the GAA, there was one rule for it and another for everybody else - and now, anybody who criticises the GAA is apparently Edwin Poots

Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel and all that

Again, if we are still in this situation next year, there should be no club championships, no formal club competitions, no trophies, no more opportunities for more superspreading events

Just a series of non-competitive matches to keep fit and have a bit of fun, like Go Games

Just another rant, ok Poots

Good riposte

If you're going continually GAA bash without acknowledging all the other factors I brought up then you are no better than Poots

[sid waddell]

Sid do you believe the rising cases is down to the GAA? If you do then you can be put in the same bracket as Poots, if on the other hand you believe it's not helped the rise of cases alongside wet bars being opened, colleges reopened schools reopened other close contact services reopened then you are not the same as Poots.

All these factors, and forgetting what's happening across the world, the North's rise in case is down to the general public being complacent and not following simple guidelines.

The reason it spreads is because people are not social distancing they are not using sanitizer or washing hands. Even ones that have been in known contact with someone who's been positive haven't isolated!

I was at club games in Antrim and what happened at the pitch and after the games was brilliant, what happened after they left the pitch becomes an individual decision to break the rules, the pubs that allowed it to happen broke the rules. If there was rule breaks at the ground then yes blame that county board, there are 32 county boards, how many broke guidelines?

The GAA is undoubtedly a contributor to increased spread

It helped to spread complacency in society as a whole, and that came right from the top and spread downwards through the organisation

In a similar way to how the Clifden golf jolly generated such anger - and rightly so - because it showed that people with high profile positions in politics and the judiciary believed there was one rule for them and one rule for others, the GAA, the most important civil society organisation in the country, cocked a snook at the regulations in a very public and high handed way

The GAA has a position of immense influence and authority in Irish society, a unique position actually, it permeates every parish in the country, one might say it is the glue that holds Irish society together

Therefore it had a special responsibility to publicly adhere to restrictions and be seen to fully behind them

It didn't do that, it took the piss

For the GAA, there was one rule for it and another for everybody else - and now, anybody who criticises the GAA is apparently Edwin Poots

Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel and all that

Again, if we are still in this situation next year, there should be no club championships, no formal club competitions, no trophies, no more opportunities for more superspreading events

Just a series of non-competitive matches to keep fit and have a bit of fun, like Go Games

Just another rant, ok Poots

Good riposte

If you're going continually GAA bash without acknowledging all the other factors I brought up then you are no better than Poots

Again you're just proving my point, arguing against a straw man and refusing to engage in good faith

It seems there is unfortunately a sizable enough cohort in the GAA who will brook no internal dissent over this and just close  ranks and frame any dissent as an attack on their identity

Everybody who dissents is now Edwin Poots

Ludicrous stuff - and sadly the wider world political context has fed into this identity based paranoia complex

[PadraicHenryPearse]

Life can be very long, short is 38, the age a very good club mate of mine that died recently. Angelo, you are full of shit and a reincarnation of the WUM's we've had on here for years

The narrative of what you said is that its ok for people who are young, fit and healthy to die providing its not from Covid?

There are huge negative consequences of lockdowns and restrictions, we saw rises in cases of domestic violence during the first lockdown, mental health issues are almost certain to become a bigger issue with it, the economic issues it brings, the threat to people's livelihoods, jobs, ability to provide for their families, the social isolation people who live alone or elderly people feel.

At what point do we focus on the above? At what point do we look at the latest data and trends being reported on covid, a plumetting fatality, rate, the underlying health conditions the vast majority of people who die from it have, the median and mean age of those who die and what their life expectancy would be.

Some of you are so entrenched into your thinking that you are completely unwilling to look at the big picture?

I could be petty like you and say that you guys are happy to see domestic violence and suicide rise because of what you are are advocating.

you have provided no alternative that does not lead to the same or similar issues, all you provided was the unrealistic hope that people adhere to the guidance which it is clear they have not and therefore will not do.

you keep repeating the same questions over and over again without saying how any alternative you are suggesting would address them.

no one is saying there are no socio-economic challenges with lockdowns, i dont think anyone wants a lockdown but in the absence of a credible alternative which you havent provided most people see it as neccessary.

how we stop the same thing happening after these restrictions/lockdown is what needs to be dentified. I dont k ow what they are though. i hope a gradual opening of the socio-economic enviroment and adherance to guidance would work but it clearly hasnt.

[Angelo]

Life can be very long, short is 38, the age a very good club mate of mine that died recently. Angelo, you are full of shit and a reincarnation of the WUM's we've had on here for years

The narrative of what you said is that its ok for people who are young, fit and healthy to die providing its not from Covid?

There are huge negative consequences of lockdowns and restrictions, we saw rises in cases of domestic violence during the first lockdown, mental health issues are almost certain to become a bigger issue with it, the economic issues it brings, the threat to people's livelihoods, jobs, ability to provide for their families, the social isolation people who live alone or elderly people feel.

At what point do we focus on the above? At what point do we look at the latest data and trends being reported on covid, a plumetting fatality, rate, the underlying health conditions the vast majority of people who die from it have, the median and mean age of those who die and what their life expectancy would be.

Some of you are so entrenched into your thinking that you are completely unwilling to look at the big picture?

I could be petty like you and say that you guys are happy to see domestic violence and suicide rise because of what you are are advocating.

you have provided no alternative that does not lead to the same or similar issues, all you provided was the unrealistic hope that people adhere to the guidance which it is clear they have not and therefore will not do.

you keep repeating the same questions over and over again without saying how any alternative you are suggesting would address them.

no one is saying there are no socio-economic challenges with lockdowns, i dont think anyone wants a lockdown but in the absence of a credible alternative which you havent provided most people see it as neccessary.

how we stop the same thing happening after these restrictions/lockdown is what needs to be dentified. I dont k ow what they are though. i hope a gradual opening of the socio-economic enviroment and adherance to guidance would work but it clearly hasnt.

Neither have you.

The same negative economic and societal issues will return now during lockdown and will probably return a worse effect.

It's a trade off, the fatality of the virus has plummeted at double digit multiples. It is my view that the impacts of lockdown and excessive restrictions will have more negative consequences than what we had in place prior to this second wave on society as a whole.

There's a reason why a large group of people aren't complying now, they don't fear the virus. The first wave had resonance because we saw the images from Lombardy and Madrid, people had a genuine fear that this could shoot fit and healthy people down. The data tends to point at this risk being remote, probably as remote as the flu which we live with every single winter.

[Captain Obvious]

If we are still in this situation next year, there should be no club championships, no formal club competitions, no trophies, no more opportunities for more superspreading events

Just a series of non-competitive matches to keep fit and have a bit of fun, like Go Games

Club games without the competitive edge are a waste of time. Players can keep fit training and in the gym. In a situation like like many will be taking up other sports and won't be coming back to GAA when it returns to competitive action.

Why would they be a waste of time?

It's often said that club players just want to play, and the over emphasis on competition is frequently lamented on here

Playing non-competitive football is far more enjoyable than going to the gym

In fact it's often been said that the ultra-competitive nature of GAA games leads to a smaller playing population than there could or should be

This was the motivating factor behind the "Recreational GAA" idea some years ago which I think Diarmuid Marsden was involved in formulating

The strength of grass roots soccer is that there is a level for everybody

That isn't really the case in GAA

The competitive edge is what makes the game that it is and what players enjoy most about this sport.

Every match at any level creates its own competitive dynamic

Training even has its own competitive dynamic

The GAA prides itself as a community organisation

Now it seems to want its cake and eat it

The right to keep creating superspreading events is not the most valuable feature of the GAA

The most valuable feature is the keeping fit, playing a bit of ball, and having fun, and community

That's what it's supposed to be anyway

Our definition of what community is has now had to change due to the unforeseen circumstances brought about by a pandemic

Yet now it appears the right to hold superspreading events during a pandemic is the most important thing as far as some people are concerned

The "we are not for turning, never, never, never" mantra

The organised competition competitive edge is what leads to those superspreading events

That's fundamentally anti-community and individualist

And being anti-community and individualist was never my understanding of what the GAA was supposed to be about

Not every match, challenge games there is many examples of players minding themselves for the more important games ahead. Training only steps up when the real competitive action is around the corner.

Little or no known spread of this virus from playing matches outdoors. It's well known that the virus is a super spreader in a crowded place indoors. In the future community organisation equals making sure the latter doesn't happen and that's not just GAA after county title celebrations,. People attending Birthday parties, communions etc are just as responsible for their actions in these times

[PadraicHenryPearse]

Life can be very long, short is 38, the age a very good club mate of mine that died recently. Angelo, you are full of shit and a reincarnation of the WUM's we've had on here for years

The narrative of what you said is that its ok for people who are young, fit and healthy to die providing its not from Covid?

There are huge negative consequences of lockdowns and restrictions, we saw rises in cases of domestic violence during the first lockdown, mental health issues are almost certain to become a bigger issue with it, the economic issues it brings, the threat to people's livelihoods, jobs, ability to provide for their families, the social isolation people who live alone or elderly people feel.

At what point do we focus on the above? At what point do we look at the latest data and trends being reported on covid, a plumetting fatality, rate, the underlying health conditions the vast majority of people who die from it have, the median and mean age of those who die and what their life expectancy would be.

Some of you are so entrenched into your thinking that you are completely unwilling to look at the big picture?

I could be petty like you and say that you guys are happy to see domestic violence and suicide rise because of what you are are advocating.

you have provided no alternative that does not lead to the same or similar issues, all you provided was the unrealistic hope that people adhere to the guidance which it is clear they have not and therefore will not do.

you keep repeating the same questions over and over again without saying how any alternative you are suggesting would address them.

no one is saying there are no socio-economic challenges with lockdowns, i dont think anyone wants a lockdown but in the absence of a credible alternative which you havent provided most people see it as neccessary.

how we stop the same thing happening after these restrictions/lockdown is what needs to be dentified. I dont k ow what they are though. i hope a gradual opening of the socio-economic enviroment and adherance to guidance would work but it clearly hasnt.

Neither have you.

The same negative economic and societal issues will return now during lockdown and will probably return a worse effect.

It's a trade off, the fatality of the virus has plummeted at double digit multiples. It is my view that the impacts of lockdown and excessive restrictions will have more negative consequences than what we had in place prior to this second wave on society as a whole.

There's a reason why a large group of people aren't complying now, they don't fear the virus. The first wave had resonance because we saw the images from Lombardy and Madrid, people had a genuine fear that this could shoot fit and healthy people down. The data tends to point at this risk being remote, probably as remote as the flu which we live with every single winter.

i have, i am advocating lockdown again and in the absence of something better and as of now i am.not aware of what that would be another lockdown and another as needs require.

the alternative is herd immunity and i have already provided my reason for not purposing that course inclusing socio-economic reasons.

i have also mentioned that comparing restrictions/lockdown fataility rates with potential herd immunity fatality rates is not comparing like with like. i dont know how much early detection and how much better we are at treating covid is or if the strain has weakened but i think you can agree if hospitals get overwhelm, which they will with herd immunity, they are close with the last 7 months restrictions that more people will die.

you camnot compare the flu those rates are us nearly alwyas having capacity, having a vaccine and living pre covid lives.

if we lived pre covid lives now, how soon would the hosiptals get overwhelmed  and thr fatality rate start to increase!!

[Angelo]

Life can be very long, short is 38, the age a very good club mate of mine that died recently. Angelo, you are full of shit and a reincarnation of the WUM's we've had on here for years

The narrative of what you said is that its ok for people who are young, fit and healthy to die providing its not from Covid?

There are huge negative consequences of lockdowns and restrictions, we saw rises in cases of domestic violence during the first lockdown, mental health issues are almost certain to become a bigger issue with it, the economic issues it brings, the threat to people's livelihoods, jobs, ability to provide for their families, the social isolation people who live alone or elderly people feel.

At what point do we focus on the above? At what point do we look at the latest data and trends being reported on covid, a plumetting fatality, rate, the underlying health conditions the vast majority of people who die from it have, the median and mean age of those who die and what their life expectancy would be.

Some of you are so entrenched into your thinking that you are completely unwilling to look at the big picture?

I could be petty like you and say that you guys are happy to see domestic violence and suicide rise because of what you are are advocating.

you have provided no alternative that does not lead to the same or similar issues, all you provided was the unrealistic hope that people adhere to the guidance which it is clear they have not and therefore will not do.

you keep repeating the same questions over and over again without saying how any alternative you are suggesting would address them.

no one is saying there are no socio-economic challenges with lockdowns, i dont think anyone wants a lockdown but in the absence of a credible alternative which you havent provided most people see it as neccessary.

how we stop the same thing happening after these restrictions/lockdown is what needs to be dentified. I dont k ow what they are though. i hope a gradual opening of the socio-economic enviroment and adherance to guidance would work but it clearly hasnt.

Neither have you.

The same negative economic and societal issues will return now during lockdown and will probably return a worse effect.

It's a trade off, the fatality of the virus has plummeted at double digit multiples. It is my view that the impacts of lockdown and excessive restrictions will have more negative consequences than what we had in place prior to this second wave on society as a whole.

There's a reason why a large group of people aren't complying now, they don't fear the virus. The first wave had resonance because we saw the images from Lombardy and Madrid, people had a genuine fear that this could shoot fit and healthy people down. The data tends to point at this risk being remote, probably as remote as the flu which we live with every single winter.

i have, i am advocating lockdown again and in the absence of something better and as of now i am.not aware of what that would be another lockdown and another as needs require.

the alternative is herd immunity and i have already provided my reason for not purposing that course inclusing socio-economic reasons.

i have also mentioned that comparing restrictions/lockdown fataility rates with potential herd immunity fatality rates is not comparing like with like. i dont know how much early detection and how much better we are at treating covid is or if the strain has weakened but i think you can agree if hospitals get overwhelm, which they will with herd immunity, they are close with the last 7 months restrictions that more people will die.

you camnot compare the flu those rates are us nearly alwyas having capacity, having a vaccine and living pre covid lives.

if we lived pre covid lives now, how soon would the hosiptals get overwhelmed  and thr fatality rate start to increase!!

Who is mentioning pre-Covid lives?

I think we should have stuck with the way we were living after coming out of the first lockdown.

The bottom line is that people don't fear the virus now, if the problem is a compliance problem then more restrictions aren't going to help when compliance is the problem.

What % of cases requite hospitalisation since we have moved into the second wave. Why have governments not catered for this sufficiently particularly when you look at some of the money being thrown about, surely the health service is the thing that requires the most investment in the immediate term.

[armaghniac]

I think we should have stuck with the way we were living after coming out of the first lockdown.

The bottom line is that people don't fear the virus now, if the problem is a compliance problem then more restrictions aren't going to help when compliance is the problem.

If your work is closed then you can't go in there an spread the virus, likewise pubs and shops.

What % of cases requite hospitalisation since we have moved into the second wave. Why have governments not catered for this sufficiently particularly when you look at some of the money being thrown about, surely the health service is the thing that requires the most investment in the immediate term.

In the budget, the Dublin government promised 2,400 new hospital and community care beds, which needs another 4,500 nurses. The Irish Nurses and Midwives Organisation (INMO) said that there aren't 4500 nurses available in the next 3 months. If the health service is under provisioned then this cannot be fixed in the short term. Every other country has Covid as well, so you aren't going to be able reruit large number internationally either.

[Angelo]

I think we should have stuck with the way we were living after coming out of the first lockdown.

The bottom line is that people don't fear the virus now, if the problem is a compliance problem then more restrictions aren't going to help when compliance is the problem.

If your work is closed then you can't go in there an spread the virus, likewise pubs and shops.

What % of cases requite hospitalisation since we have moved into the second wave. Why have governments not catered for this sufficiently particularly when you look at some of the money being thrown about, surely the health service is the thing that requires the most investment in the immediate term.

In the budget, the Dublin government promised 2,400 new hospital and community care beds, which needs another 4,500 nurses. The Irish Nurses and Midwives Organisation (INMO) said that there aren't 4500 nurses available in the next 3 months. If the health service is under provisioned then this cannot be fixed in the short term. Every other country has Covid as well, so you aren't going to be able reruit large number internationally either.

If your work is closed then there are far reaching consequences, not everyone can work from home and business owners are put under severe financial pressure which could result in job losses.

It's grand talking about the consequences of Covid but there are huge consequences of lockdowns and restrictive measure which people do not seem to accept.

[PadraicHenryPearse]

Life can be very long, short is 38, the age a very good club mate of mine that died recently. Angelo, you are full of shit and a reincarnation of the WUM's we've had on here for years

The narrative of what you said is that its ok for people who are young, fit and healthy to die providing its not from Covid?

There are huge negative consequences of lockdowns and restrictions, we saw rises in cases of domestic violence during the first lockdown, mental health issues are almost certain to become a bigger issue with it, the economic issues it brings, the threat to people's livelihoods, jobs, ability to provide for their families, the social isolation people who live alone or elderly people feel.

At what point do we focus on the above? At what point do we look at the latest data and trends being reported on covid, a plumetting fatality, rate, the underlying health conditions the vast majority of people who die from it have, the median and mean age of those who die and what their life expectancy would be.

Some of you are so entrenched into your thinking that you are completely unwilling to look at the big picture?

I could be petty like you and say that you guys are happy to see domestic violence and suicide rise because of what you are are advocating.

you have provided no alternative that does not lead to the same or similar issues, all you provided was the unrealistic hope that people adhere to the guidance which it is clear they have not and therefore will not do.

you keep repeating the same questions over and over again without saying how any alternative you are suggesting would address them.

no one is saying there are no socio-economic challenges with lockdowns, i dont think anyone wants a lockdown but in the absence of a credible alternative which you havent provided most people see it as neccessary.

how we stop the same thing happening after these restrictions/lockdown is what needs to be dentified. I dont k ow what they are though. i hope a gradual opening of the socio-economic enviroment and adherance to guidance would work but it clearly hasnt.

Neither have you.

The same negative economic and societal issues will return now during lockdown and will probably return a worse effect.

It's a trade off, the fatality of the virus has plummeted at double digit multiples. It is my view that the impacts of lockdown and excessive restrictions will have more negative consequences than what we had in place prior to this second wave on society as a whole.

There's a reason why a large group of people aren't complying now, they don't fear the virus. The first wave had resonance because we saw the images from Lombardy and Madrid, people had a genuine fear that this could shoot fit and healthy people down. The data tends to point at this risk being remote, probably as remote as the flu which we live with every single winter.

i have, i am advocating lockdown again and in the absence of something better and as of now i am.not aware of what that would be another lockdown and another as needs require.

the alternative is herd immunity and i have already provided my reason for not purposing that course inclusing socio-economic reasons.

i have also mentioned that comparing restrictions/lockdown fataility rates with potential herd immunity fatality rates is not comparing like with like. i dont know how much early detection and how much better we are at treating covid is or if the strain has weakened but i think you can agree if hospitals get overwhelm, which they will with herd immunity, they are close with the last 7 months restrictions that more people will die.

you camnot compare the flu those rates are us nearly alwyas having capacity, having a vaccine and living pre covid lives.

if we lived pre covid lives now, how soon would the hosiptals get overwhelmed  and thr fatality rate start to increase!!

Who is mentioning pre-Covid lives?

I think we should have stuck with the way we were living after coming out of the first lockdown.

The bottom line is that people don't fear the virus now, if the problem is a compliance problem then more restrictions aren't going to help when compliance is the problem.

What % of cases requite hospitalisation since we have moved into the second wave. Why have governments not catered for this sufficiently particularly when you look at some of the money being thrown about, surely the health service is the thing that requires the most investment in the immediate term.

you have being comparing against the flu so i assumed you were at least trying im some way to like with like...

what we are doing  now is seeing the grow in numbers of people with covid to the point where lockdowns are being re introduced to prevent the hospitals being overwhelmed. It would be interesting to know what peoples opinions of covid in ireland are but i dont think you can make a sweeping statement like people dont fear the virus now....

the socio-economic impact of a situation where the hospitals are overwhelmed (we need to deal with what we got, not what health system we should have) would be way worst that rolling lockdowns. 

i am all for living with covid if the numbers can be kept low but from what we have seen that is not possible, there will come a point where we need to lockdown again to prevent hospitals beong overehelmed and other services being curtailed.

[Angelo]

Life can be very long, short is 38, the age a very good club mate of mine that died recently. Angelo, you are full of shit and a reincarnation of the WUM's we've had on here for years

The narrative of what you said is that its ok for people who are young, fit and healthy to die providing its not from Covid?

There are huge negative consequences of lockdowns and restrictions, we saw rises in cases of domestic violence during the first lockdown, mental health issues are almost certain to become a bigger issue with it, the economic issues it brings, the threat to people's livelihoods, jobs, ability to provide for their families, the social isolation people who live alone or elderly people feel.

At what point do we focus on the above? At what point do we look at the latest data and trends being reported on covid, a plumetting fatality, rate, the underlying health conditions the vast majority of people who die from it have, the median and mean age of those who die and what their life expectancy would be.

Some of you are so entrenched into your thinking that you are completely unwilling to look at the big picture?

I could be petty like you and say that you guys are happy to see domestic violence and suicide rise because of what you are are advocating.

you have provided no alternative that does not lead to the same or similar issues, all you provided was the unrealistic hope that people adhere to the guidance which it is clear they have not and therefore will not do.

you keep repeating the same questions over and over again without saying how any alternative you are suggesting would address them.

no one is saying there are no socio-economic challenges with lockdowns, i dont think anyone wants a lockdown but in the absence of a credible alternative which you havent provided most people see it as neccessary.

how we stop the same thing happening after these restrictions/lockdown is what needs to be dentified. I dont k ow what they are though. i hope a gradual opening of the socio-economic enviroment and adherance to guidance would work but it clearly hasnt.

Neither have you.

The same negative economic and societal issues will return now during lockdown and will probably return a worse effect.

It's a trade off, the fatality of the virus has plummeted at double digit multiples. It is my view that the impacts of lockdown and excessive restrictions will have more negative consequences than what we had in place prior to this second wave on society as a whole.

There's a reason why a large group of people aren't complying now, they don't fear the virus. The first wave had resonance because we saw the images from Lombardy and Madrid, people had a genuine fear that this could shoot fit and healthy people down. The data tends to point at this risk being remote, probably as remote as the flu which we live with every single winter.

i have, i am advocating lockdown again and in the absence of something better and as of now i am.not aware of what that would be another lockdown and another as needs require.

the alternative is herd immunity and i have already provided my reason for not purposing that course inclusing socio-economic reasons.

i have also mentioned that comparing restrictions/lockdown fataility rates with potential herd immunity fatality rates is not comparing like with like. i dont know how much early detection and how much better we are at treating covid is or if the strain has weakened but i think you can agree if hospitals get overwhelm, which they will with herd immunity, they are close with the last 7 months restrictions that more people will die.

you camnot compare the flu those rates are us nearly alwyas having capacity, having a vaccine and living pre covid lives.

if we lived pre covid lives now, how soon would the hosiptals get overwhelmed  and thr fatality rate start to increase!!

Who is mentioning pre-Covid lives?

I think we should have stuck with the way we were living after coming out of the first lockdown.

The bottom line is that people don't fear the virus now, if the problem is a compliance problem then more restrictions aren't going to help when compliance is the problem.

What % of cases requite hospitalisation since we have moved into the second wave. Why have governments not catered for this sufficiently particularly when you look at some of the money being thrown about, surely the health service is the thing that requires the most investment in the immediate term.

you have being comparing against the flu so i assumed you were at least trying im some way to like with like...

what we are doing  now is seeing the grow in numbers of people with covid to the point where lockdowns are being re introduced to prevent the hospitals being overwhelmed. It would be interesting to know what peoples opinions of covid in ireland are but i dont think you can make a sweeping statement like people dont fear the virus now....

the socio-economic impact of a situation where the hospitals are overwhelmed (we need to deal with what we got, not what health system we should have) would be way worst that rolling lockdowns. 

i am all for living with covid if the numbers can be kept low but from what we have seen that is not possible, there will come a point where we need to lockdown again to prevent hospitals beong overehelmed and other services being curtailed.

What I'm comparing with the flu is how we live with a virus that kills, causes massive health problems and puts the health system under immense pressure every single year without making any sort of societal or economic changes.

I don't think it's a case of keeping the numbers low, are the cases kept low for flu every winter? Not really.

It's a case of what sort of impact it will have? We are seeing signs now that the virus does not seem to be anywhere near as fatal as we may have initially thought it was.

[dublin7]

It's not that people don't fear the virus it's more they think they won't get it and it'll happen to somebody else.

Another big problem is people showing symptoms, getting tested and then mixing with people/playing sport before getting the results assuming they'll test negative and thinking it doesn't matter. That's been a major factor in the spread of the virus

[PadraicHenryPearse]

Life can be very long, short is 38, the age a very good club mate of mine that died recently. Angelo, you are full of shit and a reincarnation of the WUM's we've had on here for years

The narrative of what you said is that its ok for people who are young, fit and healthy to die providing its not from Covid?

There are huge negative consequences of lockdowns and restrictions, we saw rises in cases of domestic violence during the first lockdown, mental health issues are almost certain to become a bigger issue with it, the economic issues it brings, the threat to people's livelihoods, jobs, ability to provide for their families, the social isolation people who live alone or elderly people feel.

At what point do we focus on the above? At what point do we look at the latest data and trends being reported on covid, a plumetting fatality, rate, the underlying health conditions the vast majority of people who die from it have, the median and mean age of those who die and what their life expectancy would be.

Some of you are so entrenched into your thinking that you are completely unwilling to look at the big picture?

I could be petty like you and say that you guys are happy to see domestic violence and suicide rise because of what you are are advocating.

you have provided no alternative that does not lead to the same or similar issues, all you provided was the unrealistic hope that people adhere to the guidance which it is clear they have not and therefore will not do.

you keep repeating the same questions over and over again without saying how any alternative you are suggesting would address them.

no one is saying there are no socio-economic challenges with lockdowns, i dont think anyone wants a lockdown but in the absence of a credible alternative which you havent provided most people see it as neccessary.

how we stop the same thing happening after these restrictions/lockdown is what needs to be dentified. I dont k ow what they are though. i hope a gradual opening of the socio-economic enviroment and adherance to guidance would work but it clearly hasnt.

Neither have you.

The same negative economic and societal issues will return now during lockdown and will probably return a worse effect.

It's a trade off, the fatality of the virus has plummeted at double digit multiples. It is my view that the impacts of lockdown and excessive restrictions will have more negative consequences than what we had in place prior to this second wave on society as a whole.

There's a reason why a large group of people aren't complying now, they don't fear the virus. The first wave had resonance because we saw the images from Lombardy and Madrid, people had a genuine fear that this could shoot fit and healthy people down. The data tends to point at this risk being remote, probably as remote as the flu which we live with every single winter.

i have, i am advocating lockdown again and in the absence of something better and as of now i am.not aware of what that would be another lockdown and another as needs require.

the alternative is herd immunity and i have already provided my reason for not purposing that course inclusing socio-economic reasons.

i have also mentioned that comparing restrictions/lockdown fataility rates with potential herd immunity fatality rates is not comparing like with like. i dont know how much early detection and how much better we are at treating covid is or if the strain has weakened but i think you can agree if hospitals get overwhelm, which they will with herd immunity, they are close with the last 7 months restrictions that more people will die.

you camnot compare the flu those rates are us nearly alwyas having capacity, having a vaccine and living pre covid lives.

if we lived pre covid lives now, how soon would the hosiptals get overwhelmed  and thr fatality rate start to increase!!

Who is mentioning pre-Covid lives?

I think we should have stuck with the way we were living after coming out of the first lockdown.

The bottom line is that people don't fear the virus now, if the problem is a compliance problem then more restrictions aren't going to help when compliance is the problem.

What % of cases requite hospitalisation since we have moved into the second wave. Why have governments not catered for this sufficiently particularly when you look at some of the money being thrown about, surely the health service is the thing that requires the most investment in the immediate term.

you have being comparing against the flu so i assumed you were at least trying im some way to like with like...

what we are doing  now is seeing the grow in numbers of people with covid to the point where lockdowns are being re introduced to prevent the hospitals being overwhelmed. It would be interesting to know what peoples opinions of covid in ireland are but i dont think you can make a sweeping statement like people dont fear the virus now....

the socio-economic impact of a situation where the hospitals are overwhelmed (we need to deal with what we got, not what health system we should have) would be way worst that rolling lockdowns. 

i am all for living with covid if the numbers can be kept low but from what we have seen that is not possible, there will come a point where we need to lockdown again to prevent hospitals beong overehelmed and other services being curtailed.

What I'm comparing with the flu is how we live with a virus that kills, causes massive health problems and puts the health system under immense pressure every single year without making any sort of societal or economic changes.

I don't think it's a case of keeping the numbers low, are the cases kept low for flu every winter? Not really.

It's a case of what sort of impact it will have? We are seeing signs now that the virus does not seem to be anywhere near as fatal as we may have initially thought it was.

one final time then i give up..

you are comparing the flu figures which has a vaccine, which is seasonal and which our hosiptals can nearly always cope with and everyone lived their "normal" pre covid lives.... to

we dont have a vaccine, its not seasonal and twice it has got close to overwhelming hosiptals and we have seriously changed the way we live our lifes.

to get even close to comparing the full consquences of covid and make at least a decent comparsion to the flu numbers we would need to go back to our lives pre covid and see how many die then.

However, we are not stupid and lockeddown as the level of death if we continued our normal routine would have been way higher than it was back in March/April..

[Milltown Row2]

If we are still in this situation next year, there should be no club championships, no formal club competitions, no trophies, no more opportunities for more superspreading events

Just a series of non-competitive matches to keep fit and have a bit of fun, like Go Games

Club games without the competitive edge are a waste of time. Players can keep fit training and in the gym. In a situation like like many will be taking up other sports and won't be coming back to GAA when it returns to competitive action.

Why would they be a waste of time?

It's often said that club players just want to play, and the over emphasis on competition is frequently lamented on here

Playing non-competitive football is far more enjoyable than going to the gym

In fact it's often been said that the ultra-competitive nature of GAA games leads to a smaller playing population than there could or should be

This was the motivating factor behind the "Recreational GAA" idea some years ago which I think Diarmuid Marsden was involved in formulating

The strength of grass roots soccer is that there is a level for everybody

That isn't really the case in GAA

What a pile of shit Sid. You've obviously never been able to kick a ball or swing stick!!

Recreational hurling and football is and has been available for years in clubs, the thirds team is that team.

It's often said that players just want to play... said no GAA player ever