Where next for Donegal?

[Blowitupref]

This was the first year Donegal have used that defensive system...wait until they perfect it

[Fear ón Srath Bán]

The ten meanest defences, midfields, and attacks in this year's Championship, by average score conceded per game:

Donegal    9.50
Kildare    11.71
Dublin     12.20
Galway    13.00
Kerry      13.60
Longford  13.67
Mayo      14.20
Meath     14.25
Wexford  14.40
Cork       14.60

Fixed that for you Hardy! 

[FL/MAYO]

It would have been interesting to see how Kerry would have coped with that type of defense.

Donegal have to find find some way of having Murphy stay up in the forward line, its a waste having one of the best forwards in the country stuck somewhere between his own half back line and midfield. If Donegal could switch between an orthodox formation and the way they play now during a game it would cause all types of confusion with the opposition.

[ross4life]

Kerry didn't cope too well in 2003 & one of the reasons why Donegal didn't succeed yesterday was they didn't have forwards like Peter Canavan,Steven O'Neill.

[Cde]

I'd expect Jim Mcguinness to do the same again next year with a few minor tweaks .
the tweaks being come changes and ideas on how and when to attack.
Jim is like an American football coach now at this stage, he will no doubt try to create 'set plays' that Donegal can 'run' at certain times and win scores.
I would suspect that he might look for a more potent freetaker as Murphy and McFadden are not as good from 40 metres out...If donegal had Cluxton yesterday they would have won.

Durkan a great keeper and shot stopper but a GK that can kick 45's and more would seem to be the new desired comodity in football right now and for the near future.

Durkan can kick 45's with the best of them. He plays full forward with his club and takes all the long range free's and 45's. I seen him playing against Bundoran this year in the championship in Donegal and he scored 7 or 8 points that day from outside the forty and a few of them were outside the fifty

[cadence]

...also reckon that Donegal will not be as copetitive next season - the fatigue their bodies will have to feel after such a season of three hour traning sessions and the amount of work they take to keep up such performances- well the body can hardly take that for too long....
something will have to give, if not next seaosn then def the season afterwards, but I suspect that half of them will be inj if they all continue training from Christmas again...

McGuinness is smart, so prob will know to rest them until well into the NFL

...also reckon that Donegal will not be as copetitive next season - the fatigue their bodies will have to feel after such a season of three hour traning sessions and the amount of work they take to keep up such performances- well the body can hardly take that for too long....
something will have to give, if not next seaosn then def the season afterwards, but I suspect that half of them will be inj if they all continue training from Christmas again...

McGuinness is smart, so prob will know to rest them until well into the NFL

i really enjoy your posts. they have a great level of insight in them. however...


distance runners, especially marathon runners and even more so ultra marathon runners, put huge mileage on the clock weekly and constantly, being in training all the time (including cross-training) without the body giving out. it's not a case of impossible to achieve the level of fitness mcguinness wants to implement his strategy, a fair few of those players just don't have enough training under them. building up that speed endurance and overall endurance takes more time than the year they've had. building on their training regimes, i'd expect those donegal players to be well able to manage the full 70mins next year. if they kept training they'll be able to go for even longer. it's not just about speed endurance either to control the lactate build and the improve recovery times, overall muscle endurance is important too, hence they ran out of gas. none of those lads are anywhere near the fitness they can achieve. with enough years of training under them, they'd be able to play 2 games like that back-to-back. it's very achieveable i think. currently, it's a 35mins intense fartleks session, with a break to refuel and stretch, followed by another 35mins fartleks session. any experienced runner will tell you the same. you simply need to train properly and for long enough to achieve the goal you have. i def think we'll see more of the same next year. but i would expect them to have the legs to be able to push on and attack teams in the last 20mins. i think that's what he'll try to do.

[INDIANA]

Donegal can do all the ultra marathons they like it wont change the one salient fact they will never win an All-Ireland trained by Mc Guinness.

And you can quote me on that.

[cadence]

Donegal can do all the ultra marathons they like it wont change the one salient fact they will never win an All-Ireland trained by Mc Guinness.

And you can quote me on that.

they don't need anything near ultra level, they need to build on their fitness, not drop off and lose it. if he does remain the man in charge, which is fairly likely, i'd expect him to address the fitness failings yesterday. one things for sure, they won't be less fit. i'm guessing that he'll try to improve 2 things. the ability to attack and compete all over the field and the fitness capacity to allow them to do this and wear teams down. if he continues to want them to play an attacking running possession game (edit: once we have possession i mean, we'll still be quite a defensive outlook i reckon), to do that for the full 70 he needs them fitter.

not to everyone's tastes for sure, but that's the way it's going to pan out i think.

[Kerry Mike]

fartleks, now  that's a word you dont see  enough of.

[cadence]

running and farting at the same time.

[cadence]

at speed.

[Orangemac]

Because of this, for me it'll be more likely than not that this Donegal team will be a one-season wonder, the same way the likes of Monaghan, Fermanagh and Down have been in the last few years (though the jury is still out on Down).

Would go along with this, next year will be more difficult. A couple of pacy half forwards who can buy into this system and another midfielder are needed already plus a few players were maybe giving it one last push this year, the likes of Hegarty,Toye, Cassidy who may not be back next year.

Murphy should have been switched into FF a few times and a few Hail Marys rained in on him as over the last half hour Donegal barely had a shot never mind a score.

[muppet]

I'd expect Jim Mcguinness to do the same again next year with a few minor tweaks .
the tweaks being come changes and ideas on how and when to attack.
Jim is like an American football coach now at this stage, he will no doubt try to create 'set plays' that Donegal can 'run' at certain times and win scores.
I would suspect that he might look for a more potent freetaker as Murphy and McFadden are not as good from 40 metres out...If donegal had Cluxton yesterday they would have won.

Durkan a great keeper and shot stopper but a GK that can kick 45's and more would seem to be the new desired comodity in football right now and for the near future.

Durkan can kick 45's with the best of them. He plays full forward with his club and takes all the long range free's and 45's. I seen him playing against Bundoran this year in the championship in Donegal and he scored 7 or 8 points that day from outside the forty and a few of them were outside the fifty

Wow.

I bet he was the furthest forward too.

[lynchbhoy]

distance runners, especially marathon runners and even more so ultra marathon runners, put huge mileage on the clock weekly and constantly, being in training all the time (including cross-training) without the body giving out. it's not a case of impossible to achieve the level of fitness mcguinness wants to implement his strategy, a fair few of those players just don't have enough training under them. building up that speed endurance and overall endurance takes more time than the year they've had. building on their training regimes, i'd expect those donegal players to be well able to manage the full 70mins next year. if they kept training they'll be able to go for even longer. it's not just about speed endurance either to control the lactate build and the improve recovery times, overall muscle endurance is important too, hence they ran out of gas. none of those lads are anywhere near the fitness they can achieve. with enough years of training under them, they'd be able to play 2 games like that back-to-back. it's very achieveable i think. currently, it's a 35mins intense fartleks session, with a break to refuel and stretch, followed by another 35mins fartleks session. any experienced runner will tell you the same. you simply need to train properly and for long enough to achieve the goal you have. i def think we'll see more of the same next year. but i would expect them to have the legs to be able to push on and attack teams in the last 20mins. i think that's what he'll try to do.

Interesting enough that Cadence.
This may prove to be true, However all the stamina training in the world does not take into account the hits that you get in Gaelic football. You don't get them in hurling. Only American football, ice hockey and rugby will you get the same kind of physical contact and these other sports lads wear some element of body armour/pads.
Taking a lot of hits takes it out of you.
IMO Donegal were up there as the fittest team in the country – having eclipsed Kildare and Dublin – but they had to be in order to play that kind of game and last the 70 minutes.
If it was just running then Donegal wouldn't have the problem, its how they use their bodies to absorb runners and tackles etc. This will cause or accelerate injury more than ordinary running as a fatigued body shipping a tackle can more easily be put off balance and injure an ankle, knee or hamstring etc.

We are comparing these Gaelic footballers to professional athletes also. Our lads don't have the luxury of being able to train, rest and get supplemental foods paid for them etc. We have a lad doing his days work, driving to training, doing a 2-3 hour session and heading home to be in bed by midnight if he's lucky – before he gets up early to head to work again.
It doesn't even have to be physical work these days, its just the constant strain on the body with no lengthy period of rest for the body or worse – the brain.
It may not be rocket science, but when you are a player, your minds always flicks back to training, games and football. Its worse for managers though in that regard !

I have said over the last number of years that Tyrone would not win back to back All Irelands for the fatigue/injury reason. Their style of play demands too much of the body to sustain it over any more than a season – unless you have a massive and talented squad.
Even Kerry cant sustain consecutive seasons thee days – and their style of play is to use the ball more than the likes of Donegal, Dublin, Cork etc

This is all my own opinion, but while I think Donegal will be there or thereabouts again next year (and I have said for the past 6 or 7 years that Donegal had the talent to win Ulster and maybe more) it would surprise me if they don't have problems with injuries etc that will lessen their effectiveness.
I could be wrong and frequently am !!
 

[regal]

I'd expect Jim Mcguinness to do the same again next year with a few minor tweaks .
the tweaks being come changes and ideas on how and when to attack.
Jim is like an American football coach now at this stage, he will no doubt try to create 'set plays' that Donegal can 'run' at certain times and win scores.
I would suspect that he might look for a more potent freetaker as Murphy and McFadden are not as good from 40 metres out...If donegal had Cluxton yesterday they would have won.

Durkan a great keeper and shot stopper but a GK that can kick 45's and more would seem to be the new desired comodity in football right now and for the near future.

Durkan can kick 45's with the best of them. He plays full forward with his club and takes all the long range free's and 45's. I seen him playing against Bundoran this year in the championship in Donegal and he scored 7 or 8 points that day from outside the forty and a few of them were outside the fifty

Perhaps the next time Donegal are playing Bundoran Durcan could take all the fress.

Donegal need to thank Gallagher, Hegarty, Toye and Cassidy for all the effort they have put in over the years. They need to find a midfield partnership, bulk up mchugh and move him to 11 and keep murphy at full forward. However, no matter what they do they wont be back in all AI semi final next year.