Is the job of manager/coach over-rated

[time ticking away]

Just spent a night talking to two knowledgable football men. But i wonder if the manager makes a noticable difference or are managers full of their own self importance

[scud]

Having played under many number of managers at various levels its very easy to tell the good ones, the leaders, from the bluffers. He/she won't turn a team of no hopers into champions but I believe a good manager is crucial

[screenexile]

First of all they are two very separate positions. Nowadays there are very few teams who have one man running the show and you will usually find there are up to 4 in a management setup for any team. The Manager is the main man and what he says goes, he organises tactics, picks the team, deals with player welfare and keeps an eye on everyone else to make sure they are doing their job. The coach does exactly that, he takes direction from the manager and organises training accordingly, depending on what the manager wants to work on i.e. speed, strength, stamina, skills, tactics... then you tend to have someone who looks after logistics like jerseys, balls, equipment, water bottles that type of thing. Generally I would have 3 in a management team with a Manager and Coach and then someone who organises things and liaises with the club/county committee.

Having had some excellent managers and some godawful ones I can tell you now that a good manager is worth its weight in gold!

[loughshore lad]

Having had some excellent managers and some godawful ones I can tell you now that a good manager is worth its weight in gold!

Secrrenexile- who were the excellent ones and what in your mind made them better than the poor ones?

[screenexile]

Hmmm good question.

Excellent ones - Brian McGilligan, Henry Downey, Martin McConnell, Danny McAuley, Matt Trolan

For me it was the fact that when they spoke to you you knew what they were talking about. Henry Downey came out with a line one day saying "I don't think you would bite through that glass to get on this team". A statement like that says a lot about him and the way he saw the game.

Also for me was their ability to command respect. McConnell wouldnt' have the playing experience or the hero factor of a Downey or a McGilligan (Both being big heroes as I was young at the time of the All Ireland) yet the way he organises the team, the overall setup of the team and the way he talks about the game and seems to know everything about every team you're playing means that you can't but have respect for that.

McGilligan may seem like a big man who just commands respect by his presence but in reality he is a scary personality and you wouldn't dare to cross him, don't get me wrong he was a very fair man but if you stepped out of line or didn't pu tht effort in you got pulled on it fairly quickly. I thankfully never did but his ability to give you a stare or a complete bollicking that would give you nightmares was unreal and definitely helped to get lads working to the top of their game. He was only supposed to be the coach of the U21s that year but in reality he was the main man behind the team it was just unfortunate that a few lads 'opted out' of playing U21 football that year and we were unlucky to get beat by a Fermanagh team that had maybe 8 of the current county team on it, while we were missing lads like Paddy Bradley, Niall McCusker and Kevin McGuckin.

Danny McAuley was a different character. He was one of those pompous cynical men from the club who thinks the world's against him. He was full of great sayings that had you crying with laughter even when you weren't supposed to (As sure as there is shite in a cat, being my personal favourite). For me I played my best football when he was my manager (U16 to Minor) and it's hard to put your finger on as to why but whatever he did he was able to get the best out of me. He was also good at the tactical stuff and where to put boys when things were in trouble and he seemed to have a plan for most eventualities. Having said that he also ruffled a few feathers and a lot of boys didn't and still don't get on with him but I always thought he was a good manager.

Matt was also a different character. He was the local Headmaster of the Primary school so was able to draw on the respect he received from that to use on the team. He oversaw a massive transition in our club at the turn of the decade which saw almost a complete clearout of the old team that had gotten tanked in the championship first round in 2000 to a very young and inexperienced team coming very lose to Ballinderry in the 2001 cship Semi Final (Who then went on to win the All Ireland).


The other thing about these lads is their knowledge of the game too. I've had managers who are good at motivating a team but with no real tactical awareness and managers who take great sessions and have good tactical ability but don't get respect from players. Anybody else care to take a stab at who their best manager was and why?

[Bensars]

Yes, they are usually occupied by those with a need to impress or worse still the local teacher who has the ambition to boss lads about.

[IolarCoisCuain]

A good manager/coach won't win you trophies on his own but a bad one can lose them.

It's a thankless job, really. But when the poor divils have the bug, what else can they do?

[AZOffaly]

A good manager will get the most out of his players, tactically, physically and mentally. If that is good enough to win a trophy, then they will win a trophy.

Hundreds of good managers have not won anything, because the raw material simply isn't good enough, but they have maximised that raw material.
Likewise, a lot of poor enough managers have presided over winning teams, because while they may not maximise potential, there was enough there to win anyway.

Edit: I also acknowlege the point that at this stage, possibly with the exception of Mick O'Dwyer and Brian Cody, I shouild really have said 'management team' rather than ''manager'.

[wherefromreferee?]

ScreenExile
I surprised you haven't mentioned Tony Scullion in your list, or maybe he hasn't managed or coached a team in your parish, but having seen him on that celebrity bainisteoir programme, I said he'd be great to play under.

[screenexile]

He managed us once but it was a strange situation as he was actually managing a team in Tyrone at the same time. He said himself he felt bad about it because when he does something he wants to give it everything and while he gave both teams everything circumstances dictated that we probably both lost out a bit that year having him spread so thin.

Tony is a great coach and a FANTASTIC motivator and inspirational kind of manager but maybe his heart ruled his head in the past and he would get very animated and totally absorbed in the game when maybe other managers can take that step back and look at things a bit more calm and controlled. It was a good 6 years ago when he managed us so I would say he has definitely improved as a no. 1 though and the lads on the panel at the minute who won a minor championship under him would defintiely say he was the best manager they ever had. He's currently taking our Minor team and they play Ballinderry in a couple of weeks in a match that will go a long way to deciding the championship so that could hopefully be another one to add to his CV!