Seanad Éireann - should it stay or should it go?

[anglocelt39]

The reason we had a  no vote yesterday in my opinion is due in no small part to the 20% of the voting electorate who are the vote no to everything including the proposed canonisation of Mother Theresa idea. Anybody with any doubts on this one should go back to the most populist referendum we have ever had to give politicians some say in the setting of judges pay when 20% of the electorate voted against that for gods sake. These are probably the same dudes who would have voted against a proposal to maintain or increase judges pay. So there we have yesterdays no vote, 20% eternal naysayers, some percentage with genuine concerns and another very substantial group who were just dying to remind Enda that the Mayo for Sam card sometime is a bit too close to the Bertie image for comfort.

Reform of the Seanad??? cop on lads FG will drop this idea like a hot spud and our Senators who made themselves visible in their own self interests over the last few weeks will heave a big sigh of relief.

Hardy, I'm 53 years of age, remind me of a few things the Seanad have done in my lifetime that I should be genuinely grateful for, not to include the spotting of upside down full stops on legislation making its way to the Aras.

[Hardy]

The reason we had a  no vote yesterday in my opinion is due in no small part to the 20% of the voting electorate who are the vote no to everything including the proposed canonisation of Mother Theresa idea. Anybody with any doubts on this one should go back to the most populist referendum we have ever had to give politicians some say in the setting of judges pay when 20% of the electorate voted against that for gods sake. These are probably the same dudes who would have voted against a proposal to maintain or increase judges pay. So there we have yesterdays no vote, 20% eternal naysayers, some percentage with genuine concerns and another very substantial group who were just dying to remind Enda that the Mayo for Sam card sometime is a bit too close to the Bertie image for comfort.

Reform of the Seanad??? cop on lads FG will drop this idea like a hot spud and our Senators who made themselves visible in their own self interests over the last few weeks will heave a big sigh of relief.

Hardy, I'm 53 years of age, remind me of a few things the Seanad have done in my lifetime that I should be genuinely grateful for, not to include the spotting of upside down full stops on legislation making its way to the Aras.

Anglo, do you think that question is any more relevant now than it was an hour or so ago when I answered effectively the same one for Muppet, or this morning or the few other times I've made the point?

OK. One more time. The Seanad, as currently constituted and ever since 1937 or whenever it was instituted, is undemocratic, useless and corrupt. If I post that sentence another few times in individual posts, would that do it?

Happy Birthday.

[muppet]

The reason we had a  no vote yesterday in my opinion is due in no small part to the 20% of the voting electorate who are the vote no to everything including the proposed canonisation of Mother Theresa idea. Anybody with any doubts on this one should go back to the most populist referendum we have ever had to give politicians some say in the setting of judges pay when 20% of the electorate voted against that for gods sake. These are probably the same dudes who would have voted against a proposal to maintain or increase judges pay. So there we have yesterdays no vote, 20% eternal naysayers, some percentage with genuine concerns and another very substantial group who were just dying to remind Enda that the Mayo for Sam card sometime is a bit too close to the Bertie image for comfort.

Reform of the Seanad??? cop on lads FG will drop this idea like a hot spud and our Senators who made themselves visible in their own self interests over the last few weeks will heave a big sigh of relief.

Hardy, I'm 53 years of age, remind me of a few things the Seanad have done in my lifetime that I should be genuinely grateful for, not to include the spotting of upside down full stops on legislation making its way to the Aras.

Anglo, do you think that question is any more relevant now than it was an hour or so ago when I answered effectively the same one for Muppet, or this morning or the few other times I've made the point?

OK. One more time. The Seanad, as currently constituted and ever since 1937 or whenever it was instituted, is undemocratic, useless and corrupt. If I post that sentence another few times in individual posts, would that do it?

Happy Birthday.

Hardy, even though this is an either/or debate, it is not that we agree with your opinion, nor that we disagree with it. It is simply that we feel it is in need of reform. 

[Eamonnca1]

We have a Dáil.

We have a Supreme Court.

We have a President.

I believe we don't need a Seanad. We definitely don't need a token house where the Taoiseach gets to put in 9 of his buddies (Eoghan Harris!) into 15% of the seats.

One simple question. The biggest c*ck up ever made by the Dáil was the Bank Guarantee. What did the Seanad do for us then?

There it is again, another argument that could just as easily come from the retain-and-reform lobby. (I know, I know, R&R wasn't on the ballot, I get it.)

If the Seanad was not dominated by government appointees and actually had a bit of teeth, there's a chance that someone would have been in a position to speak up about the bank guarantee.  Although to be fair, how many people at the time had any idea of what a colossal mistake that would turn out to be? How many people actually knew the exact scale of the debt that had been run up?

[muppet]

We have a Dáil.

We have a Supreme Court.

We have a President.

I believe we don't need a Seanad. We definitely don't need a token house where the Taoiseach gets to put in 9 of his buddies (Eoghan Harris!) into 15% of the seats.

One simple question. The biggest c*ck up ever made by the Dáil was the Bank Guarantee. What did the Seanad do for us then?

There it is again, another argument that could just as easily come from the retain-and-reform lobby. (I know, I know, R&R wasn't on the ballot, I get it.)

If the Seanad was not dominated by government appointees and actually had a bit of teeth, there's a chance that someone would have been in a position to speak up about the bank guarantee. Although to be fair, how many people at the time had any idea of what a colossal mistake that would turn out to be? How many people actually knew the exact scale of the debt that had been run up?

Read the bailout thread. BogballXIV of this constituency had it nailed the very next day.

As for the Seanad, I agree if it had teeth it could be useful. But what government is going to propose creating a rabid watchdog for itself?

[Maguire01]

The reason we had a  no vote yesterday in my opinion is due in no small part to the 20% of the voting electorate who are the vote no to everything including the proposed canonisation of Mother Theresa idea.

And right they would be. Time for some research on just how 'saintly' she was.

[Eamonnca1]

Read the bailout thread. BogballXIV of this constituency had it nailed the very next day.

Okay that's one. Who else?

[Eamonnca1]

The reason we had a  no vote yesterday in my opinion is due in no small part to the 20% of the voting electorate who are the vote no to everything including the proposed canonisation of Mother Theresa idea.

And right they would be. Time for some research on just how 'saintly' she was.

F***ing right. Is there some sort of anti-canonisation process? Some sort of anti-saint position she could occupy? If ever there was someone who had earned it it was that sinister old witch.

[muppet]

Read the bailout thread. BogballXIV of this constituency had it nailed the very next day.

Okay that's one. Who else?

Read the thread, most of us were on board with him within days.

[boojangles]

I don't know. My point, at the risk of boring you with repetition, is that it's more likely than it would be if there were no Seanad and that at least Seanad reform is now in the political arena. It wasn't before. For anyone who believes an effective upper house to scrutinise the doings of the Dáil is a good idea if properly implemented, we're in a better place now than we were before this referendum was called.

+1

[muppet]