Ulster Club IFC/JFC 2023

[Dreadnought]

How are teams relegated to Intermediate and Junior championships in Cavan? I understand winning is the pathway to the level above, but how do you go about going down?

1 up 1 down. Essentially the bottom 4 in the group stages play off in relegation semi finals, and then losers play relegation final when the Championship quarters, semi etc are ongoing. So overall loser relegated and replaced by below Championship winner. You have to win to move up, lose to move down

Only exception to this is when rejigging numbers, and the odd year you relegate 2 and so on. Covid also messed it here when none were relegated in 2020, but had a promotion, so 2 were relegated in 2021 and so on to rejig numbers across the 3 Championships

Your league is a farce so and handy for outside managers to make a few bob. Mess about in the league and win an odd game in champ and your grand.

Lose a few games in Monaghan and Tyrone in the league and your gone,you get found out pretty quick.

Yes, mostly. Not for the everyday club player, but mostly. Split season the issue here overall. Glad you've finally caught up

Managers still lose their jobs. Might not be as valued, but you can't lose all your games either. My own team cut their manager mid League last season.

[intheknowhow]

The League is hardly a friendly competition. Players who don't perform will not be in contention for a championship start. Winning a league is a nice feather for a manager so long as he doesn't flop come championship. Same as performing poorly in the league will either be forgiven if you go well in championship, or it will be used as a stick to further beat a manager with if he also performs poorly come championship. But this is all old news to any GAA fan. I think some on here are being deliberately disingenuous. 

And just on the unavailability of county players for league. "County player" is a bit of a stretch. Lads not within an ass's roar of a match day panel, basically anyone sniffing around a county panel will be kicked off it if they play club league. This is something I completely and utterly disagree with and really annoys me but was introduced by, funnily enough a Tyrone man and his Monaghan side kick. Then the new man after them kept it going.

Annoys me as well. Would do those lads far better to be getting football every week instead of managers sickening them with training

Vinny Corey allowed all players outside 24 to play league games last year

[marty34]

I mentioned it before, but the biggest issue seems to be they had played, and maintained their division 1 league status, and played in a junior championship. 

Had it been intermediate championship they had won, I would say people, like myself, could reconcile more with that. 

This is coming from my own point of view where, in Armagh, the leagues and championships are linked, the idea of a senior league team entering a junior championship would seem preposterous, and the outcome would be inevitable. 

In fairness, it's mad a Div 1 team, last year and this year, are playing in Junior Championship.

In south Derry you'd be looked down on if that happened. Clubs would nearly take you to court over a technicality to stay in Div. 1 and play senior championship.

If Arva were maybe Div. 1 and played Intermediate, you'd nearly let it slide but junior!  Kerry divisional teams are another joke

Regardless, the inter-county club championships are fantastic and are very enjoyable over the long winter months.  Great viewing at all levels, between the 2 codes.

[Ciarrai_thuaidh]

I mentioned it before, but the biggest issue seems to be they had played, and maintained their division 1 league status, and played in a junior championship. 

Had it been intermediate championship they had won, I would say people, like myself, could reconcile more with that. 

This is coming from my own point of view where, in Armagh, the leagues and championships are linked, the idea of a senior league team entering a junior championship would seem preposterous, and the outcome would be inevitable. 

In fairness, it's mad a Div 1 team, last year and this year, are playing in Junior Championship.

In south Derry you'd be looked down on if that happened. Clubs would nearly take you to court over a technicality to stay in Div. 1 and play senior championship.

If Arva were maybe Div. 1 and played Intermediate, you'd nearly let it slide but junior!  Kerry divisional teams are another joke

Regardless, the inter-county club championships are fantastic and are very enjoyable over the long winter months.  Great viewing at all levels, between the 2 codes.

Kerry divisional teams are a joke? Please elaborate..

[Armagh18]

I mentioned it before, but the biggest issue seems to be they had played, and maintained their division 1 league status, and played in a junior championship. 

Had it been intermediate championship they had won, I would say people, like myself, could reconcile more with that. 

This is coming from my own point of view where, in Armagh, the leagues and championships are linked, the idea of a senior league team entering a junior championship would seem preposterous, and the outcome would be inevitable. 

In fairness, it's mad a Div 1 team, last year and this year, are playing in Junior Championship.

In south Derry you'd be looked down on if that happened. Clubs would nearly take you to court over a technicality to stay in Div. 1 and play senior championship.

If Arva were maybe Div. 1 and played Intermediate, you'd nearly let it slide but junior!  Kerry divisional teams are another joke

Regardless, the inter-county club championships are fantastic and are very enjoyable over the long winter months.  Great viewing at all levels, between the 2 codes.

At the risk of opening another can of worms, I really think the divisional sides are class as they get lads from small clubs playing a far better standard than they normally would.

Do think something needs done about them sending their 9th best to to intermediate though.

[marty34]

How are teams relegated to Intermediate and Junior championships in Cavan? I understand winning is the pathway to the level above, but how do you go about going down?

1 up 1 down. Essentially the bottom 4 in the group stages play off in relegation semi finals, and then losers play relegation final when the Championship quarters, semi etc are ongoing. So overall loser relegated and replaced by below Championship winner. You have to win to move up, lose to move down

Only exception to this is when rejigging numbers, and the odd year you relegate 2 and so on. Covid also messed it here when none were relegated in 2020, but had a promotion, so 2 were relegated in 2021 and so on to rejig numbers across the 3 Championships

Your league is a farce so and handy for outside managers to make a few bob. Mess about in the league and win an odd game in champ and your grand.

Lose a few games in Monaghan and Tyrone in the league and your gone,you get found out pretty quick.

Yes, mostly. Not for the everyday club player, but mostly. Split season the issue here overall. Glad you've finally caught up

Managers still lose their jobs. Might not be as valued, but you can't lose all your games either. My own team cut their manager mid League last season.

So the league is juat a waste of time so. What's tbe point of lads playing if no interest in it.

Being a club manager in Cavan must be handy money...and no pressure.

[ranch]

I mentioned it before, but the biggest issue seems to be they had played, and maintained their division 1 league status, and played in a junior championship. 

Had it been intermediate championship they had won, I would say people, like myself, could reconcile more with that. 

This is coming from my own point of view where, in Armagh, the leagues and championships are linked, the idea of a senior league team entering a junior championship would seem preposterous, and the outcome would be inevitable. 

In fairness, it's mad a Div 1 team, last year and this year, are playing in Junior Championship.

In south Derry you'd be looked down on if that happened. Clubs would nearly take you to court over a technicality to stay in Div. 1 and play senior championship.

If Arva were maybe Div. 1 and played Intermediate, you'd nearly let it slide but junior!  Kerry divisional teams are another joke

Regardless, the inter-county club championships are fantastic and are very enjoyable over the long winter months.  Great viewing at all levels, between the 2 codes.

At the risk of opening another can of worms, I really think the divisional sides are class as they get lads from small clubs playing a far better standard than they normally would.

Do think something needs done about them sending their 9th best to to intermediate though.

The divisional sides would struggle to be viable I imagine if there were 16 senior teams.
I posted last year about how a divisional structure could work in Armagh, I must dig it out again. Obviously hypothetical, it'll never happen.

[intheknowhow]

I mentioned it before, but the biggest issue seems to be they had played, and maintained their division 1 league status, and played in a junior championship. 

Had it been intermediate championship they had won, I would say people, like myself, could reconcile more with that. 

This is coming from my own point of view where, in Armagh, the leagues and championships are linked, the idea of a senior league team entering a junior championship would seem preposterous, and the outcome would be inevitable. 

In fairness, it's mad a Div 1 team, last year and this year, are playing in Junior Championship.

In south Derry you'd be looked down on if that happened. Clubs would nearly take you to court over a technicality to stay in Div. 1 and play senior championship.

If Arva were maybe Div. 1 and played Intermediate, you'd nearly let it slide but junior!  Kerry divisional teams are another joke

Regardless, the inter-county club championships are fantastic and are very enjoyable over the long winter months.  Great viewing at all levels, between the 2 codes.

At the risk of opening another can of worms, I really think the divisional sides are class as they get lads from small clubs playing a far better standard than they normally would.

Do think something needs done about them sending their 9th best to to intermediate though.

Sure don't they have regional championships in Kerry too, like south Kerry champ etc.

Is there 70 odd clubs in Kerry? The Team that finished 3rd in their Div 1 lost the junior champ final.

How on earth is that happening? Are 50 of their clubs playing junior champ?

[Ciarrai_thuaidh]

I mentioned it before, but the biggest issue seems to be they had played, and maintained their division 1 league status, and played in a junior championship. 

Had it been intermediate championship they had won, I would say people, like myself, could reconcile more with that. 

This is coming from my own point of view where, in Armagh, the leagues and championships are linked, the idea of a senior league team entering a junior championship would seem preposterous, and the outcome would be inevitable. 

In fairness, it's mad a Div 1 team, last year and this year, are playing in Junior Championship.

In south Derry you'd be looked down on if that happened. Clubs would nearly take you to court over a technicality to stay in Div. 1 and play senior championship.

If Arva were maybe Div. 1 and played Intermediate, you'd nearly let it slide but junior!  Kerry divisional teams are another joke

Regardless, the inter-county club championships are fantastic and are very enjoyable over the long winter months.  Great viewing at all levels, between the 2 codes.

At the risk of opening another can of worms, I really think the divisional sides are class as they get lads from small clubs playing a far better standard than they normally would.

Do think something needs done about them sending their 9th best to to intermediate though.

Sure don't they have regional championships in Kerry too, like south Kerry champ etc.

Is there 70 odd clubs in Kerry? The Team that finished 3rd in their Div 1 lost the junior champ final.

How on earth is that happening? Are 50 of their clubs playing junior champ?

I really don't know how many times this has to be said before people grasp it. The league is played from March to June and by and large county Seniors and U20s are unavailable. A huge portion of college age players leave for the summer on J1s. A lot of clubs in Kerry would have sizeable contingents of players away in Limerick, Cork and even Dublin. So huge commitment early in the season isn't always possible.
When those players return it quite obviously makes a huge difference for championship. But also, the championships are ultra competitive. I wouldn't have put Milltown-Castlemaine or Listowel in the top 4 rankings of Intermediate or Junior before start of them and I think Austin Stacks or Glenflesk for example would have gone further in Intermediate. But that's the beauty of championship I guess.

[ClubScene13]

Thankfully Ballyhaise didn't beat Cullyhanna and go on to win AI. They very nearly did, now wouldn't that have been some craic.

[Look-Up!]

How are teams relegated to Intermediate and Junior championships in Cavan? I understand winning is the pathway to the level above, but how do you go about going down?

1 up 1 down. Essentially the bottom 4 in the group stages play off in relegation semi finals, and then losers play relegation final when the Championship quarters, semi etc are ongoing. So overall loser relegated and replaced by below Championship winner. You have to win to move up, lose to move down

Only exception to this is when rejigging numbers, and the odd year you relegate 2 and so on. Covid also messed it here when none were relegated in 2020, but had a promotion, so 2 were relegated in 2021 and so on to rejig numbers across the 3 Championships

Your league is a farce so and handy for outside managers to make a few bob. Mess about in the league and win an odd game in champ and your grand.

Lose a few games in Monaghan and Tyrone in the league and your gone,you get found out pretty quick.

Yes, mostly. Not for the everyday club player, but mostly. Split season the issue here overall. Glad you've finally caught up

Managers still lose their jobs. Might not be as valued, but you can't lose all your games either. My own team cut their manager mid League last season.

So the league is juat a waste of time so. What's tbe point of lads playing if no interest in it.

Being a club manager in Cavan must be handy money...and no pressure.

There is interest in it, just a much lesser competition and a great chance for lads on the fringes to exposure to a higher level in a club with second team, or for bringing young lads through.

I'd argue taking the league so seriously is a gimmick managers use to rip clubs off and charge more for their services with all the additional training and fitness stats. You cannot expect club players to be at peak from March to October. So I'd take it with a pinch of salt how tough the leagues are or at least how practical it is from a player welfare POV.

Whatever little joy is left in the club game is slowly being sucked away completely by these "professional" managerial setups and they always know how to charge regardless of results. Northern managers are notorious for it and they're picking up plenty of work in Cavan. Indeed in Dreadnought's own club it was a northern duo who unceremoniously got the gate. Seriously ignorant pair completely stuck up their own holes and extremely detrimental to player morale and development. 

[Dreadnought]

How are teams relegated to Intermediate and Junior championships in Cavan? I understand winning is the pathway to the level above, but how do you go about going down?

1 up 1 down. Essentially the bottom 4 in the group stages play off in relegation semi finals, and then losers play relegation final when the Championship quarters, semi etc are ongoing. So overall loser relegated and replaced by below Championship winner. You have to win to move up, lose to move down

Only exception to this is when rejigging numbers, and the odd year you relegate 2 and so on. Covid also messed it here when none were relegated in 2020, but had a promotion, so 2 were relegated in 2021 and so on to rejig numbers across the 3 Championships

Your league is a farce so and handy for outside managers to make a few bob. Mess about in the league and win an odd game in champ and your grand.

Lose a few games in Monaghan and Tyrone in the league and your gone,you get found out pretty quick.

Yes, mostly. Not for the everyday club player, but mostly. Split season the issue here overall. Glad you've finally caught up

Managers still lose their jobs. Might not be as valued, but you can't lose all your games either. My own team cut their manager mid League last season.

So the league is juat a waste of time so. What's tbe point of lads playing if no interest in it.

Being a club manager in Cavan must be handy money...and no pressure.

There is interest in it, just a much lesser competition and a great chance for lads on the fringes to exposure to a higher level in a club with second team, or for bringing young lads through.

I'd argue taking the league so seriously is a gimmick managers use to rip clubs off and charge more for their services with all the additional training and fitness stats. You cannot expect club players to be at peak from March to October. So I'd take it with a pinch of salt how tough the leagues are or at least how practical it is from a player welfare POV.

Whatever little joy is left in the club game is slowly being sucked away completely by these "professional" managerial setups and they always know how to charge regardless of results. Northern managers are notorious for it and they're picking up plenty of work in Cavan. Indeed in Dreadnought's own club it was a northern duo who unceremoniously got the gate. Seriously ignorant pair completely stuck up their own holes and extremely detrimental to player morale and development. 

That's it alright, I mention it above. Yes League not take as seriously (emphasis on as) but it is still played as a competition the usual club players play and use to get better. And if management has shown to be poor, they can absolutely be hooked. We suffered Championship last year because of it, but hope we push on this year

[intheknowhow]

How are teams relegated to Intermediate and Junior championships in Cavan? I understand winning is the pathway to the level above, but how do you go about going down?

1 up 1 down. Essentially the bottom 4 in the group stages play off in relegation semi finals, and then losers play relegation final when the Championship quarters, semi etc are ongoing. So overall loser relegated and replaced by below Championship winner. You have to win to move up, lose to move down

Only exception to this is when rejigging numbers, and the odd year you relegate 2 and so on. Covid also messed it here when none were relegated in 2020, but had a promotion, so 2 were relegated in 2021 and so on to rejig numbers across the 3 Championships

Your league is a farce so and handy for outside managers to make a few bob. Mess about in the league and win an odd game in champ and your grand.

Lose a few games in Monaghan and Tyrone in the league and your gone,you get found out pretty quick.

Yes, mostly. Not for the everyday club player, but mostly. Split season the issue here overall. Glad you've finally caught up

Managers still lose their jobs. Might not be as valued, but you can't lose all your games either. My own team cut their manager mid League last season.

So the league is juat a waste of time so. What's tbe point of lads playing if no interest in it.

Being a club manager in Cavan must be handy money...and no pressure.

There is interest in it, just a much lesser competition and a great chance for lads on the fringes to exposure to a higher level in a club with second team, or for bringing young lads through.

I'd argue taking the league so seriously is a gimmick managers use to rip clubs off and charge more for their services with all the additional training and fitness stats. You cannot expect club players to be at peak from March to October. So I'd take it with a pinch of salt how tough the leagues are or at least how practical it is from a player welfare POV.

Whatever little joy is left in the club game is slowly being sucked away completely by these "professional" managerial setups and they always know how to charge regardless of results. Northern managers are notorious for it and they're picking up plenty of work in Cavan. Indeed in Dreadnought's own club it was a northern duo who unceremoniously got the gate. Seriously ignorant pair completely stuck up their own holes and extremely detrimental to player morale and development. 

Very backward way of looking at it! Why would you train less than before champ?

You pay for what you get

[Look-Up!]

How are teams relegated to Intermediate and Junior championships in Cavan? I understand winning is the pathway to the level above, but how do you go about going down?

1 up 1 down. Essentially the bottom 4 in the group stages play off in relegation semi finals, and then losers play relegation final when the Championship quarters, semi etc are ongoing. So overall loser relegated and replaced by below Championship winner. You have to win to move up, lose to move down

Only exception to this is when rejigging numbers, and the odd year you relegate 2 and so on. Covid also messed it here when none were relegated in 2020, but had a promotion, so 2 were relegated in 2021 and so on to rejig numbers across the 3 Championships

Your league is a farce so and handy for outside managers to make a few bob. Mess about in the league and win an odd game in champ and your grand.

Lose a few games in Monaghan and Tyrone in the league and your gone,you get found out pretty quick.

Yes, mostly. Not for the everyday club player, but mostly. Split season the issue here overall. Glad you've finally caught up

Managers still lose their jobs. Might not be as valued, but you can't lose all your games either. My own team cut their manager mid League last season.

So the league is juat a waste of time so. What's tbe point of lads playing if no interest in it.

Being a club manager in Cavan must be handy money...and no pressure.

There is interest in it, just a much lesser competition and a great chance for lads on the fringes to exposure to a higher level in a club with second team, or for bringing young lads through.

I'd argue taking the league so seriously is a gimmick managers use to rip clubs off and charge more for their services with all the additional training and fitness stats. You cannot expect club players to be at peak from March to October. So I'd take it with a pinch of salt how tough the leagues are or at least how practical it is from a player welfare POV.

Whatever little joy is left in the club game is slowly being sucked away completely by these "professional" managerial setups and they always know how to charge regardless of results. Northern managers are notorious for it and they're picking up plenty of work in Cavan. Indeed in Dreadnought's own club it was a northern duo who unceremoniously got the gate. Seriously ignorant pair completely stuck up their own holes and extremely detrimental to player morale and development. 

Very backward way of looking at it! Why would you train less than before champ?

You pay for what you get

Of course you have to train but you need to develop players too and you won't do that by sickening a large portion of the group who you have no intention of giving any meaningful time to. Or in some cases being on players back over the Xmas long long before anything will be kicked. That's OTT for ordinary club players.

I know what they pay for. These lads are paid by the training session. Any it's always the fix for every problem, more sessions, more sessions, more sessions.

[bennydorano]

I mentioned it before, but the biggest issue seems to be they had played, and maintained their division 1 league status, and played in a junior championship. 

Had it been intermediate championship they had won, I would say people, like myself, could reconcile more with that. 

This is coming from my own point of view where, in Armagh, the leagues and championships are linked, the idea of a senior league team entering a junior championship would seem preposterous, and the outcome would be inevitable. 

In fairness, it's mad a Div 1 team, last year and this year, are playing in Junior Championship.

In south Derry you'd be looked down on if that happened. Clubs would nearly take you to court over a technicality to stay in Div. 1 and play senior championship.

If Arva were maybe Div. 1 and played Intermediate, you'd nearly let it slide but junior!  Kerry divisional teams are another joke

Regardless, the inter-county club championships are fantastic and are very enjoyable over the long winter months.  Great viewing at all levels, between the 2 codes.

At the risk of opening another can of worms, I really think the divisional sides are class as they get lads from small clubs playing a far better standard than they normally would.

Do think something needs done about them sending their 9th best to to intermediate though.

The divisional sides would struggle to be viable I imagine if there were 16 senior teams.
I posted last year about how a divisional structure could work in Armagh, I must dig it out again. Obviously hypothetical, it'll never happen.

Would love to see it in Armagh myself, posted before on it too, run the JFC as normal, when over put a couple of amalgamations/divisional sides into IFC, repeat for Intermediate teams into SFC. The success of it would be heavily reliant on team buy in. Could only be good for County football too.