Time to Split Dublin

Started by Dont Matter, September 22, 2013, 05:28:16 PM

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Is it right that Dublin got 7 million to implement a plan to dominate the GAA World?

Yes
42 (29%)
No
103 (71%)

Total Members Voted: 145

Rossfan

1.35 million vs 30 to 150k.
No wonder ye want to keep the status quo.
Davy's given us a dream to cling to
We're going to bring home the SAM

Lar Naparka

Quote from: The Hill is Blue on September 17, 2018, 03:26:13 PM
Quote from: easytiger95 on September 17, 2018, 01:40:04 PM
"In 1994, Dublin was further subdivided with Dún Laoghaire–Rathdown, Fingal and South Dublin, constituted as local government units."

You lads are making an absolute show of yourselves.


Don't feed the trolls. Dublin-hating has been a way of life since Kevin Heffernan was a boy. Let them stew in their own bile.
You are way off the mark here.
As far as GAA affairs are concerned, there has been no radical change to what was regarded as "County Dublin" when the GAA was founded and I never inferred that there had been any. The local government areas, Dublin city and county as it was then are still "Dublin" according to the rules and regulations of the GAA - and as far as I am concerned also.
GIven demographic and political changes taking place in our country, I cannot see Dublin remaining as one unit , if the GAA is to survive.
However, that is a separate issue and it has nothing to do with what we are discussing here.
The GAA is not obliged to observe political boundaries for any reason, including local government administration. Take Ballaghadereen as an example.
According to the law of the land, it is in County Roscommmon but for GAA purposes it is a Mayo club.
The GAA is not obliged to recognise ecclesiastical boundaries either. The Parish Rule that applies to the rest of the country is not observed in Dublin and this doesn't change Dublin's status in any way.
Now, what your supercilious buddy claimed when he rubbished Rossfan's post is not true What was once Dublin County, as far as local and national administration affairs are concerned, has been split into three separate counties but this has no bearing on what the GAA as a body thinks.
If he bothered to read the article he used as a reference for his erudite contribution to the discussion, he'd find that rural county Dublin, as it was pre-1994, has indeed been split into three distinct local government regions, each with its own COUNTY council.
Now, if it walks like a duck and it quacks like a duck, ergo, it's a duck!
And using language best suited to a schoolyard doesn't change the fact that Dún Laoghaire–Rathdown, Fingal and South Dublin meet the legal requirement to merit county status.
This doesn't bother the GAA nor should it but if one wanted to use sarcasm as a way of making your points, they try at least to get their facts right.
Nil Carborundum Illegitemi

Lar Naparka

Quote from: easytiger95 on September 17, 2018, 05:42:27 PM
Quote from: Lar Naparka on September 17, 2018, 02:25:52 PM
Quote from: easytiger95 on September 17, 2018, 01:40:04 PM
"In 1994, Dublin was further subdivided with Dún Laoghaire–Rathdown, Fingal and South Dublin, constituted as local government units."

You lads are making an absolute show of yourselves.
You still don't get the message.
Counties are local government units.
God between us and small farms!
I'd get more return for my efforts if I tried to push a bullock uphill with a rope.
As far as the real world is concerned there are now 28 counties in the republic.
That's according to the article you referenced to backup your original claims.
Here is the relevant excerpt one more time.
"In 1994 Dublin County Council was abolished and replaced with three separate county councils: Dún Laoghaire–Rathdown, Fingal and South Dublin.
And it gets better, the further you go:
"The total population of the three aforementioned counties and Dublin city was 1,345,402 according to the census of 2016."
My last shot at it is this, The GAA is perfectly entitled to disregard any or all of the above but that doesn't alter the fact that Rossfan was right in the first place.
Now, if you have anything constructive to ass to the argument, I'll be happy to consider it but if you persist in throwing your rattle out of your pram and resorting to cheap personal insults, I won't pamper you any further.


Good jaysis.

In the Republic of Ireland there are
26 County Councils
3 City Councils
2 City and County Councils

Which adds up to 31 LAUs (Local Authority Units) for 26 Counties.

I look forward to the case you make for splitting Galway and Cork based on their local government arrangements.

This is really embarrassing stuff lads.

There are issues for Dublin and the other 31 (that's 31 counties folks) with regard to fair funding (and what counties should be doing with that funding). But the reason Dubs fans aren't engaging with you is not because of your devastating rhetoric, but because ye constantly, constantly, undermine yourselves with transparent lies and ignorance. 31 counties in the Republic! Lord jaysis.

As I said earlier, idiocy does not deserve to be coddled.
God between us and small farms!  :D :D :D
I'd get more return for my efforts if I tried to push a bullock uphill with a rope.
As far as the real world is concerned there are now 28 counties in the republic.
That's according to the article you referenced to backup your original claims.
Here is the relevant excerpt one more time.
"In 1994 Dublin County Council was abolished and replaced with three separate county councils: Dún Laoghaire–Rathdown, Fingal and South Dublin.
And it gets better, the further you go:
"The total population of the three aforementioned counties and Dublin city was 1,345,402 according to the census of 2016."
My last shot at it is this, The GAA is perfectly entitled to disregard any or all of the above but that doesn't alter the fact that Rossfan was right in the first place.
Now, if you have anything constructive to ass to the argument, I'll be happy to consider it but if you persist in throwing your rattle out of your pram and resorting to cheap personal insults, I won't pamper you any further.
Nil Carborundum Illegitemi

easytiger95

I was arguing with syferus over his claim that Dublin was an amalgamation of four different counties- which is neither factually or grammatically correct.

The article quoted gave the date of the creation of those 4 LAUs in Dublin, which was i used it. The fact that it correctly labels them as county councils than erroneously labels them as counties is not my problem. Everyone with half a brain knows the difference between a LAU and an actual county. Google local government in Ireland and see what you find.

And now you are back tracking because you realise how stupid equating LAUs and actual counties are. You did tell us that the oireachtas had made them counties didn't you?

Good jaysis. Argue all you want about Dublin's funding but when i see morons saying Dublin should be split because Dublin is an amalgamation of 4 counties, i'll call it and them out for the stupidity it is.

You jumped on the wrong bandwagon Lar. There are a lot of thicks on this board

westbound

Quote from: easytiger95 on September 18, 2018, 01:06:23 AM
I was arguing with syferus over his claim that Dublin was an amalgamation of four different counties- which is neither factually or grammatically correct.

The article quoted gave the date of the creation of those 4 LAUs in Dublin, which was i used it. The fact that it correctly labels them as county councils than erroneously labels them as counties is not my problem. Everyone with half a brain knows the difference between a LAU and an actual county. Google local government in Ireland and see what you find.

And now you are back tracking because you realise how stupid equating LAUs and actual counties are. You did tell us that the oireachtas had made them counties didn't you?

Good jaysis. Argue all you want about Dublin's funding but when i see morons saying Dublin should be split because Dublin is an amalgamation of 4 counties, i'll call it and them out for the stupidity it is.

You jumped on the wrong bandwagon Lar. There are a lot of thicks on this board

I haven't got involved in this debate at all beacuse it's pretty pointless, but 2 questions jump out at me from your last post.

1. What is the definition of an 'actual county'?
2. What do 'county councils' govern if they don't govern counties?




Lar Naparka

Quote from: easytiger95 on September 18, 2018, 01:06:23 AM
I was arguing with syferus over his claim that Dublin was an amalgamation of four different counties- which is neither factually or grammatically correct.

The article quoted gave the date of the creation of those 4 LAUs in Dublin, which was i used it. The fact that it correctly labels them as county councils than erroneously labels them as counties is not my problem. Everyone with half a brain knows the difference between a LAU and an actual county. Google local government in Ireland and see what you find.

And now you are back tracking because you realise how stupid equating LAUs and actual counties are. You did tell us that the oireachtas had made them counties didn't you?

Good jaysis. Argue all you want about Dublin's funding but when i see morons saying Dublin should be split because Dublin is an amalgamation of 4 counties, i'll call it and them out for the stupidity it is.

You jumped on the wrong bandwagon Lar. There are a lot of thicks on this board
Now that you have chosen to drop the petty insults, I have a better idea of what you mean.
In deciding to argue a point with Rossfan, (not always a wise idea) you cited a source to back up your point of view. You linked to a Wikipedia article. Fair enough so far?
You then fundamentally disagreed with what you found there and followed with a reply to me by stating, "the fact that it correctly labels them as county councils than erroneously labels them as counties is not my problem."
Why use a source to back your case when you disagree with the main premise?
Yes, I have searched for "Local Government in Ireland, " where I found this:
"Apart from the local authorities in the counties of Dun Laoghaire, Fingal and South Dublin" and the cities of Dublin, Cork and Galway, all counties and cities and counties have been divided into municipal districts with councillors representing simultaneously the municipal district and the local authority. In total, there are 95 municipal districts in the country.
This was lifted from the website of The Local Government Management Agency
So, my friend, you now disagree with the statutory body charged with overseeing the work of al LAUs and County Councils, amongst others, as well.
No personal offence intended but hubris screams at me when I read your posts. ;D ;D
Incidentally, none of this has anything to do with Dublin GAA's affairs and is neither a case for dividing Dublin not for leaving it as it is.
Nil Carborundum Illegitemi

armaghniac

The basic point here is that an increasing population requires the State to sub divide counties in Dublin.  Are those who defend Dublin arguing that the GAA should simply ignore an increasing population imbalance, no matter how great it becomes?
If at first you don't succeed, then goto Plan B

Hound

Quote from: armaghniac on September 18, 2018, 12:52:04 PM
The basic point here is that an increasing population requires the State to sub divide counties in Dublin.  Are those who defend Dublin arguing that the GAA should simply ignore an increasing population imbalance, no matter how great it becomes?
You'd have a point if population was directly correlative with performance.

Soccer?
Hurling?
Rugby?

Maybe it's only football. Yep, split Dublin so.

armaghniac

Quote from: Hound on September 18, 2018, 01:31:57 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on September 18, 2018, 12:52:04 PM
The basic point here is that an increasing population requires the State to sub divide counties in Dublin.  Are those who defend Dublin arguing that the GAA should simply ignore an increasing population imbalance, no matter how great it becomes?
You'd have a point if population was directly correlative with performance.

Soccer?
Hurling?
Rugby?

Maybe it's only football. Yep, split Dublin so.

Population is not entirely correlative with performance, but a big pick beats a smaller pick over time.

But since you mention soccer. There are 10 "premier" league of Ireland teams, 3 of these are in Dublin, which is approximately proportionate.
If at first you don't succeed, then goto Plan B

Hound

Quote from: armaghniac on September 18, 2018, 02:20:09 PM
Quote from: Hound on September 18, 2018, 01:31:57 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on September 18, 2018, 12:52:04 PM
The basic point here is that an increasing population requires the State to sub divide counties in Dublin.  Are those who defend Dublin arguing that the GAA should simply ignore an increasing population imbalance, no matter how great it becomes?
You'd have a point if population was directly correlative with performance.

Soccer?
Hurling?
Rugby?

Maybe it's only football. Yep, split Dublin so.

Population is not entirely correlative with performance, but a big pick beats a smaller pick over time.

But since you mention soccer. There are 10 "premier" league of Ireland teams, 3 of these are in Dublin, which is approximately proportionate.

NZ rugby doesn't seem to get weaker over time, nor Chinese soccer.
No more than you, it's easy to pick apples and oranges, but saying Dublin needs to be split because of 1.35m population is total nonsense.

The soccer is a good comparison, given the % numbers playing soccer in Dublin compared to the rest of the country.

Adults playing football, stripping out the non-Dubs playing in Dublin, would be a better comparison. We'd still have the most, but the discrepancy wouldnt be near as high.

westbound

Comparing professional sports is actually a terrible comparison. Players can freely move clubs in professional sports therefore neutralising the population discrepancy.




Rossfan

Splitting Dublin is totally logical FULL STOP
Davy's given us a dream to cling to
We're going to bring home the SAM

The Hill is Blue

Quote from: armaghniac on September 18, 2018, 12:52:04 PM
The basic point here is that an increasing population requires the State to sub divide counties in Dublin.  Are those who defend Dublin arguing that the GAA should simply ignore an increasing population imbalance, no matter how great it becomes?

How about amalgamating counties who feel they can't compete?
I remember Dublin City in the Rare Old Times http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9T7OaDDR7i8

Rossfan

Start your own thread on that so!
Davy's given us a dream to cling to
We're going to bring home the SAM

armaghniac

#734
Quote from: Hound on September 18, 2018, 02:43:43 PM
Adults playing football, stripping out the non-Dubs playing in Dublin, would be a better comparison. We'd still have the most, but the discrepancy wouldnt be near as high.

That's because Dublin clubs are a ridiculous size.


Quote from: westbound on September 18, 2018, 02:54:02 PM
Comparing professional sports is actually a terrible comparison. Players can freely move clubs in professional sports therefore neutralising the population discrepancy.

yes and no. Big teams buy big players and these are in big cities in general.

Quote from: The Hill is Blue on September 18, 2018, 05:51:05 PM
How about amalgamating counties who feel they can't compete?

There are a range of counties of very broadly the same size; Kerry, Mayo, Meath, Tyrone etc  and there are some a bit smaller who compete well at times, like Monaghan or Offaly, and a few whose small population makes it difficult. If the smaller counties wish to combine there is a case for this. But they mostly affect themselves. Having one ridiculously big county undermines competition in the normal counties in a way that a few small counties do not.

But all this stuff about soccer and small counties does nothing to support Dublin's position, stop trying to divert debate .
If at first you don't succeed, then goto Plan B