26 County General Election 2020

[macdanger2]

How exactly did FF and FG "create the pension crisis"?
By not legalising Euthanasia?
By not making Euthanasia compulsory?

Jases Angelo you're shinnerbotism at its worst

Well first of all, I'd like to draw attention to the idiocy of this post.

You seem to be alluding to the fact that the pension crisis was a magical creation that happened out of thin air? The contradiction here is that you are ashamed to admit your FF/FG allegiance, yet you are one of their most ardent apologists here, consistently out here defending the indefensible for them.

The pensions crisis arose from gross mismanagement by both FF/FG. You obviously seem to be under the delusion that government makes no policy on pension contributions and entitlements, that government takes no role in fiscal management and that government and that government takes no responsibility for forward planning and contingencies when it comes to meeting those entitlements. A government in your eyes does not take any accountability for the gross incompetence and abuse of power that FF/FG have had throughout their control on the state.

The real roots of the pension issue are the bloated public sector pensions that the two establishment parties introduced and failed to address before it was too late and a pension crisis ensued.

Wink wink, nudge nudge politics that FF and FG engage in is the type of government that will bring you from one scandal into the next and I guess they're chuffed to know they'll still have a few village idiots like yourself to put a tick beside them in the ballot box.

The fact you're spouting on about euthanasia shows the level of intelligence of your average FF/FG hick.

It's a global issue largely related to demographic changes i.e. people living longer and having fewer children, therefore more pensioners with less working people to support them.
It is not an Irish or FF/FG specific issue.
The SF "solution" that "demographics will look after it" is laughable! The demographic changes are what has caused the problem! Mary-Lou reckons having SF in office will mean we'll suddenly revert to having 5 kids per household.

That's not true though, it's a bloated public service pension that is a crux of the matter and neither FF or FG took any steps to tackle the system until it was too late.

The old scheme, which applies to those hired before 2013, offers those on full 40-year service a pension equal to 50 per cent of final salary, index linked to future public pay increases and with a tax-free lump sum of 1½ times annual salary on retirement.

So someone on around €66,000 with full service would get a tax-free lump sum of around €100,000 on departure, and then a generous pension entitlement. This has generally been an unfunded pay-as-you scheme, though some groups, including teachers, have paid contributions. It is, on any calculation, an extraordinary perk.

First, a new scheme was created, the so-called single scheme, which pared back the entitlements for those joining after January 1st, 2013. Pensions for newer entrants are based on career average earnings, and are index-linked based on inflation rather than tied to public sector wage rises.

Second, a pension-related deduction was introduced for public servants as one of the crisis measures, and this was subsequently transformed – in slightly less onerous form – into an ongoing additional contribution to their pension (the so-called ACS).

This has left pre-2013 public servants with a sweet deal despite the fact they are paying a bit more. The civil service pension scheme website, for example, calculates that to buy the benefits available to a higher executive officer on retirement would require someone in the private sector to have a pension pot of €690,000, while for a principal officer the sum rises to €1.34 million.

Those public sector pension levels are obscene compared to the rest of Europe.

I don't disagree with you on the pensions but is any party willing to address it?

I don't know.

But I think pulling up SF on it when ignoring the parties that caused it the first place is as blinkered as it gets.

I don't think anyone is pulling SF up on the pensions issue other than saying that not increasing the pension age isn't a solution. It would seem from what you posted above that the changes made in 2013 have at least improved the situation

[trueblue1234]

Genuinely not having a go, as I'm not particularly up-to-speed on Irish politics and affairs, but how can there be full employment with rising levels of homelessness?
Something doesn't add up there.

Perhaps economics wasn't your strongest subject. The people in the good jobs outbid people in the less well paid jobs for the available accommodation. Employment has risen quickly in recent years and wages have risen, the amount of accommodation couldn't increase as quickly.

The problem is the rental market. Private landlords are making an absolute killing out of it, young people who are working in decent jobs are paying extortionate rents and unable to get access to mortgages to afford a house of their own so they will continue to be drained by the rental market. FF/FG policy has incentivised wealthy people and vulture funds to hoard residential property as investments as they can hugely profit out of a crazy rental market.

What policy have government brought in to regulate and control this rental market? Very little and the little they have has been full of loopholes as the rental market continues to rise and landlords continue to find ways to increase the rental prices.

There is also the little commented about fact that there are over 60 sitting FF/FG TDs who are residential landlords and who stand to benefit from an out of control rental market.

There has been changes in the north over the last number of years with regards to how much of your rental income can be offset against the finance (Mortgage) which has made buy to let much less appealing. In the South can you still offset the full mortgage against the rental income? Surely some changes along those lines will have an impact?     

[Angelo]

How exactly did FF and FG "create the pension crisis"?
By not legalising Euthanasia?
By not making Euthanasia compulsory?

Jases Angelo you're shinnerbotism at its worst

Well first of all, I'd like to draw attention to the idiocy of this post.

You seem to be alluding to the fact that the pension crisis was a magical creation that happened out of thin air? The contradiction here is that you are ashamed to admit your FF/FG allegiance, yet you are one of their most ardent apologists here, consistently out here defending the indefensible for them.

The pensions crisis arose from gross mismanagement by both FF/FG. You obviously seem to be under the delusion that government makes no policy on pension contributions and entitlements, that government takes no role in fiscal management and that government and that government takes no responsibility for forward planning and contingencies when it comes to meeting those entitlements. A government in your eyes does not take any accountability for the gross incompetence and abuse of power that FF/FG have had throughout their control on the state.

The real roots of the pension issue are the bloated public sector pensions that the two establishment parties introduced and failed to address before it was too late and a pension crisis ensued.

Wink wink, nudge nudge politics that FF and FG engage in is the type of government that will bring you from one scandal into the next and I guess they're chuffed to know they'll still have a few village idiots like yourself to put a tick beside them in the ballot box.

The fact you're spouting on about euthanasia shows the level of intelligence of your average FF/FG hick.

It's a global issue largely related to demographic changes i.e. people living longer and having fewer children, therefore more pensioners with less working people to support them.
It is not an Irish or FF/FG specific issue.
The SF "solution" that "demographics will look after it" is laughable! The demographic changes are what has caused the problem! Mary-Lou reckons having SF in office will mean we'll suddenly revert to having 5 kids per household.

That's not true though, it's a bloated public service pension that is a crux of the matter and neither FF or FG took any steps to tackle the system until it was too late.

The old scheme, which applies to those hired before 2013, offers those on full 40-year service a pension equal to 50 per cent of final salary, index linked to future public pay increases and with a tax-free lump sum of 1½ times annual salary on retirement.

So someone on around €66,000 with full service would get a tax-free lump sum of around €100,000 on departure, and then a generous pension entitlement. This has generally been an unfunded pay-as-you scheme, though some groups, including teachers, have paid contributions. It is, on any calculation, an extraordinary perk.

First, a new scheme was created, the so-called single scheme, which pared back the entitlements for those joining after January 1st, 2013. Pensions for newer entrants are based on career average earnings, and are index-linked based on inflation rather than tied to public sector wage rises.

Second, a pension-related deduction was introduced for public servants as one of the crisis measures, and this was subsequently transformed – in slightly less onerous form – into an ongoing additional contribution to their pension (the so-called ACS).

This has left pre-2013 public servants with a sweet deal despite the fact they are paying a bit more. The civil service pension scheme website, for example, calculates that to buy the benefits available to a higher executive officer on retirement would require someone in the private sector to have a pension pot of €690,000, while for a principal officer the sum rises to €1.34 million.

Those public sector pension levels are obscene compared to the rest of Europe.

I don't disagree with you on the pensions but is any party willing to address it?

I don't know.

But I think pulling up SF on it when ignoring the parties that caused it the first place is as blinkered as it gets.

I don't think anyone is pulling SF up on the pensions issue other than saying that not increasing the pension age isn't a solution. It would seem from what you posted above that the changes made in 2013 have at least improved the situation

The poster I initially pulled up on was, the crux of the matter is a badly managed, overinflated and unfunded public service pension is the cause of this issue brought to you by FF and FG. Should people who have worked hard all their lives and paid their taxes be punitively punished in order to pay for the big pensions of those who benefit from the mismanagement of FG and FF?

They haven't improved the situation, the crisis is there and it was caused by mismanagement by FF/FG.

Closing the gate after the horse has bolted comes to mind.

[brokencrossbar1]

The use of the killing of Paul Quinn is opportunistic to say the least. As you say no one iota of concern have people got for poor Briege Quinn nor do they actually know the facts. I need to be careful what I say but in terms of what was said by Murphy all I'll say is that not everything is black and white. The Quinn family are being used and that's the disgusting thing about it all.

Briege Quinn has been blue in the face for years calling for political accountability for the torture and murder of her son.

Yes she has and where have FF and FG been for the last 13 years?  This is a dogs on the street situation but the police cannot convict anyone with that type of evidence. The dogs on the street know what happened and the dogs on the street know why it happened. Not one fcuk was given about her till she became a political weapon. That's the disgusting thing.

[armaghniac]

Those public sector pension levels are obscene compared to the rest of Europe.

The Irish public sector pension scheme is fairly typical of Europe and less generous than many places, e.g. Germany. The salaries in Ireland may be higher in some cases and of course politicians did get ridiculous pensions. 
The problem in Ireland is not public service pensions, but that so many in the private sector do not have pensions and the general pension is not properly pay related.

The problem is that for decades the 26 had bloated public sector pension entitlements that were completely unfunded by public sector workers. That is absolute incompetence of the highest order from the two establishment parties and the reason for the current crisis.

The government is a going concern, it doesn't make sense for them to put aside large amounts of money, which would probably have to be borrowed, to pay pensions in the future. They just put a proportion of expenditure each year towards pay and a proportion for pensions, the only issue here was that people were living longer. That said, the FF government did have a pension fund to address these issues which was then given to private sector speculators in  the crash.

The poster I initially pulled up on was, the crux of the matter is a badly managed, overinflated and unfunded public service pension is the cause of this issue brought to you by FF and FG. Should people who have worked hard all their lives and paid their taxes be punitively punished in order to pay for the big pensions of those who benefit from the mismanagement of FG and FF?

They haven't improved the situation, the crisis is there and it was caused by mismanagement by FF/FG.

Closing the gate after the horse has bolted comes to mind.

The public service pension was not mismanaged and  is neither here nor there in this discussion.

[five points]

Briege Quinn has been blue in the face for years calling for political accountability for the torture and murder of her son.

Yes she has and where have FF and FG been for the last 13 years?  This is a dogs on the street situation but the police cannot convict anyone with that type of evidence. The dogs on the street know what happened and the dogs on the street know why it happened. Not one fcuk was given about her till she became a political weapon. That's the disgusting thing.

In politics, you strike while the iron is hot. If Briege Quinn wants accountability now, then good luck to her if she gets it.

[Angelo]

Those public sector pension levels are obscene compared to the rest of Europe.

The Irish public sector pension scheme is fairly typical of Europe and less generous than many places, e.g. Germany. The salaries in Ireland may be higher in some cases and of course politicians did get ridiculous pensions. 
The problem in Ireland is not public service pensions, but that so many in the private sector do not have pensions and the general pension is not properly pay related.

The problem is that for decades the 26 had bloated public sector pension entitlements that were completely unfunded by public sector workers. That is absolute incompetence of the highest order from the two establishment parties and the reason for the current crisis.

The government is a going concern, it doesn't make sense for them to put aside large amounts of money, which would probably have to be borrowed, to pay pensions in the future. They just put a proportion of expenditure each year towards pay and a proportion for pensions, the only issue here was that people were living longer. That said, the FF government did have a pension fund to address these issues which was then given to private sector speculators in  the crash.

That is absolute insanity.

When you offer overinflated pensions to public sector workers and you allow for it to be completely unfunded by then you give rise to a pension crisis. You are defending the indefensible here. The fact that FF then pissed away the rest of any pension fund bailing out gamblers tells you all need to know about the cause of the pension crisis.

[Angelo]

Will the victims of The Stardust fire or the Dublin/Monaghan bombings ever get justice and accountability?

[armaghniac]

There has been changes in the north over the last number of years with regards to how much of your rental income can be offset against the finance (Mortgage) which has made buy to let much less appealing. In the South can you still offset the full mortgage against the rental income? Surely some changes along those lines will have an impact?   

Of course, all these measures increase rent further.

[Baile Brigín 2]

shock horror, the establishment and there national media lapdogs are trying to smear the new kid in the playground. The Quinn family will feel justified to bring it up now when opinion suggests SF are on the cusp but as snap says the West Brit control freaks won't give a toss for the Quinn case in a weeks time. Lost a lot of respect for Miriam O Callaghan last night, seem intent on badgering Mc Donald at every turn and constantly talking over her. Hope the southern electorate see all this for what it is and vote accordingly.

Its senior hurling now

[Baile Brigín 2]

Genuinely not having a go, as I'm not particularly up-to-speed on Irish politics and affairs, but how can there be full employment with rising levels of homelessness?
Something doesn't add up there.

A shortage of housing means that rents have gone through the roof so that even people with jobs may not be able to afford rent / may have f*ck all leftover after paying rent. Increasing the supply of housing (increased supply to meet demand will reduce rent) is basically the only way to resolve this but that takes time

They have had 8 years. The housing market works exactly as designed.

[Angelo]

The public service pension was not mismanaged and  is neither here nor there in this discussion.

Not mismanaged? It was overly generous to public sector workers and completely unfunded by them. How on earth can you say it was not mismanaged when there's now complete pay inequality in the public sector and the next generation are the ones who pay the price to fund these overinflated pensions?

[five points]

There has been changes in the north over the last number of years with regards to how much of your rental income can be offset against the finance (Mortgage) which has made buy to let much less appealing. In the South can you still offset the full mortgage against the rental income? Surely some changes along those lines will have an impact?   

That was tried in 2009, when only 75% of the mortgage interest was allowed against tax. It backfired as it scared off new investors. A few years later we had a housing shortage which through neglect has morphed into a full blown disaster.

[Angelo]

Genuinely not having a go, as I'm not particularly up-to-speed on Irish politics and affairs, but how can there be full employment with rising levels of homelessness?
Something doesn't add up there.

A shortage of housing means that rents have gone through the roof so that even people with jobs may not be able to afford rent / may have f*ck all leftover after paying rent. Increasing the supply of housing (increased supply to meet demand will reduce rent) is basically the only way to resolve this but that takes time

They have had 8 years. The housing market works exactly as designed.

Precisely.

60 FF/FG landlords in power, why would they have any interest in solving an out of control rental market?

[Rossfan]

SF should make "Angelo" their finance spokesman.
He or she is pure comedy gold.
Who do I apply to for one of the €65,000 houses?