Refugees

Started by Mayo4Sam14, September 03, 2015, 04:42:21 PM

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give her dixie

Quote from: armaghniac on September 16, 2015, 12:12:14 AM
Quote from: give her dixie on September 15, 2015, 11:57:59 PM
So you're saying that the thousands and thousands of Irish who entered the US without correct paperwork "Invaded" the place?

I have heard many stories about immigration from Ireland, but this is the 1st that I have heard it called an "Invasion"

The number of Irish arriving in the US is largely immaterial to the size of the US population and didn't change its composition as it had always had a significant proportion of Irish people. I don't condone Irish people breaking the law in the US either, but in most cases they simply overstayed a visa, so they US knew who they were and the issue arose in how long they stayed. The actual identity of at least some of those in Calais is in question. Perhaps you think that the US should turf out the illegal Irish and take an equivalent number of Syrians?

On a related subject Google will match the first 5m of donations
https://onetoday.google.com/page/refugeerelief?c=IE

would you like a spade or a shovel to keep digging with?
next stop, September 10, for number 4......

muppet

Quote from: whitey on September 16, 2015, 12:39:21 AM
Are people afraid that the migrants/refugees won't assimilate and we'll end up with a situation like in England with Hate preachers, grooming gangs and jihadists.

Maybe I'm not paying attention to all news sources, but when the likes of that cvnt Choudry starts up with his hate speech in London, why aren't  there 5000 decent Muslims out there counter protesting shouting him down?

The vast majority of Muslims are decent people but the only ones we hear about are the bad ones.

If anyone thinks we can't all live peacefully side by side should read this article

http://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/people/gaa-club-s-integration-policy-pays-off-in-ireland-s-most-ethnically-diverse-town-1.2237262

Good article and a good point.
MWWSI 2017

Lar Naparka

I saw Alan Kelly being interviewed about the present refugee crisis on RTE last Tuesday and I'm still incensed by what he had to say. Looking straight at the camera, he delivered his final punch line, like a teacher admonishing his naughty pupils. Something along the lines of Michael Noonan chiding those who had thought  we get our public water supply for nothing.
"You must realise," sez Kelly, " that many of the Syrians coming in are highly qualified people in their own right. They will be a positive addition to our society."
IMHO, there is a far better chance of a Syrian surgeon wielding a mop and bucket in some fast food restaurant than there is of him or her handling a scalpel in some major hospital in the near future.
EIther the bustard knows that incoming refugees are being shamefully exploited in the labour market or else he is living in fairy land.
While I'm at it, we seem to have a higher than average number of the pseudo Liberal party on this board. I may be wrong but I can't  recall a single poster who says he, she or it ( given the nature of some of the posts here, I'm including all options) welcomes the refugees into our country and then make no mention of the fate that awaits them when they go looking for work.
t's a case of  "I'm alright,  Jack. You are welcome as long as you get to the back of the queue and don't threaten my job or expect me to do anything about the way you are being treated by unscrupulous employers."
It's long known that the softest part of Paddy the employer is his teeth.
I hate to see anyone being exploited, whether they are poor hoors coming here, desperate for work or any my fellow-citizens  who have to compete with them at the bottom of the pay scale. It doesn't matter whether someone is from Pollawaddy or Poland, at best, all any of them can expect is a zero hour, minimum wage job.
I may be wrong and some of the welcome to all to all brigade may know otherwise, but I don't know of a single non-national with professional qualifications who has walked into any sort of job other than a menial one.
Remember the Greyhonud recycling controversy that erupted lasy year when employees went on strike over their pay and conditions? Straightaway the company brought in scab labour to take their jobs.
It transpired that the workers, non-nationals and Irish alike, were getting just €300 a week when  the company announced pay cuts. Others were desperate enough to rush forward looking to take their jobs. I believe I was the only one on this board to highlight this and all I got was a single reply, expressing surprise that the pay and conditions were so bad.
It's a mystery to me why individuals  should tell the world that all are welcome when they haven't an  effin' clue about what lies ahead of those who take the welcome at face value.
Nil Carborundum Illegitemi

macdanger2

You're largely correct Lar although you're talking about a number of entirely separate issues. The question of taking in refugees rather than leaving them to die is what we are currently talking about in terms of accepting people into this country. How they are treated is important though and you're right, they should be afforded the same rights and opportunities as any Irish worker.

QuoteI may be wrong and some of the welcome to all to all brigade may know otherwise, but I don't know of a single non-national with professional qualifications who has walked into any sort of job other than a menial one.

You don't know any non-national who is working in a job other than a menial one?? Are you for real?? Not even a British or American?? You need to get out more Lar

QuoteIt transpired that the workers, non-nationals and Irish alike, were getting just €300 a week when  the company announced pay cuts. Others were desperate enough to rush forward looking to take their jobs.

This has nothing to do with immigrant workers here never mind refugees!!! It's unscrupulous Irish employers (and consumers) as well as lax regulation and / or enforcement of the regulations.


foxcommander

Good to see we've got our priorities straight...


First meeting of Irish Refugee Protection Programme Taskforce

The first meeting of the Irish Refugee Protection Programme Taskforce was held yesterday afternoon.

Chaired by Minister for Justice Frances Fitzgerald, the taskforce has brought together all of the Government Departments and agencies, including the local authorities, the UNHCR and the Irish Red Cross, to drive all of actions to implement the Programme.

The taskforce was advised that the first arrivals under the Irish Refugee Protection Programme are expected within weeks.

There was discussion on the roles and responsibilities of each organisation, with all expressing their willingness to engage fully it what needs to be done to implement the Government decision to establish the programme.

It was agreed that a number of key strands will be prioritised, including:

Work on providing accommodation for people granted refugees status will be led by the Department of the Environment and the city and county managers;

The Irish Red Cross will take the lead role in assessing and co-ordinating offers of public support and assistance, including accommodation.

The Red Cross will be communicating with people who have offered support in the coming days and has commenced the profiling of offers of support and accommodation;

The Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade will have a key role in engaging with the NGO community;

The Department of Justice and Equality and the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner will take the lead in the process of relocating persons to Ireland, the refugee assessment process and the establishment of Emergency Relocations and Orientation Centres;

Other Departments and agencies such as Health, Education, Social Protection, HSE and Tusla will implement the measures required to provide health, educational, welfare and other such services and supports.

An extensive programme of actions was identified and agreed which is now being taken forward.

Ms Fitzgerald will brief the Government on the meeting and the taskforce will meet again shortly to review progress.

John Roche, head of National and International Services for the Irish Red Cross, has said the situation is manageable due to the number of people Ireland will be accepting and the fact that their arrival will be staggered over a period of time.

Speaking to RTÉ News, he said all of the organisations involved will be working to get people settled into longer permanent, self contained accommodation which will be co-ordinated with local county councils.
Every second of the day there's a Democrat telling a lie

Lar Naparka

Quote from: macdanger2 on September 16, 2015, 01:29:41 PM
You're largely correct Lar although you're talking about a number of entirely separate issues. The question of taking in refugees rather than leaving them to die is what we are currently talking about in terms of accepting people into this country. How they are treated is important though and you're right, they should be afforded the same rights and opportunities as any Irish worker.

QuoteI may be wrong and some of the welcome to all to all brigade may know otherwise, but I don't know of a single non-national with professional qualifications who has walked into any sort of job other than a menial one.

You don't know any non-national who is working in a job other than a menial one?? Are you for real?? Not even a British or American?? You need to get out more Lar

QuoteIt transpired that the workers, non-nationals and Irish alike, were getting just €300 a week when  the company announced pay cuts. Others were desperate enough to rush forward looking to take their jobs.

This has nothing to do with immigrant workers here never mind refugees!!! It's unscrupulous Irish employers (and consumers) as well as lax regulation and / or enforcement of the regulations.

You don't know any non-national who is working in a job other than a menial one?? Are you for real?? Not even a British or American?? You need to get out more Lar

Ah, FFS Mac, you can do better than that surely! ;D ;D
How many Americans or Brits do you know who have arrived here, unable to speak the language, don't know their rights and are desperate to get a job of any sort? Or how many of them are refugees of any sort?
How many Armenian architects or Syrian surgeons have you come across who have found work in their own specialist fields?

This (Greyhound) has nothing to do with immigrant workers here never mind refugees!!! It's unscrupulous Irish employers (and consumers) as well as lax regulation and / or enforcement of the regulations.
With due (ie feck all) respect, I beg to differ. It's very much about the point I'm making. It definitely is unscrupulous Irish employers etc etc. who are the culprits here. The reason is that no one seems to care or even be aware of what's going on in the general employment sector.
Yeah, I know this topic is about the present crisis but I thought I made it clear that I was thinking of the influx of refugees that began around 2008, at the height of the boom. Maybe that part of the reason why
we differ on some points. 
Nil Carborundum Illegitemi

foxcommander

Rioting to get into Hungary isn't going to do anyone any favours.
I find it strange that people fleeing violence will use it themselves. Surely if your priority was safety then being anywhere else in the world bar the place you're in danger would be good enough?
Every second of the day there's a Democrat telling a lie

macdanger2

Quote from: foxcommander on September 16, 2015, 10:07:13 PM
Rioting to get into Hungary isn't going to do anyone any favours.
I find it strange that people fleeing violence will use it themselves. Surely if your priority was safety then being anywhere else in the world bar the place you're in danger would be good enough?

Standing patiently in line would do the trick I suppose??

macdanger2

Quote from: Lar Naparka on September 16, 2015, 09:45:30 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on September 16, 2015, 01:29:41 PM
You're largely correct Lar although you're talking about a number of entirely separate issues. The question of taking in refugees rather than leaving them to die is what we are currently talking about in terms of accepting people into this country. How they are treated is important though and you're right, they should be afforded the same rights and opportunities as any Irish worker.

QuoteI may be wrong and some of the welcome to all to all brigade may know otherwise, but I don't know of a single non-national with professional qualifications who has walked into any sort of job other than a menial one.

You don't know any non-national who is working in a job other than a menial one?? Are you for real?? Not even a British or American?? You need to get out more Lar

QuoteIt transpired that the workers, non-nationals and Irish alike, were getting just €300 a week when  the company announced pay cuts. Others were desperate enough to rush forward looking to take their jobs.

This has nothing to do with immigrant workers here never mind refugees!!! It's unscrupulous Irish employers (and consumers) as well as lax regulation and / or enforcement of the regulations.

You don't know any non-national who is working in a job other than a menial one?? Are you for real?? Not even a British or American?? You need to get out more Lar

Ah, FFS Mac, you can do better than that surely! ;D ;D
How many Americans or Brits do you know who have arrived here, unable to speak the language, don't know their rights and are desperate to get a job of any sort? Or how many of them are refugees of any sort?
How many Armenian architects or Syrian surgeons have you come across who have found work in their own specialist fields?

This (Greyhound) has nothing to do with immigrant workers here never mind refugees!!! It's unscrupulous Irish employers (and consumers) as well as lax regulation and / or enforcement of the regulations.
With due (ie feck all) respect, I beg to differ. It's very much about the point I'm making. It definitely is unscrupulous Irish employers etc etc. who are the culprits here. The reason is that no one seems to care or even be aware of what's going on in the general employment sector.
Yeah, I know this topic is about the present crisis but I thought I made it clear that I was thinking of the influx of refugees that began around 2008, at the height of the boom. Maybe that part of the reason why
we differ on some points.

So when you talk about non-nationals Lar, you're talking about non-English speakers?? Immigrants? Or refugees? Is your assertion that none work in specialised fields based on your actual experience or just an assumption?


foxcommander

Quote from: macdanger2 on September 16, 2015, 10:14:19 PM
Quote from: foxcommander on September 16, 2015, 10:07:13 PM
Rioting to get into Hungary isn't going to do anyone any favours.
I find it strange that people fleeing violence will use it themselves. Surely if your priority was safety then being anywhere else in the world bar the place you're in danger would be good enough?

Standing patiently in line would do the trick I suppose??

I can't wait to try the same trick next time I'm in the immigration line at JFK...

Does being a refugee give you licence to bypass any law you feel is unjust? Surely those who are looking for another state to help them should be somewhat respectful there is a due process involved.
Every second of the day there's a Democrat telling a lie

macdanger2

Quote from: foxcommander on September 16, 2015, 10:33:07 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on September 16, 2015, 10:14:19 PM
Quote from: foxcommander on September 16, 2015, 10:07:13 PM
Rioting to get into Hungary isn't going to do anyone any favours.
I find it strange that people fleeing violence will use it themselves. Surely if your priority was safety then being anywhere else in the world bar the place you're in danger would be good enough?

Standing patiently in line would do the trick I suppose??

I can't wait to try the same trick next time I'm in the immigration line at JFK...

Does being a refugee give you licence to bypass any law you feel is unjust? Surely those who are looking for another state to help them should be somewhat respectful there is a due process involved.

So what would you suggest they do?

give her dixie

Throughout the carpet bombing of the Middle East for over 10 years now, Ireland has allowed the USA to use
Shannon airport as a stopping ground for soldiers, arms, and rendition flights to bring people to torture chambers.

I questioned a FF TD and a FF Senator as to why they allowed this to happen. Both told me it was good for the economy.

So if Ireland was willing to take the quick buck and turn a blind eye to their role in the bloodshed in the Middle East, then
they need to step forward and use that money to help the thousands of refugees that we are to take.

Our history, both recent and longer is littered with stories of mass immigration. We were world leaders at it. I was one of them.
Everywhere I went I get treated with dignity and respect, and no shortage of generosity. The tables have now turned on Ireland
and other EU countries, and we owe it to those now migrating here fleeing conflict a warm hand and a bit of understanding.
Not only do we owe it to ourselves, our ancestors, but to humanity.

When we look back at the images we are now seeing in 10 or 20 years time, what will we say to our children?


next stop, September 10, for number 4......

Rossfan

Hopefully we can say we were more generous than the disgraceful Hungarians, Slovaks, Czechs and Poles.
Those weren't very nice to non Aryans in the 1940s either.
Davy's given us a dream to cling to
We're going to bring home the SAM

give her dixie

#163
Quote from: Rossfan on September 17, 2015, 12:14:38 AM
Hopefully we can say we were more generous than the disgraceful Hungarians, Slovaks, Czechs and Poles.
Those weren't very nice to non Aryans in the 1940s either.

Unreal scenes there today 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEeW0-gFHKI&feature=youtu.be
next stop, September 10, for number 4......

armaghniac

Quote from: Rossfan on September 17, 2015, 12:14:38 AM
Hopefully we can say we were more generous than the disgraceful Hungarians, Slovaks, Czechs and Poles.
Those weren't very nice to non Aryans in the 1940s either.

This comment is not worthy.
Hungary is coming into the limelight now because of its geographical position, it is easy to be superior about this from a distance. If more distant countries agreed on what to do then there wouldn't be problem in Hungary. In the1940s Hungary had some anti Jewish measures, but resisted demands from the Germans to hand over the Jewish population. I'm not sure that I agree with the Visegrad Group in the EU negotiations, but the rest have nothing much to be proud of either. 
If at first you don't succeed, then goto Plan B