Hamas attack Israel & subsequent genocide

Itchy · October 23, 2023, 09:42:43 AM

I deleted my posts directed at Milltown and I have sent him a PM to apologise for my comments towards him.

trailer · October 23, 2023, 10:11:40 AM

Paddy finding out that you can't run with the hare and hunt with the hounds. Will this nerd get-together still go ahead?

seafoid · October 23, 2023, 10:42:30 AM

Israel says Gaza operation may take months but 1.5 m Gazans are displaced , Israel will not feed them even though under the Geneva Conventions as the occupier it is required to do so and public opinion is turning against Israel

Turkish aid https://twitter.com/trtworld/status/1716153796517068911
Montreal https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3E3RISVxrR8
Spain Soc BDS https://twitter.com/ChrisHu34451470/status/1714843415039606787
Egyptian woman https://twitter.com/Lowkey0nline/status/1715345403875340542
Palestinian flag UK https://twitter.com/mikecmorgan/status/1715708735643877534
Egypt https://twitter.com/MaxBlumenthal/status/1715401519082660206
Yemen https://twitter.com/Kuffiyateam/status/1710700102967296419

seafoid · October 23, 2023, 10:45:19 AM

Quote from: Hound on October 23, 2023, 09:32:49 AMThe Israeli ambassador is a mirror image of itchy. Unless you are 100% with them, then you are not neutral, there is no room for looking at any other side.

I see itchy totally lost himself last night, not for the first time. He's deleted all of his posts thankfully to mitigate his embarrassment. Hope all is okay.

The Israeli ambassador is an ideologue who is trying to foist an alternative reality on the people of Ireland
Itchy is a Cavan fan who is concerned about the loss of life in Gaza.
You cannot compare the 2

There is no equivalence in the Israeli/Palestinian conflict. Israel is a predator/victim. This is something psychiatric

Hound · October 23, 2023, 12:07:17 PM

Quote from: seafoid on October 23, 2023, 10:45:19 AM
Quote from: Hound on October 23, 2023, 09:32:49 AMThe Israeli ambassador is a mirror image of itchy. Unless you are 100% with them, then you are not neutral, there is no room for looking at any other side.

I see itchy totally lost himself last night, not for the first time. He's deleted all of his posts thankfully to mitigate his embarrassment. Hope all is okay.
The Israeli ambassador is an ideologue who is trying to foist an alternative reality on the people of Ireland
Itchy is a Cavan fan who is concerned about the loss of life in Gaza.
You cannot compare the 2

There is no equivalence in the Israeli/Palestinian conflict. Israel is a predator/victim. This is something psychiatric

Wrongs committed on both sides need to be condemned, as the Irish government and president have been doing.

Dougal Maguire · October 23, 2023, 01:17:16 PM

Quote from: Hound on October 23, 2023, 09:32:49 AMThe Israeli ambassador is a mirror image of itchy. Unless you are 100% with them, then you are not neutral, there is no room for looking at any other side.

I see itchy totally lost himself last night, not for the first time. He's deleted all of his posts thankfully to mitigate his embarrassment. Hope all is okay.

So if he's done that is there any need for you to rub it in?

seafoid · October 23, 2023, 02:04:01 PM

Quote from: Hound on October 23, 2023, 12:07:17 PM
Quote from: seafoid on October 23, 2023, 10:45:19 AM
Quote from: Hound on October 23, 2023, 09:32:49 AMThe Israeli ambassador is a mirror image of itchy. Unless you are 100% with them, then you are not neutral, there is no room for looking at any other side.

I see itchy totally lost himself last night, not for the first time. He's deleted all of his posts thankfully to mitigate his embarrassment. Hope all is okay.
The Israeli ambassador is an ideologue who is trying to foist an alternative reality on the people of Ireland
Itchy is a Cavan fan who is concerned about the loss of life in Gaza.
You cannot compare the 2

There is no equivalence in the Israeli/Palestinian conflict. Israel is a predator/victim. This is something psychiatric

Wrongs committed on both sides need to be condemned, as the Irish government and president have been doing.

Israel has displaced 1.5 m people , killed over 100 children and bombed hospitals. It is also running a total siege. There is no equivalence to what Hamas did.

Armagh18 · October 23, 2023, 02:06:19 PM

Nearly 5k killed in last few weeks according to BBC

Milltown Row2 · October 23, 2023, 02:14:31 PM

Exactly Dougal, Sometimes we go down a rabbit hole and get lost in emotions and say things we probably shouldn't say or we'd defo not say to someone face to face, that's the forum way, it is great btw, but a small reflection of how people think on this wee island.

We are starting to become more left or more right... We are certainly less center and that will cause more friction and annoyance.

Look after your own and families welfare first, we have no control on what goes on in those conflicts around the world and jabbering on here about won't change that.

I'm thick skinned Itchy, years of refereeing will do that so no need to appolgise to me in fairness, I love a wee argument to get through the day

Dougal Maguire · October 23, 2023, 02:50:07 PM

Absolutely MR. Hope all is good with you

Snapchap · October 23, 2023, 03:30:01 PM

Quote from: Snapchap on October 20, 2023, 11:50:33 PM
Quote from: Hound on October 20, 2023, 11:36:43 PMI totally agree with C4 that there's not enough evidence to decide either way. (Unlike you, who made up your mind immediately with no evidence and ignore all the evidence on one side and jump on the evidence on the other side).
What's the difference? You made up your mind based on one Israeli press conference.

Do you agree with Channel 4 that the version of events/evidence presented by Israel during that press conference looks likely to have been misleading and potentially falsified/fabricated? Do you still believe that they were being "open and transparent" about the attack in the press conference, which is what you immediately claimed after you watched it?

So, Hound? Given that Channel 4 have referenced expert opinion which suggests that the evidence relayed by the Israelis in their press conference about the hospital attack was misleading and potentially falsified/fabricated, do you stand by your belief that they were being "open and transparent" in said press conference?

seafoid · October 23, 2023, 04:59:20 PM

Hound · October 23, 2023, 05:26:21 PM

Quote from: Snapchap on October 23, 2023, 03:30:01 PM
Quote from: Snapchap on October 20, 2023, 11:50:33 PM
Quote from: Hound on October 20, 2023, 11:36:43 PMI totally agree with C4 that there's not enough evidence to decide either way. (Unlike you, who made up your mind immediately with no evidence and ignore all the evidence on one side and jump on the evidence on the other side).
What's the difference? You made up your mind based on one Israeli press conference.

Do you agree with Channel 4 that the version of events/evidence presented by Israel during that press conference looks likely to have been misleading and potentially falsified/fabricated? Do you still believe that they were being "open and transparent" about the attack in the press conference, which is what you immediately claimed after you watched it?

So, Hound? Given that Channel 4 have referenced expert opinion which suggests that the evidence relayed by the Israelis in their press conference about the hospital attack was misleading and potentially falsified/fabricated, do you stand by your belief that they were being "open and transparent" in said press conference?

Christ almighty, talk about getting hung up on one point.
As I said before, at that press conference the IDF were doing their best to be seen as open and transparent - they were providing information that could be rebutted or not, they took questions from both, what they would see as, friendly and unfriendly journalists. This was different than previous press conferences when they would only take questions (probably pre-approved) from select journalists.

Is it just the recordings that two 'independent Arab experts' have questioned that you are saying was fabricated, or is there more? Those recordings always were very flimsy in terms of so called 'evidence' and hold no water either way. The site itself is key. From what I have seen, C4 have not said the evidence points to Israel doing it, they said they have not reached a conclusion. But if there is new stuff please share.

Here is the CNN analysis. Very thorough and still not completely conclusive. Lots of independent experts and not all yanks. I think if Israel did it, Hamas would have been able to produce evidence from the site, but still can't point either way for sure.

https://edition.cnn.com/2023/10/21/middleeast/cnn-investigates-forensic-analysis-gaza-hospital-blast/index.html

I see the UK (who had been silent on it so far) have now said the evidence they have looked at points to the weapon that hit the hospital coming from Gaza and not from Israel. Wording used is 'likely' so still not absolute.

But it's important to remember that if this was an errant Palestinian rocket, and not Israel, it doesn't lessen what Israel has actually done by one iota. But people dismissing all possibilities that this could have been a Palestinian rocket (and calling people idiots because they believe Israel might not have done this particular incident) are being ridiculous.

seafoid · October 23, 2023, 06:07:41 PM

Quote from: Hound on October 23, 2023, 05:26:21 PM
Quote from: Snapchap on October 23, 2023, 03:30:01 PM
Quote from: Snapchap on October 20, 2023, 11:50:33 PM
Quote from: Hound on October 20, 2023, 11:36:43 PMI totally agree with C4 that there's not enough evidence to decide either way. (Unlike you, who made up your mind immediately with no evidence and ignore all the evidence on one side and jump on the evidence on the other side).
What's the difference? You made up your mind based on one Israeli press conference.

Do you agree with Channel 4 that the version of events/evidence presented by Israel during that press conference looks likely to have been misleading and potentially falsified/fabricated? Do you still believe that they were being "open and transparent" about the attack in the press conference, which is what you immediately claimed after you watched it?

So, Hound? Given that Channel 4 have referenced expert opinion which suggests that the evidence relayed by the Israelis in their press conference about the hospital attack was misleading and potentially falsified/fabricated, do you stand by your belief that they were being "open and transparent" in said press conference?
Christ almighty, talk about getting hung up on one point.
As I said before, at that press conference the IDF were doing their best to be seen as open and transparent - they were providing information that could be rebutted or not, they took questions from both, what they would see as, friendly and unfriendly journalists. This was different than previous press conferences when they would only take questions (probably pre-approved) from select journalists.

Is it just the recordings that two 'independent Arab experts' have questioned that you are saying was fabricated, or is there more? Those recordings always were very flimsy in terms of so called 'evidence' and hold no water either way. The site itself is key. From what I have seen, C4 have not said the evidence points to Israel doing it, they said they have not reached a conclusion. But if there is new stuff please share.

Here is the CNN analysis. Very thorough and still not completely conclusive. Lots of independent experts and not all yanks. I think if Israel did it, Hamas would have been able to produce evidence from the site, but still can't point either way for sure.

https://edition.cnn.com/2023/10/21/middleeast/cnn-investigates-forensic-analysis-gaza-hospital-blast/index.html

I see the UK (who had been silent on it so far) have now said the evidence they have looked at points to the weapon that hit the hospital coming from Gaza and not from Israel. Wording used is 'likely' so still not absolute.

CNN took the Israeli line . So did Biden

The Israeli ambassador tried to convince Krishnan Guru Murthy that Israel didn't bomb the hospital.She justified her position citing Biden.

https://twitter.com/Channel4News/status/1715052724952179075

Hound · October 23, 2023, 06:19:20 PM

I agree with Krishnan Guru Murthy. You can't say with certainty that Israel didn't do it, and you can't say with certainty that Israel did do it. I definitely would not agree with that woman saying the recording proves anything at all.