Messages

Maggie Thacther.Soon after her departure from the tories it took them twenty odd years to get back into goverment.

That's not true.
John Major took over in 1990 and remained Prime Minister until 1997.

In fairness i should have said not lomg after Thachter the tory party was poor.i have to admit my knowledge was poor,
anyway my main argument of man utd being very average this year will still stand

[It's amazing, and a bit sad really, that a few nameless Internet figures can get under your skin. Get a life!]

You think what the Glazers have done is equivalent to the ruin Gillette and Hicks very nearly visited upon Liverpool in the aftermath of the economic collapse? But yes, I agree that there is little cause for gloating. Leeds, Fiorentina, almost Liverpool... no club is too big to be brought down by poor and/or malevolent ownership.

I wouldn't get any pleasure out of Man Utd going down the road Liverpool did under Gillett and Hicks. Heck, the only clubs in these islands that I think would deserve this fate are Rangers and Linfield. It's already happened to the former and the latter ain't looking too hot at the moment

However, on the basis that you can hold two opposed ideas in mind at the same time and still retain the ability to function, I'd be absolutely delighted to see the club supported by a few of the beauts who populate this thread being liquidated and salt ploughed into the ground.

It's amazing, and a bit sad really, that a few nameless Internet figures can get under your skin. Get a life!

Its amazing and a bit sad really that you can put into words the exact feelings most posters here have about you.

On the whole Man Utd decline i would have to say that the departure of ole Red Nose will have a huge say on final league position of Manure.
The man was possibly the greatest manager of all time (although id argue clough was) and for an institution like Utd to lose a calibre of a man like that is very hard to carry on regardless.
He brought a very average squad to winning a league in a canter last year (his biggest achievement outside his Aberdeen ones) and was one of the most feared men in that league from Match officials right down to journalists.

If you look at other walks of life with similar personalities and look at the organisations they controlled after they left.
Steve Jobs in Apple.Has lost all its edge in innovation since he passed away.
Maggie Thacther.Soon after her departure from the tories it took them twenty odd years to get back into goverment.
Sean Boylan in Meath.That example is fairly self explanatory.

So its very hard for any institution to just come along and say we can move on without alot of mistakes to happen along the way.
I predict a 4th place finish at best.

LFC could save a lot of time and effort if they had a black armband sewn into their kit design.

What a shit comment

What would you expect from a clown who reckons Rio'i dont take drugs' Ferdinand was the best centre half of the last twenty five years?

[In 25-odd years of watching English football, I've never seen a better defender in that league]

Cannot understand how that clown ferdinand is in the team of the year.
Without doubt the most overrated footballer of all time.

I make you mad as a box of frogs. In 25-odd years of watching English football, I've never seen a better defender in that league. He's in the autumn of his career now, but at his peak he had no flaws in his game (which doesn't mean he didn't make mistakes, everybody does). Very few defenders in history I would say that about.

Everbody entitled to their opinion but to say that about this clown is unbelieveable.
I am of the opinion that central defensive partnership should be tough and strong and put your body on the line put in big tackles and basically be as no nonsense as you can get.
Rio has none of the above.He can pass the ball yes but he isnt a last line of defence type.
Give me Vidic every day of the week and Kompany and shawcross there after before that muppet.
He always looks for an excuse after a goal is conceded whether it be a teammate or official where too often than not if he managed to get across and make a tackle it would be more beneficial.

Honestly, when you mention someone like Shawcross, it just makes it seem like you gauge defensive worth by how hard they'll kick an opponent. There is so much more to being a  defender than throwing yourself in front of everything that moves.

For the past decade when Rio has played, United have had one of the top three defences in English football every year. This is despite having had a number of below par keepers, and some very average players like Brown, O'Shea and Evans playing major parts in their seasons. For the past 3-4 years they haven't even had a midfield general worth talking about.

Ferdinand has marked big ones, small ones, quick ones, slow ones, skilful ones, and angry ones. But there isn't a single player I can think of who has had something close to an Indian sign over United during that time.

No doubt about it, Vidic's more aggressive and physical qualities make him a great counterpart for Ferdinand. But Ferdinand is one of the few players I've seen who can comfortably flit between the sweeper role, the stopper role, and between the left side or right side of defence. Vidic can't. Kompany can't. Shawcross would try, and fail miserably.

The only players I've seen in the Premiership who could have given him a run for the money were Adams (right up there, based on his last few years when he started to play a bit of ball), King and McGrath (both of whom neither had the luck with injuries, nor the trophies to stand comparison).

I may have an old fashioned outlook on defensive mentalities but i firmly believe that the hard man centre defenders were always the back bone of all successful teams.
Anyone who played with aggression in the back four would always get that adrenalin rush after putting in a good hard fair tackle knowing that the other man would have definitly come out on the wrong side.That adrenalin would drive you on to performaces at times was beyond your actual level.
While hard tackiling defending isnt the be all and end all of defenders i think a defence with four players without certain levels of this quality has a weak link.
Mcgrath was ten times the palyer ferdinand was and just because he hasnt as much medals isnt a yard stick of how good he was.

[In 25-odd years of watching English football, I've never seen a better defender in that league]

Cannot understand how that clown ferdinand is in the team of the year.
Without doubt the most overrated footballer of all time.

I make you mad as a box of frogs. In 25-odd years of watching English football, I've never seen a better defender in that league. He's in the autumn of his career now, but at his peak he had no flaws in his game (which doesn't mean he didn't make mistakes, everybody does). Very few defenders in history I would say that about.

Everbody entitled to their opinion but to say that about this clown is unbelieveable.
I am of the opinion that central defensive partnership should be tough and strong and put your body on the line put in big tackles and basically be as no nonsense as you can get.
Rio has none of the above.He can pass the ball yes but he isnt a last line of defence type.
Give me Vidic every day of the week and Kompany and shawcross there after before that muppet.
He always looks for an excuse after a goal is conceded whether it be a teammate or official where too often than not if he managed to get across and make a tackle it would be more beneficial.

not a LFC fan but i think the lad has improved in the last six months.
only young yet and has a good mentor i believe in rodgers.

IMHO I think he is decent and may improve over the next couple of years, but does he improve to the standard to get Liverpool back into the top 4 to get champions league and when there to make an impact?

All depends on several factors really like his own confidence the confidence and quality of the team he is playing with and the coaching structures he is being tutored under.
The current setup in Liverpool has the potential to nurture him under the above and thus improve him.
The ability is undoubtably there so the other factors are what is needed to bring him on.

Actually, a lot of the conditions for Hitler and Mussolini's rise are around today. We need to be careful it doesn't happen again. Right wing parties tend to profit when there are tough economic times, a perceived injustice being visited on the people, and a convenient group to blame for the woes (immigrants, muslims, jews, communists etc etc). I'd be worried about the likes of Italy and Greece.

Very good point.
A lot of policies been taken by the current western democracies are causing alot of hardship in the less well off section of societes which the likes of extreme right and left wing political wings tend to thrive on and grow.
Greece is a country which always had extreme left wing elements as well as italy and over time as the current economic policies in these countries become more severe which they will something will have to give and i believe it will.
In what form i dont know?
Maybe a popular peoples rebellion or a military junta or even a rebellion led by a figure like castro or chavez or like the other extreme mussolini or franco.
Greece is a time bomb waiting to go off.
It all depends how much more the Greek people are prepared to accept.

Great opening post.

Hitler's real problem was indeed the soviet union and most particulary stalin.
I often wonder was there a certain element of awe and wwonder on hitlers part of the stalin regime which turned into jealousy and hatred.
If certain things had happened diffrently in hitlers younger life would we have still seen the monster?
I believe so as even from an early age hitler was socially inempt and at times very strange even to his own small inner circle.
He had great confidence in himself even though he was average at best acamdemically.
He believed he was a brillant artist which simply was not the case and it actually hurt him more than anything being turned away from the university of vienna even though he was living the dream of an artists life sitting in up market vienna cafes drawing sketches and mixing with the elite until his money ran out.

I believe that some hatred was always in this lad from an early age and that certain elements over the course of his young life did indeed shape what he was to become but i believe if things were different this lad would have been evil anyway whatever walk of life he chose.

Probably, but he may have just been an evil artist instead of the architect of devestation on a huge scale. He was certainly limited as an artist, but in fairness when his mother's money ran out, he did sell paintings to stay alive, and apparently sold quite a few.

True the level of devestation would have been different if he was successful as an artist rather than a dictator

not a LFC fan but i think the lad has improved in the last six months.
only young yet and has a good mentor i believe in rodgers.

Cannot understand how that clown ferdinand is in the team of the year.
Without doubt the most overrated footballer of all time.
Delighted for baines he deserved at least that.Thought he should have got a nomination also was brillant all season.

Great opening post.

Hitler's real problem was indeed the soviet union and most particulary stalin.
I often wonder was there a certain element of awe and wwonder on hitlers part of the stalin regime which turned into jealousy and hatred.
If certain things had happened diffrently in hitlers younger life would we have still seen the monster?
I believe so as even from an early age hitler was socially inempt and at times very strange even to his own small inner circle.
He had great confidence in himself even though he was average at best acamdemically.
He believed he was a brillant artist which simply was not the case and it actually hurt him more than anything being turned away from the university of vienna even though he was living the dream of an artists life sitting in up market vienna cafes drawing sketches and mixing with the elite until his money ran out.

I believe that some hatred was always in this lad from an early age and that certain elements over the course of his young life did indeed shape what he was to become but i believe if things were different this lad would have been evil anyway whatever walk of life he chose.

Kerry won why?

[hussle and bustle of the premier league]

This fella Henriquez scored for Wigan today. Good to see him hit the ground running.

Hopefully his spell at Wigan will help him aclimatise to the hussle and bustle of the premier league.

Will never get old.

go the hammers

[stretching credibility]

I also believe that he was, just like his brothers, an IRA operative, who was taking information in and out of the prisons under the cover of his professional duties.

Why do you believe this?

He was from a family with exceptionally strong republican leanings. Three of his brothers were in the IRA. It is stretching credibility, therefore, to believe that PF didn't at the very least have pro IRA views. If he disapproved of his brothers' activities or of the IRA generally, he could very easily have taken steps to distance himself from them and from the political situation in the north. He was an educated man. He could've practiced a different branch of law, he could've relocated, he could've done a number of things. Instead he immersed himself in high profile cases involving IRA personnel. A man in his position, going in and out of the prisons with unsupervised access to IRA people, would've been very useful to the republican movement. Again, it is stretching credibility to believe that this wouldn't have occurred to the IRA leadership, or that they wouldn't have asked him to relay information back and forward. This could have been done without too much risk to himself, since they were hardly likely to compromise such an important operative by asking him to smuggle in explosives up his backside. He was only being asked to talk and listen, which he was entitled to do with his clients in private. Clearly the establishment thought he was up to no good, despite what the British government is saying now. Remember, it was senior RUC officers - not special branch grunts - who briefed Douglas Hogg before his infamous comments in parliament. There was and is no hard evidence of PF's activities, but then the same could be said of Gerry Adams. Who thinks he wasn't in the IRA?

The highlighted extracts are the huge black holes in your theory