The Sunday Game

Started by Jinxy, May 11, 2008, 10:47:55 PM

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AZOffaly

Quote from: easytiger95 on February 08, 2018, 05:46:26 PM
Well apparently the Skoda has to be hosted and streamed live from every county ground and be available world wide an a subscription platform like GAA Go or better.

The Skoda also has to make deals with local radio stations to access their commentaries. It should also be making GAA historical documentaries and magazine shows.

The Skoda is no longer a Skoda. It is a media conglomerate.

And you are now misrepresenting my whole point in this argument AZ. You and others said "look at what they do on county sites, why can't they do that on RTE/Eir/Sky/TG4/TV3 etc" and I told you exactly why they couldn't. Nobody is saying that county sites don't do great work, and nobody is saying that it is not a good idea for them to stream matches. I was just answering the question why national broadcasters don't.

In short, you keep on coming into my Porsche dealership looking for a Skoda. I've explained many times why you can't get one here.

I'll be getting a restraining order next  ;D

I'm not advocating this on RTE/EIR. That was someone else. I'm looking for a dedicated online service.

An Fhairche Abu

Great insight easytiger, I'm not a fan of the RTE coverage at all during the summer and much less the league coverage on Sunday evenings.
Interesting to see the challenges involved that a lay person wouldn't have any clue about really but I would still be very much of the opinion that of the GAA resources and footage that RTE do have access to, they use it very poorly.

Syferus

#5117
The reason RTE and TG4 don't is because they are public enterprises run by civil servants. FFS the RTE player still uses Flash in 2018 and we're supposed to think they deeply understand streaming? They've never been able to truly invoate. Sky won't because they don't give a shît and just use the GAA to keep Sky Sports subs on tap when the PL ends.

So it falls on the organisation running the games themselves to think outside the box. The ones that can do whatever the feck they like with footage recorded at any ground up and down the country that isn't on TV. Other sports do it. The GAA can too, and eventually will. This is both a money-making opportunity and a forward-facing promotional tool for the sport.

easytiger95

Quote from: Syferus on February 08, 2018, 05:41:41 PM
I never said do magazine shows and documentaries them themselves. Read what was said. RTE and TG4 alone have massive archives of GAA content that isn't live matches or highlight shows and isn't making them a single penny as it stands. It's the same sort of licensing model you see with Netflix and Amazon Video - pay the holder a fee to let you stream the video and everyone benefits.

And why would they give them to you? For GAA TV to work, the organisation has to take back all their live broadcasting rights - you're just after gutting the sports department of RTE and TG4. I doubt they would be in any mood to throw you the complete series of "Laochra Gael" and "The Marty Squad" after you just decimated their summer schedule.

And they don't have a massive archive of GAA related content that isn't live matches or highlights. Certainly, most of the series like "Breaking Ball", "The Committee Room", "The Marty Squad", "Thank Friday It's GAA", "Park Live" are all review or preview programmes, so they are relevant only really to the weeks they were recorded or broadcast in.

God love your ambition Syf, you have gone from Armagh TV to Amazon and Netflix in one fell swoop.

easytiger95

Quote from: AZOffaly on February 08, 2018, 05:47:43 PM
Quote from: easytiger95 on February 08, 2018, 05:46:26 PM
Well apparently the Skoda has to be hosted and streamed live from every county ground and be available world wide an a subscription platform like GAA Go or better.

The Skoda also has to make deals with local radio stations to access their commentaries. It should also be making GAA historical documentaries and magazine shows.

The Skoda is no longer a Skoda. It is a media conglomerate.

And you are now misrepresenting my whole point in this argument AZ. You and others said "look at what they do on county sites, why can't they do that on RTE/Eir/Sky/TG4/TV3 etc" and I told you exactly why they couldn't. Nobody is saying that county sites don't do great work, and nobody is saying that it is not a good idea for them to stream matches. I was just answering the question why national broadcasters don't.

In short, you keep on coming into my Porsche dealership looking for a Skoda. I've explained many times why you can't get one here.

I'll be getting a restraining order next  ;D

I'm not advocating this on RTE/EIR. That was someone else. I'm looking for a dedicated online service.

Yeah, you are looking for something along the lines of MILB - and I thought  I gave a fairly cogent answer as to why that model wouldn't work over here.

So now we've progressed to me looking under the bonnet of the Skoda and telling you it won't go as fast as the Porsche, and you turning around and entering it in Le Mans.


AZOffaly

Quote from: easytiger95 on February 08, 2018, 06:02:09 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on February 08, 2018, 05:47:43 PM
Quote from: easytiger95 on February 08, 2018, 05:46:26 PM
Well apparently the Skoda has to be hosted and streamed live from every county ground and be available world wide an a subscription platform like GAA Go or better.

The Skoda also has to make deals with local radio stations to access their commentaries. It should also be making GAA historical documentaries and magazine shows.

The Skoda is no longer a Skoda. It is a media conglomerate.

And you are now misrepresenting my whole point in this argument AZ. You and others said "look at what they do on county sites, why can't they do that on RTE/Eir/Sky/TG4/TV3 etc" and I told you exactly why they couldn't. Nobody is saying that county sites don't do great work, and nobody is saying that it is not a good idea for them to stream matches. I was just answering the question why national broadcasters don't.

In short, you keep on coming into my Porsche dealership looking for a Skoda. I've explained many times why you can't get one here.

I'll be getting a restraining order next  ;D

I'm not advocating this on RTE/EIR. That was someone else. I'm looking for a dedicated online service.

Yeah, you are looking for something along the lines of MILB - and I thought  I gave a fairly cogent answer as to why that model wouldn't work over here.

So now we've progressed to me looking under the bonnet of the Skoda and telling you it won't go as fast as the Porsche, and you turning around and entering it in Le Mans.

I disagree that it wouldn't work here. I point to Armagh and Mayo TV as exhibit A and B. If we had 32 individual counties all running their own .TV,  we'd actually have what I'm talking about by default.

I don't want to enter Le Mans. I just want to have a drive around the country nice and leisurely.

easytiger95

That is a bit disingenuous - MILB, which you specifically used an example seems to be a different beast than Armagh or Mayo TV, and I answered directly as to why that wouldn't work over here.

I also said that baseball as a boundary game is more suited to wide shots, robotic cams etc, whereas I don't think the same can be said of football and hurling.

That said, we don't really know enough about Mayo and Armagh TV. We don't know if they make a profit - I would suspect they don't. I would think that their costs are covered by sponsors - which is all well and good. However, the problem with running a service from sponsorship money is that if the sponsor loses interest, then the service offered could go to the wall.

I have a mate who was done a lot in this area, advising county boards on media stuff and things - I might give him a buzz over the weekend and see what he thinks of the landscape at the moment. He is a Mayo man so I'd say he is plugged in there.

I just don't think there is enough of an appetite for raw footage of games for these types of channels to stand alone, especially given our relatively small population and the lack of local broadcasting infrastructure.

Cunny Funt

Quote from: An Fhairche Abu on February 08, 2018, 05:50:58 PM
Great insight easytiger, I'm not a fan of the RTE coverage at all during the summer and much less the league coverage on Sunday evenings.
Interesting to see the challenges involved that a lay person wouldn't have any clue about really but I would still be very much of the opinion that of the GAA resources and footage that RTE do have access to, they use it very poorly.
+1

AZOffaly

Quote from: easytiger95 on February 08, 2018, 06:23:47 PM
That is a bit disingenuous - MILB, which you specifically used an example seems to be a different beast than Armagh or Mayo TV, and I answered directly as to why that wouldn't work over here.

I also said that baseball as a boundary game is more suited to wide shots, robotic cams etc, whereas I don't think the same can be said of football and hurling.

That said, we don't really know enough about Mayo and Armagh TV. We don't know if they make a profit - I would suspect they don't. I would think that their costs are covered by sponsors - which is all well and good. However, the problem with running a service from sponsorship money is that if the sponsor loses interest, then the service offered could go to the wall.

I have a mate who was done a lot in this area, advising county boards on media stuff and things - I might give him a buzz over the weekend and see what he thinks of the landscape at the moment. He is a Mayo man so I'd say he is plugged in there.

I just don't think there is enough of an appetite for raw footage of games for these types of channels to stand alone, especially given our relatively small population and the lack of local broadcasting infrastructure.

And you could well be right. I think it's more attainable though, than some of the more 'optimistic' opinions on what RTE/EIR/TG4 could do in a very professional manner.

Syferus

What you're all arguing about boils down to timescale - eventually cellular coverage and via fiber optic networks  will be so good that you could stream a match from the Aran Islands with little issue, all the while video compression will get better and better with .265 HEVC only starting to break through right now. And eventually software AI will become good enough at tracking action that a cameraman won't be even needed.

When these things happen, who knows. But anyone who thinks that the service outline cannot happen for technical reasons is, frankly, wrong. I think it's very feasible already.

easytiger95

Quote from: Syferus on February 08, 2018, 06:43:05 PM
What you're all arguing about boils down to timescale - eventually cellular coverage and via fiber optic networks  will be so good that you could stream a match from the Aran Islands with little issue, all the while video compression will get better and better with .265 HEVC only starting to break through right now. And eventually software AI will become good enough at tracking action that a cameraman won't be even needed.

When these things happen, who knows. But anyone who thinks that the service outline cannot happen for technical reasons is, frankly, wrong. I think it's very feasible already.

I'd actually love to get a service outline from you beyond "stream all matches - make it like GAA Go". I'd like to see some kind of structure. What is it that you want? Because, frankly, if you don't outline specifically what you want, then it is very easy to claim that it would work. And given that one of the only things that you have been clear about is the reliance on the broadband infrastructure currently at county grounds for this new service, then I think scepticism is warranted.


easytiger95

Quote from: Syferus on February 08, 2018, 06:43:05 PM
And eventually software AI will become good enough at tracking action that a cameraman won't be even needed.

God, I just saw this.

Unicorns.

Syferus

#5127
Quote from: easytiger95 on February 08, 2018, 07:00:58 PM
Quote from: Syferus on February 08, 2018, 06:43:05 PM
And eventually software AI will become good enough at tracking action that a cameraman won't be even needed.

God, I just saw this.

Unicorns.

You seriously think that won't happen? Seriously?

You're way off base if you don't realise the amount of jobs that will be done cheaper and better than humans by AI in the decades ahead.

imtommygunn

Quote from: Syferus on February 08, 2018, 06:43:05 PM
What you're all arguing about boils down to timescale - eventually cellular coverage and via fiber optic networks  will be so good that you could stream a match from the Aran Islands with little issue, all the while video compression will get better and better with .265 HEVC only starting to break through right now. And eventually software AI will become good enough at tracking action that a cameraman won't be even needed.

When these things happen, who knows. But anyone who thinks that the service outline cannot happen for technical reasons is, frankly, wrong. I think it's very feasible already.

Look at elon musk. Almost anything is possible with money.

Any level of compression will still require a half decent network backbone.

We have areas without significantly better bandwidth than a dialup modem.

easytiger95

Quote from: Syferus on February 08, 2018, 07:02:45 PM
Quote from: easytiger95 on February 08, 2018, 07:00:58 PM
Quote from: Syferus on February 08, 2018, 06:43:05 PM
And eventually software AI will become good enough at tracking action that a cameraman won't be even needed.

God, I just saw this.

Unicorns.

You seriously think that won't happen? Seriously?

You're way off base if you don't realise the amount of jobs that will be done cheaper and better than humans by AI in the decades ahead.
Syf i already work with robotic cameras and voice recignition software. We are always looking to see what advances there are in automation. But AI controlled cameras are at least a decade away and they will be used in studio situations.
Your optimism abiut them being used in a match situation represents a fundamental misunderstanding of what cameras actually do at a match, which makes your certainty in your pronouncements all the more baffling. I can see AI providing nice add ons such as player cams etc but the software is miles and years away from replacing staff on main match cams.

Which kind of makes it irrelevant to the discussion about a service and opportunity you think is just around the corner- and you still haven't described.

Just because elon musk stuck a tesla in space doesn't mean that we'll all be orbiting in sports cars next year.