Looks like some dirty bastard has injured many people in Barcelona (Las Ramblas) area by driving a van into pedestrians. This shit is becoming the new norm. Hopefully there are no deaths but early reports do not look good on this front.
Thats a very very busy area with lots of tourists. Not good.
Just seen a video that I really didn't want to, I suspect many injured will become many dead..
Two gunmen now holed up in a bar! Hostages have been taken.
Two confirmed dead already.
Sky news reporting a local radio station that is claiming there may be up to 13 deaths. Horrendous situation for people to be caught up in going about their business on holidays.
Catalunya is about five minutes from my front door. Huge transport hub right at the top of the Rambla. At that time of the evening it would have been absolutely teeming.
Every major city in Europe is getting attacked something if anything has to be done to stop this madness. Some horrific videos posted up on social media, the people responsible for those videos should have a little cop on.
The Rambla would be perfect target for that kind of attack too. Jammed pedestrian central walkway with traffic on either side. Considering that's it's slap bang in the centre of one of Europe's biggest cities, it's remarkably easily accessible by car.
Every major city my arse. And it's nearly impossible to stop an insane fücker getting in a car or van and driving into a crowd.
The only surprising about this that they hadn't thought to lean on such a weakness in the system before now. Far harder than build a bomb than turn an ignition, and with much more likelihood of being caught.
Thoughts are with the victims, as always.
Quote from: Captain Obvious on August 17, 2017, 06:56:34 PM
Every major city in Europe is getting attacked something if anything has to be done to stop this madness. Some horrific videos posted up on social media, the people responsible for those videos should have a little cop on.
A little cop on????? For f**k sake they should be tried and if convicted they should work at hard labour until they die, with a kicking every now and again the horrible bastards!
Harsh sentence for posting a video.
Halfwit.
I was in Palma last week and I was taken aback at how lax traffic restrictions were, cars and scooters driving right up beside listed buildings and people on walkways that look to any tourist's eye to be a fully pedestrianised area. Most of the narrow Oldtown streets are so tight that if someone came down them with a car with the intent to injure a bystander has absolutely no chance of escape.
If that is widespread in Spain they need to revise their approach as it opens the country up to the worst possible outcomes from these attacks.
How do you manage the threat? Is it possible that every pedestrian area will have to be packed with bollards to stop vehicles being able to move at high speed through them?
Modern society to take out their phones and film the carnage it seems, 13 dead so far with so many injured that death toll is sure to rise. Barcelona one of my favorites cites, full of life,energy and friendliness. La Ramblas today i fear O Connell street Dublin could be hit by a similar attack in the future
I'm not sure how you would do it in somewhere like Las Ramblas with heavy traffic but ever since the events in Nice, I have been surprised something hasn't been done about access to the Paseo Marítimo in San Sebastian. It would be absolute carnage if some nutjob got in there with a truck at the best of times (and even more so this current week which is Semana Grande, and you can barely move in the evening with the festivities)
Croke park all Ireland day! Or St Pats Day
Quote from: CiKe on August 17, 2017, 08:41:16 PM
I'm not sure how you would do it in somewhere like Las Ramblas with heavy traffic
It's remarkably accessible. Two lanes of traffic either side of a pedestrian walkway, close to major thoroughfares and motorways. Driving into town and mounting the pedestrian reservation wouldn't be too difficult.
Quote from: stew on August 17, 2017, 07:44:45 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on August 17, 2017, 06:56:34 PM
Every major city in Europe is getting attacked something if anything has to be done to stop this madness. Some horrific videos posted up on social media, the people responsible for those videos should have a little cop on.
A little cop on????? For f**k sake they should be tried and if convicted they should work at hard labour until they die, with a kicking every now and again the horrible b**tards!
Stew, I assume you misread his post?
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 17, 2017, 10:20:12 PM
Quote from: stew on August 17, 2017, 07:44:45 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on August 17, 2017, 06:56:34 PM
Every major city in Europe is getting attacked something if anything has to be done to stop this madness. Some horrific videos posted up on social media, the people responsible for those videos should have a little cop on.
A little cop on????? For f**k sake they should be tried and if convicted they should work at hard labour until they die, with a kicking every now and again the horrible b**tards!
Stew, I assume you misread his post?
Or he's on the wine
Rumours of a house that was blown up near Barcelona the day before being link to attack
Quote from: Cunny Funt on August 17, 2017, 08:11:00 PM
Modern society to take out their phones and film the carnage it seems, 13 dead so far with so many injured that death toll is sure to rise. Barcelona one of my favorites cites, full of life,energy and friendliness. La Ramblas today i fear O Connell street Dublin could be hit by a similar attack in the future
Henry Street would be the street I would worry about being attacked. It has happened before so we could not say it was a surprise if it happened again. Some Arab got angry when his asylum application was turned down. There should be barriers at the top and bottom of Henry Street and the junctions with Moore Street and Liffey Street. You could look at doing the same thing on Grafton Street and Talbot Street as well.
Sure why not just have fecking 30 foot railings the whole way round each city...
Remember living in Belfast and if you happened to be caught out when the gates closed at 11 you had to climb them to get home!
Shit way to live
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 17, 2017, 11:55:13 PM
Sure why not just have fecking 30 foot railings the whole way round each city...
Remember living in Belfast and if you happened to be caught out when the gates closed at 11 you had to climb them to get home!
Shit way to live
Yeah, a barrier that could save a lot of lives is a shit way to live alright. There are plenty of barriers that can prevent most vehicles but not impede pedestrians in any way.
If Ireland doesn't take heed of these warning signs all over Europe we deserve what we get.
Quote from: Capt Pat on August 17, 2017, 11:49:57 PM
Quote from: Cunny Funt on August 17, 2017, 08:11:00 PM
Modern society to take out their phones and film the carnage it seems, 13 dead so far with so many injured that death toll is sure to rise. Barcelona one of my favorites cites, full of life,energy and friendliness. La Ramblas today i fear O Connell street Dublin could be hit by a similar attack in the future
Henry Street would be the street I would worry about being attacked. It has happened before so we could not say it was a surprise if it happened again. Some Arab got angry when his asylum application was turned down. There should be barriers at the top and bottom of Henry Street and the junctions with Moore Street and Liffey Street. You could look at doing the same thing on Grafton Street and Talbot Street as well.
What they need is electronic barriers that fire engines etc could open. No brainer.
6 civilians injured when car rammed pedestrians in cambrils. 5 suspects dead. No civilians dead. Well done to Spanish police. These things come in waves.
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 12:06:40 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 17, 2017, 11:55:13 PM
Sure why not just have fecking 30 foot railings the whole way round each city...
Remember living in Belfast and if you happened to be caught out when the gates closed at 11 you had to climb them to get home!
Shit way to live
Yeah, a barrier that could save a lot of lives is a shit way to live alright. There are plenty of barriers that can prevent most vehicles but not impede pedestrians in any way.
If Ireland doesn't take heed of these warning signs all over Europe we deserve what we get.
You honestly think a 30 foot barrier will save lives?? Flipping numpty! They'll change method to something else and continue on doing what they do.... terrorise
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 07:42:38 AM
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 12:06:40 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 17, 2017, 11:55:13 PM
Sure why not just have fecking 30 foot railings the whole way round each city...
Remember living in Belfast and if you happened to be caught out when the gates closed at 11 you had to climb them to get home!
Shit way to live
Yeah, a barrier that could save a lot of lives is a shit way to live alright. There are plenty of barriers that can prevent most vehicles but not impede pedestrians in any way.
If Ireland doesn't take heed of these warning signs all over Europe we deserve what we get.
You honestly think a 30 foot barrier will save lives?? Flipping numpty! They'll change method to something else and continue on doing what they do.... terrorise
Why do you keep talking about a 30 foot barrier???? A row of bollards is all that's needed.
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 12:06:40 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 17, 2017, 11:55:13 PM
Sure why not just have fecking 30 foot railings the whole way round each city...
Remember living in Belfast and if you happened to be caught out when the gates closed at 11 you had to climb them to get home!
Shit way to live
Yeah, a barrier that could save a lot of lives is a shit way to live alright. There are plenty of barriers that can prevent most vehicles but not impede pedestrians in any way.
If Ireland doesn't take heed of these warning signs all over Europe we deserve what we get.
I'll need this comment explained a bit more. So if we aren't going to barricade all our towns and cities then we deserve to have innocent civilians killed? Wow! We've been there and done that in the North with road blocks into towns and cities, not really something you want and will only prevent this type of attack. A rigid barrier on a street isn't going to stop a terrorist intent on doing damage.
I cant understand these people that take their phone out and start filming injured and dead people.
Even if you aren't first aid trained surely your first instinct should be to go and help the people instead of filming them.
Its sickening behaviour and is also a valuable tool for the terrorists in terms of propaganda. Why do their job for them?
New buildings these days are built/ landscaped with terrorism in mind...strategically placed stone/ concrete sculptures, seats, anything really would reduce the scale of the carnage. It would work in pedestrian areas and shouldn't impact on daily life. Even Belfast City Airport has now got a big grass bank where the old drop off used to be and doesn't detract from the look of the place.
Active bollards exist as well for the likes of Fire Engines/ Ambulances etc
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 08:17:45 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 07:42:38 AM
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 12:06:40 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 17, 2017, 11:55:13 PM
Sure why not just have fecking 30 foot railings the whole way round each city...
Remember living in Belfast and if you happened to be caught out when the gates closed at 11 you had to climb them to get home!
Shit way to live
Yeah, a barrier that could save a lot of lives is a shit way to live alright. There are plenty of barriers that can prevent most vehicles but not impede pedestrians in any way.
If Ireland doesn't take heed of these warning signs all over Europe we deserve what we get.
You honestly think a 30 foot barrier will save lives?? Flipping numpty! They'll change method to something else and continue on doing what they do.... terrorise
Why do you keep talking about a 30 foot barrier???? A row of bollards is all that's needed.
Ok a row of bollards, that will stop a person wanting to set off a bomb or shoot people or stab people?
Quote from: doodaa on August 18, 2017, 08:22:15 AM
I cant understand these people that take their phone out and start filming injured and dead people.
Even if you aren't first aid trained surely your first instinct should be to go and help the people instead of filming them.
Its sickening behaviour and is also a valuable tool for the terrorists in terms of propaganda. Why do their job for them?
New buildings these days are built/ landscaped with terrorism in mind...strategically placed stone/ concrete sculptures, seats, anything really would reduce the scale of the carnage. It would work in pedestrian areas and shouldn't impact on daily life. Even Belfast City Airport has now got a big grass bank where the old drop off used to be and doesn't detract from the look of the place.
Active bollards exist as well for the likes of Fire Engines/ Ambulances etc
I don't understand it either although I did read somewhere that that footage is useful to police in the aftermath. However it's one thing to record it quite another to post it on social media? I was searching yesterday for news on it and clicked what I thought was a link from an on scene news reporter which I had to turn off after 2/3 seconds as it was making me ill.
Quote from: Boycey on August 18, 2017, 09:14:51 AM
Quote from: doodaa on August 18, 2017, 08:22:15 AM
I cant understand these people that take their phone out and start filming injured and dead people.
Even if you aren't first aid trained surely your first instinct should be to go and help the people instead of filming them.
Its sickening behaviour and is also a valuable tool for the terrorists in terms of propaganda. Why do their job for them?
New buildings these days are built/ landscaped with terrorism in mind...strategically placed stone/ concrete sculptures, seats, anything really would reduce the scale of the carnage. It would work in pedestrian areas and shouldn't impact on daily life. Even Belfast City Airport has now got a big grass bank where the old drop off used to be and doesn't detract from the look of the place.
Active bollards exist as well for the likes of Fire Engines/ Ambulances etc
I don't understand it either although I did read somewhere that that footage is useful to police in the aftermath. However it's one thing to record it quite another to post it on social media? I was searching yesterday for news on it and clicked what I thought was a link from an on scene news reporter which I had to turn off after 2/3 seconds as it was making me ill.
I would doubt if evidence gathering is their main motive, more than likely they want their name on a little BBC caption on the news that night. Sick.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 09:13:46 AM
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 08:17:45 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 07:42:38 AM
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 12:06:40 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 17, 2017, 11:55:13 PM
Sure why not just have fecking 30 foot railings the whole way round each city...
Remember living in Belfast and if you happened to be caught out when the gates closed at 11 you had to climb them to get home!
Shit way to live
Yeah, a barrier that could save a lot of lives is a shit way to live alright. There are plenty of barriers that can prevent most vehicles but not impede pedestrians in any way.
If Ireland doesn't take heed of these warning signs all over Europe we deserve what we get.
You honestly think a 30 foot barrier will save lives?? Flipping numpty! They'll change method to something else and continue on doing what they do.... terrorise
Why do you keep talking about a 30 foot barrier???? A row of bollards is all that's needed.
Ok a row of bollards, that will stop a person wanting to set off a bomb or shoot people or stab people?
No, but they could stop these attacks with cars.
Ie, the type of attack that has been most common recently and the type of attack that this thread is specifically discussing.
A 30 foot barrier wouldn't stop someone wanting to bomb, shoot or stab people either.
CPTED. Crime prevention through environmental design.
The siting of mature trees and bollards screened as benches has the ability to stop these types of car/van attacks.
However as mentioned it won't stop the lone wolf attack.
All modern tourist attractions/arenas would have these kind of bollards built into the architecture - for example the big "ARSENAL" sign outside the Emirates. But then that wouldn't stop a Manchester Arena type attack.
Provisions have to be made for these car rampages as they are so easy to carry out but unfortunately it's not going to stop the terrorists carrying out other types of attack.
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 17, 2017, 10:20:12 PM
Quote from: stew on August 17, 2017, 07:44:45 PM
Quote from: Captain Obvious on August 17, 2017, 06:56:34 PM
Every major city in Europe is getting attacked something if anything has to be done to stop this madness. Some horrific videos posted up on social media, the people responsible for those videos should have a little cop on.
A little cop on????? For f**k sake they should be tried and if convicted they should work at hard labour until they die, with a kicking every now and again the horrible b**tards!
Stew, I assume you misread his post?
Er.... Correct, obviously meant that for the scum driving into people.
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 10:31:31 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 09:13:46 AM
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 08:17:45 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 07:42:38 AM
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 12:06:40 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 17, 2017, 11:55:13 PM
Sure why not just have fecking 30 foot railings the whole way round each city...
Remember living in Belfast and if you happened to be caught out when the gates closed at 11 you had to climb them to get home!
Shit way to live
Yeah, a barrier that could save a lot of lives is a shit way to live alright. There are plenty of barriers that can prevent most vehicles but not impede pedestrians in any way.
If Ireland doesn't take heed of these warning signs all over Europe we deserve what we get.
You honestly think a 30 foot barrier will save lives?? Flipping numpty! They'll change method to something else and continue on doing what they do.... terrorise
Why do you keep talking about a 30 foot barrier???? A row of bollards is all that's needed.
Ok a row of bollards, that will stop a person wanting to set off a bomb or shoot people or stab people?
No, but they could stop these attacks with cars.
Ie, the type of attack that has been most common recently and the type of attack that this thread is specifically discussing.
A 30 foot barrier wouldn't stop someone wanting to bomb, shoot or stab people either.
If you read my post again I was joking about the 30 foot barrier!! Lived through as you have and did nothing to prevent bombs or shootings in Belfast...
intelligence is only way they will stop these attacks or at the very least minimize them
The extremists will likely adapt and change to suit whatever environment you create. They already have us going through the drudgery of airport security and turning our cities into nicely landscape fortresses isn't stopping the underlying causes.
It is easier to get a vehicle than build a bomb, so bollards and the like might still do some good. Likewise you might get some intelligence about people trying to get bomb making materials, but everyone has a yoke.
you can't prepare or defeat gorilla warfare...the Irish know this better than most. It is a long strategy, a grueling strategy, one that pits sheer force of will and belief in a cause against a mammoth force and takes small bites of it over and over again...
they've coupled this with population, numbers. no abortions, no euthanasia, average of 3-5 children per household against countries like Belgium where couples have 1.3 children, abortions and euthanasia. 15 or 20 years down the line muslims are the majority....with more countries to follow?
Today there are dissident republicans in Ireland..I know who the ones are in my own town and I haven't lived there for 10-12 years. You know who the ones are in your town but you would never give them up even if you disagree with what they are doing? I can't see muslims giving up ISIS or radicals - I can't.
I don't know how to stop it or how to slow it but I believe its coming
Quote from: The Iceman on August 18, 2017, 02:03:18 PM
you can't prepare or defeat gorilla warfare...the Irish know this better than most. It is a long strategy, a grueling strategy, one that pits sheer force of will and belief in a cause against a mammoth force and takes small bites of it over and over again...
they've coupled this with population, numbers. no abortions, no euthanasia, average of 3-5 children per household against countries like Belgium where couples have 1.3 children, abortions and euthanasia. 15 or 20 years down the line muslims are the majority....with more countries to follow?
Today there are dissident republicans in Ireland..I know who the ones are in my own town and I haven't lived there for 10-12 years. You know who the ones are in your town but you would never give them up even if you disagree with what they are doing? I can't see muslims giving up ISIS or radicals - I can't.
I don't know how to stop it or how to slow it but I believe its coming
Bananas. Use bananas.
Quote from: thejuice on August 18, 2017, 12:56:46 PM
The extremists will likely adapt and change to suit whatever environment you create. They already have us going through the drudgery of airport security and turning our cities into nicely landscape fortresses isn't stopping the underlying causes.
Just because they'll adapt you don't fúcking stop trying to make it as hard as possible for them. I'd hate to see you or Milltown dealing with computer security.. sure they'll find a way in, let's not bother making it hard for them.
Preventive measures for attacks and dealing with the root causes is not an either/or situation.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 12:42:38 PM
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 10:31:31 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 09:13:46 AM
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 08:17:45 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 07:42:38 AM
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 12:06:40 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 17, 2017, 11:55:13 PM
Sure why not just have fecking 30 foot railings the whole way round each city...
Remember living in Belfast and if you happened to be caught out when the gates closed at 11 you had to climb them to get home!
Shit way to live
Yeah, a barrier that could save a lot of lives is a shit way to live alright. There are plenty of barriers that can prevent most vehicles but not impede pedestrians in any way.
If Ireland doesn't take heed of these warning signs all over Europe we deserve what we get.
You honestly think a 30 foot barrier will save lives?? Flipping numpty! They'll change method to something else and continue on doing what they do.... terrorise
Why do you keep talking about a 30 foot barrier???? A row of bollards is all that's needed.
Ok a row of bollards, that will stop a person wanting to set off a bomb or shoot people or stab people?
No, but they could stop these attacks with cars.
Ie, the type of attack that has been most common recently and the type of attack that this thread is specifically discussing.
A 30 foot barrier wouldn't stop someone wanting to bomb, shoot or stab people either.
If you read my post again I was joking about the 30 foot barrier!! Lived through as you have and did nothing to prevent bombs or shootings in Belfast...
intelligence is only way they will stop these attacks or at the very least minimize them
Yes, it was hilarious.
Disagree wrt intelligence. The only way to stop this is playing the long game of winning over hearts and minds. What intelligence is to be gained on a lone wolf who hires/buys a car and drives it into people? How would you prove that a random would-be terrorist was planning one of these attacks? Because he's a muslim with a car??
Properly placed and discreet barriers to vehicle access in heavily pedestrianised areas of main city centres would definitely help. At the very least it would make it difficult for the lunatic in a hire car. Stopping someone who wants to get a gun/make a bomb is a completely different problem, and one where you can at least catch and convict someone of something BEFORE they actually carry out their attack.
Quote from: The Iceman on August 18, 2017, 02:03:18 PM
you can't prepare or defeat gorilla warfare...the Irish know this better than most. It is a long strategy, a grueling strategy, one that pits sheer force of will and belief in a cause against a mammoth force and takes small bites of it over and over again...
they've coupled this with population, numbers. no abortions, no euthanasia, average of 3-5 children per household against countries like Belgium where couples have 1.3 children, abortions and euthanasia. 15 or 20 years down the line muslims are the majority....with more countries to follow?
Today there are dissident republicans in Ireland..I know who the ones are in my own town and I haven't lived there for 10-12 years. You know who the ones are in your town but you would never give them up even if you disagree with what they are doing? I can't see muslims giving up ISIS or radicals - I can't.
I don't know how to stop it or how to slow it but I believe its coming
.
Yes those gorillas. Dangerous beasties in a conflict scenario
There certainly are parallels with Ireland. When a half wit convinces themselves they are right some element will convince themselves that any step is justified. No difference between indiscriminate bombing and indiscriminate bombing. The objective of both is to terrorise the many and heyho some might die along the way
Anybody who looks to ancient texts for their life guidance might just end up taking the whole thing seriously. Then we are all in trouble. Society's enforced respect for religion and reluctance to examine the texts and current beliefs doesn't help.
Ring the police re those dissos.
Quote from: LCohen on August 18, 2017, 02:55:01 PM
Quote from: The Iceman on August 18, 2017, 02:03:18 PM
you can't prepare or defeat gorilla warfare...the Irish know this better than most. It is a long strategy, a grueling strategy, one that pits sheer force of will and belief in a cause against a mammoth force and takes small bites of it over and over again...
they've coupled this with population, numbers. no abortions, no euthanasia, average of 3-5 children per household against countries like Belgium where couples have 1.3 children, abortions and euthanasia. 15 or 20 years down the line muslims are the majority....with more countries to follow?
Today there are dissident republicans in Ireland..I know who the ones are in my own town and I haven't lived there for 10-12 years. You know who the ones are in your town but you would never give them up even if you disagree with what they are doing? I can't see muslims giving up ISIS or radicals - I can't.
I don't know how to stop it or how to slow it but I believe its coming
.
Yes those gorillas. Dangerous beasties in a conflict scenario
There certainly are parallels with Ireland. When a half wit convinces themselves they are right some element will convince themselves that any step is justified. No difference between indiscriminate bombing and indiscriminate bombing. The objective of both is to terrorise the many and heyho some might die along the way
Anybody who looks to ancient texts for their life guidance might just end up taking the whole thing seriously. Then we are all in trouble. Society's enforced respect for religion and reluctance to examine the texts and current beliefs doesn't help.
Ring the police re those dissos.
pardon my spelling mistakes! feck of AZ! ha
guerilla war fare aside - the numbers game will beat us all in the end...the van attacks, the bombings they just speed it up a day or two.....
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 02:53:11 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 12:42:38 PM
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 10:31:31 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 09:13:46 AM
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 08:17:45 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 07:42:38 AM
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 12:06:40 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 17, 2017, 11:55:13 PM
Sure why not just have fecking 30 foot railings the whole way round each city...
Remember living in Belfast and if you happened to be caught out when the gates closed at 11 you had to climb them to get home!
Shit way to live
Yeah, a barrier that could save a lot of lives is a shit way to live alright. There are plenty of barriers that can prevent most vehicles but not impede pedestrians in any way.
If Ireland doesn't take heed of these warning signs all over Europe we deserve what we get.
You honestly think a 30 foot barrier will save lives?? Flipping numpty! They'll change method to something else and continue on doing what they do.... terrorise
Why do you keep talking about a 30 foot barrier???? A row of bollards is all that's needed.
Ok a row of bollards, that will stop a person wanting to set off a bomb or shoot people or stab people?
No, but they could stop these attacks with cars.
Ie, the type of attack that has been most common recently and the type of attack that this thread is specifically discussing.
A 30 foot barrier wouldn't stop someone wanting to bomb, shoot or stab people either.
If you read my post again I was joking about the 30 foot barrier!! Lived through as you have and did nothing to prevent bombs or shootings in Belfast...
intelligence is only way they will stop these attacks or at the very least minimize them
Yes, it was hilarious.
Disagree wrt intelligence. The only way to stop this is playing the long game of winning over hearts and minds. What intelligence is to be gained on a lone wolf who hires/buys a car and drives it into people? How would you prove that a random would-be terrorist was planning one of these attacks? Because he's a muslim with a car??
Properly placed and discreet barriers to vehicle access in heavily pedestrianised areas of main city centres would definitely help. At the very least it would make it difficult for the lunatic in a hire car. Stopping someone who wants to get a gun/make a bomb is a completely different problem, and one where you can at least catch and convict someone of something BEFORE they actually carry out their attack.
So its random? they don't work in cells small groups feeding of information from higher groups within these organisations? The police randomly killed a cell just outside Cambrills then too ?
Quote from: The Iceman on August 18, 2017, 02:58:16 PM
Quote from: LCohen on August 18, 2017, 02:55:01 PM
Quote from: The Iceman on August 18, 2017, 02:03:18 PM
you can't prepare or defeat gorilla warfare...the Irish know this better than most. It is a long strategy, a grueling strategy, one that pits sheer force of will and belief in a cause against a mammoth force and takes small bites of it over and over again...
they've coupled this with population, numbers. no abortions, no euthanasia, average of 3-5 children per household against countries like Belgium where couples have 1.3 children, abortions and euthanasia. 15 or 20 years down the line muslims are the majority....with more countries to follow?
Today there are dissident republicans in Ireland..I know who the ones are in my own town and I haven't lived there for 10-12 years. You know who the ones are in your town but you would never give them up even if you disagree with what they are doing? I can't see muslims giving up ISIS or radicals - I can't.
I don't know how to stop it or how to slow it but I believe its coming
.
Yes those gorillas. Dangerous beasties in a conflict scenario
There certainly are parallels with Ireland. When a half wit convinces themselves they are right some element will convince themselves that any step is justified. No difference between indiscriminate bombing and indiscriminate bombing. The objective of both is to terrorise the many and heyho some might die along the way
Anybody who looks to ancient texts for their life guidance might just end up taking the whole thing seriously. Then we are all in trouble. Society's enforced respect for religion and reluctance to examine the texts and current beliefs doesn't help.
Ring the police re those dissos.
pardon my spelling mistakes! feck of AZ! ha
guerilla war fare aside - the numbers game will beat us all in the end...the van attacks, the bombings they just speed it up a day or two.....
To clarify
Who is the "us" whose days are numbered?
What is the "it" that you believe is coming?
us being Christians I think he's on about and Muslim domination being it?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 03:00:34 PM
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 02:53:11 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 12:42:38 PM
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 10:31:31 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 09:13:46 AM
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 08:17:45 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 07:42:38 AM
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 12:06:40 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 17, 2017, 11:55:13 PM
Sure why not just have fecking 30 foot railings the whole way round each city...
Remember living in Belfast and if you happened to be caught out when the gates closed at 11 you had to climb them to get home!
Shit way to live
Yeah, a barrier that could save a lot of lives is a shit way to live alright. There are plenty of barriers that can prevent most vehicles but not impede pedestrians in any way.
If Ireland doesn't take heed of these warning signs all over Europe we deserve what we get.
You honestly think a 30 foot barrier will save lives?? Flipping numpty! They'll change method to something else and continue on doing what they do.... terrorise
Why do you keep talking about a 30 foot barrier???? A row of bollards is all that's needed.
Ok a row of bollards, that will stop a person wanting to set off a bomb or shoot people or stab people?
No, but they could stop these attacks with cars.
Ie, the type of attack that has been most common recently and the type of attack that this thread is specifically discussing.
A 30 foot barrier wouldn't stop someone wanting to bomb, shoot or stab people either.
If you read my post again I was joking about the 30 foot barrier!! Lived through as you have and did nothing to prevent bombs or shootings in Belfast...
intelligence is only way they will stop these attacks or at the very least minimize them
Yes, it was hilarious.
Disagree wrt intelligence. The only way to stop this is playing the long game of winning over hearts and minds. What intelligence is to be gained on a lone wolf who hires/buys a car and drives it into people? How would you prove that a random would-be terrorist was planning one of these attacks? Because he's a muslim with a car??
Properly placed and discreet barriers to vehicle access in heavily pedestrianised areas of main city centres would definitely help. At the very least it would make it difficult for the lunatic in a hire car. Stopping someone who wants to get a gun/make a bomb is a completely different problem, and one where you can at least catch and convict someone of something BEFORE they actually carry out their attack.
So its random? they don't work in cells small groups feeding of information from higher groups within these organisations? The police randomly killed a cell just outside Cambrills then too ?
Cells still exist. Counter intelligence can work against command and control structures.
But the kingpins call for lone wolf low tech attacks. Very difficult to stop these via intelligence
Probably the most ridiculous thing said in this thread (and that's saying something) was Iceman even suggesting a major European countries would have a Muslim majority in 15-20 years. They won't have one in 1500-2000 years, let alone two decades. Belgium, the example he used, has a Muslim population of 5% as of 2009. To put that into perspective, there are six over times that number of people in Belgium who have no religion at all. If you want to talk about a religious grouping that will become a majority in the years ahead, that's the one to be looking at.
Fear mongering at it's most frothing and senseless.
New attack in Finland
There was 5 killed and 2 arrested lately, the 5 killed had fake bomb belts on that's 7 lone wolf's just hanging around the same place?
yes you'll get the crack pot, who's probably not even linked to any organisation and that is impossible to stop, bollards barriers and police manpower but in most cases this is not random, well picked populated cities with a group involved, money, fake ID, and other means to buy/rent vans/cars for these.. well supported radicalised people...
I believe the ones killed were very young late teens early 20's, easy to manipulate
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 03:09:28 PM
Probably the most ridiculous thing said in this thread (and that's saying something) was Iceman even suggesting a major European countries would have a Muslim majority in 15-20 years. They won't have one in 1500-2000 years, let alone two decades. Belgium, the example he used, has a Muslim population of 5% as of 2009. To put that into perspective, there are six over times that number of people in Belgium who have no religion at all. If you want to talk about a religious grouping that will become a majority in the years ahead, that's the one to be looking at.
Fear mongering at it's most frothing and senseless.
Surely the most ridiculous thing was when that same Iceman used euthanasia in his line of argument. Demented
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 03:14:52 PM
There was 5 killed and 2 arrested lately, the 5 killed had fake bomb belts on that's 7 lone wolf's just hanging around the same place?
yes you'll get the crack pot, who's probably not even linked to any organisation and that is impossible to stop, bollards barriers and police manpower but in most cases this is not random, well picked populated cities with a group involved, money, fake ID, and other means to buy/rent vans/cars for these.. well supported radicalised people...
I believe the ones killed were very young late teens early 20's, easy to manipulate
I'm not saying the Spanish attacks are lone wolves.
1. The capital of Belgium is the jihadist capital of Europe. Islamic terrorist Salah Abdeslam fled to Brussels after attacking Paris. He was aided and embedded by Muslim locals. Belgian authorities caught Abdeslam over the weekend. Police believe the attack on Tuesday was a response to the arrest.
2. Belgium has the highest per capita of recruited fighters of any nation in Europe. Over 500 Muslims from Belgium have joined jihadist groups. Most come from Brussels.
3. Belgium-based Islamic extremism is highly concentrated in specific locales of Brussels, specifically, the Muslim-populated Molenbeek district. The small area contains 22 known mosques. Many of the Muslims that have joined jihad come from this district.
4. Parts of Brussels have been described as Muslim "no go zones." Molenbeek has attracted over 600 extremist imams since 1980. Many in the small district follow Sharia law and shun outsiders.
5. 70% of Brussel's population is foreign, namely immigrants Turkey, Morocco, and France. The multicultural nature of the city has prompted authorities to turn a blind eye to suspicious activity all in the service of "tolerance."
Your numbers come from 2008/9 - is that 6% still 6 %? Brussels was listed as 25% Muslim in 2008 also. What number is that now?
Muslims don't believe in abortion or euthenasia...white westerners do. It may seem insignificant but it all adds up it all compounds. 1.3 children is sustaining the population, 4 kids per muslim family doubles their population. So white europeans are going down at the rate of 50% and muslim population is increasing at a rate of 200% or more...I don't think it's far fetched to say Brussels will be a muslim majority very soon? Is belgium that far fetched either?
Quote from: LCohen on August 18, 2017, 03:19:08 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 03:14:52 PM
There was 5 killed and 2 arrested lately, the 5 killed had fake bomb belts on that's 7 lone wolf's just hanging around the same place?
yes you'll get the crack pot, who's probably not even linked to any organisation and that is impossible to stop, bollards barriers and police manpower but in most cases this is not random, well picked populated cities with a group involved, money, fake ID, and other means to buy/rent vans/cars for these.. well supported radicalised people...
I believe the ones killed were very young late teens early 20's, easy to manipulate
I'm not saying the Spanish attacks are lone wolves.
I just don't buy the random out of the blue attacks by one person....
he's told by others so that's already more than one, he's given money and ID to carry out a single person attack...
Paris and Manchester were well coordinated London seemed less but just cause its one person doesn't mean he's a lone wolf, one person carrying out the attack others organising it and some scouting or watching it from afar, the lone wolf works cause there is no escape plan required.. I still think gathering information, covert operations and use of informants will help...
No Universal change on international policies in the Middle East Africa and beyond will stop these lads unfortunately, well not in the immediate future, I haven't heard of one good foreign police yet to fix it
Quote from: The Iceman on August 18, 2017, 03:28:43 PM
1. The capital of Belgium is the jihadist capital of Europe. Islamic terrorist Salah Abdeslam fled to Brussels after attacking Paris. He was aided and embedded by Muslim locals. Belgian authorities caught Abdeslam over the weekend. Police believe the attack on Tuesday was a response to the arrest.
2. Belgium has the highest per capita of recruited fighters of any nation in Europe. Over 500 Muslims from Belgium have joined jihadist groups. Most come from Brussels.
3. Belgium-based Islamic extremism is highly concentrated in specific locales of Brussels, specifically, the Muslim-populated Molenbeek district. The small area contains 22 known mosques. Many of the Muslims that have joined jihad come from this district.
4. Parts of Brussels have been described as Muslim "no go zones." Molenbeek has attracted over 600 extremist imams since 1980. Many in the small district follow Sharia law and shun outsiders.
5. 70% of Brussel's population is foreign, namely immigrants Turkey, Morocco, and France. The multicultural nature of the city has prompted authorities to turn a blind eye to suspicious activity all in the service of "tolerance."
Your numbers come from 2008/9 - is that 6% still 6 %? Brussels was listed as 25% Muslim in 2008 also. What number is that now?
Muslims don't believe in abortion or euthenasia...white westerners do. It may seem insignificant but it all adds up it all compounds. 1.3 children is sustaining the population, 4 kids per muslim family doubles their population. So white europeans are going down at the rate of 50% and muslim population is increasing at a rate of 200% or more...I don't think it's far fetched to say Brussels will be a muslim majority very soon? Is belgium that far fetched either?
5%. And it sounds very much like you're trying to grasp at straws when you got called out on your hyperbole.
If you think that the children of any religious grouping will be as religious as they are now in even 15-20 years, let alone the many millenniums and incredible turns of fortune it would take for such a small minority to become the majority in a western country, you don't see the direction the wind is blowing. Secularism is winning in the west, not Islam.
Quote from: The Iceman on August 18, 2017, 03:28:43 PM
1. The capital of Belgium is the jihadist capital of Europe. Islamic terrorist Salah Abdeslam fled to Brussels after attacking Paris. He was aided and embedded by Muslim locals. Belgian authorities caught Abdeslam over the weekend. Police believe the attack on Tuesday was a response to the arrest.
2. Belgium has the highest per capita of recruited fighters of any nation in Europe. Over 500 Muslims from Belgium have joined jihadist groups. Most come from Brussels.
3. Belgium-based Islamic extremism is highly concentrated in specific locales of Brussels, specifically, the Muslim-populated Molenbeek district. The small area contains 22 known mosques. Many of the Muslims that have joined jihad come from this district.
4. Parts of Brussels have been described as Muslim "no go zones." Molenbeek has attracted over 600 extremist imams since 1980. Many in the small district follow Sharia law and shun outsiders.
5. 70% of Brussel's population is foreign, namely immigrants Turkey, Morocco, and France. The multicultural nature of the city has prompted authorities to turn a blind eye to suspicious activity all in the service of "tolerance."
Your numbers come from 2008/9 - is that 6% still 6 %? Brussels was listed as 25% Muslim in 2008 also. What number is that now?
Muslims don't believe in abortion or euthenasia...white westerners do. It may seem insignificant but it all adds up it all compounds. 1.3 children is sustaining the population, 4 kids per muslim family doubles their population. So white europeans are going down at the rate of 50% and muslim population is increasing at a rate of 200% or more...I don't think it's far fetched to say Brussels will be a muslim majority very soon? Is belgium that far fetched either?
So if they do become Muslim is that a bad thing for you? will they all become jihadist ? strange
Quote from: The Iceman on August 18, 2017, 03:28:43 PM
1. The capital of Belgium is the jihadist capital of Europe. Islamic terrorist Salah Abdeslam fled to Brussels after attacking Paris. He was aided and embedded by Muslim locals. Belgian authorities caught Abdeslam over the weekend. Police believe the attack on Tuesday was a response to the arrest.
2. Belgium has the highest per capita of recruited fighters of any nation in Europe. Over 500 Muslims from Belgium have joined jihadist groups. Most come from Brussels.
3. Belgium-based Islamic extremism is highly concentrated in specific locales of Brussels, specifically, the Muslim-populated Molenbeek district. The small area contains 22 known mosques. Many of the Muslims that have joined jihad come from this district.
4. Parts of Brussels have been described as Muslim "no go zones." Molenbeek has attracted over 600 extremist imams since 1980. Many in the small district follow Sharia law and shun outsiders.
5. 70% of Brussel's population is foreign, namely immigrants Turkey, Morocco, and France. The multicultural nature of the city has prompted authorities to turn a blind eye to suspicious activity all in the service of "tolerance."
Your numbers come from 2008/9 - is that 6% still 6 %? Brussels was listed as 25% Muslim in 2008 also. What number is that now?
Muslims don't believe in abortion or euthenasia...white westerners do. It may seem insignificant but it all adds up it all compounds. 1.3 children is sustaining the population, 4 kids per muslim family doubles their population. So white europeans are going down at the rate of 50% and muslim population is increasing at a rate of 200% or more...I don't think it's far fetched to say Brussels will be a muslim majority very soon? Is belgium that far fetched either?
Presumably you are quaking in your boots about what white Christian are doing with their current majority positions?
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 03:33:40 PM
Quote from: The Iceman on August 18, 2017, 03:28:43 PM
1. The capital of Belgium is the jihadist capital of Europe. Islamic terrorist Salah Abdeslam fled to Brussels after attacking Paris. He was aided and embedded by Muslim locals. Belgian authorities caught Abdeslam over the weekend. Police believe the attack on Tuesday was a response to the arrest.
2. Belgium has the highest per capita of recruited fighters of any nation in Europe. Over 500 Muslims from Belgium have joined jihadist groups. Most come from Brussels.
3. Belgium-based Islamic extremism is highly concentrated in specific locales of Brussels, specifically, the Muslim-populated Molenbeek district. The small area contains 22 known mosques. Many of the Muslims that have joined jihad come from this district.
4. Parts of Brussels have been described as Muslim "no go zones." Molenbeek has attracted over 600 extremist imams since 1980. Many in the small district follow Sharia law and shun outsiders.
5. 70% of Brussel's population is foreign, namely immigrants Turkey, Morocco, and France. The multicultural nature of the city has prompted authorities to turn a blind eye to suspicious activity all in the service of "tolerance."
Your numbers come from 2008/9 - is that 6% still 6 %? Brussels was listed as 25% Muslim in 2008 also. What number is that now?
Muslims don't believe in abortion or euthenasia...white westerners do. It may seem insignificant but it all adds up it all compounds. 1.3 children is sustaining the population, 4 kids per muslim family doubles their population. So white europeans are going down at the rate of 50% and muslim population is increasing at a rate of 200% or more...I don't think it's far fetched to say Brussels will be a muslim majority very soon? Is belgium that far fetched either?
5%. And it sounds very much like you're trying to grasp at straws when you got called out on your hyperbole.
If you think that the children of any religious grouping will be as religious as they are now in even 15-20 years, let alone the many millenniums and incredible turns of fortune it would take for such a small minority to become the majority in a western country, you don't see the direction the wind is blowing. Secularism is winning in the west, not Islam.
secularism can't win when secular people are not even able to sustain their population. How does that work? 1.3 children per "family" older people dying off, older people choosing assisted suicide (big story about it this week). Muslims are 4 kids per family and running tight family units (so far). I've seen no evidence that they aren't religious because there parents are... its a numbers game and muslims will win it
Sharia law is no joke
White "christians" aren't the majority. Cultural christians perhaps but they are not Christians.... it's already secular
Quote from: Gabriel_Hurl on August 18, 2017, 03:11:49 PM
New attack in Finland
Saw this on Newstalk's twitter but not a word about it even in the sub headlines on RTE. Strange.
Quote from: The Iceman on August 18, 2017, 03:42:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 03:33:40 PM
Quote from: The Iceman on August 18, 2017, 03:28:43 PM
1. The capital of Belgium is the jihadist capital of Europe. Islamic terrorist Salah Abdeslam fled to Brussels after attacking Paris. He was aided and embedded by Muslim locals. Belgian authorities caught Abdeslam over the weekend. Police believe the attack on Tuesday was a response to the arrest.
2. Belgium has the highest per capita of recruited fighters of any nation in Europe. Over 500 Muslims from Belgium have joined jihadist groups. Most come from Brussels.
3. Belgium-based Islamic extremism is highly concentrated in specific locales of Brussels, specifically, the Muslim-populated Molenbeek district. The small area contains 22 known mosques. Many of the Muslims that have joined jihad come from this district.
4. Parts of Brussels have been described as Muslim "no go zones." Molenbeek has attracted over 600 extremist imams since 1980. Many in the small district follow Sharia law and shun outsiders.
5. 70% of Brussel's population is foreign, namely immigrants Turkey, Morocco, and France. The multicultural nature of the city has prompted authorities to turn a blind eye to suspicious activity all in the service of "tolerance."
Your numbers come from 2008/9 - is that 6% still 6 %? Brussels was listed as 25% Muslim in 2008 also. What number is that now?
Muslims don't believe in abortion or euthenasia...white westerners do. It may seem insignificant but it all adds up it all compounds. 1.3 children is sustaining the population, 4 kids per muslim family doubles their population. So white europeans are going down at the rate of 50% and muslim population is increasing at a rate of 200% or more...I don't think it's far fetched to say Brussels will be a muslim majority very soon? Is belgium that far fetched either?
5%. And it sounds very much like you're trying to grasp at straws when you got called out on your hyperbole.
If you think that the children of any religious grouping will be as religious as they are now in even 15-20 years, let alone the many millenniums and incredible turns of fortune it would take for such a small minority to become the majority in a western country, you don't see the direction the wind is blowing. Secularism is winning in the west, not Islam.
secularism can't win when secular people are not even able to sustain their population. How does that work? 1.3 children per "family" older people dying off, older people choosing assisted suicide (big story about it this week). Muslims are 4 kids per family and running tight family units (so far). I've seen no evidence that they aren't religious because there parents are... its a numbers game and muslims will win it
Sharia law is no joke
White "christians" aren't the majority. Cultural christians perhaps but they are not Christians.... it's already secular
Secularism doesn't rely on 2 secularists riding and a little secularist popping out.
People are not born secularist. They are not born Christian or Muslim either no matter how much spiritualists try to claim them.
Sharia law is no joke. Neither us Christian fundamentalism. As we can see
Quote from: Esmarelda on August 18, 2017, 03:42:46 PM
Quote from: Gabriel_Hurl on August 18, 2017, 03:11:49 PM
New attack in Finland
Saw this on Newstalk's twitter but not a word about it even in the sub headlines on RTE. Strange.
was on bbc thread
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-40978446
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 03:14:52 PM
There was 5 killed and 2 arrested lately, the 5 killed had fake bomb belts on that's 7 lone wolf's just hanging around the same place?
yes you'll get the crack pot, who's probably not even linked to any organisation and that is impossible to stop, bollards barriers and police manpower but in most cases this is not random, well picked populated cities with a group involved, money, fake ID, and other means to buy/rent vans/cars for these.. well supported radicalised people...
I believe the ones killed were very young late teens early 20's, easy to manipulate
All these people were caught AFTER the event MR, when they had put their head above the parapet so to speak. Have you EVER heard of any terrorist being arrested for planning an attack with a car? Intelligence agencies haven't a chance with this.
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 04:17:51 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 03:14:52 PM
There was 5 killed and 2 arrested lately, the 5 killed had fake bomb belts on that's 7 lone wolf's just hanging around the same place?
yes you'll get the crack pot, who's probably not even linked to any organisation and that is impossible to stop, bollards barriers and police manpower but in most cases this is not random, well picked populated cities with a group involved, money, fake ID, and other means to buy/rent vans/cars for these.. well supported radicalised people...
I believe the ones killed were very young late teens early 20's, easy to manipulate
All these people were caught AFTER the event MR, when they had put their head above the parapet so to speak. Have you EVER heard of any terrorist being arrested for planning an attack with a car? Intelligence agencies haven't a chance with this.
Nail on head - society today is fucked, social media and the internet has a lot to answer for, any gormless halfwit can be groomed to do anything, or any gormless halfwit can go down in flames on an international stage carrying out a cowardly act. Unfortunately the press these events get globally will only inspire other fuckwits to act similarly, even those not radicalised can simply follow these cowards if they have any sore of grievance, bit like that pilot who flew the plane into a mountain.
Quote from: LCohen on August 18, 2017, 03:47:46 PM
Quote from: The Iceman on August 18, 2017, 03:42:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 03:33:40 PM
Quote from: The Iceman on August 18, 2017, 03:28:43 PM
1. The capital of Belgium is the jihadist capital of Europe. Islamic terrorist Salah Abdeslam fled to Brussels after attacking Paris. He was aided and embedded by Muslim locals. Belgian authorities caught Abdeslam over the weekend. Police believe the attack on Tuesday was a response to the arrest.
2. Belgium has the highest per capita of recruited fighters of any nation in Europe. Over 500 Muslims from Belgium have joined jihadist groups. Most come from Brussels.
3. Belgium-based Islamic extremism is highly concentrated in specific locales of Brussels, specifically, the Muslim-populated Molenbeek district. The small area contains 22 known mosques. Many of the Muslims that have joined jihad come from this district.
4. Parts of Brussels have been described as Muslim "no go zones." Molenbeek has attracted over 600 extremist imams since 1980. Many in the small district follow Sharia law and shun outsiders.
5. 70% of Brussel's population is foreign, namely immigrants Turkey, Morocco, and France. The multicultural nature of the city has prompted authorities to turn a blind eye to suspicious activity all in the service of "tolerance."
Your numbers come from 2008/9 - is that 6% still 6 %? Brussels was listed as 25% Muslim in 2008 also. What number is that now?
Muslims don't believe in abortion or euthenasia...white westerners do. It may seem insignificant but it all adds up it all compounds. 1.3 children is sustaining the population, 4 kids per muslim family doubles their population. So white europeans are going down at the rate of 50% and muslim population is increasing at a rate of 200% or more...I don't think it's far fetched to say Brussels will be a muslim majority very soon? Is belgium that far fetched either?
5%. And it sounds very much like you're trying to grasp at straws when you got called out on your hyperbole.
If you think that the children of any religious grouping will be as religious as they are now in even 15-20 years, let alone the many millenniums and incredible turns of fortune it would take for such a small minority to become the majority in a western country, you don't see the direction the wind is blowing. Secularism is winning in the west, not Islam.
secularism can't win when secular people are not even able to sustain their population. How does that work? 1.3 children per "family" older people dying off, older people choosing assisted suicide (big story about it this week). Muslims are 4 kids per family and running tight family units (so far). I've seen no evidence that they aren't religious because there parents are... its a numbers game and muslims will win it
Sharia law is no joke
White "christians" aren't the majority. Cultural christians perhaps but they are not Christians.... it's already secular
Secularism doesn't rely on 2 secularists riding and a little secularist popping out.
People are not born secularist. They are not born Christian or Muslim either no matter how much spiritualists try to claim them.
Sharia law is no joke. Neither us Christian fundamentalism. As we can see
I'll take a radical Catholic like Padre Pio over a radical muslim like your mate Bin Laden any day.
Mother Theresa was a radical Catholic - she wasn't lopping off childrens heads or drowning families in dunk tanks
you can have your sharia law and radical islam
peace
f**king state of that argument. "Your mate bin Laden".
Quote from: punt kick on August 18, 2017, 04:24:20 PM
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 04:17:51 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 03:14:52 PM
There was 5 killed and 2 arrested lately, the 5 killed had fake bomb belts on that's 7 lone wolf's just hanging around the same place?
yes you'll get the crack pot, who's probably not even linked to any organisation and that is impossible to stop, bollards barriers and police manpower but in most cases this is not random, well picked populated cities with a group involved, money, fake ID, and other means to buy/rent vans/cars for these.. well supported radicalised people...
I believe the ones killed were very young late teens early 20's, easy to manipulate
All these people were caught AFTER the event MR, when they had put their head above the parapet so to speak. Have you EVER heard of any terrorist being arrested for planning an attack with a car? Intelligence agencies haven't a chance with this.
Nail on head - society today is fucked, social media and the internet has a lot to answer for, any gormless halfwit can be groomed to do anything, or any gormless halfwit can go down in flames on an international stage carrying out a cowardly act. Unfortunately the press these events get globally will only inspire other fuckwits to act similarly, even those not radicalised can simply follow these cowards if they have any sore of grievance, bit like that pilot who flew the plane into a mountain.
How has it a lot to answer for? It makes communication easier for everyone, including those that want to harm others, and so it should take some of the blame? I'm engaging with you now. If you go out and kick a dog because I annoy you is it the board's fault?
Yeah because we are talking about kicking a dog here. So many gobshites with their head in the sand or up their arse no wonder society is heading towards a cliff edge.
Quote from: punt kick on August 18, 2017, 05:13:50 PM
Yeah because we are talking about kicking a dog here. So many gobshites with their head in the sand or up their arse no wonder society is heading towards a cliff edge.
Surely it's easier to explain your point than typing a sentence full of sensational idioms with little substance.
I am in my 5th decade on this planet and knew a time of rules and boundaries. Most kids exist within the social and virtual society online in which there are no rules and boundaries. Anything goes, anything can be posted - shared etc. Society is becoming so use to extremism on a daily basis it is fast losing it's moral compass. Technology for all its good is going to be our downfall and social media is playing its part.
Quote from: punt kick on August 18, 2017, 05:32:28 PM
I am in my 5th decade on this planet and knew a time of rules and boundaries. Most kids exist within the social and virtual society online in which there are no rules and boundaries. Anything goes, anything can be posted - shared etc. Society is becoming so use to extremism on a daily basis it is fast losing it's moral compass. Technology for all its good is going to be our downfall and social media is playing its part.
Your five decades have granted you little wisdom. Every generation grows old and can't understand the changes they see in the youth. The world has been about to end for as long as a words or pictures have been recorded on the side of a rocks.
You are in the great wheel of life and you can't even see it.
Quote from: The Iceman on August 18, 2017, 04:25:43 PM
Quote from: LCohen on August 18, 2017, 03:47:46 PM
Quote from: The Iceman on August 18, 2017, 03:42:32 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 03:33:40 PM
Quote from: The Iceman on August 18, 2017, 03:28:43 PM
1. The capital of Belgium is the jihadist capital of Europe. Islamic terrorist Salah Abdeslam fled to Brussels after attacking Paris. He was aided and embedded by Muslim locals. Belgian authorities caught Abdeslam over the weekend. Police believe the attack on Tuesday was a response to the arrest.
2. Belgium has the highest per capita of recruited fighters of any nation in Europe. Over 500 Muslims from Belgium have joined jihadist groups. Most come from Brussels.
3. Belgium-based Islamic extremism is highly concentrated in specific locales of Brussels, specifically, the Muslim-populated Molenbeek district. The small area contains 22 known mosques. Many of the Muslims that have joined jihad come from this district.
4. Parts of Brussels have been described as Muslim "no go zones." Molenbeek has attracted over 600 extremist imams since 1980. Many in the small district follow Sharia law and shun outsiders.
5. 70% of Brussel's population is foreign, namely immigrants Turkey, Morocco, and France. The multicultural nature of the city has prompted authorities to turn a blind eye to suspicious activity all in the service of "tolerance."
Your numbers come from 2008/9 - is that 6% still 6 %? Brussels was listed as 25% Muslim in 2008 also. What number is that now?
Muslims don't believe in abortion or euthenasia...white westerners do. It may seem insignificant but it all adds up it all compounds. 1.3 children is sustaining the population, 4 kids per muslim family doubles their population. So white europeans are going down at the rate of 50% and muslim population is increasing at a rate of 200% or more...I don't think it's far fetched to say Brussels will be a muslim majority very soon? Is belgium that far fetched either?
5%. And it sounds very much like you're trying to grasp at straws when you got called out on your hyperbole.
If you think that the children of any religious grouping will be as religious as they are now in even 15-20 years, let alone the many millenniums and incredible turns of fortune it would take for such a small minority to become the majority in a western country, you don't see the direction the wind is blowing. Secularism is winning in the west, not Islam.
secularism can't win when secular people are not even able to sustain their population. How does that work? 1.3 children per "family" older people dying off, older people choosing assisted suicide (big story about it this week). Muslims are 4 kids per family and running tight family units (so far). I've seen no evidence that they aren't religious because there parents are... its a numbers game and muslims will win it
Sharia law is no joke
White "christians" aren't the majority. Cultural christians perhaps but they are not Christians.... it's already secular
Secularism doesn't rely on 2 secularists riding and a little secularist popping out.
People are not born secularist. They are not born Christian or Muslim either no matter how much spiritualists try to claim them.
Sharia law is no joke. Neither us Christian fundamentalism. As we can see
I'll take a radical Catholic like Padre Pio over a radical muslim like your mate Bin Laden any day.
Mother Theresa was a radical Catholic - she wasn't lopping off childrens heads or drowning families in dunk tanks
you can have your sharia law and radical islam
peace
Is this the sort of horse dung you are going to retort with?
My mate Bin Laden?? Any evidence for that? If you are going to debase all argument with this sort of cowardice I might as well accuse you of not only being a practicing child abuser but the global architect of all abuse. I would be offering the same amount of supporting evidence.
Likewise my sharia law????? Which barrel are you scraping this stuff from? Are you really throwing the towel in this easily? Has your argument got nothing better to hang on to?
Padre Pio. Fraudulent self harmers are always good for backing up a point.
Teresa. Now there's a girl who knew how to stand in the way of helping people. Ever talk to the aid workers trying to get something done in Calcutta?
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 05:57:18 PM
Quote from: punt kick on August 18, 2017, 05:32:28 PM
I am in my 5th decade on this planet and knew a time of rules and boundaries. Most kids exist within the social and virtual society online in which there are no rules and boundaries. Anything goes, anything can be posted - shared etc. Society is becoming so use to extremism on a daily basis it is fast losing it's moral compass. Technology for all its good is going to be our downfall and social media is playing its part.
Your five decades have granted you little wisdom. Every generation grows old and can't understand the changes they see in the youth. The world has been about to end for as long as a words or pictures have been recorded on the side of a rocks.
You are in the great wheel of life and you can't even see it.
I am in the 5th decade ;) and we are in a car with the wheels about to come off. As a society we are at the abyss. Look at the images online even on normal individuals its all false photoshoped crap, why - reality is a thing of the past.
Quote from: punt kick on August 18, 2017, 09:48:51 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 05:57:18 PM
Quote from: punt kick on August 18, 2017, 05:32:28 PM
I am in my 5th decade on this planet and knew a time of rules and boundaries. Most kids exist within the social and virtual society online in which there are no rules and boundaries. Anything goes, anything can be posted - shared etc. Society is becoming so use to extremism on a daily basis it is fast losing it's moral compass. Technology for all its good is going to be our downfall and social media is playing its part.
Your five decades have granted you little wisdom. Every generation grows old and can't understand the changes they see in the youth. The world has been about to end for as long as a words or pictures have been recorded on the side of a rocks.
You are in the great wheel of life and you can't even see it.
I am in the 5th decade ;) and we are in a car with the wheels about to come off. As a society we are at the abyss. Look at the images online even on normal individuals its all false photoshoped crap, why - reality is a thing of the past.
What's your next move then?
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 04:17:51 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 03:14:52 PM
There was 5 killed and 2 arrested lately, the 5 killed had fake bomb belts on that's 7 lone wolf's just hanging around the same place?
yes you'll get the crack pot, who's probably not even linked to any organisation and that is impossible to stop, bollards barriers and police manpower but in most cases this is not random, well picked populated cities with a group involved, money, fake ID, and other means to buy/rent vans/cars for these.. well supported radicalised people...
I believe the ones killed were very young late teens early 20's, easy to manipulate
All these people were caught AFTER the event MR, when they had put their head above the parapet so to speak. Have you EVER heard of any terrorist being arrested for planning an attack with a car? Intelligence agencies haven't a chance with this.
So there hadn't been arrests before an attack has been carried out? Cells have been arrested plenty times so god knows how many attacks have been stopped, by an 'individual' lone wolf from that group... you do agree that these 'randoms' have financial backing to do this and instructions?
Quote from: LCohen on August 18, 2017, 09:56:22 PM
Quote from: punt kick on August 18, 2017, 09:48:51 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 05:57:18 PM
Quote from: punt kick on August 18, 2017, 05:32:28 PM
I am in my 5th decade on this planet and knew a time of rules and boundaries. Most kids exist within the social and virtual society online in which there are no rules and boundaries. Anything goes, anything can be posted - shared etc. Society is becoming so use to extremism on a daily basis it is fast losing it's moral compass. Technology for all its good is going to be our downfall and social media is playing its part.
Your five decades have granted you little wisdom. Every generation grows old and can't understand the changes they see in the youth. The world has been about to end for as long as a words or pictures have been recorded on the side of a rocks.
You are in the great wheel of life and you can't even see it.
I am in the 5th decade ;) and we are in a car with the wheels about to come off. As a society we are at the abyss. Look at the images online even on normal individuals its all false photoshoped crap, why - reality is a thing of the past.
What's your next move then?
Let them at it. Sun has 4 billion years left humanity be lucky to see out this century.
Quote from: punt kick on August 18, 2017, 11:25:55 PM
Quote from: LCohen on August 18, 2017, 09:56:22 PM
Quote from: punt kick on August 18, 2017, 09:48:51 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 05:57:18 PM
Quote from: punt kick on August 18, 2017, 05:32:28 PM
I am in my 5th decade on this planet and knew a time of rules and boundaries. Most kids exist within the social and virtual society online in which there are no rules and boundaries. Anything goes, anything can be posted - shared etc. Society is becoming so use to extremism on a daily basis it is fast losing it's moral compass. Technology for all its good is going to be our downfall and social media is playing its part.
Your five decades have granted you little wisdom. Every generation grows old and can't understand the changes they see in the youth. The world has been about to end for as long as a words or pictures have been recorded on the side of a rocks.
You are in the great wheel of life and you can't even see it.
I am in the 5th decade ;) and we are in a car with the wheels about to come off. As a society we are at the abyss. Look at the images online even on normal individuals its all false photoshoped crap, why - reality is a thing of the past.
What's your next move then?
Let them at it. Sun has 4 billion years left humanity be lucky to see out this century.
Define Humanity in this context?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 10:07:02 PM
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 04:17:51 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 03:14:52 PM
There was 5 killed and 2 arrested lately, the 5 killed had fake bomb belts on that's 7 lone wolf's just hanging around the same place?
yes you'll get the crack pot, who's probably not even linked to any organisation and that is impossible to stop, bollards barriers and police manpower but in most cases this is not random, well picked populated cities with a group involved, money, fake ID, and other means to buy/rent vans/cars for these.. well supported radicalised people...
I believe the ones killed were very young late teens early 20's, easy to manipulate
All these people were caught AFTER the event MR, when they had put their head above the parapet so to speak. Have you EVER heard of any terrorist being arrested for planning an attack with a car? Intelligence agencies haven't a chance with this.
So there hadn't been arrests before an attack has been carried out? Cells have been arrested plenty times so god knows how many attacks have been stopped, by an 'individual' lone wolf from that group... you do agree that these 'randoms' have financial backing to do this and instructions?
Cells have been arrested for planning bombs/shootings. This case in particular is a prime example. These guys only came to the attention of the intelligence agencies when they accidentally blew up the house they were making a bomb in. Now even whenever they had done something as prominent as that and put a marker on themselves, they were STILL fit to get away with the car thing. I have to laugh at talk of 'financing' these operations. How much 'financial backing' does it take to buy/rent/steal a car? Jesus you could do it for fifty euro. Hence, there little to no hope of catching someone planning this type of attack before the event.
Quote from: Franko on August 22, 2017, 08:41:34 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 10:07:02 PM
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 04:17:51 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 03:14:52 PM
There was 5 killed and 2 arrested lately, the 5 killed had fake bomb belts on that's 7 lone wolf's just hanging around the same place?
yes you'll get the crack pot, who's probably not even linked to any organisation and that is impossible to stop, bollards barriers and police manpower but in most cases this is not random, well picked populated cities with a group involved, money, fake ID, and other means to buy/rent vans/cars for these.. well supported radicalised people...
I believe the ones killed were very young late teens early 20's, easy to manipulate
All these people were caught AFTER the event MR, when they had put their head above the parapet so to speak. Have you EVER heard of any terrorist being arrested for planning an attack with a car? Intelligence agencies haven't a chance with this.
So there hadn't been arrests before an attack has been carried out? Cells have been arrested plenty times so god knows how many attacks have been stopped, by an 'individual' lone wolf from that group... you do agree that these 'randoms' have financial backing to do this and instructions?
Cells have been arrested for planning bombs/shootings. This case in particular is a prime example. These guys only came to the attention of the intelligence agencies when they accidentally blew up the house they were making a bomb in. Now even whenever they had done something as prominent as that and put a marker on themselves, they were STILL fit to get away with the car thing. I have to laugh at talk of 'financing' these operations. How much 'financial backing' does it take to buy/rent/steal a car? Jesus you could do it for fifty euro. Hence, there little to no hope of catching someone planning this type of attack before the event.
A lot of these lads travel to ISIS areas for training and radicalization, they don't walk
Quote from: punt kick on August 18, 2017, 11:25:55 PM
Quote from: LCohen on August 18, 2017, 09:56:22 PM
Quote from: punt kick on August 18, 2017, 09:48:51 PM
Quote from: Syferus on August 18, 2017, 05:57:18 PM
Quote from: punt kick on August 18, 2017, 05:32:28 PM
I am in my 5th decade on this planet and knew a time of rules and boundaries. Most kids exist within the social and virtual society online in which there are no rules and boundaries. Anything goes, anything can be posted - shared etc. Society is becoming so use to extremism on a daily basis it is fast losing it's moral compass. Technology for all its good is going to be our downfall and social media is playing its part.
Your five decades have granted you little wisdom. Every generation grows old and can't understand the changes they see in the youth. The world has been about to end for as long as a words or pictures have been recorded on the side of a rocks.
You are in the great wheel of life and you can't even see it.
I am in the 5th decade ;) and we are in a car with the wheels about to come off. As a society we are at the abyss. Look at the images online even on normal individuals its all false photoshoped crap, why - reality is a thing of the past.
What's your next move then?
Let them at it. Sun has 4 billion years left humanity be lucky to see out this century.
Do you suffer from mood swings?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 22, 2017, 11:51:31 AM
Quote from: Franko on August 22, 2017, 08:41:34 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 10:07:02 PM
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 04:17:51 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 03:14:52 PM
There was 5 killed and 2 arrested lately, the 5 killed had fake bomb belts on that's 7 lone wolf's just hanging around the same place?
yes you'll get the crack pot, who's probably not even linked to any organisation and that is impossible to stop, bollards barriers and police manpower but in most cases this is not random, well picked populated cities with a group involved, money, fake ID, and other means to buy/rent vans/cars for these.. well supported radicalised people...
I believe the ones killed were very young late teens early 20's, easy to manipulate
All these people were caught AFTER the event MR, when they had put their head above the parapet so to speak. Have you EVER heard of any terrorist being arrested for planning an attack with a car? Intelligence agencies haven't a chance with this.
So there hadn't been arrests before an attack has been carried out? Cells have been arrested plenty times so god knows how many attacks have been stopped, by an 'individual' lone wolf from that group... you do agree that these 'randoms' have financial backing to do this and instructions?
Cells have been arrested for planning bombs/shootings. This case in particular is a prime example. These guys only came to the attention of the intelligence agencies when they accidentally blew up the house they were making a bomb in. Now even whenever they had done something as prominent as that and put a marker on themselves, they were STILL fit to get away with the car thing. I have to laugh at talk of 'financing' these operations. How much 'financial backing' does it take to buy/rent/steal a car? Jesus you could do it for fifty euro. Hence, there little to no hope of catching someone planning this type of attack before the event.
A lot of these lads travel to ISIS areas for training and radicalization, they don't walk
What training is required to drive the car into someone? This is getting difficult.
Quote from: Franko on August 22, 2017, 01:41:30 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 22, 2017, 11:51:31 AM
Quote from: Franko on August 22, 2017, 08:41:34 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 10:07:02 PM
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 04:17:51 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 03:14:52 PM
There was 5 killed and 2 arrested lately, the 5 killed had fake bomb belts on that's 7 lone wolf's just hanging around the same place?
yes you'll get the crack pot, who's probably not even linked to any organisation and that is impossible to stop, bollards barriers and police manpower but in most cases this is not random, well picked populated cities with a group involved, money, fake ID, and other means to buy/rent vans/cars for these.. well supported radicalised people...
I believe the ones killed were very young late teens early 20's, easy to manipulate
All these people were caught AFTER the event MR, when they had put their head above the parapet so to speak. Have you EVER heard of any terrorist being arrested for planning an attack with a car? Intelligence agencies haven't a chance with this.
So there hadn't been arrests before an attack has been carried out? Cells have been arrested plenty times so god knows how many attacks have been stopped, by an 'individual' lone wolf from that group... you do agree that these 'randoms' have financial backing to do this and instructions?
Cells have been arrested for planning bombs/shootings. This case in particular is a prime example. These guys only came to the attention of the intelligence agencies when they accidentally blew up the house they were making a bomb in. Now even whenever they had done something as prominent as that and put a marker on themselves, they were STILL fit to get away with the car thing. I have to laugh at talk of 'financing' these operations. How much 'financial backing' does it take to buy/rent/steal a car? Jesus you could do it for fifty euro. Hence, there little to no hope of catching someone planning this type of attack before the event.
A lot of these lads travel to ISIS areas for training and radicalization, they don't walk
What training is required to drive the car into someone? This is getting difficult.
Driving lessons.
No security service in the world can watch every potential radical. It's simply not possible and to even go down the route of adequately policing travel to hotbeds of radicalization the airports and ports need to get into some serious racial profiling.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on August 22, 2017, 01:46:48 PM
Quote from: Franko on August 22, 2017, 01:41:30 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 22, 2017, 11:51:31 AM
Quote from: Franko on August 22, 2017, 08:41:34 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 10:07:02 PM
Quote from: Franko on August 18, 2017, 04:17:51 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 18, 2017, 03:14:52 PM
There was 5 killed and 2 arrested lately, the 5 killed had fake bomb belts on that's 7 lone wolf's just hanging around the same place?
yes you'll get the crack pot, who's probably not even linked to any organisation and that is impossible to stop, bollards barriers and police manpower but in most cases this is not random, well picked populated cities with a group involved, money, fake ID, and other means to buy/rent vans/cars for these.. well supported radicalised people...
I believe the ones killed were very young late teens early 20's, easy to manipulate
All these people were caught AFTER the event MR, when they had put their head above the parapet so to speak. Have you EVER heard of any terrorist being arrested for planning an attack with a car? Intelligence agencies haven't a chance with this.
So there hadn't been arrests before an attack has been carried out? Cells have been arrested plenty times so god knows how many attacks have been stopped, by an 'individual' lone wolf from that group... you do agree that these 'randoms' have financial backing to do this and instructions?
Cells have been arrested for planning bombs/shootings. This case in particular is a prime example. These guys only came to the attention of the intelligence agencies when they accidentally blew up the house they were making a bomb in. Now even whenever they had done something as prominent as that and put a marker on themselves, they were STILL fit to get away with the car thing. I have to laugh at talk of 'financing' these operations. How much 'financial backing' does it take to buy/rent/steal a car? Jesus you could do it for fifty euro. Hence, there little to no hope of catching someone planning this type of attack before the event.
A lot of these lads travel to ISIS areas for training and radicalization, they don't walk
What training is required to drive the car into someone? This is getting difficult.
Driving lessons.
No security service in the world can watch every potential radical. It's simply not possible and to even go down the route of adequately policing travel to hotbeds of radicalization the airports and ports need to get into some serious racial profiling.
100%. They haven't a hope.
As everyone here says the lads who just ram with vehicles don't need any real planning and no need to even form a cell or contact someone higher up the food chain.
Another thing now is that some deranged lads who go out and do these things get claimed by ISIS after the fact and that gets them their ticket to paradise too and martyrdom.
Reading some of the Barca details these lads had planning and organisation but never popped up anywhere before. Even the town where most of them came from is meant to be a nice well-adjusted town.
The world is a bif fucked in fairness.