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Folks judging by a few of the threads on the board it's safe to say a good few of you here like to gamble, i like a punt on the football but i also would have a we flutter on the horses too. If I'm honest if i stuck to just football i believe i could make a small profit but the problem is when i bet on horses I'd lose. Also if i do get a half decent win then I'd scarper from the bookies with my winnings and would not stand there punting with my winnings, some friends of mine have said if they win they'd spend the day in the bookies until they were broke.

What type of gambler are you and what do you gamble on?

is that you oisin? :D

Quote from: lawnseed on September 11, 2011, 05:46:56 PM
is that you oisin? :D

Caught out FFS

Quote from: illdecide on September 11, 2011, 05:49:15 PM

Quote from: lawnseed on September 11, 2011, 05:46:56 PM
is that you oisin? :D

Caught out FFS

your supposed to be quit >:(      :D

Casual gambler. I like a wee football/Gaelic bet each week and then I do a little extra betting when I have some spare money floating about. Get the odd success and prob break about even most years. I only do the horses when Cheltenham is on, a big race is on or I'm actually at the races. Would never spend more than 15 mins in the bookies. Pick the bet and leave.

Haven't a clue about it. The chat on the various gambling threads may as well be Japanese. I'd be a very, very rare gambler and have seen it get its claws into some people.

Quote from: Tony Baloney on September 11, 2011, 06:33:52 PM
Haven't a clue about it. The chat on the various gambling threads may as well be Japanese. I'd be a very, very rare gambler and have seen it get its claws into some people.

+1
I've no interest in it. Money is too hard to come by without giving it away again. As the saying goes, there's never a poor bookie.

Quote from: tbrick18 on September 11, 2011, 07:23:51 PM
As the saying goes, there's never a poor bookie.

That's because they refuse the bets of anyone who isn't a mug, not because they can't be beaten.

Folks - My younger brother knows a lot about racing and says to back a horse called Born To Sea next time he runs. Just so you know.  8)

As for this thread, Sports gambling certainly appears to have become popular in the last few years. I guess the idea of a football acca (high potential return for small outlay) appeals to a lot of people. Access to internet in almost every home has probably assisted the growth of sports gambling big time too.

Don't forget bookies are gamblers too, and there's been a few poor ones over the years - contrary to the cliche above. And a small handful of punters have succeeded too (probably easier than ever now thanks to the introduction of the exchanges where not only have you backers, but also layers, traders, arbers, etc). To be a good gambler, you need a combination of discipline, patience, nerve and a rare knowledge of what you punt on. Most people many of these qualities.

People not very good at Maths tend to make poor gamblers too.

Back a good few horses and do few bets on the G.A.A and soccer as well,for a while there i found myself going into bookies to put on a horse i fancied and staying on and backing dogs and racing in south africa and other random countries where i knew nothing about any of the horses and was losing a bomb,i've since started using my online account for pretty much all of my bets because the mug punting i end up doing in the bookies would fairly swiftly land a man in the poor house!
The 1 bit of betting i simply can't fathom is the cartoon racing,id be sat in a bookies watching grown men shout at a cartoon that they've 50 e/w on and think holy god there can't be a recession going on at all  :o!

A punter has one key advantage over the bookmaker: the bookmaker lays on every race/match/fight etc whereas the punter can be selective on which races/matches/fights he plays in. The key to successful punting is to be as selective and disciplined as possible.

My own background is in national hunt racing so naturally it's my sport of choice from a betting point of view. I occasionally will have a bet on the local club matches and such but I struggle to find an edge in other sports. Finding an edge isn't easy but it can be done. Keep a record of all your bets (the more detailed a database the better) and try to identify the kind of events that you win money in and vice versa. I learned that I had most success in backing novice hurdlers and chasers so I will tend to focus on these races and I study them thoroughly - the more you watch the more you learn. I tend to avoid lower grade racing and handicaps. A grade 1 horse is far more likely to show consistent form rather than a moderately bred yak being ridden by some cowboy around one of the gaff tracks.

As STS says, an appreciation of the maths side of things is essential in order to maximise profits and minimise losses. For example, I rarely back multiples because the odds are stacked in the bookmaker's favour. The prospect of a big payout may be tempting but the better long term strategy is to play the percentages. I would estimate that two thirds of my bets are each way wagers with the other third being win singles. I will back each way at prices down to as low as 5/2. The logic behind it is simple - if I back a horse at 3/1 each way one quarter the odds and my horse is placed, I will still get 87.5% of my original stake back. If I'd backed the horse to win and it was placed, I'd have lost 100% of my stake rather than 12.5%. A decent form student should be backing enough winners at around the 3/1 mark to be making such a strategy profitable.

The concept of value is one that is often talked about by tipsters and pundits. However, I don't agree with many of the common interpretations of 'value'. I have heard a lot of punters say that they will never back at odds on because there's no value in it but that is nonsense as far as I'm concerned. A horse could be available to back at 4/6 when it should be a 1/3 shot on all known form - Sea The Stars in the Irish Campion Stakes being a prime example. It's easy to say it in hindsight (though I'm sure if someone fished out the page on the Horse Racing Thread I was saying the same before the race!) but 4/6 was a cracking value bet.

A punter should study as much as possible because he will learn something watching each race whether he has had a bet or not. Be patient and selective and wait for the right punting opportunity to come around. Too many lads are inclined to have a bet just because it's a big Saturday race or whatever. Always trust your own judgement and always try to bet to level stakes which is probably the one rule that I find difficult to adhere to.

Quote from: Donnellys Hollow on September 11, 2011, 09:53:29 PM
A punter has one key advantage over the bookmaker: the bookmaker lays on every race/match/fight etc whereas the punter can be selective on which races/matches/fights he plays in. The key to successful punting is to be as selective and disciplined as possible.

My own background is in national hunt racing so naturally it's my sport of choice from a betting point of view. I occasionally will have a bet on the local club matches and such but I struggle to find an edge in other sports. Finding an edge isn't easy but it can be done. Keep a record of all your bets (the more detailed a database the better) and try to identify the kind of events that you win money in and vice versa. I learned that I had most success in backing novice hurdlers and chasers so I will tend to focus on these races and I study them thoroughly - the more you watch the more you learn. I tend to avoid lower grade racing and handicaps. A grade 1 horse is far more likely to show consistent form rather than a moderately bred yak being ridden by some cowboy around one of the gaff tracks.

As STS says, an appreciation of the maths side of things is essential in order to maximise profits and minimise losses. For example, I rarely back multiples because the odds are stacked in the bookmaker's favour. The prospect of a big payout may be tempting but the better long term strategy is to play the percentages. I would estimate that two thirds of my bets are each way wagers with the other third being win singles. I will back each way at prices down to as low as 5/2. The logic behind it is simple - if I back a horse at 3/1 each way one quarter the odds and my horse is placed, I will still get 87.5% of my original stake back. If I'd backed the horse to win and it was placed, I'd have lost 100% of my stake rather than 12.5%. A decent form student should be backing enough winners at around the 3/1 mark to be making such a strategy profitable.

The concept of value is one that is often talked about by tipsters and pundits. However, I don't agree with many of the common interpretations of 'value'. I have heard a lot of punters say that they will never back at odds on because there's no value in it but that is nonsense as far as I'm concerned. A horse could be available to back at 4/6 when it should be a 1/3 shot on all known form - Sea The Stars in the Irish Campion Stakes being a prime example. It's easy to say it in hindsight (though I'm sure if someone fished out the page on the Horse Racing Thread I was saying the same before the race!) but 4/6 was a cracking value bet.

A punter should study as much as possible because he will learn something watching each race whether he has had a bet or not. Be patient and selective and wait for the right punting opportunity to come around. Too many lads are inclined to have a bet just because it's a big Saturday race or whatever. Always trust your own judgement and always try to bet to level stakes which is probably the one rule that I find difficult to adhere to.

You could do that. Or do what I do. Close yer eyes. Stick a pin in it. Place £1.

 totally agree about the e/w down to 5/2 if ur having a decent bet on it.  discipline is a big thing you have to have  in betting to make a profit ya have 2 put the study in imo

DH you logic there is well and good for you and prob a few with a brain but if you spend a couple of hours in the bookies on a sat afternoon and watch the same guys wearing the same clothes betting on every single race and afterwards their horse is beaten they turn to the paper on the wall and look at the winner and then they'll shout over to Paddy..."hey Paddy that was O'Briens horse there and look Jimmy Joe was riding it. He's a Bastard that...How'd we miss that"...lol.

I've a PP account on-line but have a weekly limit on it to £10 as i wouldn't trust myself, i believe on-line gambling is def the worst. I recently heard of a friend of mine who was in debt big time due to gambling (talking near £50k) and I've never seen him inside of a bookie shop in my life. In fact i never knew he gambled, i believe when you're handing over a card instead of cash it doesn't feel as bad.

P.S. would you agree that if you've suffered a loss the worst thing you can do is chase it by placing bigger bets to try and get your cash back? and why do you not get the same buzz when your football's winning than you do when your horse is  ahead at the finish line

Discipline and form study are essential ingredients of profitable gambling. I started punting on soccer and horses while at school, had a few nice wins over the years, but overall i doubt if i was ahead of the bookie.

Then i moved house which happened to be right beside a bookies shop and coincided with me running a business from the house. i was almost always finished up for the day by lunchtime so i'd nip into the bookies out of boredom. Had a few wins, decided i was a pro punter, upped my stakes and started losing[this was horses by the way]. Tried chasing my losses with even bigger punts and before long i pissed the business away.

In many ways it was a blessing as i had to take a long hard look at myself and admit that i had a problem. Stopped gambling altogether for 3 months, which was actually easier than i thought. i decided that if i was going to punt again i would need to do some research so i tracked down everything i could by people who were making a living at it. I was amazed at the discipline involved but the thing that really struck me was the insistence that a book be kept of all bets made.

So, i tested the waters with a few months of soccer betting. Took extensive notes, researched form trends, a team's most important players etc and found that i was well in front.

That was 5 years ago and i've turned a profit every year since. No vast fortunes, the best year was just over 3k ahead.

I still lose my discipline. For example i've done 6 horses since saturday., mostly because of boredom[ at a very rare loose end on saturday]. Had to have a word with myself about it today.

What i've learned is that running after life changing money is futile, always punt within your means, always keep accounts and review regularly, always do the research and never bet with the heart.

oh, and never put tips up on internet forums as they'll always lose !!

Up until about 12 months ago I used to make enough over the year to pay the majority of the mortgage, this was over a period of four and a half years based on the work of a syndicate on BAGS racing. Unfortunately have been roaded out of all available avenues for getting enough on regularly to make it worth the hassle. The amount of people claiming to be professional punters or making it pay is laughable.

Unreal some of the stories from people and the sad consequences it can lead to at some homes...What makes gambling so addictive? and why can't people stop rather than gamble the money they can't afford to lose...I gamble mostly on football but do punt on horses too but i only gamble with money i can afford to lose, i would never gamble money that i couldn't afford to lose.

Quote from: ardchieftain on September 12, 2011, 11:04:15 PM
profitable gambling

;D

Quote from: oakleafgael on September 12, 2011, 11:31:32 PM
Up until about 12 months ago I used to make enough over the year to pay the majority of the mortgage, this was over a period of four and a half years based on the work of a syndicate on BAGS racing. Unfortunately have been roaded out of all available avenues for getting enough on regularly to make it worth the hassle. The amount of people claiming to be professional punters or making it pay is laughable.

I have been trying to get into arbing but its very time consuming especially at the start.  You come home form work, or after training and you just couldnt be bother, but I really want to give it a lash.  Is this soemthing you would be into/try yourself?

Quote from: oakleafgael on September 12, 2011, 11:31:32 PM
Up until about 12 months ago I used to make enough over the year to pay the majority of the mortgage, this was over a period of four and a half years based on the work of a syndicate on BAGS racing. Unfortunately have been roaded out of all available avenues for getting enough on regularly to make it worth the hassle. The amount of people claiming to be professional punters or making it pay is laughable.

Yet you are claiming the same thing?  ???

I bet online, rarely.  I normally try and keep with the sure bets even if the profit is small.  I bet on hurling, soccer and maybe American Football.  I stay away from horses.  Too many to pick from and very hard to win on.

I learned my lesson a couple of years ago when I put alot of money on Tiger Woods to win one of the Opens.  He was well ahead when I backed him but he didn't win.  Luckily for me Paddy Power paid out early.  The latest bet I made was picking the winners of the four Rugby World Cup groups.  But I wouldn't consider myself a gambler as such.

As my dad would say, you go into the bookies and there's 4 windows for paying in but only one window for paying out.

I bet online, £10 a week to Paddy Power. If I win then fine I take out my £10 pounds and bet with Paddy's money.

I do some football, Gaelic football and mainly hurling.  I try and stay away from the big prices as they very rarely win ::) so 4/6 2/5 or 1/3's will do. I try and build it up to £80 or £90 and take it out and start over again. Have managed a few recently which keeps the wife happy as we have online banking and see can see what I bet!! so it's easy to be controlled ;D

I don't bet to make a lot of money (you never really do) for me the winning is great but it's a hobby/vice that I like doing, I don't control the purse strings so won't ever lose my house over gambling.

Hurling is good in that they don't normally have draws and the favourites normally win. Getting the handicaps in these games can be profitable, as said already, knowing the teams and watching the games is crucial in making money.

A friend of mine bets the odd ton on say a 1/3 or 2/5 double, but on things that he knowledge on. He normally wins but there is no way I'll ever bet a ton on anything. (Unless it's Paddy's money)

All windows pay out.

Hurling bet for the weekend, now no real money but profit that you can build on

Thurles Sarsfields 1/7
Nenagh Eire Og   1/7
Erins Own           4/11
Clonkill                1/4

Other ones you can add would be De La Salle (but they didn't win last week)
Lismore and Clarinbridge. But being greedy means you might lose out

Never bet on club hurling, must do a wee bit of research.
Does anyone do handicap betting on gaa club games ?

put up a tip on the soccer betting thread, braga are seriously overpriced

Quote from: ardchieftain on September 14, 2011, 10:53:58 PM
Never bet on club hurling, must do a wee bit of research.
Does anyone do handicap betting on gaa club games ?

put up a tip on the soccer betting thread, braga are seriously overpriced

No, but they usually give you handicaps for the finals.

Its about making a small profit and betting with their money for a change

What about a punt on St Galls for the Kilmacud 7s MR ?  Your lads normally take it fairly seriously and if play to their ability wouldn't be far away ... can only see price with one firm so far, 3/1

When I hear gambling talk it just sounds like gibberish to me. I like to keep it that way.

Gives the sat afternoon pinters plenty of mindless rubbish to get interested in whilst in the bar all day long. Part of the alpha males expected behavioural traits in pubs during the day hence why fools are more likely get involved and be easy meat for the bookie.

I remember calling a few years ago at a fellas house to pick him up for work.  He was AWOL.  By the third day the oul boy took me inside giving off about the cub.  He had shacked up with some woman and was in the da s  words a useless lazy good for nothin etc.  He ranted on about how hard he had worked so he could retire young with plenty of money, and thon lazy so and so of a son etc. - now this guy was 40 odd in a council house, but I left impressed anyway, and happened to mention to soemone about this daddy guy in a bar.  The laziest of the laziest hoors I was told spend all day in bed and all night gambling online.  never done a days work in his life..  Abnout a month later the doode was also arrested for drug supplying.. bad bluffing lieing hoor... 

We will be heading down with our best seven's team. Was talking to one player he said they should win their group. After that its a lottery really. Too short a price for me

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on September 14, 2011, 10:40:21 PM
Hurling bet for the weekend, now no real money but profit that you can build on

Thurles Sarsfields 1/7
Nenagh Eire Og   1/7
Erins Own           4/11
Clonkill                1/4

Other ones you can add would be De La Salle (but they didn't win last week)
Lismore and Clarinbridge. But being greedy means you might lose out

I like a gamble and would have a bet every week on horse racing/soccer/gaa/golf or a combiation of these.

Im going to take ur picks this weekend MR and have a go at it.

Id say I generally do well enough at punting and would break about even over the year if being honest.

Wouldn't recommend Clarinbridge. They're entitled to be favourites, but that's an excellent up and coming St Thomas team, who need the win more than Clarinbridge do.

Quote from: Lone Shark on September 15, 2011, 03:17:05 PM
Wouldn't recommend Clarinbridge. They're entitled to be favourites, but that's an excellent up and coming St Thomas team, who need the win more than Clarinbridge do.

Yes and that's why i left the out of the main bet, only if you're greedy. was down in Galway and watched their Minor team a couple of years ago wining the title against Loughrea, cracking game.

Hadn't heard of St Thomas's before that doing well at senior, so I'd err on the side of caution

I prefer gambling on horses as that is where the biggest edge can be found! Although I remember reading some Hugh Taylor advice saying to avoid Group and Grade Ones as the horses's strengths and weaknesses are well exposed to the bookmakers. However I concentrate on these kind of races as this is where information on runners are at a maximum. With variables such as form, ground, track, distance, breeding, running action, horse looks, weather, time of year, race conditions, trainer from, stats & trends, you will generally find a way to disagree with the bookmaker particularly as prices tend towards big numbers. E.g. A 33/1 shot might only be a 16/1 shot in your opinion - and that's a big edge. Not the kind of edge you will get punting on soccer and rugby. A horse at 3/1 that you feel is only 7/4 is also quite a big edge and I'd doubt you'll get that in any "match" either.

I like Donnelly Hollow's post and approach. Although, I am rarely an each-way backer myself. It's not something I disagree with, but the lure of the win is usually too good to resist! I guess my philosophy is study the form to find the winner. And analyse the prices after studying the form. Main thing is not to let the price act as a deterrant. In fact, the bigger the price, the better.

Events such as Cycling, Athletics and say the Olympics are also good to bet on. Bookmakers will not have anywhere near the resources or expertise to compile betting for such events. Now and again, you come across the odd event where one of the runner's price is woefully out from what it should be. If you're a gambler, a little bit of knowledge in less-bet events is a big help.

Good programme on RTÉ there about gambling addiction, I'd say it's a huge problem now with the easy access on your phone

Quote from: macdanger2 on April 23, 2018, 10:33:21 PM
Good programme on RTÉ there about gambling addiction, I'd say it's a huge problem now with the easy access on your phone

Very informative program not surprising none of the betting companies would come on the show for a chat.

There's a lot more horse racing on TV these days, a large portion of it sponsored by the gambling companies. That's something that could easily be restricted for a start

Quote from: Cunny Funt on April 23, 2018, 10:55:56 PM

Quote from: macdanger2 on April 23, 2018, 10:33:21 PM
Good programme on RTÉ there about gambling addiction, I'd say it's a huge problem now with the easy access on your phone

Very informative program not surprising none of the betting companies would come on the show for a chat.

Only bet what you can afford is the best policy, if you've an addiction then it's near on impossible to avoid betting advertising. Place a ban on these ads would be a start, football clubs being sponsored by betting companies should be banned also.. I know lads that are hooked and see ones on fb posting bets up which encourage others no doubt!

I would dread to think what I have gambled over the years, for years I was only a 50p Yankee and a £5 football bet on a Saturday, which progressed to betting every day. I was fortunate enough that I never got hooked and that I never gambled money I didn't have, but even now when I would do the occasional bet the same guys are on the gaming machines (which should be banned in my opinion). Only gamble with what you can afford to lose is wise advice.

John Duggan (Today FM) on twitter had a good point about bookmakers banning / limiting accounts of successful punters, yet were more that happy to facilitate serial losers.

Should be some sort of consistency or regulation in that regard.

Quote from: Insane Bolt on April 24, 2018, 07:32:55 AM
I would dread to think what I have gambled over the years, for years I was only a 50p Yankee and a £5 football bet on a Saturday, which progressed to betting every day. I was fortunate enough that I never got hooked and that I never gambled money I didn't have, but even now when I would do the occasional bet the same guys are on the gaming machines (which should be banned in my opinion). Only gamble with what you can afford to lose is wise advice.

I'd say that's how many people start but it gets out of control.

Quote from: Tony Baloney on April 24, 2018, 08:29:04 AM

Quote from: Insane Bolt on April 24, 2018, 07:32:55 AM
I would dread to think what I have gambled over the years, for years I was only a 50p Yankee and a £5 football bet on a Saturday, which progressed to betting every day. I was fortunate enough that I never got hooked and that I never gambled money I didn't have, but even now when I would do the occasional bet the same guys are on the gaming machines (which should be banned in my opinion). Only gamble with what you can afford to lose is wise advice.

I'd say that's how many people start but it gets out of control.

Those FOBT gaming machines seem to be one of the biggest problems. I would very rarely be in a bookies as on the odd occasions i do a bet its generally on the phone. But I know of at least 3 guys who have got into serious problems on those machines. I really cannot see the appeal of them but these guys would not generally have been big "traditional" gamblers as such, they would have done the odd football bet and Cheltenham  but you would hear stories of them sitting in the Bookies on these machines for hours on a Saturday. The numbers that they were rumored to be losing was scary.  I know the law has changed on these to reduce the maximum stakes etc which is a start.

Quote from: macdanger2 on April 23, 2018, 11:02:12 PM
There's a lot more horse racing on TV these days, a large portion of it sponsored by the gambling companies. That's something that could easily be restricted for a start

Is that true? I seem to remember horse racing on RTE every saturday in the 80s and 90s. It was the main item on Sports Stadium.

Quote from: AZOffaly on April 24, 2018, 08:45:21 AM

Quote from: macdanger2 on April 23, 2018, 11:02:12 PM
There's a lot more horse racing on TV these days, a large portion of it sponsored by the gambling companies. That's something that could easily be restricted for a start

Is that true? I seem to remember horse racing on RTE every saturday in the 80s and 90s. It was the main item on Sports Stadium.

Racing everyday bar Xmas eve and Xmas day

Quote from: Insane Bolt on April 24, 2018, 09:04:07 AM

Quote from: AZOffaly on April 24, 2018, 08:45:21 AM

Quote from: macdanger2 on April 23, 2018, 11:02:12 PM
There's a lot more horse racing on TV these days, a large portion of it sponsored by the gambling companies. That's something that could easily be restricted for a start

Is that true? I seem to remember horse racing on RTE every saturday in the 80s and 90s. It was the main item on Sports Stadium.

Racing everyday bar Xmas eve and Xmas day

There is the horse racing channel, it shows racing every day from various tracks! The one that gets me is virtual racing !! I back horses only at Grand national, Cheltenham or if i get the chance to go to Down Royal.. wouldnt have a clue, TBH.. 7/2 the draw tonight  :)

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on April 24, 2018, 09:16:26 AM

Quote from: Insane Bolt on April 24, 2018, 09:04:07 AM

Quote from: AZOffaly on April 24, 2018, 08:45:21 AM

Quote from: macdanger2 on April 23, 2018, 11:02:12 PM
There's a lot more horse racing on TV these days, a large portion of it sponsored by the gambling companies. That's something that could easily be restricted for a start

Is that true? I seem to remember horse racing on RTE every saturday in the 80s and 90s. It was the main item on Sports Stadium.

Racing everyday bar Xmas eve and Xmas day

There is the horse racing channel, it shows racing every day from various tracks! The one that gets me is virtual racing !! I back horses only at Grand national, Cheltenham or if i get the chance to go to Down Royal.. wouldnt have a clue, TBH.. 7/2 the draw tonight  :)
Know a lad who only gambles on the virtual horses.....and he studies the form....I kid you not😂

Quote from: TabClear on April 24, 2018, 08:44:47 AM

Quote from: Tony Baloney on April 24, 2018, 08:29:04 AM

Quote from: Insane Bolt on April 24, 2018, 07:32:55 AM
I would dread to think what I have gambled over the years, for years I was only a 50p Yankee and a £5 football bet on a Saturday, which progressed to betting every day. I was fortunate enough that I never got hooked and that I never gambled money I didn't have, but even now when I would do the occasional bet the same guys are on the gaming machines (which should be banned in my opinion). Only gamble with what you can afford to lose is wise advice.

I'd say that's how many people start but it gets out of control.

Those FOBT gaming machines seem to be one of the biggest problems. I would very rarely be in a bookies as on the odd occasions i do a bet its generally on the phone. But I know of at least 3 guys who have got into serious problems on those machines. I really cannot see the appeal of them but these guys would not generally have been big "traditional" gamblers as such, they would have done the odd football bet and Cheltenham  but you would hear stories of them sitting in the Bookies on these machines for hours on a Saturday. The numbers that they were rumored to be losing was scary.  I know the law has changed on these to reduce the maximum stakes etc which is a start.

Not defending the FOBTs but they are limited to £100 a spin. Ban them and what will the fellas do? They will go online where they can put on a lot more than £100 a spin. How do you stop it?

Quote from: Don Johnson on April 24, 2018, 09:36:02 AM

Quote from: TabClear on April 24, 2018, 08:44:47 AM

Quote from: Tony Baloney on April 24, 2018, 08:29:04 AM

Quote from: Insane Bolt on April 24, 2018, 07:32:55 AM
I would dread to think what I have gambled over the years, for years I was only a 50p Yankee and a £5 football bet on a Saturday, which progressed to betting every day. I was fortunate enough that I never got hooked and that I never gambled money I didn't have, but even now when I would do the occasional bet the same guys are on the gaming machines (which should be banned in my opinion). Only gamble with what you can afford to lose is wise advice.

I'd say that's how many people start but it gets out of control.

Those FOBT gaming machines seem to be one of the biggest problems. I would very rarely be in a bookies as on the odd occasions i do a bet its generally on the phone. But I know of at least 3 guys who have got into serious problems on those machines. I really cannot see the appeal of them but these guys would not generally have been big "traditional" gamblers as such, they would have done the odd football bet and Cheltenham  but you would hear stories of them sitting in the Bookies on these machines for hours on a Saturday. The numbers that they were rumored to be losing was scary.  I know the law has changed on these to reduce the maximum stakes etc which is a start
Not defending the FOBTs but they are limited to £100 a spin. Ban them and what will the fellas do? They will go online where they can put on a lot more than £100 a spin. How do you stop it?

Outside of Sharia Law I don't know how you stop gambling

A full scale ban on all gambling advertising should be the logical first step, see how it goes from there.

Quote from: Don Johnson on April 24, 2018, 10:01:56 AM
A full scale ban on all gambling advertising should be the logical first step, see how it goes from there.

I agree on the ad ban, plus take those machines out of the bookies, there are 3 in my local, i wouldnt know how to put money into them but there are lads all ages, whacking money into left right and centre! I'd say in the time it takes me to do my two fiver bets (one soccer, the other a mix of Gaa and rugby) they would have spent £40

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on April 24, 2018, 09:16:26 AM

Quote from: Insane Bolt on April 24, 2018, 09:04:07 AM

Quote from: AZOffaly on April 24, 2018, 08:45:21 AM

Quote from: macdanger2 on April 23, 2018, 11:02:12 PM
There's a lot more horse racing on TV these days, a large portion of it sponsored by the gambling companies. That's something that could easily be restricted for a start

Is that true? I seem to remember horse racing on RTE every saturday in the 80s and 90s. It was the main item on Sports Stadium.

Racing everyday bar Xmas eve and Xmas day

There is the horse racing channel, it shows racing every day from various tracks! The one that gets me is virtual racing !! I back horses only at Grand national, Cheltenham or if i get the chance to go to Down Royal.. wouldnt have a clue, TBH.. 7/2 the draw tonight  :)

You have to have access to the horse racing channel though, so you're probably already 'into' it at that stage. For the casual observer, horse racing is hardly any more in your face, or is it?

Just looking at my original post on this from years ago and realising that i gamble far less these days than i did.  I still like a flutter but really only when i have time to actually watch the event or even the scores coming in of a Saturday.  This would be rare enough. Once a month if lucky.

Quote from: Don Johnson on April 24, 2018, 09:36:02 AM

Quote from: TabClear on April 24, 2018, 08:44:47 AM

Quote from: Tony Baloney on April 24, 2018, 08:29:04 AM

Quote from: Insane Bolt on April 24, 2018, 07:32:55 AM
I would dread to think what I have gambled over the years, for years I was only a 50p Yankee and a £5 football bet on a Saturday, which progressed to betting every day. I was fortunate enough that I never got hooked and that I never gambled money I didn't have, but even now when I would do the occasional bet the same guys are on the gaming machines (which should be banned in my opinion). Only gamble with what you can afford to lose is wise advice.

I'd say that's how many people start but it gets out of control.

Those FOBT gaming machines seem to be one of the biggest problems. I would very rarely be in a bookies as on the odd occasions i do a bet its generally on the phone. But I know of at least 3 guys who have got into serious problems on those machines. I really cannot see the appeal of them but these guys would not generally have been big "traditional" gamblers as such, they would have done the odd football bet and Cheltenham  but you would hear stories of them sitting in the Bookies on these machines for hours on a Saturday. The numbers that they were rumored to be losing was scary.  I know the law has changed on these to reduce the maximum stakes etc which is a start.

Not defending the FOBTs but they are limited to £100 a spin. Ban them and what will the fellas do? They will go online where they can put on a lot more than £100 a spin. How do you stop it?

Christ, £100 a spin!! I had no idea they could reach that level. You are probably right DJ, with online gambling being so accessible its hard to stop someone gambling if they want to. I have sat in the pub with mates on a saturday who would easily bet on 5-6 races plus a football bet. At least pre online betting you had to physically make an effort to put a bet on (even if it was just telling the barman to phone it in!)

Are bookies under any duty of care with respect to allowing people to bet if they think they have a problem?

It's the gambling on anything and everything that gets me. Football...how many corners, free kicks. Yellow cards etc

Quote from: Insane Bolt on April 24, 2018, 10:26:01 AM
It's the gambling on anything and everything that gets me. Football...how many corners, free kicks. Yellow cards etc

I agree with you on that. The followers of the horses are an older generation. I have seen lads in the clubhouse on the phones betting on the soccer a lot. They might back Kane Messi Salah etc to score the first goal. If he doesnt they will then take the option that he will score next on thebalance of probabilities. I read in a local paper one weekend whike in Wexford of some young lad pulling over 7000 from Paddy Power using is phone account. Its a far cry from a shilling each way on Pigotts horse in the Derby

Would like to do a wee bet  (£5) a week on the soccer,  any advice on what type of bet , apart from not to bother!
Wouldn't bet at all, not even the National,  but would be a bitacraic

Quote from: Dire Ear on April 24, 2018, 10:45:50 AM
Would like to do a wee bet  (£5) a week on the soccer,  any advice on what type of bet , apart from not to bother!
Wouldn't bet at all, not even the National,  but would be a bitacraic

I do a 1 euro yankee each weekend on the first to score which costs 11 euro. The one time the four selections clicked ( Shearer Owen Van Nistleroy Davies) I pulled 1988.
Since then I have often got two correct or three correct ( three doubles and a treble) which gives a nice return.
I have my favourites and often the individual price might be only 5/2 but if you get a few together it adds up. I pick four from across the divisions and Europe.
Kane , Salah, Huyton Luton, Marriott of Peterboro, Akinfenwa , Ronaldo, Messi, Griesmann,Belotti of Torino. are all regulars. The problem is picking the right four.
Akinfenwa is due a turn usually around 4/1

Quote from: Dire Ear on April 24, 2018, 10:45:50 AM
Would like to do a wee bet  (£5) a week on the soccer,  any advice on what type of bet , apart from not to bother!
Wouldn't bet at all, not even the National,  but would be a bitacraic

I do a £5 football accumulator bet most Saturdays, usually 5-6 teams, haven't won for about 5years😩

Quote from: Avondhu star on April 24, 2018, 10:55:42 AM

Quote from: Dire Ear on April 24, 2018, 10:45:50 AM
Would like to do a wee bet  (£5) a week on the soccer,  any advice on what type of bet , apart from not to bother!
Wouldn't bet at all, not even the National,  but would be a bitacraic

I do a 1 euro yankee each weekend on the first to score which costs 11 euro. The one time the four selections clicked ( Shearer Owen Van Nistleroy Davies) I pulled 1988.
Since then I have often got two correct or three correct ( three doubles and a treble) which gives a nice return.
I have my favourites and often the individual price might be only 5/2 but if you get a few together it adds up. I pick four from across the divisions and Europe.
Kane , Salah, Huyton Luton, Marriott of Peterboro, Akinfenwa , Ronaldo, Messi, Griesmann,Belotti of Torino. are all regulars. The problem is picking the right four.
Akinfenwa is due a turn usually around 4/1

One winner in 30 years is hardly worth it.

Quote from: tommysmith on April 24, 2018, 11:05:47 AM

Quote from: Avondhu star on April 24, 2018, 10:55:42 AM

Quote from: Dire Ear on April 24, 2018, 10:45:50 AM
Would like to do a wee bet  (£5) a week on the soccer,  any advice on what type of bet , apart from not to bother!
Wouldn't bet at all, not even the National,  but would be a bitacraic

I do a 1 euro yankee each weekend on the first to score which costs 11 euro. The one time the four selections clicked ( Shearer Owen Van Nistleroy Davies) I pulled 1988.
Since then I have often got two correct or three correct ( three doubles and a treble) which gives a nice return.
I have my favourites and often the individual price might be only 5/2 but if you get a few together it adds up. I pick four from across the divisions and Europe.
Kane , Salah, Huyton Luton, Marriott of Peterboro, Akinfenwa , Ronaldo, Messi, Griesmann,Belotti of Torino. are all regulars. The problem is picking the right four.
Akinfenwa is due a turn usually around 4/1

One winner in 30 years is hardly worth it.

Is anybody a winner? I do it the craic, putting a fiver on tonights match will give me some interest in watching it, I wont be a millionaire, but what i do is try and build up a pot till about maybe £80 quid... take out £60 and have a £20 on a big odd bet.. Ive yet to get a decent return, been very close on a couple of occasions but i wont hold out on getting one

I like a bet myself. Horses mostly occasionally football boxing and golf. Yesterday I was in playing a game of snooker and there were school kids in playing the fruit machines. I couldn't help thinking they were setting themselves up for trouble gambling on that shite. It was disgusting they were allowed too as well.

Quote from: Insane Bolt on April 24, 2018, 11:00:08 AM

Quote from: Dire Ear on April 24, 2018, 10:45:50 AM
Would like to do a wee bet  (£5) a week on the soccer,  any advice on what type of bet , apart from not to bother!
Wouldn't bet at all, not even the National,  but would be a bitacraic

I do a £5 football accumulator bet most Saturdays, usually 5-6 teams, haven't won for about 5years😩

retire

Quote from: lurganblue on April 24, 2018, 12:03:34 PM

Quote from: Insane Bolt on April 24, 2018, 11:00:08 AM

Quote from: Dire Ear on April 24, 2018, 10:45:50 AM
Would like to do a wee bet  (£5) a week on the soccer,  any advice on what type of bet , apart from not to bother!
Wouldn't bet at all, not even the National,  but would be a bitacraic

I do a £5 football accumulator bet most Saturdays, usually 5-6 teams, haven't won for about 5years😩

retire

😂😂 Wouldn't be the same on Saturdays..... Not swearing at the tv 😜

Have an online account. Never back big stakes - annoys me if I lose to be honest.

Usually try and chip away at the account, try and get up to a decent round figure. Withdraw, leave the rest and see where it takes me.

Bet 365 occasionally throw a 5er in the account so when I do run out I try and use that to start back up again.

Suppose I'm a boredom gambler really, wouldn't bother me if I didn't do one for a month. Then could do 4 or 5 in one week.

Quote from: tommysmith on April 24, 2018, 11:05:47 AM

Quote from: Avondhu star on April 24, 2018, 10:55:42 AM

Quote from: Dire Ear on April 24, 2018, 10:45:50 AM
Would like to do a wee bet  (£5) a week on the soccer,  any advice on what type of bet , apart from not to bother!
Wouldn't bet at all, not even the National,  but would be a bitacraic

I do a 1 euro yankee each weekend on the first to score which costs 11 euro. The one time the four selections clicked ( Shearer Owen Van Nistleroy Davies) I pulled 1988.
Since then I have often got two correct or three correct ( three doubles and a treble) which gives a nice return.
I have my favourites and often the individual price might be only 5/2 but if you get a few together it adds up. I pick four from across the divisions and Europe.
Kane , Salah, Huyton Luton, Marriott of Peterboro, Akinfenwa , Ronaldo, Messi, Griesmann,Belotti of Torino. are all regulars. The problem is picking the right four.
Akinfenwa is due a turn usually around 4/1

One winner in 30 years is hardly worth it.

I've never been able to recreate the feeling of that first win on West Tip in the National at the age of 10. Chasing the dragon  ;D

Quote from: tommysmith on April 24, 2018, 11:05:47 AM

Quote from: Avondhu star on April 24, 2018, 10:55:42 AM

Quote from: Dire Ear on April 24, 2018, 10:45:50 AM
Would like to do a wee bet  (£5) a week on the soccer,  any advice on what type of bet , apart from not to bother!
Wouldn't bet at all, not even the National,  but would be a bitacraic

I do a 1 euro yankee each weekend on the first to score which costs 11 euro. The one time the four selections clicked ( Shearer Owen Van Nistleroy Davies) I pulled 1988.
Since then I have often got two correct or three correct ( three doubles and a treble) which gives a nice return.
I have my favourites and often the individual price might be only 5/2 but if you get a few together it adds up. I pick four from across the divisions and Europe.
Kane , Salah, Huyton Luton, Marriott of Peterboro, Akinfenwa , Ronaldo, Messi, Griesmann,Belotti of Torino. are all regulars. The problem is picking the right four.
Akinfenwa is due a turn usually around 4/1

One winner in 30 years is hardly worth it.

Where did you get the 30 years? Read the post before making stupid comments

I pulled 1988 i.e. 1988 euros not placed the bet in 1988. I also referred to getting three results correct a number of times which gives a combination of a treble and three doubles which gives a very good payout.

Quote from: Insane Bolt on April 24, 2018, 11:00:08 AM

Quote from: Dire Ear on April 24, 2018, 10:45:50 AM
Would like to do a wee bet  (£5) a week on the soccer,  any advice on what type of bet , apart from not to bother!
Wouldn't bet at all, not even the National,  but would be a bitacraic

I do a £5 football accumulator bet most Saturdays, usually 5-6 teams, haven't won for about 5years😩

You are probably throwing in an outsider to boost your return. Great if it works out but its not an outsider for nothing.

e.g. Over ten seasons Man Utd will beat West Brom probably 7 times draw twice and lose once in the home fixture. Why bet against those odds?

3 teams! the bookies only need one result, you need all. my bet on a Saturday, I go with home teams around the even mark, or better, let ride, generally a fiver but if i'm feeling flush (once a month ) i'll hammer on a tenner! Last of the big spenders.. the online betting is for during the week, couple quid on goalscorer and correct result.. My wife would go bonkers if I was doing anymore

Quote from: AZOffaly on April 24, 2018, 10:18:44 AM

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on April 24, 2018, 09:16:26 AM

Quote from: Insane Bolt on April 24, 2018, 09:04:07 AM

Quote from: AZOffaly on April 24, 2018, 08:45:21 AM

Quote from: macdanger2 on April 23, 2018, 11:02:12 PM
There's a lot more horse racing on TV these days, a large portion of it sponsored by the gambling companies. That's something that could easily be restricted for a start

Is that true? I seem to remember horse racing on RTE every saturday in the 80s and 90s. It was the main item on Sports Stadium.

Racing everyday bar Xmas eve and Xmas day

There is the horse racing channel, it shows racing every day from various tracks! The one that gets me is virtual racing !! I back horses only at Grand national, Cheltenham or if i get the chance to go to Down Royal.. wouldnt have a clue, TBH.. 7/2 the draw tonight  :)

You have to have access to the horse racing channel though, so you're probably already 'into' it at that stage. For the casual observer, horse racing is hardly any more in your face, or is it?

Apart from Saturday coverage and the very big meetings, the rest are covered pretty equally by Racing UK and At the Races (the latter has all the Irish racing, but that's moving to the former next year.)

Racing UK is subscription only, but At the Races is available on my Sky box CH 415. Not sure if everyone has it or if its part of another sports package (but I think its available to all?). Their coverage is actually very good.

I do quite a bit of betting, but I really hate bookies. Amazing how quick they are to restrict or ban if you go on a good run, regardless of how shite you might have been in the past.  I've no idea how a JP or other top gambler are able to get big bets on, they can't have online accounts anyway

Quote from: Hound on April 24, 2018, 01:32:02 PM

Quote from: AZOffaly on April 24, 2018, 10:18:44 AM

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on April 24, 2018, 09:16:26 AM

Quote from: Insane Bolt on April 24, 2018, 09:04:07 AM

Quote from: AZOffaly on April 24, 2018, 08:45:21 AM

Quote from: macdanger2 on April 23, 2018, 11:02:12 PM
There's a lot more horse racing on TV these days, a large portion of it sponsored by the gambling companies. That's something that could easily be restricted for a start

Is that true? I seem to remember horse racing on RTE every saturday in the 80s and 90s. It was the main item on Sports Stadium.

Racing everyday bar Xmas eve and Xmas day

There is the horse racing channel, it shows racing every day from various tracks! The one that gets me is virtual racing !! I back horses only at Grand national, Cheltenham or if i get the chance to go to Down Royal.. wouldnt have a clue, TBH.. 7/2 the draw tonight  :)

You have to have access to the horse racing channel though, so you're probably already 'into' it at that stage. For the casual observer, horse racing is hardly any more in your face, or is it?

Apart from Saturday coverage and the very big meetings, the rest are covered pretty equally by Racing UK and At the Races (the latter has all the Irish racing, but that's moving to the former next year.)

Racing UK is subscription only, but At the Races is available on my Sky box CH 415. Not sure if everyone has it or if its part of another sports package (but I think its available to all?). Their coverage is actually very good.

I do quite a bit of betting, but I really hate bookies. Amazing how quick they are to restrict or ban if you go on a good run, regardless of how shite you might have been in the past.  I've no idea how a JP or other top gambler are able to get big bets on, they can't have online accounts anyway

JP and the likes would have quite a few of their big bets on the course where most big bookies are happy to lay (providing its a decent meeting).

For those smaller meetings I like you have no idea how or where they would get on

Quote from: Avondhu star on April 24, 2018, 01:13:38 PM

Quote from: tommysmith on April 24, 2018, 11:05:47 AM

Quote from: Avondhu star on April 24, 2018, 10:55:42 AM

Quote from: Dire Ear on April 24, 2018, 10:45:50 AM
Would like to do a wee bet  (£5) a week on the soccer,  any advice on what type of bet , apart from not to bother!
Wouldn't bet at all, not even the National,  but would be a bitacraic

I do a 1 euro yankee each weekend on the first to score which costs 11 euro. The one time the four selections clicked ( Shearer Owen Van Nistleroy Davies) I pulled 1988.
Since then I have often got two correct or three correct ( three doubles and a treble) which gives a nice return.
I have my favourites and often the individual price might be only 5/2 but if you get a few together it adds up. I pick four from across the divisions and Europe.
Kane , Salah, Huyton Luton, Marriott of Peterboro, Akinfenwa , Ronaldo, Messi, Griesmann,Belotti of Torino. are all regulars. The problem is picking the right four.
Akinfenwa is due a turn usually around 4/1

One winner in 30 years is hardly worth it.

Where did you get the 30 years? Read the post before making stupid comments

I pulled 1988 i.e. 1988 euros not placed the bet in 1988. I also referred to getting three results correct a number of times which gives a combination of a treble and three doubles which gives a very good payout.

:D

I had an online account and was placing a large single bet £5000 at 11/10 and three times the site crashed....eventually had to ring them and they offered me 10/11 so I told them stuff it and closed the account. They hate paying out.

Well, don't leave us hanging.... bet win or lose?

Quote from: Don Johnson on April 24, 2018, 09:36:02 AM

Quote from: TabClear on April 24, 2018, 08:44:47 AM

Quote from: Tony Baloney on April 24, 2018, 08:29:04 AM

Quote from: Insane Bolt on April 24, 2018, 07:32:55 AM
I would dread to think what I have gambled over the years, for years I was only a 50p Yankee and a £5 football bet on a Saturday, which progressed to betting every day. I was fortunate enough that I never got hooked and that I never gambled money I didn't have, but even now when I would do the occasional bet the same guys are on the gaming machines (which should be banned in my opinion). Only gamble with what you can afford to lose is wise advice.

I'd say that's how many people start but it gets out of control.

Those FOBT gaming machines seem to be one of the biggest problems. I would very rarely be in a bookies as on the odd occasions i do a bet its generally on the phone. But I know of at least 3 guys who have got into serious problems on those machines. I really cannot see the appeal of them but these guys would not generally have been big "traditional" gamblers as such, they would have done the odd football bet and Cheltenham  but you would hear stories of them sitting in the Bookies on these machines for hours on a Saturday. The numbers that they were rumored to be losing was scary.  I know the law has changed on these to reduce the maximum stakes etc which is a start.

Not defending the FOBTs but they are limited to £100 a spin. Ban them and what will the fellas do? They will go online where they can put on a lot more than £100 a spin. How do you stop it?

That's shocking TBH...I've never played them machines but i have watched a few do it and to think they could lose £100 every time that wheel spins is remarkable. I like a flutter (as you know Don) but i've never gambled money that i couldn't afford to lose but there are so many people you see standing in the Bookies shop wearing the same clothes talking the same sh*te to the same people and they're doing it years, they obviously gamble every penny they earn as they haven't a decent pair of shoes on their feet.
I know you say if you tell the people to stop they'll go elsewhere to do it and you're prob right, there's no real answer to it all.

Regularly footering with Skybet. Cash out is a great invention but puts you in a dilemma more times, there's absolutely no doubt in my mind that it's statistically better to cash out in 90% of bets, but the gambler in me keeps me there most of the time. Have only cashed out once were I got the sickener of the bet coming in. I'd say if you continually cash out they're bound to have some algorithm in place to deal with you.

Quote from: bennydorano on April 24, 2018, 04:10:37 PM
Well, don't leave us hanging.... bet win or lose?

Team won ok but I had no bet

Quote from: bennydorano on April 24, 2018, 04:15:47 PM
Regularly footering with Skybet. Cash out is a great invention but puts you in a dilemma more times, there's absolutely no doubt in my mind that it's statistically better to cash out in 90% of bets, but the gambler in me keeps me there most of the time. Have only cashed out once were I got the sickener of the bet coming in. I'd say if you continually cash out they're bound to have some algorithm in place to deal with you.
[/quote

yeah close you down...........bookies will not keep accounts open where they  are losing.

and you get a lovely letter back telling you that you dont fit their profile of some such platitude........

My vice is poker machines. Was really bad at them many years ago. Would get paid and blow the lot and have 4 pints. Now i go to the pub with a few quid to throw into it, thats it, when its gone its gone. Have a  flutter on the National

Quote from: bennydorano on April 24, 2018, 04:15:47 PM
Regularly footering with Skybet. Cash out is a great invention but puts you in a dilemma more times, there's absolutely no doubt in my mind that it's statistically better to cash out in 90% of bets, but the gambler in me keeps me there most of the time. Have only cashed out once were I got the sickener of the bet coming in. I'd say if you continually cash out they're bound to have some algorithm in place to deal with you.

Not sure about that. Are the bookies offering cash-out to be competitive with each other, or because it benefits them overall? I'm inclined to think the latter. It limits their risk and the cash-out value is always below what it should be, i.e. good margin built in.

I mean (by way of an example) if you're mid bet say with a 5 team accum at evens and 4 are up & 1 drawing with 20 mins to go, if you staked £20, they'd likely be offering you £40-60 by this stage - statistically speaking I think it makes sense to take your profit and go. More often than not I let it ride and get £0

Quote from: bennydorano on April 25, 2018, 09:41:57 AM
I mean (by way of an example) if you're mid bet say with a 5 team accum at evens and 4 are up & 1 drawing with 20 mins to go, if you staked £20, they'd likely be offering you £40-60 by this stage - statistically speaking I think it makes sense to take your profit and go. More often than not I let it ride and get £0

The way I look at it is would I be happy with getting the cash out from my initial outlay.

In above example would I be happy getting £40 from a £20 bet - the answer would be no because if that is what I wanted to win I would have backed one even money shot.

Quote from: Hound on April 25, 2018, 07:45:57 AM

Quote from: bennydorano on April 24, 2018, 04:15:47 PM
Regularly footering with Skybet. Cash out is a great invention but puts you in a dilemma more times, there's absolutely no doubt in my mind that it's statistically better to cash out in 90% of bets, but the gambler in me keeps me there most of the time. Have only cashed out once were I got the sickener of the bet coming in. I'd say if you continually cash out they're bound to have some algorithm in place to deal with you.

Not sure about that. Are the bookies offering cash-out to be competitive with each other, or because it benefits them overall? I'm inclined to think the latter. It limits their risk and the cash-out value is always below what it should be, i.e. good margin built in.

You are completely right. Cash out is one of the most profitable things bookies have brought in this past few years.

Quote from: TabClear on April 24, 2018, 10:25:10 AM

Quote from: Don Johnson on April 24, 2018, 09:36:02 AM

Quote from: TabClear on April 24, 2018, 08:44:47 AM

Quote from: Tony Baloney on April 24, 2018, 08:29:04 AM

Quote from: Insane Bolt on April 24, 2018, 07:32:55 AM
I would dread to think what I have gambled over the years, for years I was only a 50p Yankee and a £5 football bet on a Saturday, which progressed to betting every day. I was fortunate enough that I never got hooked and that I never gambled money I didn't have, but even now when I would do the occasional bet the same guys are on the gaming machines (which should be banned in my opinion). Only gamble with what you can afford to lose is wise advice.

I'd say that's how many people start but it gets out of control.

Those FOBT gaming machines seem to be one of the biggest problems. I would very rarely be in a bookies as on the odd occasions i do a bet its generally on the phone. But I know of at least 3 guys who have got into serious problems on those machines. I really cannot see the appeal of them but these guys would not generally have been big "traditional" gamblers as such, they would have done the odd football bet and Cheltenham  but you would hear stories of them sitting in the Bookies on these machines for hours on a Saturday. The numbers that they were rumored to be losing was scary.  I know the law has changed on these to reduce the maximum stakes etc which is a start.

Not defending the FOBTs but they are limited to £100 a spin. Ban them and what will the fellas do? They will go online where they can put on a lot more than £100 a spin. How do you stop it?

Christ, £100 a spin!! I had no idea they could reach that level. You are probably right DJ, with online gambling being so accessible its hard to stop someone gambling if they want to. I have sat in the pub with mates on a saturday who would easily bet on 5-6 races plus a football bet. At least pre online betting you had to physically make an effort to put a bet on (even if it was just telling the barman to phone it in!)

Are bookies under any duty of care with respect to allowing people to bet if they think they have a problem?

Most bookies now have plenty of Gamcare posters etc (When the FUN stops, stop) round the place by law. Then if people want to exclude they do it themselves, they have to get a passport style photo and fill in a form and that is them for however long they wish from 6 months to life.

The online bookies are soon bringing in a thing that if you exclude from one you exclude from all who sign up to this scheme. Plenty of people just go round all the onlines at the minute, exclude from one, sign up to the next and so on.

Quote from: Taylor on April 25, 2018, 09:46:25 AM

Quote from: bennydorano on April 25, 2018, 09:41:57 AM
I mean (by way of an example) if you're mid bet say with a 5 team accum at evens and 4 are up & 1 drawing with 20 mins to go, if you staked £20, they'd likely be offering you £40-60 by this stage - statistically speaking I think it makes sense to take your profit and go. More often than not I let it ride and get £0

The way I look at it is would I be happy with getting the cash out from my initial outlay.

In above example would I be happy getting £40 from a £20 bet - the answer would be no because if that is what I wanted to win I would have backed one even money shot.

The small odds offered on football will not give the big payout that the punter wants
That's why they go for the five six team accumulator which might pay six to one etc.
However there are punters prepared to throw 500 at 4/5 to win 400. If it works out great if not too bad

Quote from: Don Johnson on April 25, 2018, 10:54:26 AM

Quote from: Hound on April 25, 2018, 07:45:57 AM

Quote from: bennydorano on April 24, 2018, 04:15:47 PM
Regularly footering with Skybet. Cash out is a great invention but puts you in a dilemma more times, there's absolutely no doubt in my mind that it's statistically better to cash out in 90% of bets, but the gambler in me keeps me there most of the time. Have only cashed out once were I got the sickener of the bet coming in. I'd say if you continually cash out they're bound to have some algorithm in place to deal with you.

Not sure about that. Are the bookies offering cash-out to be competitive with each other, or because it benefits them overall? I'm inclined to think the latter. It limits their risk and the cash-out value is always below what it should be, i.e. good margin built in.

You are completely right. Cash out is one of the most profitable things bookies have brought in this past few years.

I doubt the stats are available anywhere outside management in the industry but it would be really interesting to see the data. I agree they didn't bring it in for any altruistic purposes.

they will all cash you our permanently if you have a winning account or reduce your stakes to 5 cent

Quote from: bennydorano on April 25, 2018, 12:21:06 PM

Quote from: Don Johnson on April 25, 2018, 10:54:26 AM

Quote from: Hound on April 25, 2018, 07:45:57 AM

Quote from: bennydorano on April 24, 2018, 04:15:47 PM
Regularly footering with Skybet. Cash out is a great invention but puts you in a dilemma more times, there's absolutely no doubt in my mind that it's statistically better to cash out in 90% of bets, but the gambler in me keeps me there most of the time. Have only cashed out once were I got the sickener of the bet coming in. I'd say if you continually cash out they're bound to have some algorithm in place to deal with you.

Not sure about that. Are the bookies offering cash-out to be competitive with each other, or because it benefits them overall? I'm inclined to think the latter. It limits their risk and the cash-out value is always below what it should be, i.e. good margin built in.

You are completely right. Cash out is one of the most profitable things bookies have brought in this past few years.

I doubt the stats are available anywhere outside management in the industry but it would be really interesting to see the data. I agree they didn't bring it in for any altruistic purposes.

The profit margins on cash out are huge.

Simple enough to work it out is to check what the odds are on the team to win and what you would get back if you cashed out at that period.
In a fair world putting the cash out amount on the team to win should in essence return what the full bet would.

If you look at this it wont be close

Your own bets are easy worked out surely but the stats for the public as a whole would be interesting. Not information that would be easily accessible I'd imagine.

Quote from: bennydorano on April 25, 2018, 01:21:21 PM
Your own bets are easy worked out surely but the stats for the public as a whole would be interesting. Not information that would be easily accessible I'd imagine.

Correct Benny - impossible to get.

You can be sure the bookies didnt introduce it to give the punter value though

Quote from: bennydorano on April 25, 2018, 12:21:06 PM

Quote from: Don Johnson on April 25, 2018, 10:54:26 AM

Quote from: Hound on April 25, 2018, 07:45:57 AM

Quote from: bennydorano on April 24, 2018, 04:15:47 PM
Regularly footering with Skybet. Cash out is a great invention but puts you in a dilemma more times, there's absolutely no doubt in my mind that it's statistically better to cash out in 90% of bets, but the gambler in me keeps me there most of the time. Have only cashed out once were I got the sickener of the bet coming in. I'd say if you continually cash out they're bound to have some algorithm in place to deal with you.

Not sure about that. Are the bookies offering cash-out to be competitive with each other, or because it benefits them overall? I'm inclined to think the latter. It limits their risk and the cash-out value is always below what it should be, i.e. good margin built in.

You are completely right. Cash out is one of the most profitable things bookies have brought in this past few years.

I doubt the stats are available anywhere outside management in the industry but it would be really interesting to see the data. I agree they didn't bring it in for any altruistic purposes.

I've seen the data for smaller online bookies and it's ridiculous. Could only imagine how it looks for the likes of Bet365, Paddy Power.

Quote from: illdecide on April 24, 2018, 04:12:41 PM

Quote from: Don Johnson on April 24, 2018, 09:36:02 AM

Quote from: TabClear on April 24, 2018, 08:44:47 AM

Quote from: Tony Baloney on April 24, 2018, 08:29:04 AM

Quote from: Insane Bolt on April 24, 2018, 07:32:55 AM
I would dread to think what I have gambled over the years, for years I was only a 50p Yankee and a £5 football bet on a Saturday, which progressed to betting every day. I was fortunate enough that I never got hooked and that I never gambled money I didn't have, but even now when I would do the occasional bet the same guys are on the gaming machines (which should be banned in my opinion). Only gamble with what you can afford to lose is wise advice.

I'd say that's how many people start but it gets out of control.

Those FOBT gaming machines seem to be one of the biggest problems. I would very rarely be in a bookies as on the odd occasions i do a bet its generally on the phone. But I know of at least 3 guys who have got into serious problems on those machines. I really cannot see the appeal of them but these guys would not generally have been big "traditional" gamblers as such, they would have done the odd football bet and Cheltenham  but you would hear stories of them sitting in the Bookies on these machines for hours on a Saturday. The numbers that they were rumored to be losing was scary.  I know the law has changed on these to reduce the maximum stakes etc which is a start.

Not defending the FOBTs but they are limited to £100 a spin. Ban them and what will the fellas do? They will go online where they can put on a lot more than £100 a spin. How do you stop it?

That's shocking TBH...I've never played them machines but i have watched a few do it and to think they could lose £100 every time that wheel spins is remarkable. I like a flutter (as you know Don) but i've never gambled money that i couldn't afford to lose but there are so many people you see standing in the Bookies shop wearing the same clothes talking the same sh*te to the same people and they're doing it years, they obviously gamble every penny they earn as they haven't a decent pair of shoes on their feet.
I know you say if you tell the people to stop they'll go elsewhere to do it and you're prob right, there's no real answer to it all.

Industry players trying to overturn the likely reduction in FOBT stakes. I see in the article  William Hill referenced as it derives 54% of its retail revenue from gaming machines., seems a massive proportion.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-43941046

Quote from: bennydorano on April 24, 2018, 04:15:47 PM
Regularly footering with Skybet. Cash out is a great invention but puts you in a dilemma more times, there's absolutely no doubt in my mind that it's statistically better to cash out in 90% of bets, but the gambler in me keeps me there most of the time. Have only cashed out once were I got the sickener of the bet coming in. I'd say if you continually cash out they're bound to have some algorithm in place to deal with you.

That can't be right Benny.
Say you bet £10 on a horse at 5/1.  It is going well in running and has a 50% chance of winning from that point.  The means that the true odds are Evens but you will be offered (say) £19 to cash out, ie you will be paying another slice of overround if you cash out.

Financially you would be better to let your bet run, but psychologically it may be better to cash out because we find it hard to deal with losing runs.  So a possible answer to that would have been to back something at Evens in the first place instead of something at a bigger price!!

Think mine is a personal experience, the bets that I regularly do are like 4/5/6 team win accums, both teams to score or over 2.5 goals. I have honest to god lost count of the amount of times I've been offered decent cash outs but let them pass and then the accum inevitably gets sunk.

Cash Out really is for mugs:
If a punter has an accumulator on it's last leg as in Man Utd yesterday:
Punter has £10 acc to win £70 and 1st  three teams win thus waiting on Man Utd  to win
Invariably at 1-1{at almost 90 mins) the Cash Out will barely cover the stake however when Man Utd score in injury time the Cash Out offer will be increased YET substantially less than the initial payout-in this case a simple back of Arsenal and Draw(to small stakes) would have provided a greater return than the Cash Out amount being offered

But it's not if you judge it right. £10 accum on 4 x Evs football teams pays £160 if it wins, if 3 are up and one drawing with 25mins to go you might get an offer of say £40/£50, say you cash out and the bet collapses into dung with equalisers in 1 or 2 games, if you've cashed out you've profited greatly and had the pleasure of sticking it to the bookie. This is the scenario that I'm talking about and I experience the most.

I can see the value in cashing out in certain situations but must admit it's something i've never done myself.  I'm too stubborn.  I picked a bet to win and will let that run it's course.  I can deal with that bet losing but i would have a hard time dealing with it winning and me having cashed out for a relatively small amount. 

Quote from: bennydorano on April 30, 2018, 09:22:36 PM
But it's not if you judge it right. £10 accum on 4 x Evs football teams pays £160 if it wins, if 3 are up and one drawing with 25mins to go you might get an offer of say £40/£50, say you cash out and the bet collapses into dung with equalisers in 1 or 2 games, if you've cashed out you've profited greatly and had the pleasure of sticking it to the bookie. This is the scenario that I'm talking about and I experience the most.

But sure if you are happy with a £40/£50 pay out then just back a 3/1 or 4/1 shot (or teams to this value).
Much better chance of winning than a 15/1 4 timer

f**k me is it that hard a situation to grasp. I'm well aware of the ins and outs of gambling, Cash out can benefit the punter too in some circumstances is my point - IF you play it right.

Quote from: bennydorano on May 01, 2018, 04:19:54 PM
f**k me is it that hard a situation to grasp. I'm well aware of the ins and outs of gambling, Cash out can benefit the punter too in some circumstances is my point - IF you play it right.

Not hard to grasp at all Benny. If cash out was in any way beneficial to punters do you really think all the bookies would have introduced it?

Thats like saying in some circumstances it benefits a person to gamble. Of course it does but gambling makes bookies rich as does the cash out option

It must be hard enough to grasp because it is beneficial to punters sometimes - in the EXACT way I've outlined. Big picture,  the bookie is well in front, but to say there's no benefit to the punter is just plain wrong, 100% wrong.

Quote from: bennydorano on May 01, 2018, 05:30:52 PM
It must be hard enough to grasp because it is beneficial to punters sometimes - in the EXACT way I've outlined. Big picture,  the bookie is well in front, but to say there's no benefit to the punter is just plain wrong, 100% wrong.

Bit like going for the ride and pulling out at last minute Benny😜

Better playing the percentages/ proceeding with caution than  blowing your load and facing the consequences in 9 months :)

With Benny on this one, sorta. I'd use cash out on bigger accums say whenever I've a couple of quid left over in the account I'd stick it on 10/12 teams for the craic.  If most selections are winning I'd cash out if there's decent enough profit to be had because I haven't the patience to wait to the end. 

Anyone do much in-game betting on soccer? You can get decent odds on the better teams to when they fall behind if you're patient enough to wait until about 20 minutes to go.

You can solve the cash-out conundrum by boycotting the bookies and betting with Betfair. Betfair also offers cash-out in play, but a better option, if the in-play trend is favourable, is to lay your own bet to get the maximum guaranteed return.

It can be a bit complicated to work this out on the fly if you want to get on before the trend reverses. My solution (when I used to bet somewhat seriously) was to have a spreadsheet with the first (back) bet stake and odds in place. Then you enter the current lay odds in a cell and a formula gives you the optimum lay stake.

Quote from: bennydorano on May 01, 2018, 06:03:37 PM
Better playing the percentages/ proceeding with caution than  blowing your load and facing the consequences in 9 months :)

Arc here now lads.....if that's all he wanted what's the point in entering in the first place  :P

Cashed out tonight, before Bayern scored to make it 2-2

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-44148285

Quote from: Insane Bolt on May 17, 2018, 07:44:46 AM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-44148285

Glad to see that to be honest.
Those fixed odds machines are the real plague when it comes to gambling addiction

They need to be banned altogether. It's legalised robbery.

Quote from: Hardy on May 17, 2018, 08:54:14 AM
They need to be banned altogether. It's legalised robbery.

Unsurprisingly the bookmakers are threatening thousands of job losses if this comes into effect

I seen a friend blowing £300 pound in about 5 minutes on those machines going at £25 a spin, he was only 17 at the time.  That being said, had it been £2 only he still would have lost that £300, just would have taken him a bit longer.

Quote from: Ethan Tremblay on May 17, 2018, 09:19:03 AM
I seen a friend blowing £300 pound in about 5 minutes on those machines going at £25 a spin, he was only 17 at the time.  That being said, had it been £2 only he still would have lost that £300, just would have taken him a bit longer.

Thats still an improvement in my book. More opportunity for him to come to his senses or staff to have a word.

I was in Vegas a few years ago and remember taking a wander through the VIP/High Limit slots section of the Venetian. I think the limit was $5000 per spin!

Did I read somewhere that gambling on sports is now going to be legal throughout America??!!!

That will definitely kick things up a notch!!!

People need to take personal responsibility. Drink, drugs, gambling. Everything is addictive. Children should be taught self control. That ability to know when enough is enough.

The new regulation can't get implemented in the north as there is no devolved government to enforce it.

Quote from: Minder on May 17, 2018, 08:57:22 AM

Quote from: Hardy on May 17, 2018, 08:54:14 AM
They need to be banned altogether. It's legalised robbery.

Unsurprisingly the bookmakers are threatening thousands of job losses if this comes into effect

Job losses? Is that the people who make them and maintain the MACHINES?

The machines will still be made and maintained elswhere, unless they employed someone to turn them off and on

Quote from: trailer on May 17, 2018, 11:25:45 AM
People need to take personal responsibility. Drink, drugs, gambling. Everything is addictive. Children should be taught self control. That ability to know when enough is enough.

That was tried . . .

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/20/NRJUSTSAYNO.jpg/170px-NRJUSTSAYNO.jpg)

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 17, 2018, 11:42:28 AM

Quote from: Minder on May 17, 2018, 08:57:22 AM

Quote from: Hardy on May 17, 2018, 08:54:14 AM
They need to be banned altogether. It's legalised robbery.

Unsurprisingly the bookmakers are threatening thousands of job losses if this comes into effect

Job losses? Is that the people who make them and maintain the MACHINES?

The machines will still be made and maintained elswhere, unless they employed someone to turn them off and on

The job losses are with the betting shops. They are unsustainable without the money people piss away into FOBT's!!

Quote from: screenexile on May 17, 2018, 11:44:18 AM

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 17, 2018, 11:42:28 AM

Quote from: Minder on May 17, 2018, 08:57:22 AM

Quote from: Hardy on May 17, 2018, 08:54:14 AM
They need to be banned altogether. It's legalised robbery.

Unsurprisingly the bookmakers are threatening thousands of job losses if this comes into effect

Job losses? Is that the people who make them and maintain the MACHINES?

The machines will still be made and maintained elswhere, unless they employed someone to turn them off and on

The job losses are with the betting shops. They are unsustainable without the money people piss away into FOBT's!!

There are two people at a time working in them? Will they just close them and expect everyone to go online? they won't close. Licence to print money... And if they do close people will find other jobs

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 17, 2018, 11:47:24 AM

Quote from: screenexile on May 17, 2018, 11:44:18 AM

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 17, 2018, 11:42:28 AM

Quote from: Minder on May 17, 2018, 08:57:22 AM

Quote from: Hardy on May 17, 2018, 08:54:14 AM
They need to be banned altogether. It's legalised robbery.

Unsurprisingly the bookmakers are threatening thousands of job losses if this comes into effect

Job losses? Is that the people who make them and maintain the MACHINES?

The machines will still be made and maintained elswhere, unless they employed someone to turn them off and on

The job losses are with the betting shops. They are unsustainable without the money people piss away into FOBT's!!

There are two people at a time working in them? Will they just close them and expect everyone to go online? they won't close. Licence to print money... And if they do close people will find other jobs

You're miles off there Milltown no harm to you.

Quote from: Boycey on May 17, 2018, 11:59:47 AM

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 17, 2018, 11:47:24 AM

Quote from: screenexile on May 17, 2018, 11:44:18 AM

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 17, 2018, 11:42:28 AM

Quote from: Minder on May 17, 2018, 08:57:22 AM

Quote from: Hardy on May 17, 2018, 08:54:14 AM
They need to be banned altogether. It's legalised robbery.

Unsurprisingly the bookmakers are threatening thousands of job losses if this comes into effect

Job losses? Is that the people who make them and maintain the MACHINES?

The machines will still be made and maintained elswhere, unless they employed someone to turn them off and on

The job losses are with the betting shops. They are unsustainable without the money people piss away into FOBT's!!

There are two people at a time working in them? Will they just close them and expect everyone to go online? they won't close. Licence to print money... And if they do close people will find other jobs

You're miles off there Milltown no harm to you.

If I am and the bookies close down then I'll accept that, but I feel that they will stay open.. and if they do close then it should save people money on using the machines

Can't wait for Sean Graham's closing down sale😂

I've worked in the gaming industry most of my adult life and know for a fact that many bookies shops exist solely for those FOBTs. This article explains it better than I could and bear in mind its from a few years back and the yield from FOBTs is probably higher now.

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-22934305

Closing the shops won't stop gamblers they're like druggies/alcoholics they will just find their fix somewhere else unfortunately.

Quote from: Boycey on May 17, 2018, 12:53:51 PM
I've worked in the gaming industry most of my adult life and know for a fact that many bookies shops exist solely for those FOBTs. This article explains it better than I could and bear in mind its from a few years back and the yield from FOBTs is probably higher now.

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-22934305

Closing the shops won't stop gamblers they're like druggies/alcoholics they will just find their fix somewhere else unfortunately.

That may be the case and possibly for 2/3 of the people who go to the bookie shop they wont touch the machines.. They wont be missed, and if that forces someone to go online and do it then that needs regulated stronger also..

I would have a bet most weekends, and if I have anything left in my online account I'll snipe away during the week, but we are talking a couple pound here and there, but to watch (I'm only in briefly) on a Sat afternoon these fellas (and the odd woman) throw their dosh into those machine is unreal! Seen a lad throw £50 on 29 on roulette! nut job

But as you say, they will find other places to do it, might as well start somewhere though

Just to back up what I said earlier, take a look at the graphic in that article in relation to money over the counter vs money into those FOBTs

https://www.bbc.com/sport/horse-racing/44152194

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 17, 2018, 01:10:06 PM

Quote from: Boycey on May 17, 2018, 12:53:51 PM
I've worked in the gaming industry most of my adult life and know for a fact that many bookies shops exist solely for those FOBTs. This article explains it better than I could and bear in mind its from a few years back and the yield from FOBTs is probably higher now.

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-22934305

Closing the shops won't stop gamblers they're like druggies/alcoholics they will just find their fix somewhere else unfortunately.

That may be the case and possibly for 2/3 of the people who go to the bookie shop they wont touch the machines.. They wont be missed, and if that forces someone to go online and do it then that needs regulated stronger also..

I would have a bet most weekends, and if I have anything left in my online account I'll snipe away during the week, but we are talking a couple pound here and there, but to watch (I'm only in briefly) on a Sat afternoon these fellas (and the odd woman) throw their dosh into those machine is unreal! Seen a lad throw £50 on 29 on roulette! nut job

But as you say, they will find other places to do it, might as well start somewhere though

Lad at worked was telling me this morning he spunked £3500 on those machines in a day, "addictive as fu*k" was his take on them.  £25 a go he was doing.

That's mad Ted.

Quote from: johnnycool on May 17, 2018, 04:27:44 PM

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 17, 2018, 01:10:06 PM

Quote from: Boycey on May 17, 2018, 12:53:51 PM
I've worked in the gaming industry most of my adult life and know for a fact that many bookies shops exist solely for those FOBTs. This article explains it better than I could and bear in mind its from a few years back and the yield from FOBTs is probably higher now.

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-22934305

Closing the shops won't stop gamblers they're like druggies/alcoholics they will just find their fix somewhere else unfortunately.

That may be the case and possibly for 2/3 of the people who go to the bookie shop they wont touch the machines.. They wont be missed, and if that forces someone to go online and do it then that needs regulated stronger also..

I would have a bet most weekends, and if I have anything left in my online account I'll snipe away during the week, but we are talking a couple pound here and there, but to watch (I'm only in briefly) on a Sat afternoon these fellas (and the odd woman) throw their dosh into those machine is unreal! Seen a lad throw £50 on 29 on roulette! nut job

But as you say, they will find other places to do it, might as well start somewhere though

Lad at worked was telling me this morning he spunked £3500 on those machines in a day, "addictive as fu*k" was his take on them.  £25 a go he was doing.

That's mad Ted.

That is crazy. Could he "afford" to loose it? What I mean is that there is probably a relatively small proportion of the population who would actually be able to access £3500 cash off the cuff. Even if I had it in my account I am limited to £500 per day from an ATM. I physically would not be able to go through that much cash without calling in at a bank. 

Gambling is every bit as bad if not worse than drink and drugs.  Too much money being made from them so governments turn a blind eye.

Got my bookies lotto numbers up last night 350/1 - 3 numbers from 7😁

Quote from: TabClear on May 17, 2018, 04:45:02 PM

Quote from: johnnycool on May 17, 2018, 04:27:44 PM

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 17, 2018, 01:10:06 PM

Quote from: Boycey on May 17, 2018, 12:53:51 PM
I've worked in the gaming industry most of my adult life and know for a fact that many bookies shops exist solely for those FOBTs. This article explains it better than I could and bear in mind its from a few years back and the yield from FOBTs is probably higher now.

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-22934305

Closing the shops won't stop gamblers they're like druggies/alcoholics they will just find their fix somewhere else unfortunately.

That may be the case and possibly for 2/3 of the people who go to the bookie shop they wont touch the machines.. They wont be missed, and if that forces someone to go online and do it then that needs regulated stronger also..

I would have a bet most weekends, and if I have anything left in my online account I'll snipe away during the week, but we are talking a couple pound here and there, but to watch (I'm only in briefly) on a Sat afternoon these fellas (and the odd woman) throw their dosh into those machine is unreal! Seen a lad throw £50 on 29 on roulette! nut job

But as you say, they will find other places to do it, might as well start somewhere though

Lad at worked was telling me this morning he spunked £3500 on those machines in a day, "addictive as fu*k" was his take on them.  £25 a go he was doing.

That's mad Ted.

That is crazy. Could he "afford" to loose it? What I mean is that there is probably a relatively small proportion of the population who would actually be able to access £3500 cash off the cuff. Even if I had it in my account I am limited to £500 per day from an ATM. I physically would not be able to go through that much cash without calling in at a bank.

A mixture of months salary and whatever savings he had.

His ma still gets his pay and gives him it to him in weekly installments as he can't trust himself. This is a mid thirties lad with three kids....