Violence in Adult Club Football

Started by Jinxy, September 17, 2018, 09:54:12 AM

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In your county, has it:

Significantly increased in recent years
Significantly decreased in recent years
It's about the same

The Gs Man

Question for parents.

If your 18 or 19 year old son, playing in a minor, U21 or senior game was on the receiving end of a dirty punch and ended up with a broken nose or worse, a broken jaw, what would you do? 

Would you go to the police / guards?

Would you let the County Board sort it, with the potential of a lenient suspension being handed out?

Would you try and persuade the lad to leave the sport?

Just interested in other's experiences.  I'm not looking forward to the day my young lads are playing under the threat of something like that happening.  I'm worrying about it already.
Keep 'er lit

dublin7

Quote from: Norf Tyrone on October 24, 2018, 10:50:26 AM
I'm not sure why that Tyrone v Tipp game keeps getting mentioned. It wasn't a dirty game and Tipp were more aggressive than Tyrone if anything. A knee to McShane comes to mind.

I don't recall any accusation of verbals at the time. However when one or two mention it since the story just grows legs.

To be fair the Tipp manager came out publicly to accuse Tyrone of over the top sledging. GAA did investigate, but couldn't prove anything. It was Tipp players words against Tyrone players. 

spuds

In my eyes it is as simple as a selector who has no right to be on the pitch hits a player on the field of play with all he could muster.

Is 8 weeks a suitable punishment? Not near it in my opinion.

We need to protect our players and show no tolerance to such thuggery.
"As I get older I notice the years less and the seasons more."
John Hubbard

BennyCake

Quote from: Insane Bolt on October 24, 2018, 01:31:28 PM
It all comes down to respect.....or in the case of GAA....a total lack of it. Why are the powers that be so reluctant to adopt things that work in other sports....in particular rugby. Players address the ref with respect....usually only the captain can approach the ref to speak. In GAA, players, management and supporters in general have no respect for officials.

Yes but rugby refs speak clearly to players and explain decisions in a matter of fact way. In gaa they don't. Take Joe McQuillan who just points and says nothing. That enrages me watchin it. God know how players feel. We need refs trained like in RUgby

TabClear

Quote from: BennyCake on October 24, 2018, 02:05:45 PM
Quote from: Insane Bolt on October 24, 2018, 01:31:28 PM
It all comes down to respect.....or in the case of GAA....a total lack of it. Why are the powers that be so reluctant to adopt things that work in other sports....in particular rugby. Players address the ref with respect....usually only the captain can approach the ref to speak. In GAA, players, management and supporters in general have no respect for officials.

Yes but rugby refs speak clearly to players and explain decisions in a matter of fact way. In gaa they don't. Take Joe McQuillan who just points and says nothing. That enrages me watchin it. God know how players feel. We need refs trained like in RUgby

Totally agree. When I played there were a few refs who would explain what had happened and were constantly talking to the players about why the free was awarded and the players generally appreciated it. You might disagree but you understood why the ref had blew the whistle. Unfortunately they were in the minority

blewuporstuffed

Quote from: spuds on October 24, 2018, 01:54:41 PM
In my eyes it is as simple as a selector who has no right to be on the pitch hits a player on the field of play with all he could muster.

Is 8 weeks a suitable punishment? Not near it in my opinion.

We need to protect our players and show no tolerance to such thuggery.
Its absolutely not a suitable punishment, but the problem i am highlighting is the ramshackle nature of the rules and suspensions. Its all over the place and range from the ridiculous 1 game ban for striking a player, to 3 months for squirting water.
There is no consistency or sense of fairness.
Perhaps if there was, there would be more of an acceptance of the punishment.
The feeling at the minute is 'why should i accept 3 months/6month / or whatever when yer man down the road got away with nothing/1 game etc etc'

Just because something was particularly bad (and that incident was bad) and caught on camera , picking a number out of the air doesnt work. it needs to be consistent and in the rules before hand.

for what its worth i think it should be more like:

Two yellows or red card for dangerous play- 1 game ban
striking or violent conduct by a player: 3 games, (with at least 1 for those games in the relevant competition)
Violent conduct as part of a melee :5 games
non playing official encroachment onto the pitch: sent to the stand, followed by a one game pitch side ban.
if it happens more than once in a season an additional 3 games
an official involved in violent conduct: 12 game sideline ban. realistically an 8 week ban (or even 12 or 24) could mean very little at this stage of the season for a team going out of the championship. Game bans are far more effective

I can only please one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow doesn't look good either

Milltown Row2

Quote from: TabClear on October 24, 2018, 02:16:52 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on October 24, 2018, 02:05:45 PM
Quote from: Insane Bolt on October 24, 2018, 01:31:28 PM
It all comes down to respect.....or in the case of GAA....a total lack of it. Why are the powers that be so reluctant to adopt things that work in other sports....in particular rugby. Players address the ref with respect....usually only the captain can approach the ref to speak. In GAA, players, management and supporters in general have no respect for officials.

Yes but rugby refs speak clearly to players and explain decisions in a matter of fact way. In gaa they don't. Take Joe McQuillan who just points and says nothing. That enrages me watchin it. God know how players feel. We need refs trained like in RUgby

Totally agree. When I played there were a few refs who would explain what had happened and were constantly talking to the players about why the free was awarded and the players generally appreciated it. You might disagree but you understood why the ref had blew the whistle. Unfortunately they were in the minority

Its not as easy as you think talking to the players during the game, I do it and try and have a laugh with them but there are players who never stop moaning, gets to a point were you just stop, as like anything else in life, if you are being berated the whole game for every call then you just shut down and don't bother trying to explain because its not good enough..

Id say most referee's speak to players at National level, you'll hardly hear McQuillian speak from watching him on TV or even at a county ground for that matter, teh TV keeps up with the play not the ref
None of us are getting out of here alive, so please stop treating yourself like an after thought. Ea

twohands!!!

Brawls everywhere you look and the only action the GAA is taking in terms of the rules on discipline is reducing punishment for players who get 2 yellows in matches (instead of getting sent off like they did before, they get to go and have a sit down on the side-line for 10 minutes before they rejoin the action.)

Says it all about the GAA's approach to discipline.

Whatever is the opposite of zero-tolerance seems to be the GAA's approach.

At this stage there seems to be zero point in behaving decently on a pitch (all it does is put you at a disadvantage) - look at your man in Tralee - he stays out of the scrap, gets blindsided by a punch to the jaw and what punishment does the sc**bag get - a miserable 8 week suspension.

If the player had got stuck into the melee odds are that he wouldn't have got punched at all - says it all about the GAA disciplinary system - wade into a melee and grab arms, shoulders, the collars of jersies and you'll be fine, stay out and you are liable to get blindsided by a sneaky punch from a coward (who despite being caught bang to rights will get a miserable 8 weeks of a ban)

Therealdonald

Said it before. Train the refs up to a higher standard, refs from outside counties, and more-disciplined players. Its a nationwide problem caused by poor refereeing, too many hyped up McGregors, and alot of grey area rules. The GAA needs to sort it out. I don't see players ceasing to play because of it, but for a spectacle and the reputation of the game, something needs done.

iorras

Quote from: The Gs Man on October 24, 2018, 01:42:58 PM
Question for parents.

If your 18 or 19 year old son, playing in a minor, U21 or senior game was on the receiving end of a dirty punch and ended up with a broken nose or worse, a broken jaw, what would you do? 

Would you go to the police / guards?

Would you let the County Board sort it, with the potential of a lenient suspension being handed out?

Would you try and persuade the lad to leave the sport?

Just interested in other's experiences.  I'm not looking forward to the day my young lads are playing under the threat of something like that happening.  I'm worrying about it already.
Personally I would be inclined to go to the guards but its not as simple as that. firstly the young fella wronged may not want you to do that feeling that it'll be seen as "bad form", secondly I dont know how seriously the guards would take it and it might only make the whole thing worse.
The fundamental problem is that if you involve the law in these situations you are seen as a bit of a bollix. There are very few in ireland who will admit when their own are wrong but we have the highest of high standards when it comes to the "other crowd" whoever they may be. We need alot more honesty around a wrong being a wrong, and get away from the rediculous tendency to underplay an action either because a) we know the person who did it and "hes a lovely lad off the field" and "its totally out of charachter" or b) "sure he wasnt that badly hurt" just because the injured party doesnt end up with a jaw full of wire and eating through a straw for 6 weeks. If you box someone, especially if they are not expecting it, its only luck when they are not seriously injured.

BennyCake

Quote from: Milltown Row2 on October 24, 2018, 03:25:13 PM
Quote from: TabClear on October 24, 2018, 02:16:52 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on October 24, 2018, 02:05:45 PM
Quote from: Insane Bolt on October 24, 2018, 01:31:28 PM
It all comes down to respect.....or in the case of GAA....a total lack of it. Why are the powers that be so reluctant to adopt things that work in other sports....in particular rugby. Players address the ref with respect....usually only the captain can approach the ref to speak. In GAA, players, management and supporters in general have no respect for officials.

Yes but rugby refs speak clearly to players and explain decisions in a matter of fact way. In gaa they don't. Take Joe McQuillan who just points and says nothing. That enrages me watchin it. God know how players feel. We need refs trained like in RUgby

Totally agree. When I played there were a few refs who would explain what had happened and were constantly talking to the players about why the free was awarded and the players generally appreciated it. You might disagree but you understood why the ref had blew the whistle. Unfortunately they were in the minority

Its not as easy as you think talking to the players during the game, I do it and try and have a laugh with them but there are players who never stop moaning, gets to a point were you just stop, as like anything else in life, if you are being berated the whole game for every call then you just shut down and don't bother trying to explain because its not good enough..

Id say most referee's speak to players at National level, you'll hardly hear McQuillian speak from watching him on TV or even at a county ground for that matter, teh TV keeps up with the play not the ref

Refs just seem to stand and point. Never explains his decision while players go berserk in frustration.

Players will piss and moan yes, so either book any player who argues, or move the ball up. And keep moving the ball up until he stops arguing

Stall the Bailer

Quote from: BennyCake on October 24, 2018, 06:25:47 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on October 24, 2018, 03:25:13 PM
Quote from: TabClear on October 24, 2018, 02:16:52 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on October 24, 2018, 02:05:45 PM
Quote from: Insane Bolt on October 24, 2018, 01:31:28 PM
It all comes down to respect.....or in the case of GAA....a total lack of it. Why are the powers that be so reluctant to adopt things that work in other sports....in particular rugby. Players address the ref with respect....usually only the captain can approach the ref to speak. In GAA, players, management and supporters in general have no respect for officials.

Yes but rugby refs speak clearly to players and explain decisions in a matter of fact way. In gaa they don't. Take Joe McQuillan who just points and says nothing. That enrages me watchin it. God know how players feel. We need refs trained like in RUgby

Totally agree. When I played there were a few refs who would explain what had happened and were constantly talking to the players about why the free was awarded and the players generally appreciated it. You might disagree but you understood why the ref had blew the whistle. Unfortunately they were in the minority

Its not as easy as you think talking to the players during the game, I do it and try and have a laugh with them but there are players who never stop moaning, gets to a point were you just stop, as like anything else in life, if you are being berated the whole game for every call then you just shut down and don't bother trying to explain because its not good enough..

Id say most referee's speak to players at National level, you'll hardly hear McQuillian speak from watching him on TV or even at a county ground for that matter, teh TV keeps up with the play not the ref

Refs just seem to stand and point. Never explains his decision while players go berserk in frustration.

Players will piss and moan yes, so either book any player who argues, or move the ball up. And keep moving the ball up until he stops arguing
You are only allowed to move it once.

lenny

Quote from: Stall the Bailer on October 24, 2018, 07:06:20 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on October 24, 2018, 06:25:47 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on October 24, 2018, 03:25:13 PM
Quote from: TabClear on October 24, 2018, 02:16:52 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on October 24, 2018, 02:05:45 PM
Quote from: Insane Bolt on October 24, 2018, 01:31:28 PM
It all comes down to respect.....or in the case of GAA....a total lack of it. Why are the powers that be so reluctant to adopt things that work in other sports....in particular rugby. Players address the ref with respect....usually only the captain can approach the ref to speak. In GAA, players, management and supporters in general have no respect for officials.

Yes but rugby refs speak clearly to players and explain decisions in a matter of fact way. In gaa they don't. Take Joe McQuillan who just points and says nothing. That enrages me watchin it. God know how players feel. We need refs trained like in RUgby

Totally agree. When I played there were a few refs who would explain what had happened and were constantly talking to the players about why the free was awarded and the players generally appreciated it. You might disagree but you understood why the ref had blew the whistle. Unfortunately they were in the minority

Its not as easy as you think talking to the players during the game, I do it and try and have a laugh with them but there are players who never stop moaning, gets to a point were you just stop, as like anything else in life, if you are being berated the whole game for every call then you just shut down and don't bother trying to explain because its not good enough..

Id say most referee's speak to players at National level, you'll hardly hear McQuillian speak from watching him on TV or even at a county ground for that matter, teh TV keeps up with the play not the ref

Refs just seem to stand and point. Never explains his decision while players go berserk in frustration.

Players will piss and moan yes, so either book any player who argues, or move the ball up. And keep moving the ball up until he stops arguing
You are only allowed to move it once.

The ref can move it more than once though. As many times as he likes.

Dire Ear

Quote from: The Gs Man on October 24, 2018, 01:42:58 PM
Question for parents.

If your 18 or 19 year old son, playing in a minor, U21 or senior game was on the receiving end of a dirty punch and ended up with a broken nose or worse, a broken jaw, what would you do? 

Would you go to the police / guards?

Would you let the County Board sort it, with the potential of a lenient suspension being handed out?

Would you try and persuade the lad to leave the sport?

Just interested in other's experiences.  I'm not looking forward to the day my young lads are playing under the threat of something like that happening.  I'm worrying about it already.
Would love to be able to go to the cops, but couldn't
Wouldn't trust the county board,  the rules are not tight enough for the subsequent appeals.
If he wanted to leave , I wouldn't stop him;  his happiness and safety would be the no.1 factor

Stall the Bailer

Not according to the rule book. Part of the problem, a lot of players, managers, supporters and some refs don't know the rules.