Are Dublin the best team ever ?

[ballinaman]

Say what you like about Dont Matter but his dedication to using the $ in Dublin everytime is remarkable....

[Zulu]

Because you can't do it. What do you propose, that Dublin never develop GAA black spots, that they don't coach players to kick off both feet so they don't get too good? We have to try and develop all counties but certain counties will always be stronger due to their size. Dublin are doing everything right so I can't understand why people seem to want to punish them.

What you continue to ignore is money, I don't know why but you always avoid it. Dubl$n pay people big money to do everything right, they have almost unlimited resources to do so. No other county comes within 100 miles of the finance available to Dubl$n. That's why your calls for other counties to try and catch them is nonsense, the money isn't there for them to do that. It's as simple as that.

It isn't as simple as that. Dublin, due to its size, needs more money than Laois to just do the same things. There is no reason why many counties can't replicate a lot of what Dublin do at lower levels at least and that will go a long way towards producing better players at senior level.

Zulu,

Most of the dub supporters on here seem like sound skins, but I heard something over the weekend that may challenge above point.
When Dublin finish training they are provided with packed meals for next two day until they are back again at training.
I was in croke park on sat, an all Ireland q final was over after 25 mins, not dublins fault, but the gaa surely cannot ignore the elephant in the room for much longer.
Either provide other counties with similar coaching resources at underage for next 10 years, or else a lot of people could end up staying at home from games.
How difficult will it be for managers of the non top eight teams to get their players out training in November and to get the financing to prepare same.

Joe, I'm not talking about the senior set up but there has always been county set ups far in advance of others. When I played county minor, we turned up one year without any footballs as the manager and gear were in the bus carrying the lads from the other side of the county and they arrived 5 minutes before throw in. In my last year as an U21 we had, maybe two training sessions (I actually can't remember having any but I'm presuming we had one or two) before we played Kerry even though we were in the Munster final the previous year. Money has always played a part in helping some counties succeed while others faltered.

The point I'm making is there is money to invest and counties can apply for funding to improve underage development if they have a good plan. They may not be able to match the Dubs finance for their senior squads but they can do a better job at underage, Roscommon and Cavan are two examples of this.

[AZOffaly]

Say what you like about Dont Matter but his dedication to using the $ in Dublin everytime is remarkable....

It's nice to see commitment in this day and age.

[imtommygunn]

He would make a great corner back. Dogged and never lets up!!

[Zulu]

Utter nonsense. Cork have 5 GDA's the last I heard (covering both football and hurling), yet have millions to pump into P Ui C. They might have more GDA's now but it certainly isn't enough to properly cater for Cork and the county board and some of their clubs have the money to address that if they wanted to. Other counties can afford and can apply for funding to get more GDA's if they want and put a plan in place to do so.

By the way, if Dublin can now afford to take on more of the financial burden and reduce Central council funding then of course they should do that. My view has always been that the GAA should help all counties maximise their potential but you can't do that by giving everyone the same amount. You target certain counties for particular attention and once they get to where Dublin is you move on. Most counties wouldn't need the same level of funding Dublin get to maximise their potential because they don't have to reach as big a population.

We're not talking about facilities, Cork are getting assistance for Páirc Uí Chaoimh just as Dubl$n got assistance for their home stadium Croke Park. Where will all the other counties get the money for these games development officers? How will they pay all the coaches? Does the GAA have money to cover everyone? Will ordinary citizens be happy to pay for these plans? The money isn't there, the GAA invest in Dubl$n because they get a return on the investment. It's a business move.

Your suggestion in the second paragraph is crazy. You want to improve certain counties but leave the rest behind, what are they meant to do? Just sit and watch other counties get special funding and see Gaelic Games destroyed in their county. Joke.

I'm not talking about facilities either. Cork had in the region of €10 million in the bank some of which they could have used to fund more GDA's yet they've decided to use it all on a stadium instead. That's a choice Cork have made but the money was there.

Of course investment in Dublin is about a return and so it should be, no point pissing money away on anybody. If other counties get a plan together, show why they need they money then it is there for them. But they also need to provide a return on this investment which is only right and proper.

Errr no, but by giving everyone the same you'll end up helping few if anyone. The idea is not to leave anyone behind but to build up everyone in stages. There has to be a plan when investing millions of euros otherwise their is no acceptability, no way of ensuring the money is being well spent and no way of tracking improvements. Why the hell would anyone argue that it's better to give both county A and B €100,000 each if it is quite clear county A use this money well while county B are pissing it away? Would it not make more sense to give more to the county using it well and providing a return on the investment and giving less to county B while telling them if you get your act together you'll get the money back?

[Johnnybegood]

Utter nonsense. Cork have 5 GDA's the last I heard (covering both football and hurling), yet have millions to pump into P Ui C. They might have more GDA's now but it certainly isn't enough to properly cater for Cork and the county board and some of their clubs have the money to address that if they wanted to. Other counties can afford and can apply for funding to get more GDA's if they want and put a plan in place to do so.

By the way, if Dublin can now afford to take on more of the financial burden and reduce Central council funding then of course they should do that. My view has always been that the GAA should help all counties maximise their potential but you can't do that by giving everyone the same amount. You target certain counties for particular attention and once they get to where Dublin is you move on. Most counties wouldn't need the same level of funding Dublin get to maximise their potential because they don't have to reach as big a population.

We're not talking about facilities, Cork are getting assistance for Páirc Uí Chaoimh just as Dubl$n got assistance for their home stadium Croke Park. Where will all the other counties get the money for these games development officers? How will they pay all the coaches? Does the GAA have money to cover everyone? Will ordinary citizens be happy to pay for these plans? The money isn't there, the GAA invest in Dubl$n because they get a return on the investment. It's a business move.

Your suggestion in the second paragraph is crazy. You want to improve certain counties but leave the rest behind, what are they meant to do? Just sit and watch other counties get special funding and see Gaelic Games destroyed in their county. Joke.

do Dublin own croke park?

[J70]

They seem to own the Hill 16 part, at least.

[Dont Matter]

I'm not talking about facilities either. Cork had in the region of €10 million in the bank some of which they could have used to fund more GDA's yet they've decided to use it all on a stadium instead. That's a choice Cork have made but the money was there.

Of course investment in Dublin is about a return and so it should be, no point pissing money away on anybody. If other counties get a plan together, show why they need they money then it is there for them. But they also need to provide a return on this investment which is only right and proper.

Errr no, but by giving everyone the same you'll end up helping few if anyone. The idea is not to leave anyone behind but to build up everyone in stages. There has to be a plan when investing millions of euros otherwise their is no acceptability, no way of ensuring the money is being well spent and no way of tracking improvements. Why the hell would anyone argue that it's better to give both county A and B €100,000 each if it is quite clear county A use this money well while county B are pissing it away? Would it not make more sense to give more to the county using it well and providing a return on the investment and giving less to county B while telling them if you get your act together you'll get the money back?

Stadiums like Corks have to be done. It's not just GDA's that have Dubl$n where they are.

The aim should be to improve all counties equally, give everyone a fair chance to compete. A strategic programme manager and team should be appointed to every county. They formalise a plan and assess what's needed for the county they're assigned to. They go back to HQ with the report and the cost of implementing it. Obviously some counties will need more money and some less.
This way you'll have accountability, everyone will know where the money is going so it wont and can't be wasted, every county will have proper structures in place to produce talent and increase playing numbers in Gaelic Games and most of all it's FAIR for every county.

[Johnnybegood]

They seem to own the Hill 16 part, at least.

the hill was open to all patrons last Saturday and was pretty full
The hill was open to all patrons the previous Sunday and was pretty empty

[Johnnybegood]

I'm not talking about facilities either. Cork had in the region of €10 million in the bank some of which they could have used to fund more GDA's yet they've decided to use it all on a stadium instead. That's a choice Cork have made but the money was there.

Of course investment in Dublin is about a return and so it should be, no point pissing money away on anybody. If other counties get a plan together, show why they need they money then it is there for them. But they also need to provide a return on this investment which is only right and proper.

Errr no, but by giving everyone the same you'll end up helping few if anyone. The idea is not to leave anyone behind but to build up everyone in stages. There has to be a plan when investing millions of euros otherwise their is no acceptability, no way of ensuring the money is being well spent and no way of tracking improvements. Why the hell would anyone argue that it's better to give both county A and B €100,000 each if it is quite clear county A use this money well while county B are pissing it away? Would it not make more sense to give more to the county using it well and providing a return on the investment and giving less to county B while telling them if you get your act together you'll get the money back?

likewise croke park needed re developement
The rest of your post is your best yet! Good work and good idea.

Stadiums like Corks have to be done. It's not just GDA's that have Dubl$n where they are.

The aim should be to improve all counties equally, give everyone a fair chance to compete. A strategic programme manager and team should be appointed to every county. They formalise a plan and assess what's needed for the county they're assigned to. They go back to HQ with the report and the cost of implementing it. Obviously some counties will need more money and some less.
This way you'll have accountability, everyone will know where the money is going so it wont and can't be wasted, every county will have proper structures in place to produce talent and increase playing numbers in Gaelic Games and most of all it's FAIR for every county.

[Mike Sheehy]

All messing aside, I've never seen any teams fans as confident as Dublin fans are right now. Even if you factor in Dublin fans natural cockiness its absolutely amazing what is going on. There is a Kerry v Mayo thread over on reservoirdubs.com and almost all the responses are in the form of "I'd rather get Mayo/Kerry in the final...". Donegal must be loving this.

[Dont Matter]

do Dublin own croke park?

They haven't played a championship football game away from Croke Park since 2006, all league home games played there, they get to choose their dressing room, which side of the pitch they warm up on, get to train there when others are not allowed, as J70 says they get a whole section of the stadium for their fans only.

[Crete Boom]

do Dublin own croke park?

They haven't played a championship football game away from Croke Park since 2006, all league home games played there, they get to choose their dressing room, which side of the pitch they warm up on, get to train there when others are not allowed, as J70 says they get a whole section of the stadium for their fans only.

In fairness Don't Matter plenty of Mayomen and women went on the Hill for last years final and looking from the Cusack stand it looked split 50/50 with Mayo and Dublin fans. My brother was on the hill and he said it was grand apart form the usual result we get in finals

I think a lot of counties and fans swap their Hill 16 allocation for stand tickets but last year due to money being tight anyone who had no problem standing for a few hours took a Hill ticket gladly.

[macdanger2]

Indiana is 100% right also on the Croke Park was never an advantage for the Dubs a few years ago when Tyrone ( and others) could turn them over in their back yard. The Dubs temperament was questioned continually at the time in throwing away first half leads

A few years ago when they played their league games in Parnell park?? Kinda proves the point that playing there so often is an advantage.

Of course the AI semi finals and final should be played there but giving the younger Dublin players who play during the league Croke Park experience in Feb / Mar has to be an advantage. It's not why they're so successful at the moment but perhaps it's one of the inches that Al pacino talked about....

Only A handful of All Ireland's in the last 30 years alone would argue against your point.

In fact it could be argued the it was a negative, in that younger players hadn't room to develop their full potential due the degree of pressure, media spotlight etc.

Cosgroves missed free kick last kick of the game in front of the Hill, ( 2002 against Armagh- I think) springs to mind.

It seems like you're missing my point entirely.

Since 2010, Dublin have played all their league games (3-4 games) in Croke Park - this is an advantage to them as they (and their younger players in particular) are significantly more familiar with Croke Park than other teams as a result.

If Cosgrave had played all his league games for the previous two seasons in Corke Park, then perhaps that last-minute kick would have been different

[AZOffaly]

The whole Croke park discussion is a different topic. Dublin have always had those advantages, and to be honest I think most Dubs would prefer an auld spin down the country for a couple of provincial games.

I've already said that it's advantageous to have your whole routine down pat all year, every year, for the championship, but that's been the case for many years now and it's not the reason for the current team's success. It may be a contributory factor but it's in the ha'penny place compared to the type of player they are producing from their underage structures and club games, and the preparation that is going into these teams.

The brutal truth is that Dublin would beat at least 26 or 27 counties in Ireland in their own home pitch 10 times out of 10, at the moment.