The ulster rugby trial

Started by caprea, February 01, 2018, 11:45:56 PM

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David McKeown

#2040
Quote from: AZOffaly on March 12, 2018, 04:16:14 PM
If the verdict is guilty, can the accused automatically appeal? And if the verdict is not guilty, does 'double jeopardy'  apply in UK law, or is that limited to the US?

There's no automatic right of appeal, any appeal must be on a point of law. In first instance any appeal would be to a single judge on written arguments who may or may not grant leave. A three judge panel will then hear the arguments and will either grant or refuse leave. If they refus leave that's the end of the matter. If they grant leave they will consider the merits of the appeal and rule accordingly.

From what I've read (usual caveats applying) the prosecution seem to have done a good job of making the defendants look either confused or like liars. There's not much I've read though to make me think they ha e made the complainant version any more believable. For a conviction she has to be believed at least as far as it relates to Jackson, Olding and McIlroy. For an acquittal they don't have to be believed at all.

It will be interesting to see what the Jury decides having heard all of the evidence.
2022 Allianz League Prediction Competition Winner

seafoid

I don't think any of the defendants are credible. Harrison and McIlroy in particular were all over the place.
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

trailer

Quote from: seafoid on March 12, 2018, 04:49:43 PM
I don't think any of the defendants are credible. Harrison and McIlroy in particular were all over the place.

I don't know if McIlroy comes across as an arsehole or (and I genuinely mean this) somewhat aloof with no real cognitive thoughts.

AZOffaly

Quote from: trailer on March 12, 2018, 04:56:33 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 12, 2018, 04:49:43 PM
I don't think any of the defendants are credible. Harrison and McIlroy in particular were all over the place.

I don't know if McIlroy comes across as an arsehole or (and I genuinely mean this) somewhat aloof with no real cognitive thoughts.

A sociopath maybe!

Franko

Quote from: trailer on March 12, 2018, 04:56:33 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 12, 2018, 04:49:43 PM
I don't think any of the defendants are credible. Harrison and McIlroy in particular were all over the place.

I don't know if McIlroy comes across as an arsehole or (and I genuinely mean this) somewhat aloof with no real cognitive thoughts.

Syferus?

trailer

Quote from: Franko on March 12, 2018, 05:03:09 PM
Quote from: trailer on March 12, 2018, 04:56:33 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 12, 2018, 04:49:43 PM
I don't think any of the defendants are credible. Harrison and McIlroy in particular were all over the place.

I don't know if McIlroy comes across as an arsehole or (and I genuinely mean this) somewhat aloof with no real cognitive thoughts.

Syferus?

:o

AQMP

Quote from: seafoid on March 12, 2018, 04:49:43 PM
I don't think any of the defendants are credible. Harrison and McIlroy in particular were all over the place.

Agreed.  Their evidence was pure dung from start to finish.  The only thing they agreed on was to use the word "consensual" as much as possible.  If I was on the jury I'd be thinking, "I can discount all the defendants' evidence...now do I believe the girl?"

seafoid

If I was Harrison I wouldn't back the other 3. He came across as reserved and not the orgy type. Why would he take one for team flute?
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

Therealdonald

Reading the excerpts from Cooney's tweets makes for uncomfortable reading. Is Harrison trying to throw himself under the bus?

Syferus

Quote from: seafoid on March 12, 2018, 06:03:04 PM
If I was Harrison I wouldn't back the other 3. He came across as reserved and not the orgy type. Why would he take one for team flute?

"Bros before hoes"

Why are you expecting anything else from a bunch of entitled meatheads?

Therealdonald

Quote from: Syferus on March 12, 2018, 06:08:28 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 12, 2018, 06:03:04 PM
If I was Harrison I wouldn't back the other 3. He came across as reserved and not the orgy type. Why would he take one for team flute?

"Bros before hoes"

Why are you expecting anything else from a bunch of entitled meatheads?

Syf, did you apply to get into Queen's or something and got rejected?

Hound

Defence has been an absolute joke! Allowing McIlroy and Harrison take the stand was a disaster, and completely predictably so. That's a big disadvantage of having 4 separate defence teams, as they all try and save themselves rather than having a co-ordinated approach. I wondered at the start why McIlroy and Harrison were even charged, but the prosecution knew exactly what they were doing.

Having said all that, I think not guilty is still a strong possibility. Frozen/complying when you've no way out, when it's the least worst option is not only believable, its almost automatic. However, when you've 3 other girls nearby, when there's no violence or threats, when you take off your own top, when one scream would have ended it all, when a rescuer actually comes into the room and you ignore her, I couldn't vote guilty. But I haven't seen every piece of evidence, so will see what the jury comes up with.

Perjury on the other hand, especially for McIlory, I'd vote for that all day long!   

Milltown Row2

Was chatting to the brother in-law who's a solicitor and he was saying by now the jury will have already made their mind up and the arguments at the end wont make a big difference.. for him, having 9 lads on the jury is crazy and they might be aquitted on that..

I think there's more than a reasonable doubt where their guilt is involved, so who knows
None of us are getting out of here alive, so please stop treating yourself like an after thought. Ea

Taylor

As a fireside lawyer and with all the usual caveats after the defence screwed up by putting them on the stand at the moment I think Harrison & McIlroy could get done and the other two get off.

Could change my mind as the verdicts approach but the reasonable doubt could be enough to get PJ & SO off.

brokencrossbar1

I think of all of them McIlroy is most at risk of conviction. His is a stand alone crime in that it's alleged exposure. Harrison's is kinda linked with Jackson and Olding I'm withholding information relating to their 'crimes'.  If they are found not guilty then I think the jury would have to find Harrison not guilty also. Not guaranteed but there's a strong possibility