Author Topic: Arlene's bigotry shines through  (Read 9806 times)

seafoid

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Re: Arlene's bigotry shines through
« Reply #270 on: February 23, 2018, 03:07:42 PM »
Another interesting bit from the article

"The nationalist was the most annoyed and frustrated. He was particularly angry that unionism seemed content to economically withdraw into itself and into the eastern counties of the North.

He vividly described the economic waste land that exists on the western side of a line that stretches from Coleraine, bulging out to encompassing most of Tyrone and reaching the southern most point of Fermanagh. His most insightful description was that on their side of the line they had two airports and two universities.

The other businessman was less colourful but even more interesting. Born into a unionist background and a business that straddled the Border, his thesis was that Irish unionism was on its last legs.

Because of the changing demographics he argued that all that was needed was to convince a small number of unionists that Irish unity was the future. He was adamant that the number of unionists persuadable to that opinion was growing, and that the wrong people to do the persuading was Sinn Féin.

The argument as to who are the right people to do the persuading is for another day in the not too distant future, but the substance of this businessman’s argument is being heard more often in unexpected quarters."

Pretty much bang on.  Though what I would add is that the bit in bold summarises well what's going on here right now.

"Sinn Fein are doing it all wrong" is the cry.

But people are VERY light on answers and actions when it comes to doing it the "correct" way.
The stats in the Paul Gosling link are shocking

1.   Since partition, the economic strength of the north and the south have gone into reverse. In 1920, 80% of Irish industrial output was in and around Belfast, with Belfast the largest city in the island of Ireland.  The economy of the Republic is now four times larger than that of Northern Ireland, with industrial output ten times larger than that of Northern Ireland.
2.   Average full time income per head in the Republic in 2016 was £40,403, compared to £25,999 in Northern Ireland. In other words, a worker in the Republic is typically paid half as much again as someone working in Northern Ireland.
3.   Since the Good Friday Agreement, increased investment has flown to the Republic, rather than to Northern Ireland. Some £312bn of US investment has gone into the Republic since the GFA.
4.   GVA – gross value added – per capita in the Republic in 2014 was €38,100, compared to €22,000 in Northern Ireland, just 57% of that in the south.
5.   The Republic is much more globally and export focused than is Northern Ireland. As of 2015, exports accounted for 39.5% of Irish economic output, twice the level of Northern Ireland.
6.   The Republic is Northern Ireland’s main export market, accounting for 31% of international exports – a market likely to contract significantly following Brexit.
7.   The economic performance gap between the Republic and Northern Ireland is widening. According to the latest Economic Eye study from accountancy firm EY, economic growth last year in the Republic was 4.9% and in Northern Ireland it was 1.4%.
8.   The Republic is expected to increase its employment level, while Northern Ireland is predicted to lose jobs. EY predicts that the Republic will generate an additional 91,000 jobs by 2020 compared to 2016, whereas Northern Ireland will lose 3,500 jobs.

It is not shocking at all, I regularly journey across the border and the difference in economic prosperity is fairly evident. The difference in wages between north and south is striking and the amount of tradesmen making the daily commute to Dublin from the north is huge. There must be no tradesmen in the south.

Even something as simple as infrastructure and roads, it is fairly shocking how the pendulum has swung firmly in favour of the south in the last 15/20 years. The north economically has massive potential upon reunification particularly along the east coast, but it is being completely stifled by the inability of entrenched unionists to see beyond a flag.

One thing about the South is stability. The Troubles are still wreaking havoc in the North in terms of economic output. So many business connections were lost. 30 years of experience missed out on.

I was in Lebanon after the civil war ended. Before the war it had been the main economic centre in the Arab world. The hotels all had photos of film stars from the 50s and 60s . By the time the war ended Dubai had become the banking hub. Beirut will never regain what it lost.

Unionism is such a shortsighted ideology.
"you can try and intimidate us, but f**k youse, we're going to win an All-Ireland anyway"

ziggysego

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Re: Arlene's bigotry shines through
« Reply #271 on: February 23, 2018, 04:59:50 PM »
Wee Jeffery got some roasting on The View last night. A joy to watch.
" a roasting " ?
Leave the rugby trial out of it

Don't be disgusting!! 😠
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smelmoth

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Re: Arlene's bigotry shines through
« Reply #272 on: February 23, 2018, 06:28:53 PM »
Arlene speaks today
We were not contemplating bringing in an Irish language act and I could not be clearer in relation to that. If you look at the so-called draft agreement that is only one of a number of documents that were circulated and put out and about, and I think the important thing is that we now reflect on where we got to in relation to all of those issues, we have a budget put in place, I think that is important for the people of Northern Ireland and that we move forward.
Move forward! !!!
DUPUDA? ?
Maybe to 1697 perhaps  >:(

Doesn't really matter, she's an irrelevance, a mediocre solicitor from the sticks way out of her league with no discernible role now that Stormont is finito. If she doesn't throw the towel in, the findings of the RHI Inquiry will in all likelihood finish her, such was her ineptitude in the handling of that farce from the very start (not to mention the benefits accrued from it by members of her family in Fermanagh). As I said before, Brexit and demographics will sort the rest out for the Irish people of the putrid statelet ... tick tock, tick tock

If uk leave with a deal that impacts negatively on the 2 way trade between U.K. And RoI and RoI then also leave will that hasten a united ireland?

Demographics?? If this is based on percentage of the population identifying as from the catholic community times the percentage who want a UI times the percentage that will actually vote for it where are you getting data from that makes you think this is a simple matter of tick tock?

As for DUP they are a sorry bunch. The party contains many unsavoury candidates. Their support many more. But there is a gravitational pull towards their electoral success. Not all their voters share all of their unpleasant views and most would have no truck with UDA. The party are beholden to a scary right wing. It looks to me that will split unless in unearths a Paisley-like demagogue. Not said with relish

seafoid

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Re: Arlene's bigotry shines through
« Reply #273 on: February 23, 2018, 06:44:04 PM »
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/feb/23/good-friday-agreement-irish-brexit-northern-ireland

..last week’s attack on the agreement by a trio of Brexiteers is a development worth unpicking. On 15 February, the Irish historian Ruth Dudley Edwards wrote a Daily Telegraph article on the 13-month impasse at Stormont that concluded: “Realists believe the [deal] has served its purpose and run its course, leaving behind the unintended consequence of enshrining sectarianism in the political process.”
The following day the Tory MP Owen Paterson, a former Northern Ireland secretary, tweeted a link to the piece with a comment: “The collapse of power-sharing in Northern Ireland shows the Good Friday agreement has outlived its use.” Last Saturday the Tory MEP Daniel Hannan wrote, again in the Telegraph, that the agreement was “often spoken about in quasi-religious terms … but its flaws have become clearer over time”. Finally, two days later, the Labour MP Kate Hoey told the Huffington Post that she thought the agreement needed “a cold, rational look”, and that the power-sharing Northern Ireland executive it mandated was “not sustainable in the long term”.
The condemnation of Paterson, Hannan and Hoey has been fierce: this week Hoey told the Northern Ireland affairs select committee that finding fault with the Good Friday agreement was “as if you’re saying you want to kill all babies at birth”. In their defence, all three could argue their criticism was directed at Stormont’s failure rather than the agreement’s international aspects, such as cross-border trade and cooperation. But their long-held position on Brexit – Hannan was one of its chief architects – suggests a different motive: “If the Belfast agreement must die so that the glorious ideal of Brexit may live, so be it,” to quote Fintan O’Toole in today’s Irish Times about this “cynical and reckless” exercise.
"you can try and intimidate us, but f**k youse, we're going to win an All-Ireland anyway"

red hander

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Re: Arlene's bigotry shines through
« Reply #274 on: February 23, 2018, 07:00:54 PM »
Arlene speaks today
We were not contemplating bringing in an Irish language act and I could not be clearer in relation to that. If you look at the so-called draft agreement that is only one of a number of documents that were circulated and put out and about, and I think the important thing is that we now reflect on where we got to in relation to all of those issues, we have a budget put in place, I think that is important for the people of Northern Ireland and that we move forward.
Move forward! !!!
DUPUDA? ?
Maybe to 1697 perhaps  >:(

Doesn't really matter, she's an irrelevance, a mediocre solicitor from the sticks way out of her league with no discernible role now that Stormont is finito. If she doesn't throw the towel in, the findings of the RHI Inquiry will in all likelihood finish her, such was her ineptitude in the handling of that farce from the very start (not to mention the benefits accrued from it by members of her family in Fermanagh). As I said before, Brexit and demographics will sort the rest out for the Irish people of the putrid statelet ... tick tock, tick tock

If uk leave with a deal that impacts negatively on the 2 way trade between U.K. And RoI and RoI then also leave will that hasten a united ireland?

Demographics?? If this is based on percentage of the population identifying as from the catholic community times the percentage who want a UI times the percentage that will actually vote for it where are you getting data from that makes you think this is a simple matter of tick tock?

As for DUP they are a sorry bunch. The party contains many unsavoury candidates. Their support many more. But there is a gravitational pull towards their electoral success. Not all their voters share all of their unpleasant views and most would have no truck with UDA. The party are beholden to a scary right wing. It looks to me that will split unless in unearths a Paisley-like demagogue. Not said with relish

There is little chance of the Republic leaving the EU under any Brexit scenario, IMO. I believe the Tories will throw the DUP under the bus to get an advantageous deal, and as the EU has already indicated, that would involve the putrid statelet staying in customs union/single market, i.e special status and a border down Irish Sea. What are the DUP going to do? Pull the plug? That will let in Corbyn, who'd happily hand them their arses.

The demographics will not just be a sectarian headcount, Brexit has ensured that. Economics plays a part with a section of unionists as it does with castle Catholics, and if they think they'll be better off in a UI then they'll be more likely to back that. There's also the hardened attitude of the nationalist crocodiles sick to the back teeth of being treated with disdain by the DUP (thieving Planters) in their own land and now more likely to express their anger at the ballot box.

Wouldn't at all be surprised if the DUP splits, sure hasn't it got arch splitters like Foster and Donaldson in its ranks?

Rossfan

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Re: Arlene's bigotry shines through
« Reply #275 on: February 23, 2018, 07:07:42 PM »
I think ye can all take it as read that the "RoI" won't be leaving the EU.
John Waters and a bunch of rightist extremists invited Farage to an "Irexit" event.
Apart from them nobody else interested in leaving the EU.
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armaghniac

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Re: Arlene's bigotry shines through
« Reply #276 on: February 23, 2018, 07:13:04 PM »
Demographics?? If this is based on percentage of the population identifying as from the catholic community times the percentage who want a UI times the percentage that will actually vote for it where are you getting data from that makes you think this is a simple matter of tick tock?

it isn't a simple matter of tick tock, you still have to put forward your case, but you at least have people listening to you. The problem is that the issue will then revolve around things like economics, matters on which SF have no credibility.

if at first you don't succeed, then goto Plan B

seafoid

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Re: Arlene's bigotry shines through
« Reply #277 on: February 23, 2018, 08:21:06 PM »
Demographics?? If this is based on percentage of the population identifying as from the catholic community times the percentage who want a UI times the percentage that will actually vote for it where are you getting data from that makes you think this is a simple matter of tick tock?

it isn't a simple matter of tick tock, you still have to put forward your case, but you at least have people listening to you. The problem is that the issue will then revolve around things like economics, matters on which SF have no credibility.
The UK is an awful mess. the Brexit crowd do not care how much damage their pet project does and they do not care about NI. we are in real uncharted territory. It is very like  100 years ago. Anything can happen.
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smelmoth

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Re: Arlene's bigotry shines through
« Reply #278 on: February 23, 2018, 09:26:43 PM »
I think ye can all take it as read that the "RoI" won't be leaving the EU.
John Waters and a bunch of rightist extremists invited Farage to an "Irexit" event.
Apart from them nobody else interested in leaving the EU.

You can take it as read that RoI doesn't want Uk to leave the EU.

Once it does leave then we have get practicalities. The level of trade with UK and the level of intermediate products traded with U.K. that are part of the supply chain for traded products with EU and ROTW will create practical difficulties

Owen Brannigan

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Re: Arlene's bigotry shines through
« Reply #279 on: February 23, 2018, 09:28:08 PM »
Foster got a roasting from Mrs Paisley who still carries a fair sway with the Church wing of the DUP:

“If you are a minister and someone in your department is wrong, the buck stops at your desk,” said Baroness Paisley.
“You have got to do what is right and stand down from your position until the matter is sorted out,” she told BBC Radio Foyle.


She said the DUP was as much to blame as Sinn Féin for the current impasse.

Asked if she included the DUP in people not facing up to the truth, she said: “That’s right. They’re hiding from the truth. And you must be absolutely honest with one another because there’s only one way to be honest when you’ve made a mistake and it’s to confess your sin and confess your mistakes because no one is perfect.

“If that had been done at the beginning, there would have been a very different situation than the one we are in at the minute. We would not be in the mess we are in,” she added.


https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/baroness-paisley-my-husband-would-not-have-created-this-mess-1.3402512

armaghniac

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Re: Arlene's bigotry shines through
« Reply #280 on: February 23, 2018, 09:37:18 PM »
Foster got a roasting from Mrs Paisley who still carries a fair sway with the Church wing of the DUP:

“If you are a minister and someone in your department is wrong, the buck stops at your desk,” said Baroness Paisley.
“You have got to do what is right and stand down from your position until the matter is sorted out,” she told BBC Radio Foyle.


She said the DUP was as much to blame as Sinn Féin for the current impasse.

Asked if she included the DUP in people not facing up to the truth, she said: “That’s right. They’re hiding from the truth. And you must be absolutely honest with one another because there’s only one way to be honest when you’ve made a mistake and it’s to confess your sin and confess your mistakes because no one is perfect.

“If that had been done at the beginning, there would have been a very different situation than the one we are in at the minute. We would not be in the mess we are in,” she added.


https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/baroness-paisley-my-husband-would-not-have-created-this-mess-1.3402512

I heard her interviewed on RTÉ radio this morning, I hope that in 30 years time that I am as well able to state my case.
if at first you don't succeed, then goto Plan B

Avondhu star

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Re: Arlene's bigotry shines through
« Reply #281 on: February 23, 2018, 10:33:09 PM »
Wee Jeffery got some roasting on The View last night. A joy to watch.
" a roasting " ?
Leave the rugby trial out of it

Don't be disgusting!! 😠

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