Monaghan v Tyrone - Sunday 15th June - St Tiernach's Park Clones

[tc_manchester]

Agree with most of my fellow Tyrone posters on here, and I've been saying it for a number of seasons, but I think it's time for change at the top. The football we are playing is far from pleasing on the eye, and would be acceptable, bar the fact it's also very ineffectual.

A few weeks ago, when the Tyrone Co Board announced Club Championship fixtures, there was 6 or 7 of the County panel who expressed their anger on social media. I feel that behind the scenes there appears to be a lack of unity between the players, the CB, Harte and the Clubs. In fact I don't fell it's that far behind the scenes.

At the minute you don't get this over arching feeling that we're all in this together and this is very reflective on the chemistry on the field.

The easy thing for me to say, is that we need a change of management, however I am aware that there are probably not too many alternates out there. One of the obvious candidates for me though was on the opposition bench yesterday.

the problem is that there are no suitable candidates within tyrone and the county board will never go for an outside manager.
it's a very conservative attitude to have and will prove quite costly in the long run.

John Donnelly from Fermanagh managed the county team. If the criteria is that the manager lives/works in the county the MOR would qualify ok

[timmyot501]

Great win yesterday for Monaghan.  Nearly let it slip but luckily Tyrone missed the late free.  Thought all the backs played well. Clerkin and Hughes did well in midfield and dispite some forwards not being up to scratch we just about got enough scores.  Can't afford to miss as much in future games though.

[DennistheMenace]

Monaghan's 3 best players in order - Kelly, Wylie and Mone. Absolutely superb and willing to do the dirty work and all contributed going forward and linking defence to attack. Monaghan were maybe a 7/10 in that game overall and have vast room for improvement which can only be a good thing.

Tyrone battled well as they always do and have a fierce determination inbred in them but sadly for them quality was lacking. Their full forward line was so ineffective (bar McCurry) it's sad to see the decline of Stephen O'Neill who was once an absolutely superb player. Just doesn't have the legs therefore ball winning ability is lacking. Mickey got it wrong in a few areas I thought.

Donegal v Monaghan final I think.

[clarshack]

Agree with most of my fellow Tyrone posters on here, and I've been saying it for a number of seasons, but I think it's time for change at the top. The football we are playing is far from pleasing on the eye, and would be acceptable, bar the fact it's also very ineffectual.

A few weeks ago, when the Tyrone Co Board announced Club Championship fixtures, there was 6 or 7 of the County panel who expressed their anger on social media. I feel that behind the scenes there appears to be a lack of unity between the players, the CB, Harte and the Clubs. In fact I don't fell it's that far behind the scenes.

At the minute you don't get this over arching feeling that we're all in this together and this is very reflective on the chemistry on the field.

The easy thing for me to say, is that we need a change of management, however I am aware that there are probably not too many alternates out there. One of the obvious candidates for me though was on the opposition bench yesterday.

the problem is that there are no suitable candidates within tyrone and the county board will never go for an outside manager.
it's a very conservative attitude to have and will prove quite costly in the long run.

John Donnelly from Fermanagh managed the county team. If the criteria is that the manager lives/works in the county the MOR would qualify ok

fair enough. MOR would be a good choice.

[Fuzzman]

It's bad when we're getting sympathy from Jinxy. 

As I said last night congrats to Monaghan and ye should have won by far more.
Tyrone are definitely a second tier team now and will be unless we change a lot about ourselves which I can't see happening.

TBH, I thought Monaghan weren't great either but it was there first day out this year after weeks off. I think Hughes is a great forward and McManus will get a lot better now if he has no setbacks. besides them two though their forwards are nothing special and I would worry Donegal could beat ye if McFadden can get back to where he was.

I too was disappointed in their players and fans after the game but I suppose they have suffered a lot under us and so it was huge relief for them. Horse Devlin does annoy other teams players when he goes on sledging and shouldering lads and there is no need for it. Looks bad.

Where I was sitting Dessie Mone's whole family were in front of me including kids and lets just say they were far from gracious winners. They were booing our frees and clapping our wides whereas we were actually applauding when Monaghan kicked very good points the odd time.

I shook their hand at the end which I think they weren't too sure how to react but you could see the relief on their faces. They thought they'd blown it again so I can excuse their bad winning mentality

As I said earlier in the year I think Mickey has lost the run of himself and continues to make wrong calls. I am NOT calling for his head as we owe him a lot more than he owes us. To start my club mate Stevie and then to leave him in at FF for long periods just shows how he's lost his ruthlessness or lack of vision of how the game is going. Surely throwing big Sean, Mattie or even Joey in at 14 would have caused panic. Wylie played well and is a great player but he wasn't exactly challenged too often. The ball into the FF line was often poor and with Stephens now lack of pace it was food and drink for Wylie all day.

Mickey has become more and more frustrated I think the last few years. Not having the players he used to have. Not having enough leaders or players with the fight and balls to make it happen. Yes there should have been at least 5 mins injury time but Mickey 5-10 years ago would never have reacted like that and would have been taken defeat graciously. He said a few weeks ago that he wants to stay on for another few years and it's a great job he has so I am not expecting him to leave any time soon. I think for a lot of fans though we don't enjoy watching Tyrone play any more which is sad. Maybe the back door will allow the young lads develop and so he'll stop playing the older lads. Mattie Donnelly was immense yesterday and I would like to see McCurry getting better ball into him and I think McAliskey looked sharp.
I heard Coney was playing very well at MF for his club but I suppose it's very different to intercounty level

I enjoyed the day out yesterday and the craic in the car up and down. Yes I was disappointed but Monaghan deserved their win and God knows they've put up listening to us for long enough and being the bridesmaids. We met Banty in his pub after the game and the craic was great there.

I was however annoyed (AGAIN) with RTE TSG last night and this ever growing anti Tyrone feeling. I usually like Whelan but there was very much a biased attitude of "Devil rub it into them" and he even said what's good for the goose if good for the gander. That is not very balanced analysis imho and to be digging up video's from previous years to counter argue that the ref was justified to not add on more time was just childish.
Also I laughed at how many of ye on here said that the ref was right not to add on more time as Morgan was taking so long to take his frees. So does that mean then that if Tyrone were leading then you would change your tune and say he should add on 10 mins as Morgan was taking so long with his frees. I actually did laugh out loud when I read that.

Ahh well. I had a good father's day when I eventually got home.

[orangeman]

Colm Keys' take on the game - http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/harte-fury-as-tyrone-edged-out-30356657.html

Did Tyrone foul that much in the first half in particular ?.

Harte's assistant Tony Donnelly suggested afterwards that his manager's ire was over the amount of time added on at the end and the fact that the end was signalled just after Tyrone had won a throw-in. Their belief was that play should have been allowed to continue.The free count against Tyrone was 26-17, 14-6 in the first half when they seemed to have a couple of 'stonewall' decisions from good positions go against them.

[Nally Stand]

Hopefully RTE take their key analyst Tommy Carr to task then. He thought the Hughes incident was a blatant black card. After multiple replays he decided that Hughes "took one for the team" yet later his colleagues decide that Sean dived. I didn't see the Sunday Game but did they highlight how easily the lad went over for the penalty?

Clutching at straws.

It really is. I don't see how you can compare a penalty being given after clear contact with a player pulling another down with him to win a free. If your main defence is quoting Tommy Carr then it's not a very strong one to be fair.

I think the lad went down very easily - is that not a dive to achieve an advantage? There was clear contact between Hughes and Cavanagh. Why was Hughes' arm over the top of Sean's shoulder? My quote of Tommy Carr is more a dig at the analysis on RTE. They have experts looking at the same incident and they arrive at completely polar apart conclusions.

Crucially, the "experts" who had time to view the incident several times - and that's both Brolly and Spillane, and O'Se and Whelan - all reached the same conclusion.

And I haven't heard ANYONE else question the penalty decision.

Maguire the penalty decision was a farce. A textbook dive. A fair and legal tackle went in and he dropped like a stone. The reason no fuss had been made about that is firstly, because it wasn't scored, and secondly because Joe Brolly never mentioned it and if the last few pages of this thread (and several other threads) shows, most lads desperately need Joe to tell them what to think and then they'll blindly repeat him ad nauseum.

You clearly don't know how Joe Brolly is perceived in Monaghan with a comment like that. 

You are being completely biased, which is understandable, but it was a stonewall penalty. As to whether is was deliberate/intentional/clumsy/accidental (i.e. a black or yellow) is debatable within the confusion surrounding the application of cards, but it was definitely a penalty.

I'm not just talking about Monaghan folk. The threads from last two Tyrone games have been polluted by people endlessly rehashing whatever Joe Brolly told them to think. As for the penalty, it wasn't scored so not exactly vital, but I defy you to take another look at it and then still try to tell yourself it was a "stonewall penalty". The man dropped to the ground like a stone but that's as near as it got to "stonewall". But sure as I say, unless Joe Brolly says so too....

[Tubberman]

Hopefully RTE take their key analyst Tommy Carr to task then. He thought the Hughes incident was a blatant black card. After multiple replays he decided that Hughes "took one for the team" yet later his colleagues decide that Sean dived. I didn't see the Sunday Game but did they highlight how easily the lad went over for the penalty?

Clutching at straws.

It really is. I don't see how you can compare a penalty being given after clear contact with a player pulling another down with him to win a free. If your main defence is quoting Tommy Carr then it's not a very strong one to be fair.

I think the lad went down very easily - is that not a dive to achieve an advantage? There was clear contact between Hughes and Cavanagh. Why was Hughes' arm over the top of Sean's shoulder? My quote of Tommy Carr is more a dig at the analysis on RTE. They have experts looking at the same incident and they arrive at completely polar apart conclusions.

Crucially, the "experts" who had time to view the incident several times - and that's both Brolly and Spillane, and O'Se and Whelan - all reached the same conclusion.

And I haven't heard ANYONE else question the penalty decision.

Maguire the penalty decision was a farce. A textbook dive. A fair and legal tackle went in and he dropped like a stone. The reason no fuss had been made about that is firstly, because it wasn't scored, and secondly because Joe Brolly never mentioned it and if the last few pages of this thread (and several other threads) shows, most lads desperately need Joe to tell them what to think and then they'll blindly repeat him ad nauseum.

You clearly don't know how Joe Brolly is perceived in Monaghan with a comment like that. 

You are being completely biased, which is understandable, but it was a stonewall penalty. As to whether is was deliberate/intentional/clumsy/accidental (i.e. a black or yellow) is debatable within the confusion surrounding the application of cards, but it was definitely a penalty.

I'm not just talking about Monaghan folk. The threads from last two Tyrone games have been polluted by people endlessly rehashing whatever Joe Brolly told them to think. As for the penalty, it wasn't scored so not exactly vital, but I defy you to take another look at it and then still try to tell yourself it was a "stonewall penalty". The man dropped to the ground like a stone but that's as near as it got to "stonewall". But sure as I say, unless Joe Brolly says so too....

I'm one of the non-Monaghan folk and if you look at when I posted, it was before the end of the game, so I'm capable of forming an opinion without waiting for Brolly to do it for me.

[imtommygunn]

The Cavanagh stuff doesn't have to come from Brolly. I don't listen to Brolly. Watched a bit of him last week and won't be watching again in a hurry. It's plain for everyone to see and it's getting worse by the year.

The Sunday game thing on time wasting was actually pathetic though. I do think there is an element of two fingers up to Tyrone for not engaging with RTE and it is weak. Whelan also let himself down with that.

[Main Street]

It's bad when we're getting sympathy from Jinxy. 

As I said last night congrats to Monaghan and ye should have won by far more.
Tyrone are definitely a second tier team now and will be unless we change a lot about ourselves which I can't see happening.

TBH, I thought Monaghan weren't great either but it was there first day out this year after weeks off. I think Hughes is a great forward and McManus will get a lot better now if he has no setbacks. besides them two though their forwards are nothing special and I would worry Donegal could beat ye if McFadden can get back to where he was.

I too was disappointed in their players and fans after the game but I suppose they have suffered a lot under us and so it was huge relief for them. Horse Devlin does annoy other teams players when he goes on sledging and shouldering lads and there is no need for it. Looks bad.

Where I was sitting Dessie Mone's whole family were in front of me including kids and lets just say they were far from gracious winners. They were booing our frees and clapping our wides whereas we were actually applauding when Monaghan kicked very good points the odd time.

I shook their hand at the end which I think they weren't too sure how to react but you could see the relief on their faces. They thought they'd blown it again so I can excuse their bad winning mentality

As I said earlier in the year I think Mickey has lost the run of himself and continues to make wrong calls. I am NOT calling for his head as we owe him a lot more than he owes us. To start my club mate Stevie and then to leave him in at FF for long periods just shows how he's lost his ruthlessness or lack of vision of how the game is going. Surely throwing big Sean, Mattie or even Joey in at 14 would have caused panic. Wylie played well and is a great player but he wasn't exactly challenged too often. The ball into the FF line was often poor and with Stephens now lack of pace it was food and drink for Wylie all day.

Mickey has become more and more frustrated I think the last few years. Not having the players he used to have. Not having enough leaders or players with the fight and balls to make it happen. Yes there should have been at least 5 mins injury time but Mickey 5-10 years ago would never have reacted like that and would have been taken defeat graciously. He said a few weeks ago that he wants to stay on for another few years and it's a great job he has so I am not expecting him to leave any time soon. I think for a lot of fans though we don't enjoy watching Tyrone play any more which is sad. Maybe the back door will allow the young lads develop and so he'll stop playing the older lads. Mattie Donnelly was immense yesterday and I would like to see McCurry getting better ball into him and I think McAliskey looked sharp.
I heard Coney was playing very well at MF for his club but I suppose it's very different to intercounty level

I enjoyed the day out yesterday and the craic in the car up and down. Yes I was disappointed but Monaghan deserved their win and God knows they've put up listening to us for long enough and being the bridesmaids. We met Banty in his pub after the game and the craic was great there.

I was however annoyed (AGAIN) with RTE TSG last night and this ever growing anti Tyrone feeling. I usually like Whelan but there was very much a biased attitude of "Devil rub it into them" and he even said what's good for the goose if good for the gander. That is not very balanced analysis imho and to be digging up video's from previous years to counter argue that the ref was justified to not add on more time was just childish.
Also I laughed at how many of ye on here said that the ref was right not to add on more time as Morgan was taking so long to take his frees. So does that mean then that if Tyrone were leading then you would change your tune and say he should add on 10 mins as Morgan was taking so long with his frees. I actually did laugh out loud when I read that.

Ahh well. I had a good father's day when I eventually got home.

Thank you Fuzzman for your self-aggrandising account of your exemplary display of sportsmanship, in contrast to the heathens around you.
Just how you managed to stay above the pettiness of tribal rivalry (no doubt being on a high horse helped) and applaud the point scoring by the opposition was astonishing and by your own account just  how you could look those heathens  straight in the eye and congratulate them with an offered handshake after the game. Possibly they were a wee bit suspicious that they might be dragged to the ground.


I don't know about the validity of just adding 2 minutes at the end, but rightly or wrongly this is how it is frustratingly done in most every game I have seen.
In context of most every other game in the GAA world, 2 minutes was appropriate.

Re the late free,  Tyrone used up 1 minute missing that free knowing they only had 2 minutes. Tyrone gambled all  on converting the free and leaving no time for Monaghan to get up the field and score a point.

[BennyHarp]

Agree with most of my fellow Tyrone posters on here, and I've been saying it for a number of seasons, but I think it's time for change at the top. The football we are playing is far from pleasing on the eye, and would be acceptable, bar the fact it's also very ineffectual.

A few weeks ago, when the Tyrone Co Board announced Club Championship fixtures, there was 6 or 7 of the County panel who expressed their anger on social media. I feel that behind the scenes there appears to be a lack of unity between the players, the CB, Harte and the Clubs. In fact I don't fell it's that far behind the scenes.

At the minute you don't get this over arching feeling that we're all in this together and this is very reflective on the chemistry on the field.

The easy thing for me to say, is that we need a change of management, however I am aware that there are probably not too many alternates out there. One of the obvious candidates for me though was on the opposition bench yesterday.

the problem is that there are no suitable candidates within tyrone and the county board will never go for an outside manager.
it's a very conservative attitude to have and will prove quite costly in the long run.

John Donnelly from Fermanagh managed the county team. If the criteria is that the manager lives/works in the county the MOR would qualify ok

I suppose that was the similar position to John Donnelly, didn't he play for Trillick and managed the Clarkes at one point.

[WT4E]

One of the obvious candidates for me though was on the opposition bench yesterday.

MOR? What about PTG?

Meh. Peter to me lacks a bit of charisma based on his punditry levels, and he hardly inspired at Fermanagh.

Horse Devlin would be a good selection for next manager

[The Bearded One]

There was a bit of agro at half time in Gerry Arthurs stand, not sure what sparked it but a Monaghan man seemed to lose the head badly with his Tyrone neighbours. He had a rant, made his way out of his seat then came back again. At this stage there was quite an audience.

Another Monaghan (MN2) got involved, started roaring the Tyrone man to 'mind his language, there are children sitting here'.

Another muttered comment from Tyrone man and MN2 shouts again, 'mind your language, there a f*cking children sitting here beside me'. Oh the irony!

Stewards kept an eye on them after half time but thankfully nothing happened after that.

[sheamy]

Conor Clarke in 'Christ the Redeemer' pose.

[Main Street]

Conor Clarke in 'Christ the Redeemer' pose.

Hughes should have aimed for the redeemer's jewels.