Hello all. Recently my daughter starter Irish dancing. It was innocent enough to start with but I am becoming very uncomfortable with it. My Mrs doesn't agree! These are my concerns, interested to hear from others in a similar situation on what they did. My daughter is 10 yrs old.
1- Kids from 4 yrs old competing as in there are winners and losers. Seems to me it should be about enjoyment at that age. Other sports are non competitive under 10.
2 - Fake tan and wigs. Sexualising small children in my opinion. Apparently you get marked down if you do not conform.
3- Feiseanna are some of the most disorganised shambles of events I've ever encountered. Last one my daughter arrived home at 1am, she was gone since 2pm to an event 1 hr from our house.
4- It's all about money. 1000 euro dresses (marked down if you don't wear at certain grades), expensive to enter, allow people to walk of the street and register to fill the coffers, that's why it's so disorganised, place full of people selling crap.
5- Medals for all. Huge trophies and medals. It's like chocolate for kids keeps them coming back.
6- Psycho Mammies. They'd whinge about their kids being out in the rain for an hour's football, or having to support a local football club but all the above is ok.
7- What's any of this doing to support the culture of traditional Irish dancing
I'm hoping someone will come on here and tell me I'm totally wrong and why.
You are right! pulled our girl from it after a year. Sadly a money racket at every level.
The whole fake tan and dresses and hairdos are silly and hate that if soneone wamts to compete at a high level, they have to conform with this bull.
If your child is enjoying the lessons, go for it. If her teacher is entering her into all these féis', maybe a quiet word in her ear,
On a different note, american football may increase it's popularity.
https://www.rte.ie/entertainment/2017/1013/912283-alex-collins-baltimore-ravens-irish-dancing/
Start an alternative tan-free, not money driven organisation for people who are in it for the dancing/culture rather than the competition/fashion/money?
Get them to go Sean Nós
My daughter started a couple of months ago as well. She loves it so far, like yourself I'm a bit concerned with some of the shenanigans that goes with it.Anything to keep the two women in my life happy 😊
My daughter goes to festival dancing. Different from feis. No wigs and much plainer dresses. No makeup till they reach 12 and even then it is frowned upon. Dresses are much cheaper and there are a lot of 'hand me downs ' within the Schools. It is competitive but the youngest age group is 8s. I always thought there'd be a great parody kinda like the Blades of Glory type movie!!
Quote from: Hardy on December 03, 2017, 12:35:01 PM
Start an alternative tan-free, not money driven organisation for people who are in it for the dancing/culture rather than the competition/fashion/money?
Great idea except i would have to know something about dancing and I dont.
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on December 03, 2017, 12:38:11 PM
My daughter goes to festival dancing. Different from feis. No wigs and much plainer dresses. No makeup till they reach 12 and even then it is frowned upon. Dresses are much cheaper and there are a lot of 'hand me downs ' within the Schools. It is competitive but the youngest age group is 8s. I always thought there'd be a great parody kinda like the Blades of Glory type movie!!
Always thought that festivals were for one community and feis for the other, e.g. Tyrone Feis v Portadown festival, is this not the case?
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on December 03, 2017, 12:38:11 PM
My daughter goes to festival dancing. Different from feis. No wigs and much plainer dresses. No makeup till they reach 12 and even then it is frowned upon. Dresses are much cheaper and there are a lot of 'hand me downs ' within the Schools. It is competitive but the youngest age group is 8s. I always thought there'd be a great parody kinda like the Blades of Glory type movie!!
Do you have a link the website of the organisation that arranges that festival dancing? I've no problem with the dancing itself, it's the other shite I'm worried about.
Quote from: FL/MAYO on December 03, 2017, 12:36:02 PM
My daughter started a couple of months ago as well. She loves it so far, like yourself I'm a bit concerned with some of the shenanigans that goes with it.Anything to keep the two women in my life happy 😊
For how long will she be happy. She can't keep winning and winning. What then?
Quote from: Itchy on December 03, 2017, 10:46:12 AM
Hello all. Recently my daughter starter Irish dancing. It was innocent enough to start with but I am becoming very uncomfortable with it. My Mrs doesn't agree! These are my concerns, interested to hear from others in a similar situation on what they did. My daughter is 10 yrs old.
1- Kids from 4 yrs old competing as in there are winners and losers. Seems to me it should be about enjoyment at that age. Other sports are non competitive under 10.
2 - Fake tan and wigs. Sexualising small children in my opinion. Apparently you get marked down if you do not conform.
3- Feiseanna are some of the most disorganised shambles of events I've ever encountered. Last one my daughter arrived home at 1am, she was gone since 2pm to an event 1 hr from our house.
4- It's all about money. 1000 euro dresses (marked down if you don't wear at certain grades), expensive to enter, allow people to walk of the street and register to fill the coffers, that's why it's so disorganised, place full of people selling crap.
5- Medals for all. Huge trophies and medals. It's like chocolate for kids keeps them coming back.
6- Psycho Mammies. They'd whinge about their kids being out in the rain for an hour's football, or having to support a local football club but all the above is ok.
7- What's any of this doing to support the culture of traditional Irish dancing
I'm hoping someone will come on here and tell me I'm totally wrong and why.
Are you sure the money problem isn't a normal Cavan issue? :)
Quote from: Owen Brannigan on December 03, 2017, 01:05:19 PM
Quote from: Itchy on December 03, 2017, 10:46:12 AM
Hello all. Recently my daughter starter Irish dancing. It was innocent enough to start with but I am becoming very uncomfortable with it. My Mrs doesn't agree! These are my concerns, interested to hear from others in a similar situation on what they did. My daughter is 10 yrs old.
1- Kids from 4 yrs old competing as in there are winners and losers. Seems to me it should be about enjoyment at that age. Other sports are non competitive under 10.
2 - Fake tan and wigs. Sexualising small children in my opinion. Apparently you get marked down if you do not conform.
3- Feiseanna are some of the most disorganised shambles of events I've ever encountered. Last one my daughter arrived home at 1am, she was gone since 2pm to an event 1 hr from our house.
4- It's all about money. 1000 euro dresses (marked down if you don't wear at certain grades), expensive to enter, allow people to walk of the street and register to fill the coffers, that's why it's so disorganised, place full of people selling crap.
5- Medals for all. Huge trophies and medals. It's like chocolate for kids keeps them coming back.
6- Psycho Mammies. They'd whinge about their kids being out in the rain for an hour's football, or having to support a local football club but all the above is ok.
7- What's any of this doing to support the culture of traditional Irish dancing
I'm hoping someone will come on here and tell me I'm totally wrong and why.
Are you sure the money problem isn't a normal Cavan issue? :)
When I wrote my opening post I did so with a realisation a comic genius would surely be along soon to mock it.
Quote from: Itchy on December 03, 2017, 01:03:24 PM
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on December 03, 2017, 12:38:11 PM
My daughter goes to festival dancing. Different from feis. No wigs and much plainer dresses. No makeup till they reach 12 and even then it is frowned upon. Dresses are much cheaper and there are a lot of 'hand me downs ' within the Schools. It is competitive but the youngest age group is 8s. I always thought there'd be a great parody kinda like the Blades of Glory type movie!!
Do you have a link the website of the organisation that arranges that festival dancing? I've no problem with the dancing itself, it's the other shite I'm worried about.
http://www.fdta.net
Only number 2 is different from when I did it 25 years ago. Wigs probably better for the hair than the bendy rollers used previously.
So you could say it hasn't succumbed to the PC requirement to give everyone a prize.
Oh - feiseanna were conducted below a fog of smoke and without iPads to entertain children, so arguably it is in a better state than 25 years ago ;D
My sister in law has spent a minor fortune on Irish Dancing. I used to like the whole romance of it and the Irishness of it. But jez, the constant cost and time! Weekends, Days, evenings and late nights eaten up with it. And for what - a Plastic Cup or a €2 medal?
The better you get the more money it costs you. Extra lessons, Hotels, Dresses, Entry fee costs. I felt bad turning my back on it. But it was one of the wisest decisions. There is a lack of comradely, as everyone is competing against each other. Time and money we saved is was invested on Music (learning a instrument(s)), Sport (Football, Soccer and Hurling) and Leisure time (going to the beach, day excursions, etc).
Money better spent!
Footnote: I also noticed that ''Good looking'' Girls tended to win over the more plain Janes. I have two nieces who fell into this Category, where the plain Jane was a better Dancer but never did as well as her better looking sister.
Quote from: hardstation on December 03, 2017, 08:26:13 PM
The two "sides" always made me laugh. The venom with which people say "she dances for the other side" is fantastic. Some young girl with ginger ringlets and a sequenced Celtic swan stitched down the back of her velvet dress finds herself embroiled in a vicious political conflict.
Class.
Sorry lad you've completely lost me. What two sides?
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on December 03, 2017, 12:38:11 PM
I always thought there'd be a great parody kinda like the Blades of Glory type movie!!
Sounds a runner that. Must get her started. Wigs and Reels.
Quote from: hardstation on December 03, 2017, 09:33:19 PM
Coimisiún v Comhdháil of course.
You'd think when the rebels split they would've changed some of the stupid crap
My daughter is 14 and has been at Irish dancing since she was 8.
I could probably have paid off my mortgage by now if we'd have told her 'no' at the start.
But she loves it. So whadda ye do?
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on December 03, 2017, 12:38:11 PM
My daughter goes to festival dancing. Different from feis. No wigs and much plainer dresses. No makeup till they reach 12 and even then it is frowned upon. Dresses are much cheaper and there are a lot of 'hand me downs ' within the Schools. It is competitive but the youngest age group is 8s. I always thought there'd be a great parody kinda like the Blades of Glory type movie!!
Same here, less hassle and no wigs or tan or any of the other crap, my daughter started when she was 4 also, she loved it and it, she was decent enough but she stopped once she got to first year and saved us a fortune as even with the festival dancing its expensive enough and the long days away to Ballygobackwards to sit through 8 hours of other people dancing is something i wasnt prepared to do, so the wife did it!
My parents and my Dad in particular have been involved in running a Feis for most of their lives. The dancing is the biggest section and the one they're most closely involved in. I call in to help out or just to see them over the marathon weekends they put in organising. I am always horrified by the trappings like the fake tan, makeup, wigs and fluorescent coloured dresses. This has definitely got much worse in the last 25 years. Back then there would have been no wigs, and certainly no bright fluorescent pink or yellow colours - but nice celtic patterned dresses.
My folks would talk to adjudicators a lot and they always say that these additional trappings make no difference - they just look at the footwork and form etc. Trouble is none of the Mammies or the teachers believe that and no one is brave enough to break this crazy cycle. My Dad in particular would have liked my girls to get into it but they're shown no interest. I'm kinda relieved. I've no issue with the dancing - I like watching Irish dancing - but I find the associated rubbish to be akin to American beauty pageants.
Load of drivel, I have 3rd cousins in USA and they send their children to Irish dancing, their great great grandparents wouldn't have Irish danced in Ireland, if you want to celebrate true Irish culture, get your children to learn the Irish language and teach them about Irish mythology not prance around in a wig.
Quote from: magpie seanie on December 04, 2017, 02:50:35 PM
My parents and my Dad in particular have been involved in running a Feis for most of their lives. The dancing is the biggest section and the one they're most closely involved in. I call in to help out or just to see them over the marathon weekends they put in organising. I am always horrified by the trappings like the fake tan, makeup, wigs and fluorescent coloured dresses. This has definitely got much worse in the last 25 years. Back then there would have been no wigs, and certainly no bright fluorescent pink or yellow colours - but nice celtic patterned dresses.
My folks would talk to adjudicators a lot and they always say that these additional trappings make no difference - they just look at the footwork and form etc. Trouble is none of the Mammies or the teachers believe that and no one is brave enough to break this crazy cycle. My Dad in particular would have liked my girls to get into it but they're shown no interest. I'm kinda relieved. I've no issue with the dancing - I like watching Irish dancing - but I find the associated rubbish to be akin to American beauty pageants.
How come Sligo has two feisanna?
Quote from: Owenmoresider on December 06, 2017, 01:55:46 PM
Quote from: magpie seanie on December 04, 2017, 02:50:35 PM
My parents and my Dad in particular have been involved in running a Feis for most of their lives. The dancing is the biggest section and the one they're most closely involved in. I call in to help out or just to see them over the marathon weekends they put in organising. I am always horrified by the trappings like the fake tan, makeup, wigs and fluorescent coloured dresses. This has definitely got much worse in the last 25 years. Back then there would have been no wigs, and certainly no bright fluorescent pink or yellow colours - but nice celtic patterned dresses.
My folks would talk to adjudicators a lot and they always say that these additional trappings make no difference - they just look at the footwork and form etc. Trouble is none of the Mammies or the teachers believe that and no one is brave enough to break this crazy cycle. My Dad in particular would have liked my girls to get into it but they're shown no interest. I'm kinda relieved. I've no issue with the dancing - I like watching Irish dancing - but I find the associated rubbish to be akin to American beauty pageants.
How come Sligo has two feisanna?
Don't mention the war!!!!
A group of people wanted to present a cup to Feis Ceoil is Sligo in memory of Seamus Devins. They rejected it so the same people set up Feis Shligigh in honour of Sligo's Noble Six. My Grandfather was a founder member of Feis Shligigh.
That's my understanding of things.
I see there is a major scandal hitting Irish Dancing Circles (Circles? Is that the right word?) Allegations of competition fixing. https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2022/10/07/news/irish_dance_competition-fixing_investigation_to_focus_on_messages_shared_by_at_least_18_individuals-2852643/ (https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2022/10/07/news/irish_dance_competition-fixing_investigation_to_focus_on_messages_shared_by_at_least_18_individuals-2852643/)
I am not really surprised to be honest. The whole thing has a stink off it from the dresses to the wigs and make up on the children. I think a lot of parents and "instructors" are in for themselves and not the child. This seems to give the impression of a closed house. Imagine if this was something dominated by men. The outcry that there would be!
They've set up a helpline for anyone who might be effected. Number is 1800-1234567-123-123
Quote from: trailer on October 10, 2022, 11:34:48 AM
I see there is a major scandal hitting Irish Dancing Circles (Circles? Is that the right word?) Allegations of competition fixing. https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2022/10/07/news/irish_dance_competition-fixing_investigation_to_focus_on_messages_shared_by_at_least_18_individuals-2852643/ (https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2022/10/07/news/irish_dance_competition-fixing_investigation_to_focus_on_messages_shared_by_at_least_18_individuals-2852643/)
I am not really surprised to be honest. The whole thing has a stink off it from the dresses to the wigs and make up on the children. I think a lot of parents and "instructors" are in for themselves and not the child. This seems to give the impression of a closed house. Imagine if this was something dominated by men. The outcry that there would be!
The state of the make-up and hair surely is enough to put anyone off.
I for one am OUTRAGED
Not sure how this irish dancing works but the "sexual" favours thing, is there a lot of lesbicans involved in this or do some men get involved as well?
Excuse my ignorance..