Standard of Refs

[guevara]

I never said McCarthy's fouls were all red card offences.

Okay lets flip it. Lets say Kerry committed the fouls McCarthy & Costello did. Would Gough had come to the same decisions?  Not a chance!

Darragh Ó Sé, in his post-match column, is nowhere near as sore as you are in respect of the refereeing performance, in that he (correctly) states that Dublin established the (thus far and no further) line with Gough early on, and weren't afraid to max it out.

It's entirely within Dublin's rights to push the line and try to max it out.

However it was David Gough's job to establish the line in accordance with the rules of the game & apply them fairly &  consistently to both.

I'm not one bit sore. I made a point about his performance and was criticised by a current Referee on here who admittedly hadn't seen the game properly or the incidents at his time of posting.

[Milltown Row2]

I never said McCarthy's fouls were all red card offences.

Okay lets flip it. Lets say Kerry committed the fouls McCarthy & Costello did. Would Gough had come to the same decisions?  Not a chance!

Darragh Ó Sé, in his post-match column, is nowhere near as sore as you are in respect of the refereeing performance, in that he (correctly) states that Dublin established the (thus far and no further) line with Gough early on, and weren't afraid to max it out.

It's entirely within Dublin's rights to push the line and try to max it out.

However it was David Gough's job to establish the line in accordance with the rules of the game & apply them fairly &  consistently to both.

I'm not one bit sore. I made a point about his performance and was criticised by a current Referee on here who admittedly hadn't seen the game properly or the incidents at his time of posting.

Your last bit is balls btw... I said I had watched the game, albeit on the phone, and said I'll re-watch the game to see if this manic that should have been sent off was given an easier time, because someone made up a thing of him being captain he should stay on, which is balls

So even after watching it, and giving my assessment your view and mine is different

[guevara]

Why is it one ref makes them work for a free, and another was giving frees for very littikr in the semi, it's either a free or its not.

According to MR2, the ref was correct when he called a foul in one incident of foul play and still correct when he doesn't call a foul in a similar  or even worse incident of foul play, because apparently it wasn't foul play when the ref decides it wasn't a foul. Or the last resort excuse, it wasn't foul play because of the peculiar viewing angle.

Regardless, a GAA ref  has a mammoth task to ref championship games, I 100% favour having 2 refs  say from group stage onward. There's usually an experience ref  lingering on the sideline whose only duty is to inform the mentors of what's what. I couldn't care less if the 2 refs slightly differed on their application of the rules. Eventually they will end up performing in unison like those synchronized swimmers.
For my money Coldrick was the best at letting a game roll with the punches and blowing up for foul play when appropriate, definitely the best for an Ulster free for all final.

If ref'ing was so simple, as in how everyone here knows better and how it should be applied, then why are we having these discussions?

2 Ref's? f**k me! Clubs struggle to put forward one referee, the fall out rate after completing the course is nearly 50% after the first year, main reason is gobshites either hanging over the fence or on the pitch telling the ref he's a useless cnut!

Some people haven't the first clue of the actual rules, and still questioning the rules when they are explained, As for Sunday's game I haven't seen it on TV, watching it on my phone isn't the same, was raining too which didnt help, I'll watch the game back, as I said earlier

Plenty of Referees haven't a clue on the rules either!  The problem a lot of the time is Refs apply their own interpretation of the rules. Take Sunday for example David Gough influenced the game by not applying the rules of the game consistently.
McCarthy should not have been on the pitch & it could be argued that he allowed Dublin away with overly aggressive late hits (McCarthy, Smalls) & let Costello away with throwing a punch.

If you have played the game you will realise his call to overturn the Clifford free was a cop out. Why did he not consult his umpires on the other decisions?

There is no consistency from game to game and as a neutral it appears The Dubs seem to come out on the right side of these inconsistent performances in the big games.

I'd say that if me and you sat down to do a rules test that I'd come out on top, I'd say if Gough and me sat down to do a rules test, he'd better my score, any ref that is intercounty they have to get 95% I think, club refs 85%

I've played the game, both codes well into my 40's from juvenile to senior so I'm fairly confident on the game, you said he did not consult his umpires, how do you know? These guys are on a live feed and speaking to their umpires/linesmen flat out throughout the game, but you know better?

You are trying to apply black and white, its not like that, and if you played the game, you'd understand that. Everyone knows the rules when they goggle it

Nice assumptions there, but you are avoiding the elephant in the room. Should McCarthy have been on the pitch? Did he influence the outcome of the game by remaining on the pitch?

If the answer to the first question is no then Gough f*cked up, regardless or not if he would better either you or me in some rules test.

On your second point about constant communication with his fellow officials, you and I both know that if we were a Kerry player on Sunday and that was the only decision he actively went to seek opinion from The Umpires, you would be livid. Costello strike was pretty obvious as was McCarthy's numerous yellow card offences.

So whether you like it or not, knowing the rulebook inside out and applying it fairly and consistently are two very different things.

Are you saying he wasn't talking to his umpires? I've said they use an open mic and do talk to their linesmen and umpires, for some reason you felt they weren't I'm assuming then you had a listening device during the match that told you that?

As I've said I would need to watch the game properly as oppose to watching while dandering through London and on a train, also, he didn't call it and didn't do it to piss you off, or because he was the captain and didn't want to annoy him on his big day!

[LeoMc]

I never said McCarthy's fouls were all red card offences.

Okay lets flip it. Lets say Kerry committed the fouls McCarthy & Costello did. Would Gough had come to the same decisions?  Not a chance!

Darragh Ó Sé, in his post-match column, is nowhere near as sore as you are in respect of the refereeing performance, in that he (correctly) states that Dublin established the (thus far and no further) line with Gough early on, and weren't afraid to max it out.

It's entirely within Dublin's rights to push the line and try to max it out.

However it was David Gough's job to establish the line in accordance with the rules of the game & apply them fairly &  consistently to both.

I'm not one bit sore. I made a point about his performance and was criticised by a current Referee on here who admittedly hadn't seen the game properly or the incidents at his time of posting.

And has since watched the game through, analysed it in terms of free counts, gave his opinion and has not seen this blatent inconsistency only you seem to be able to see.

[guevara]

Read what I wrote in my message prior to MR2' "that is balls" point

[LeoMc]

You wrote
It's entirely within Dublin's rights to push the line and try to max it out.

However it was David Gough's job to establish the line in accordance with the rules of the game & apply them fairly &  consistently to both.

I'm not one bit sore. I made a point about his performance and was criticised by a current Referee on here who admittedly hadn't seen the game properly or the incidents at his time of posting.

To which MR2 replied "This is balls....."

To me it reads that you were trying to insinuate that his criticism of your interpretation of the game was unfounded as MR2 did not watch the game clearly. He and I are pointing out he has rewatched the whole game and his opinion has not changed.

If that is not what you were insinuating can you clarify what you did mean?

[guevara]

You wrote
It's entirely within Dublin's rights to push the line and try to max it out.

However it was David Gough's job to establish the line in accordance with the rules of the game & apply them fairly &  consistently to both.

I'm not one bit sore. I made a point about his performance and was criticised by a current Referee on here who admittedly hadn't seen the game properly or the incidents at his time of posting.

To which MR2 replied "This is balls....."

To me it reads that you were trying to insinuate that his criticism of your interpretation of the game was unfounded as MR2 did not watch the game clearly. He and I are pointing out he has rewatched the whole game and his opinion has not changed.

If that is not what you were insinuating can you clarify what you did mean?

No I think you will find I made the point that he was on here talking down to anyone who disagreed with his narrative, without having seen the match or the incidents properly. His language not mine.

We disagree on the points raised & that is fine, everyone is entitled to an opinion. What is sad is someone thinking because they are a Referee that this allows them talk down to everyone else on the rules of the game and their application.

Everyone is all for"it being a mans game" or a"physical game" until it effects them or their team.

I merely made the point that on Sunday, in my eyes Gough let one team away with some very questionable calls.

[restorepride]

You wrote
It's entirely within Dublin's rights to push the line and try to max it out.

However it was David Gough's job to establish the line in accordance with the rules of the game & apply them fairly &  consistently to both.

I'm not one bit sore. I made a point about his performance and was criticised by a current Referee on here who admittedly hadn't seen the game properly or the incidents at his time of posting.

To which MR2 replied "This is balls....."

To me it reads that you were trying to insinuate that his criticism of your interpretation of the game was unfounded as MR2 did not watch the game clearly. He and I are pointing out he has rewatched the whole game and his opinion has not changed.

If that is not what you were insinuating can you clarify what you did mean?

No I think you will find I made the point that he was on here talking down to anyone who disagreed with his narrative, without having seen the match or the incidents properly. His language not mine.

We disagree on the points raised & that is fine, everyone is entitled to an opinion. What is sad is someone thinking because they are a Referee that this allows them talk down to everyone else on the rules of the game and their application.

Everyone is all for"it being a mans game" or a"physical game" until it effects them or their team.

I merely made the point that on Sunday, in my eyes Gough let one team away with some very questionable calls.

Wise up. On your own admission, you only saw a 'coming together' involving Costello in real time.  You changed your mind later.  Too late, game over - the reality for any referee who only gets a split second to make a call.  At this stage your one-sided commentary is more than questionable.  Dublin won and deserved it. 

[guevara]

Enlighten me thrn, how is it questionnable?
The point you clearly seem to miss is that I was sat in The Cusack. David Gough is a lot closer & can see the incident happen in front of him

Dublin won yes, but whether they deserved it or not is another matter.

[Fear ón Srath Bán]

I never said McCarthy's fouls were all red card offences.

Okay lets flip it. Lets say Kerry committed the fouls McCarthy & Costello did. Would Gough had come to the same decisions?  Not a chance!

Darragh Ó Sé, in his post-match column, is nowhere near as sore as you are in respect of the refereeing performance, in that he (correctly) states that Dublin established the (thus far and no further) line with Gough early on, and weren't afraid to max it out.

It's entirely within Dublin's rights to push the line and try to max it out.

However it was David Gough's job to establish the line in accordance with the rules of the game & apply them fairly &  consistently to both.

I'm not one bit sore. I made a point about his performance and was criticised by a current Referee on here who admittedly hadn't seen the game properly or the incidents at his time of posting.

Let me rephrase: I don't see anyone as exercised as yourself about Gough's performance, including the Kerry contingent -- what's really your beef? 

This is coming from a Tír Eoghain buachaill, whom Gough has fairly recently been ridiculous in his dealings with IMHO, but credit where it's due.

[Rossfan]

Time to close this thread perhaps.

[theticklemister]

Reffing a Championship match last night.

Team were a point down, deep into injury time. They had a sideline ball about halfway up the pitch. I was probably going to allow their last attack. Their player crossed the line as he took it. I blew for a technical foul. A member of the management started shouting at me and giving it f**king loads. Full mad he went.

Whistle went shortly after I threw hop hall.

The same member of management came up to me after and said, " I knew he crossed the line, but I had to shout and back my team, it was championship."

[Milltown Row2]

Reffing a Championship match last night.

Team were a point down, deep into injury time. They had a sideline ball about halfway up the pitch. I was probably going to allow their last attack. Their player crossed the line as he took it. I blew for a technical foul. A member of the management started shouting at me and giving it f**king loads. Full mad he went.

Whistle went shortly after I threw hop hall.

The same member of management came up to me after and said, " I knew he crossed the line, but I had to shout and back my team, it was championship."

I know it's a foul and I only actually call them when I've a neutral linesman, so fair play, the manager's reaction is only natural nowadays, but unless we do nothing about his antics (obviously depending on how he speaks to you) this will be seen as the norm, 6 week suspension for start of next season should make him think a wee bit more

[imtommygunn]

If an attacking player is in the square with the ball and fist passes to another player who is standing in the square is that a square ball?

[theticklemister]

Thing about it..... he knew he was wrong but still shouted.