Author Topic: the future of the Intercounty game  (Read 4061 times)

Rossfan

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Re: the future of the Intercounty game
« Reply #120 on: December 07, 2017, 06:40:25 PM »
Quote from: OgraAnDun link=topic=28276.msg1760355#msg1760355 date=151 Their supporters had the hope of being two wins and a lucky draw away from an AIQF as well.
[/quote
Are and I was only 2 numbers away from the Lotto jackpot....
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OgraAnDun

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Re: the future of the Intercounty game
« Reply #121 on: December 07, 2017, 07:03:33 PM »
Quote from: OgraAnDun link=topic=28276.msg1760355#msg1760355 date=151 Their supporters had the hope of being two wins and a lucky draw away from an AIQF as well.
[/quote
Are and I was only 2 numbers away from the Lotto jackpot....

But you played for the thrill/craic/experience, didn't you? Would you bother paying that 2.50 if the prize was a fiver, even if your chances of winning were higher?
« Last Edit: December 07, 2017, 07:08:30 PM by OgraAnDun »

Rossfan

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Re: the future of the Intercounty game
« Reply #122 on: December 07, 2017, 07:20:03 PM »
I have a chance of winning.
Carlow and around 20 other Counties have no chance of Sam.
Ballinameen aren't in the same championship as St Brigids.
They try just as hard to win the JFC as Brids do to win the Senior.
They have a chance of winning the JFC,  they will NEVER win the SFC unless oil is discovered around Tartan or Dooneen....
In 65 years only 2 small (under 100,000) counties have reached AIFS.
Ros 1962 and 1980 and Offaly who had a golden age of 22 years with 6 finals - last one  35 years ago.
No one under 45 can really remember a small County reaching an AI Final.
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Orchard park

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Re: the future of the Intercounty game
« Reply #123 on: December 07, 2017, 09:35:22 PM »
When was serious hurling not confined to 9 counties?
You'd think Wicklow, Ros etc were competing for Liam McCarthy for years until the tiers were brought in.
Not much "football ambition" in around 20 Counties as it stands.
See Derry where players are not interested in playing for the County.
Wasn't much media coverage of the Carlow v London Qualifier game last Summer.

Football is far more widespread than hurling. The actual national game operates to very different dynamics than a minority sport like hurling and aping their elitist structures is not going to slow down the declining interest in football.

On a gaa  forum that really shows your knowledge of hurling!!!!!!!!!!
« Last Edit: December 07, 2017, 10:10:47 PM by Orchard park »

mrhardyannual

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Re: the future of the Intercounty game
« Reply #124 on: December 07, 2017, 09:45:07 PM »
When was serious hurling not confined to 9 counties?
You'd think Wicklow, Ros etc were competing for Liam McCarthy for years until the tiers were brought in.
Not much "football ambition" in around 20 Counties as it stands.
See Derry where players are not interested in playing for the County.
Wasn't much media coverage of the Carlow v London Qualifier game last Summer.
My point was that a tiered system has not improved hurling and therefore cannot be held up as an exemplar for improving football.

Rossfan

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Re: the future of the Intercounty game
« Reply #125 on: December 07, 2017, 10:18:54 PM »
Ok.
3 Competitions with teams of similar standard would make things more interesting at least.

How is the present system improving football?
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OgraAnDun

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Re: the future of the Intercounty game
« Reply #126 on: December 07, 2017, 10:27:54 PM »
I have a chance of winning.
Carlow and around 20 other Counties have no chance of Sam.
Ballinameen aren't in the same championship as St Brigids.
They try just as hard to win the JFC as Brids do to win the Senior.
They have a chance of winning the JFC,  they will NEVER win the SFC unless oil is discovered around Tartan or Dooneen....
In 65 years only 2 small (under 100,000) counties have reached AIFS.
Ros 1962 and 1980 and Offaly who had a golden age of 22 years with 6 finals - last one  35 years ago.
No one under 45 can really remember a small County reaching an AI Final.

Yeah but like I said they have a chance of their day in the sun. In fact, they got it twice and had the hope of more. In this C competition they'll get only a little more coverage than the Nicky Rackard, in other words one paragraph in an article summing up all the games in the C competition. The club competition works because it's embedded into the culture and it's not so much about the high profile matches.

mrhardyannual

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Re: the future of the Intercounty game
« Reply #127 on: December 07, 2017, 11:48:21 PM »
Ok.
3 Competitions with teams of similar standard would make things more interesting at least.

How is the present system improving football?
More interesting for whom?
The players and counties for whom this is being proposed (by those who would stay in the elite division/s)want nothing to do with it. I'm always wary of groups and individuals who think they know better than I do what's best for me.

Rossfan

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Re: the future of the Intercounty game
« Reply #128 on: December 07, 2017, 11:59:43 PM »
More interesting for players who play in a competition they have a decent chance of winning and progressing to a higher level.
Like St Brigids B and Michael Glaveys.

How does the present  I C  All Ireland system improve football?
« Last Edit: December 08, 2017, 10:08:13 AM by Rossfan »
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Esmarelda

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Re: the future of the Intercounty game
« Reply #129 on: December 08, 2017, 09:59:03 AM »
Ok.
3 Competitions with teams of similar standard would make things more interesting at least.

How is the present system improving football?
More interesting for whom?
The players and counties for whom this is being proposed (by those who would stay in the elite division/s)want nothing to do with it. I'm always wary of groups and individuals who think they know better than I do what's best for me.
This, in my opinion, is the crux of the discussion on this and many other threads.

The intercounty players were asked as a whole what they wanted about 18 months ago. They said they wanted to keep the provincial championships, the didn't want a tiered championship and they wanted the championship games/training ratio brought down. That's exactly what they're getting next summer.

Of course the players aren't the only group that should be listened to but I think they're one of the most important stakeholders.

Who else's opinion should be considered, and in what order, is open to debate but I'd have thought that the media generally, who drive a lot of the reform talk, shouldn't be near the top of such a list.

Rossfan

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Re: the future of the Intercounty game
« Reply #130 on: December 08, 2017, 10:12:35 AM »
Decisions in the GAA are made by the wise administrators in Congress and implemented by the equally wise ones in Central Council.
Hopefully they listen to the relevant ones but sometimes they just have to lead to boldly move on from endless debate and discussion.
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didlyi

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Re: the future of the Intercounty game
« Reply #131 on: December 08, 2017, 11:06:43 AM »
The Tiered system in hurling will work better than in football because in hurling the difference between the top an d the bottom is incomparable really. In football the likes of Carlow can put it up to the Dubs on a given day but probably never beat them. In hurling Cavan wouldnt come within 30 points of Galway if they played them every day for a year. Thats just the difference between the 2 games in terms of scoring power and skills required, and no reflection on the calibre of sportmen in Cavan. So less of the jibes at hurling being elitist because of the gap in standards and more about doing whats best for football as a spectacle. IMO a tiered system is NOT not the answer for football.

Esmarelda

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Re: the future of the Intercounty game
« Reply #132 on: December 08, 2017, 11:07:08 AM »
Decisions in the GAA are made by the wise administrators in Congress and implemented by the equally wise ones in Central Council.
Hopefully they listen to the relevant ones but sometimes they just have to lead to boldly move on from endless debate and discussion.
And in this case, they largely listened to what the players wanted and highlighted that fact when they announced the new structures.

mrhardyannual

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Re: the future of the Intercounty game
« Reply #133 on: December 08, 2017, 11:14:21 AM »
Decisions in the GAA are made by the wise administrators in Congress and implemented by the equally wise ones in Central Council.
Hopefully they listen to the relevant ones but sometimes they just have to lead to boldly move on from endless debate and discussion.
The introduction of tiered competitions across any range of sports has diminished the status and earning power of teams relegated/placed in the lower divisions. Teams in League of Ireland Div2 (or whatever it's called) are nearly anonymous. The Europa League at the next level has lost all significance bar the semi-finals and finals. The Pro 14 in Rugby has reduced club rugby in Ireland to a few column inches now and again. Even the Secondary European Rugby cup competition that Connacht play in this year barely gets a mention. I could go on and on. Players know when competitions are relevant or not. In this regard history and tradition are important. There is no desire anywhere to turn the All- Ireland Championship into a League where you graduate upwards or downwards based on results. That is what we have in the NFL. But once a year in the championship all teams live in hope. You might find that hope unrealistic for some but it doesn't prevent them trying. Clubs from towns and villages across England enter the FA Cup each year and their chances of beating Dagenham are no more realistic than their chance of beating Man City. The opportunity to pit yourself against the best is what drives them.

Rossfan

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Re: the future of the Intercounty game
« Reply #134 on: December 08, 2017, 11:58:08 AM »
So do you want an end to senior, Inter and Junior at club level?
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