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It actually struck me at the end of the game how chaotic KC's attempts to get subs on was. As neutrals we commented that it was unusual at the time. Also commented that KC had literally everyone back. They got stung last year and were being really stretched by Glen. Their management will have come to the conclusion that they were vulnerable at the end of games. Taking in all these factors, the current in-depth prep and "win-at-all " costs mentality of top teams, it would be a master stroke to try to get extra bodies in the defence at the end . Repelling Glen's final attacks were helped by the crowding , not just physically but the Visual deterrent of numbers back defending and lack of space . Whether this was an incredibly cynical tactic or by accident , it must be seen to be penalised or now many others  will be at it, especially when only the referee officiating . Tbf to KC management another explanation for the chaos could be the rush to get players on the field to keep them sweet with a bit of AI game-time , as they lost their place to "tribesman" Shane Walsh.
I hesitate to be critical of KC as they operate a brilliant club in a challenging environment, but this must be a hollow victory for most club stalwarts. On reflection, They'll be annoyed, no doubt , that it looks like their all-ireland would never have happened if they hadn't have pulled in the second best player in Ireland for a few months. Despite the cries of "Noice peno, ShaneO" , he's not one of their own , and the genuine KC gaels will have their heads in their hands this morning , wondering if it was all worth it.
Not wanting to take away from the great work being done in KC, but the Shane Walsh fiasco dominated the conversation amongst everyone I talked to about the match .."not a good look".
It's no consolation to Glen , but without Shane Walsh , and just 15 opposition players on the pitch they would have been AI champs, by some distance .
Regarding the extra players, if there isn't a rule to heavily penalise this, there should be.

Do you honestly believe that the clubmen of KC will have looked at this win and be annoyed? They seemed very happy at the final whistle

They won't be the slightest bit annoyed. They'll look around the clubhouse at lads they've known since 5 years of age , who are now all Ireland champions. They won't even consider the "why".

Yes MR, on reflection and with hindsight , they'll be wondering could they have done it without parachuting in the second best player in Ireland . Throw in the , probably cynical,  17 defender fiasco as well, it's a hollow victory at best, and their promotional message to their young players and potential members is sullied .
Compare that with Kilcoo, where all players came from the same rural primary school , or indeed the Cliffords winning Junior All-Ireland with Fossa.

The GAA is not like any other sport . It doesn't have an international dimension and there's no "pay for play" , but it retains it's popularity for players , and indeed , is able to punch above it's weight,  because of its ethos. Other sports admire and envy this ethos , and it should not be diluted.
City and large town clubs are advantaged by Weight of numbers , including adults migrating for work. Nobody can stop a Shane Walsh moving to Dublin for work or study , but when they get there, should there not be more regulation  on what club they choose?
St Galls AI team , for example, was bolstered by "outsiders" and good luck to you, it was all within the rules. But this is open to abuse. It would completely destroy the GAA in rural areas if more students transfer to city clubs .
The Shane Walsh scenario has been a major talking point and will leave a sour taste for those players that missed out, not just for loss of game-time , but the feeling that their AI victory is sullied. Craig Dyas , for example, is the outstanding KC player IMO , but nobody's talking about him, they're talking about a Galway freetaker parachuted in for a few months. It's not right , not just for the integrity of the GAA but for undermining the KC club. Because all KC lads were cheering at the end doesn't make it right. We all cheer any victory we're involved in , even if it's "hollow".

It actually struck me at the end of the game how chaotic KC's attempts to get subs on was. As neutrals we commented that it was unusual at the time. Also commented that KC had literally everyone back. They got stung last year and were being really stretched by Glen. Their management will have come to the conclusion that they were vulnerable at the end of games(15 players behind the ball might not be enough , even if one of them is the second best player in Ireland and a Galway man). Taking in all these factors, the current in-depth prep and "win-at-all " costs mentality of top teams, it would be a master stroke to try to get extra bodies in the defence at the end . Repelling Glen's final attacks were helped by the crowding , not just physically but the Visual deterrent of numbers back defending and lack of space . Whether this was an incredibly cynical tactic or by accident , it must be seen to be penalised or now many others  will be at it, especially when only the referee officiating . Tbf to KC management another explanation for the chaos could be the rush to get players on the field to keep them sweet with a bit of AI game-time , as they lost their place to "tribesman" (no irony there) , Shane Walsh.
I hesitate to be critical of KC as they operate a brilliant club in a challenging environment, but this must be a hollow victory for most club stalwarts. On reflection, They'll be annoyed, no doubt , that it looks like their all-ireland would never have happened if they hadn't have pulled in the second best player in Ireland for a few months. Despite the cries of "Noice peno, ShaneO" , he's not one of their own , and the genuine KC gaels will have their heads in their hands this morning , wondering if it was all worth it.
Not wanting to take away from the great work being done in KC, but the Shane Walsh fiasco dominated the conversation amongst everyone I talked to about the match .."not a good look".
It's no consolation to Glen , but without Shane Walsh , and just 15 opposition players on the pitch they would have been AI champs, by some distance .
Regarding the extra players, if there isn't a rule to heavily penalise this, there should be.

Well done to Liatroim winning the Ulster intermediate hurling final, brilliant achievement 👏

Well done indeed, a crack at some serious teams in the ai semifinal awaits.

Brilliant achievement by the Fontenoys.

Good suggestion on the Down thread about moving kickouts back to edge of small square, would make the short kickout more difficult and would encourage teams to press up.

It could actually have the opposite effect . A keeper can set the ball down and get it away quicker as he only has to run to smaller square rather than 20m. Any rule changes need to be tested in competitive games to test these unintended consequences rather than knee jerk changes. Rather than over complicate things I would keep any change simple eg no backpasses in own half, and test it for a full year in a semi-competitive environment ( ie not league or championship)

Sure we all know Dinosaurs are amphibious

Maybe if they had bought an elder stateman on a bit sooner they be in the semis.

He didn't do too much in extra time when we got to grips with him and hadn't the ball


s to take a penalty. Some leader that...
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The man owes nothing to Down or Burren, he's a legend.
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Absolutely, enormous contribution to GAA , in his club, county and beyond.

No offence but Scor??....does anyone give a shit really.
Outdated concept.

Not one single fkck. I do agree the relegation from senior championship should be scrapped.

What are your proposals for relegation/promotion from sfc?
If ifc winners this year are to get promotion to sfc , who is to be relegated ?
If it's done on league position it's unfair , as many league games are played without county players. Surely you can't penalise clubs with county players?
A sfc club plays championship with full deck including county players , if they lose 4 sfc games with their full deck then relegation is close to a fair fight. If you relegate a team from sfc on the basis of a league where they play many matches without a full deck , then it's clearly unfair on clubs with county players

Teams to win series in New Zealand:
1937 South Africa
1971 B&I Lions
1986 Australia
1994 France
2022 Ireland

Consecutive New Zealand home losses:
1937 v South Africa,
1949 v Australia,
1994 v France,
1998 v South Africa/Australia,
2022 v Ireland

Monumental result .

Can ireland maintain this for World Cup ?
That aside , the achievement stands in its own right as historic.

I have 3 complaints about the first half

1. Why was the Glass score not given when Walsh's was
2. There was a clear footblock from a scoreable position
3. Benny Heron was tripped at the top of the D and should have been a free in

No conplaints  about the second half other than the keeper jogging back to goal when he was caught up the pitch. He mightn't have made it but jesus make an effort!!

Lynch is a calamity. Has been since he first took the jersey. I just hope Gallagher has the humility and foresight to get rid of him. Connlan Bradley is a better option at present and surely we've a decent u20 keeper coming through the ranks. It's a major issue of concern going forward!

Lynch is a quality footballer , and was outstanding in his rye of a needle kickouts . When Galway pushed up he was under pressure as Derry don't currently have enough quality fielders to go long. Derry will look to improve that with perhaps using Bradley more etc.
I remember Niall Morgan and rory beggan being roundly criticised in their youth for making similar mistakes as Lynch. They persevered, and became two of the top keepers of their generation . Derry don't need to press any panic buttons. Consolidate what they have , bolster their panel and s&c over the next couple of years , and they can be real contenders . Ultimately This year was a year too soon for them .

Would like to see Kilkenny follow there win today by putting a league team out.

Long overdue a return to the NFL, 2012 since they last played in it?

IIRC in the last couple of seasons they were in the NFL they were shipping some right hammerings, even against London, Waterford & Wicklow IIRC. It's one thing entering a team into the league, it's another getting eligible players that are of a competitive standard to want to play for them, especially as football is primarily a winter/ early spring activity for most clubs there before the hurling starts to get going. You can take a horse to water, and all that...

Where I have a problem with Kilkenny is that most counties invest heavily in two sports, they only have to invest heavily in hurling. Counties who do not promote both sports should be penalised financially to level the playing field

Let go of the "Hawkeye excuse".
Galway outscored Derry 2-8 to 0-3 between 20th and 70th minutes.

You'll be hard pressed to find any poster using Hawkeye as an excuse for losing the game!!!

Don't think anyone is using Hawkeye as an excuse, but if a team lost a game by a point due to a Hawkeye error it would be unthinkable. It's been shown up as not good enough .gaa should ask for its  Money back

I can't believe Derry just rolled over during HT and agreed that the score from the 45 be allowed.
Gallagher could well have argued that the time it took to check Hawkeye denied Derry the chance for a quick kick out. Galway won the subsequent kick out and Comer scored.
Also, the Glass effort was never shown again after being given wide, despite looking like a point to most people. If the game had been closer at the end the GAA would be in an awkward spot.

The Hawkeye incidents are ridiculous tbh. Hundreds of thousands invested in a system that doesn't work. Is it not probable that the error in the system was technical tá errorred to níl . With glass point also clearly a point . They should scrap hawkeye and get their money back. There have not been enough human errors by umpires to warrant investing in this joke.

That said , and accepting that the ref gave Galway the run of the green on several occasions , Galway were clearly the better side .
Much as they have excellent forwards, their defensive system was actually better than Derry's.
Derry totally dominated the first half but their only scores were ultimately down to brilliant individual evasion to work tap over openings. Other than that Derry didn't look like scoring. Ultimately they were caught out by not having enough forward talent to keep the scoreboard ticking over . But they're young and inexperienced at this level , they'll improve and they'll be hoping a marquee forward or two emerges. Thought mccloskey performance was outstanding, pace, discipline, quality tackling . Ironically his attacking approach highlighted Derry's problem yesterday . He got himself into excellent positions but didn't have the confidence in his shooting ability.
Even though Galway were best with Comer being the main difference, galway's ease of winning and scoring scoreable frees edged them into their position of dominance .
Gallagher has been credited with Derry's success but in reality their underage success over last few years put them in this position . Gallagher's approach was found wanting yesterday , and only a massive improvement in attacking creativity and scoring capability will win them an all-ireland . It's one thing banging in 5 goals in a once off match, it's another breaking down well organised defences of the very top teams. Derry can win an all-ireland but a lot of work to do, it remains to be seen if Gallagher has the qualities to
Lead them there.

The GAA really need to look at these melees.
Problems:
They are dangerous and somebody could get seriously hurt through weight of numbers or unseen digs/ gouging , MMA tactics etc.
They are extremely bad PR for GAA.
The current sanctions are not working
The 3rd man in rule is impossible to police fairly particularly in club games with only 1 official .
Kieran mcgeeney is right , It's human nature to push back when pushed, particularly in the heat of an attritional sport. It's also human nature to protect a teammate in a dangerous clutch or on the ground with someone battering his head. I haven't heard one person criticising the Galway man who punched Tiernan Kelly ,  was this an acceptable human reaction to perceived assault on a teammate?
Some players are now MMA trained or influenced,  putting them at an advantage in a wrestling situation where they could inflict damage against an opponent not trained.
Armagh seem to be involved in a disproportionate number of these melees.

Solutions:
Accept human nature but penalise dangerous aggression. Encourage peacemaking (pulling back, calming words ) but  heavily penalise aggressive intent whether a player is first or last into the melee inevitably it's  the peacemakers who eventually bring these melees under control. If it became accepted practice to be seen to calm these situations down, they would be less likely to  develop. I've seen this happen on several occasions , so it could work if a lone ref had the support of "influencers", from both sides-players and team mentors/officials .
Heavily sanction repeat offenders financially , if Armagh were handed a £10k fine every time they're involved in a melee, it might help them reflect on what is perceived as their melee ethos.
Seperate teams at interval. Eg teams go into changing rooms separately and stay to allocated area
Strict on numbers inside the wire , eg 5 , no subs. Heavily sanction those that cross the wire or cross to opposition area.
Those inside should include a discipline official for each side, whose job is to promote control of potential melees.
All above would help change the culture around melees, which are dangerous and seriously bad PR.

https://twitter.com/StevenMcD13/status/1541823194797166595?s=20&t=Si7nNv2BfGtz5D2Pp8x37g

Very fair statement from Clann Eireann .

[I honestly thought he should have had red]

I would agree with a lot of that. I would have preferred Armagh won but I do generally like Galway. Comer was wired in that game and I honestly thought he should have had red. Walsh while wasn't fantastic was subject to some not great treatment by Morgan so I wouldn't have his behaviour down as quite as bad as you would but still expected better from him both behaviour wise and taking the game to armagh wise.

On what basis should Comer have seen red?

Some of the claptrap here since the match yesterday is incredible. That was a great game, fair play to both sets of players, a phenomenal atmosphere in the stadium which the Armagh support contributed to in a massive way. The melee was the usual handbags with the exception of one complete tr**p who should be fucked out from playing for a year.

Shane Walsh "feigning injury", I'll be kind and assume this person wasn't in CP, how Morgan didn't get a second yellow is the only "remarkable" thing. It's even noted in the IT match report, "they should also have been without James Morgan whose enthusiasm for wrestling Shane Walsh and clattering into him off the ball miraculously failed to draw further punishment than one yellow card.". Presumably this will be disavowed as West Brit propaganda.

I met some absolute gents from Armagh both pre and post match in and around CP, a much fairer appraisal of the match and the controversies was had with them, so to come online and read back through this thread is surprising, either people weren't at the match or if they were, have put some quare slant on what happened out there. I would have preferred a replay for the game but both teams knew that penalties were a possibility.
Galway turned up and once they got over the first 15 minutes gave the performance that was required on a big day. Finnerty, Tierney and McDaid came of age in Galway jerseys yesterday, Tierney had not been in top form in Connacht but came alive in CP. Shane Walsh did not have a good game, he'll know that himself, the great thing is that there is another match to try and play better in only two weeks away.
The Galway collapses are seriously troubling as against Mayo, Roscommon and now Armagh, Galway have been the better team and have contrived to make comfortable victories into something that would take years off you. Gleeson and the kickouts have been flagged as a huge weakness for a long time and it is hard to believe that we got away with those catastrophic errors yesterday. Armagh were gifted 3 goals and still didn't win, the grit and clutch play from McDaid in ET to ensure that they didn't was a sight to behold.

Derry are a formidable team and the league result will have no bearing on the semi final whatsoever. Galway need to show up and play better again the next day again, simple as that.

I've stated I wanted to see Galway win , so I'm at the very least giving a neutral viewpoint. I wasn't at the match, my opinion is formed after watching live Tv,  and replays and analysis , which those at the match didn't benefit from. I equally accept there are things not picked up on camera that I didn't see .
Shane Walsh is as gifted a player as there is in the country. But Look at the video , in the first half he was in agony with an ankle injury , but he managed to strike a free immediately afterwards with perfect technique and balance and run at 100mph. The incident with Morgan looked as if he was in real trouble , writhing about , but again running without impediment immediately after. Morgan was on a booking, who had most to lose by the wrestling match towards the end with Walsh and another?
Armagh are no angels, but it seems to me that Galway escaped scrutiny from the pundits for questionable tactics . Questionable antics are part and parcel for every county team, but RTE seem to cherry pick who they want to scrutinise.