The Diva

[AZOffaly]

Lads, I think we're nearly all in agreement on everything, we just see the same stuff in a different light. We all seem to agree that at the very least Micko gets 'soft soap' in the media, but it's either a) a bad thing or b) perfectly understandable.

I think we all agree on his enthusiasm, his record, his qualities and his impact on the game.

[passedit]

Lads, I think we're nearly all in agreement on everything, we just see the same stuff in a different light. We all seem to agree that at the very least Micko gets 'soft soap' in the media, but it's either a) a bad thing or b) perfectly understandable.

I think we all agree on his enthusiasm, his record, his qualities and his impact on the game.

Do we agree that he is a professional manager who sees the transfer system as a means of improving his teams? Are we all happy that the Thomas Walsh transfer was within the rules of the GAA?

[AZOffaly]

I don't know that you can prove Micko actually tapped him up, rather than Wicklow doing it, or Tommy Walsh himself initiating it. It seems that he does have an above average amount of transferees on his teams, but I asked the question earlier about how many gravitated as a chance to work with him?

I have an opinion on him regarding his tactics/cynicism and his media profile, but I can't prove anything about what money he may or may not get himself from these counties, nor what he does, if anything, to encourage lads to come play for him.

[Main Street]

AZ,  it sounds like you are actually defending Micko there.

For sure, all innuendoes should be shoved into the dustbin.

It would be a double irony if Wicklow could beat Laois. I think they have a fighting chance.

[AZOffaly]

I'm not defending him. I've a bit of a sick head this morning, but not that sick. All I'll say is that I don't know of any proof of any of that stuff, so I'm not going to slate him on those grounds. In fact, I don't think I'm slating him, as a manager or a man, at all. I'm just saying he does what every other manager in the country tries to do, and he does it successfully.

Obviously we've all heard anecdotal evidence about the other stuff, but you can't attack a man based on anecdotal evidence. The things I'm mentioning, I have seen with my own eyes, so I'm comfortable with my opinion on them, even if others disagree. That's the beauty of discussion I suppose

By the way, is the board on the way back? This is about the 5th or 6th issue, with stongly held differing views, which has been debated well, without much, if any, abuse or childish ranting.

With GalteeMountainBoy, BottleThrower, HomeofHurling and a few others starting to post on the hurling board as well, maybe the tide is turning back to what we used to love about this board.

Hope so.

[behind the wire]

transfers of player s is something that the gaa have been turning a blind eye to for years. thomas walsh was one of many.

[orangeman]

AZ,  it sounds like you are actually defending Micko there.

For sure, all innuendoes should be shoved into the dustbin.

It would be a double irony if Wicklow could beat Laois. I think they have a fighting chance.

[/b]


I think they'll be stuffed !

[Main Street]

Teams with a fighting chance are usually stuffed, thats why we say they have a fighting chance.
If they put up a fight they have a chance of success in certain circumstances.

[Lar Naparka]

It’s been a good discussion alright and the subject has been well and truly aired. After what I’ve read so far I have the impression that it’s a case of being more sinned against than sinning.
Honestly, I knew little or nothing about the man when I hit upon this thread.
I knew his managerial record alright and  the fact that he could be a nuisance on the sideline at times but other than that I’d be stuck if I had to compose a CV for him.
I’m keeping in mind that I have heard plenty of derogatory stories about the man that could be deemed libellous – or slanderous if they appeared in print.
The criticism I have read here stops well short of that but really no hard evidence has been offered to explain the widespread reservations about his manner or methods of work.
I mean if I read a statement along the lines of, say, “He’s a wily old rogue and his cunning is boundless,” I can take it as an honest opinion but not as a statement of fact.
I’d really need some concrete evidence to back up this opinion before I could accept it as being true and accurate.
I can go as far as taking it to be probably true but I wouldn’t pass it on as being definitely so.
In fairness to his detractors, I can relate to some of the criticisms posted here. His frequent pitch incursions and the fact that Kildare and Laois teams under his managership earned reputations for diving and drawing frees from opposing defenders was widely reported in the media at the time.
I never had enough reason to go to any match where Micko managed either side but I have read enough and seen enough TV reports to make up my own mind that he could be a bloody nuisance on the sideline and also be guilty of unsporting tactics on the field.
In short, I’ve come to that conclusion from reading media reports and watching TV analysis. In all fairness, I can’t accept an assertion that he has had an easy ride from the media throughout his managerial career.
For me, his supporters have presented a strong and obvious case; his detractors, without doubting their sincerity, still need to back up generalisations with hard evidence.

[AZOffaly]

Janey, I dunno Lar. I respect you thinking that way, but I only see opinions, on both sides, I don't see any 'facts' as such. And I suppose that's what the game is all about. I think it's all a matter of perception as well. I think Laois and Kildare dived to win frees, and that's being argued as winning frees due to their style of play and/or size. Fair enough, that's opinion, and I'll stand by mine, while taking the others' into account.

The main difference between the sides is that my perception is that he gets an easy ride, because of who he is and what he's done, and I don't like it. Others say he does, but it doesn't matter, and others again say he doesn't. Again, fair enough.

I just did a quick google, to see if I am going mad, and I immediately came across this article. I see it as being slightly sycophantic, or worse, but maybe that's just my cynical viewpoint regarding the media's treatment of him. RTE Television also, in my mind, fawn over him. The thing is that in my opinion, he doesn't need fawning or plamásing. His record speaks for itself.

Anyhow, I don't think we're going to change minds here at this stage, and as I said, it just seems to be the old 'one man's patriot' argument.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-football/mick-odwyer-glory-games-leading-man-1203496.html

[orangeman]

Next month he will be off to New York with Wicklow, who will play at the official opening of new floodlights in Gaelic Park with the same boyish enthusiasm as for his first trip abroad 50 years ago. Some man


I AGREE !

[AZOffaly]

This one as well.. although I don't even know who/what the Munster Express is. But look at the piece in bold. I nearly gagged

Micko leads Wicklow out of the wilderness
Wednesday, May 21st, 2008

by Jamie O'Keeffe

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*

Though he'd hate the term, Mick O'Dwyer is the ultimate 'Celebrity Bainisteoir'.

However, the legendary Kerryman, who just refuses to go quietly, knows that real life is much more interesting and rewarding than fiction.

It's 22 years since this former playing great led a team to an All-Ireland, his eighth as a manager: namely, that second three-in-a-row Kingdom side.

However, as Eugene McGee - whose Offaly denied O'Dywer seven Sams on the spin - observed this week, he's "never lost it" in the meantime. Indeed in McGee's view he's the only coach in the country who could have masterminded a first ever senior championship victory by the Wicklow footballers in Croke Park, and live on the telly to boot.

Ever since quitting his native county, the Waterville wanderer has taken on increasingly tough challenges: initially in Kildare where he'd two spells (guiding them to an All-Ireland final), then Laois, where on reflection he worked wonders, and now Wicklow - all with relative but definite success.

Still, having forgotten the fleeting touch of romance he brought to last year's championship - his debut season with The Garden County gleaning the much-maligned Tommy Murphy Cup - before last Sunday's shock win over Kieran McGeeny's Lilywhites, most pundits were signalling the near-72-year-old's number was finally up.

But not for the first time, and most probably not the last, he confounded expectations - albeit everyone's but his own - with a Leinster quarter-final against Laois, naturally, his next assignment. (It must be said, mind, that after last weekend's heroics it's an indictment of the GAA's treatment of us Division 4 counties that it will take a further victory to ensure the qualifiers draw includes Wicklow. They are an inspiration to their fellow minnows and further evidence that there's very little between most footballing counties right now, with the obvious illustrious exception; the present Kerry team being good enough in O'Dwyer's view to win that elusive five All-Irelands in succession.)

Yes, without that bit of Micko magic, and his enduring sense of straight-up sportsmanship - fair play to him and his teams for always playing fair - Gaelic football, facing a perennial struggle to capture the public's imagination, would be much the poorer.

O'Dwyer is a hotelier and undertaker by profession, though he's made the most of his amateur pursuits too; an ability that at times has been portrayed as more 'mercenary' than Messianic. While he intends to go on "as long there is life in my body", unfortunately he won't last forever. And then all we'll be left with is the upstanding 'Pillar' and the likes.

[orangeman]

This one as well.. although I don't even know who/what the Munster Express is. But look at the piece in bold. I nearly gagged

Micko leads Wicklow out of the wilderness
Wednesday, May 21st, 2008

by Jamie O'Keeffe

    * < prev
    * 1 of 1
    * next >

*

Though he'd hate the term, Mick O'Dwyer is the ultimate 'Celebrity Bainisteoir'.

However, the legendary Kerryman, who just refuses to go quietly, knows that real life is much more interesting and rewarding than fiction.

It's 22 years since this former playing great led a team to an All-Ireland, his eighth as a manager: namely, that second three-in-a-row Kingdom side.

However, as Eugene McGee - whose Offaly denied O'Dywer seven Sams on the spin - observed this week, he's "never lost it" in the meantime. Indeed in McGee's view he's the only coach in the country who could have masterminded a first ever senior championship victory by the Wicklow footballers in Croke Park, and live on the telly to boot.

Ever since quitting his native county, the Waterville wanderer has taken on increasingly tough challenges: initially in Kildare where he'd two spells (guiding them to an All-Ireland final), then Laois, where on reflection he worked wonders, and now Wicklow - all with relative but definite success.

Still, having forgotten the fleeting touch of romance he brought to last year's championship - his debut season with The Garden County gleaning the much-maligned Tommy Murphy Cup - before last Sunday's shock win over Kieran McGeeny's Lilywhites, most pundits were signalling the near-72-year-old's number was finally up.

But not for the first time, and most probably not the last, he confounded expectations - albeit everyone's but his own - with a Leinster quarter-final against Laois, naturally, his next assignment. (It must be said, mind, that after last weekend's heroics it's an indictment of the GAA's treatment of us Division 4 counties that it will take a further victory to ensure the qualifiers draw includes Wicklow. They are an inspiration to their fellow minnows and further evidence that there's very little between most footballing counties right now, with the obvious illustrious exception; the present Kerry team being good enough in O'Dwyer's view to win that elusive five All-Irelands in succession.)

Yes, without that bit of Micko magic, and his enduring sense of straight-up sportsmanship - fair play to him and his teams for always playing fair - Gaelic football, facing a perennial struggle to capture the public's imagination, would be much the poorer.

O'Dwyer is a hotelier and undertaker by profession, though he's made the most of his amateur pursuits too; an ability that at times has been portrayed as more 'mercenary' than Messianic. While he intends to go on "as long there is life in my body", unfortunately he won't last forever. And then all we'll be left with is the upstanding 'Pillar' and the likes.

Ok ok - AZ you can stop the research and going back over the decades !!!!!  We get your point.

[Mike Sheehy]

Do we agree that he is a professional manager who sees the transfer system as a means of improving his teams? Are we all happy that the Thomas Walsh transfer was within the rules of the GAA?

He is as professional as Ross Carr. I've heard the rumours about what managers are on in the North and I'm sure Ross Carr isn't doing it for the good of his health

...and, of course, we wont mention the individuals that benefited when Marty Clarke went to AFL....lots of dosh changed hands in that deal from what I heard.

[ONeill]

He is as professional as Ross Carr. I've heard the rumours about what managers are on in the North and I'm sure Ross Carr isn't doing it for the good of his health

Really? What's Harte on? Crozier? Gormley? McIvor? PM me if you don't want it public. Amazing the sleuths in Kerry.