The Palestine thread

[haveaharp]

While governments everywhere do nothing, turn a blind eye etc. What about the arab league ?

Seafoid and give her dixie, i admire your passion on the subject, and you both seem to be under the impression (especially seafoid) that something has to change "israel is finished" etc. What do you think is likely to happen ? (Not what do you want to happen)

Disappointed in Obama but should not have expected anything other than the "israel has the right to defend itself" line.

[glens abu]

Good turnout at rally in Belfast tonight and mass rally and march planned for Sat so everyone who can make it please try your best to be there and bring someone with you.

[Íseal agus crua isteach a]

While governments everywhere do nothing, turn a blind eye etc. What about the arab league ?

Seafoid and give her dixie, i admire your passion on the subject, and you both seem to be under the impression (especially seafoid) that something has to change "israel is finished" etc. What do you think is likely to happen ? (Not what do you want to happen)

Disappointed in Obama but should not have expected anything other than the "israel has the right to defend itself" line.

I posted a link to a documentary a couple of pages back. This should answers most of anyones questions. Barack is part of the Israeli mafia that controls American politics. 

[seafoid]

While governments everywhere do nothing, turn a blind eye etc. What about the arab league ?

Seafoid and give her dixie, i admire your passion on the subject, and you both seem to be under the impression (especially seafoid) that something has to change "israel is finished" etc. What do you think is likely to happen ? (Not what do you want to happen)

Disappointed in Obama but should not have expected anything other than the "israel has the right to defend itself" line.

I think Israel has thrived because of a few factors

- European holocaust guilt
- blind support from the Jewish diaspora
- the Lobby in the States
- Arab weakness
- American Empire
- sympathy from the ordinary people of the West, the romance of it, Exodus, the miracle of making the desert bloom, whatever
-  the peace process

As long as the peace process went on any criticism of Israel could be held at bay. It was a country say a bit like Northern Ireland with a political problem but it was in a process and working for peace and would get there.  Decent people gave Israel the benefit of the doubt in good faith.

Now it is clear the peace process was a joke, an excuse for a land grab .
http://www.aljazeera.com/palestinepapers/

There won't be a Palestinian state. There will instead be apartheid. The Europeans will pick up the tab. Long term Israel will follow Moshe Dayan's advice on how to manage the Palestinians "Treat them like dogs- those who want to can leave". By 2018 there will be over 1 million Jewish settlers in the West Bank. That is just taking the piss.


I think this is a game changer.  Walt and Mearsheimer and Jimmy Carter both wrote important books a few years ago about where Israel was headed and they were slated for antisemitism but they have been proved right.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Israel_Lobby_and_U.S._Foreign_Policy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peace_Not_Apartheid


The ADL is a Jewish charity that was set up to fight racism and bigotry in the US in the 1920s. Now it actively supports Israeli apartheid in the West Bank and Gaza. Hypocrisy is the greatest luxury.

At the moment anyone who is critical of Israel is labeled an antisemite but this insult becomes less and less effective the more Israel's long term strategy is revealed.

What is likely to happen?

First of all Israel will lose support in Europe. Then it is very hard to see younger American Jews who mostly tend towards the Democrats to support an openly racist policy that says that Jews are superior to Palestinians. So I think there will be a widening gap between Israeli Jews and American Jews.   A lot of american Jews don't want to admit that Israel does things like fire white phosphorous on civilians or demolish the homes of non Jews. "Jews wouldn't do that" . But unfortunately they do in Israel. 

The cost of the Jewish state now is the abandonment of Jewish ethics. So Israel can take a Machiavellian stance and say "it is not as bad as Somalia" but what is the point of the Jewish state then?  You adopt nihilism and you bless it. For what ?

Looking at the pillars of support

-I think the Germans have paid enough for the holocaust and younger Germans especially will be horrified by apartheid   
-The Jewish diaspora will slowly turn away
-The lobby is a wedge run by a minority- maybe this will hold out longest
-The Arabs are moving to a situation where their governments reflect the thinking of the people and nobody Arab buys Israeli PR.
-The Americans have lost their sole superpower status and China doesn't care about WW2 or owe anything to Israel
-Ordinary people will be turned away by racism and bigotry and apartheid
-There is no peace process

Israeli society will become more extremist and there will be more wars but ultimately Israel won't be able to convince the rest of the world to put up with it.

It is a total mess. 

[seafoid]

Netanyahu is such a tr**p.

http://www.mfa.gov.il/MFA/Government/Speeches+by+Israeli+leaders/2012/PM_Netanyahu_meeting_UNSG_Ban_Ki-Moon_20-Nov-2012.htm


"The moment we draw symmetry between the victims of terror and the unintended casualties that result from legitimate military action against the terrorists, the minute that false symmetry is drawn, the terrorists win."

[Harold Disgracey]

Sick bastards.

@IDFSpokesperson: Warning to reporters in Gaza: Stay away from Hamas operatives & facilities. Hamas, a terrorist group, will use you as human shields.

[Denn Forever]

If we got the 2 state solution and  both sides did not attack each other (No rockets and no more settlements), would either state be viable? 

[seafoid]

There is a whole  system behind what Israel is doing

http://www.haaretz.com/news/features/american-jews-one-way-ticket-to-the-front-line.premium-1.479238#

It is not at all clear that Lakein, who is not even registered yet as a reservist, will even be needed for service. But this does not seem to faze him. Tomorrow, he says, after a night in Jerusalem at the home of friends, he will go to the induction center, and ask to be allowed to head to the front lines of the offensive. "The Lubavitch rebbe said that 'whoever serves in the IDF gets his place reserved in the world to come.'"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lubavitcher

[give her dixie]

A bus has been hit in Tel Aviv, with 10 people injured. This will be a slight game changer me thinks.....

Retaliation will be swift and brutal in Gaza.

[haveaharp]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-20425352

[give her dixie]

This is a link to my web site where there are 3 live stream channels set up:

http://gazatvnews.com/gaza-live-stream/

1 is an English guy, Harry Fear reporting live. There is a live stream of the Gaza skyline
where you can hear the various aircraft roaming the skies bombing Gaza. The 3rd is
the Al Jazeera channel.

This is my facebook page: http://www.facebook.com/GazaTVNews

Twitter feed: https://twitter.com/GazaTVNews

I have 4 different people in Gaza as admins, and they are reporting live as attacks take place.

The power of social media in the past week has been huge as the truth is out 30 minutes before the main stream get hold of the story. There are some heroes in Gaza who have been working around the clock blogging and tweeting about the reality of this current massacre, and I have been retweeting and posting their links all week. 

[nrico2006]

Going by this thread you would swear it was all one way, harrowing pictures on TV last night of Israeli nationals bodies been dragged around by motorbikes.

[Nally Stand]

Going by this thread you would swear it was all one way, harrowing pictures on TV last night of Israeli nationals bodies been dragged around by motorbikes.

I would say where the anger is directed at on this thread is in direct proportion to the events as they have unfolded. 5 Israelis killed compared to over 140 Palestinians, over 20% of whom were children? What do you expect, a wishy-washy discussion where we pretend both sides are just as bad as each other?

[give her dixie]

Going by this thread you would swear it was all one way, harrowing pictures on TV last night of Israeli nationals bodies been dragged around by motorbikes.

No Israeli nationals were dragged around by motorbikes. Get your facts right.

[Denn Forever]

A new low.  Sympathy for the Gaza crisis is hard to maintain when you see that.