The IRISH RUGBY thread

[screenexile]

How come the kicker is respected down in Thomond Park but not up in Dublin?

Respected in Belfast as well.

[mouview]

Scotland currently at 6/4 with PPs to beat Ireland must be the bet of the month. A resurgent team against a tired looking one shorn of mainstays such as Sexton, McCarthy, Zebo, possibly BOD and Cian Healy. As I said earlier, the one thing this Irish team does give you is great investment opportunities.

[Bord na Mona man]

What do any of you lads that know a bit about rugby think of George Hooks punditry.

I played the game as a juvenile but wouldnt claim to know anything about it. So I always follow John Giles take on punditry that a good pundit should be able to explain the details of a game to the likes of me and add to their enjoyment of any game. I think Most pundits do this, Conor O'Shea especially. But all Hook seems to do is come out with over the top sound bites that create a bit of faux controversy and he adds nothing to my understanding or enjpyment of the game.

The rugby panel has gone the way of the RTE football panel.
Too many football analysis sessions get taken over by the Spillane vs. Brolly, Kerry vs. Ulster oneupmanship sideshow.

In rugby George Hook with his old-school oafery and McGurk with his non-stop interruptions has started to dominate.
It sticks out even moreso now that there is a new generation of pundits like O'Shea and Horgan from the professional era where the game is now forensically dissected.

I wouldn't absolve Giles from it either. All to often he starts his analysis of a random World Cup or European Championship game with "Well, I don't know much about them Bill". Happy enough that a few generic clichés about "moral courage" and "taking every game on its merits" will cover most bases.

[Hound]

How come the kicker is respected down in Thomond Park but not up in Dublin?

Respect my hole. There's been games in Thomond when Shane Geraghty and Jonny Sexton (for two examples) have been barracked from the first whistle to the final whistle every time they got the ball, apart from kicking at goal.

You really think the silence is out of respect? Then why the vitriol at other times? Why does the oppostion hooker get no respect when throwing in a ball to a lineout?

[AZOffaly]

Hound, kickers at Thomond Park get silence when they are kicking for goal, and yes, that is out of respect. Other times they, along with others, get dogs abuse. The opposition hooker gets noise to try and disrupt the throw, absolutely, but as that is a 'contested' play, it's to help the defensive lineout. If you think there's another reason for the silence for the kicker, you're reading too much into it.

[Olaf]

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The "respect the kicker" is whole load of nonsense. Respect the opposition before the match and after the match is what really matters. But whether its a wall of silence or a wall of noise, the home crowd should do their best to intimidate the kicker. Likewise the hooker, but he gets a lot less sympathy for some reason when a cacophony of noise tries to upset him. In my experience the home crowds at Toulouse and Munster are the best at intimidating oppostion and officials.
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Silence for a place kicker should always be observed.

In the amateur era it was always respected , not so much in the professional era. Bad form for crowds to boo a place kicker. Not on.

[Hardy]

You have to remember Hound is a Dub. (Smiley)

[Crete Boom]

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The "respect the kicker" is whole load of nonsense. Respect the opposition before the match and after the match is what really matters. But whether its a wall of silence or a wall of noise, the home crowd should do their best to intimidate the kicker. Likewise the hooker, but he gets a lot less sympathy for some reason when a cacophony of noise tries to upset him. In my experience the home crowds at Toulouse and Munster are the best at intimidating oppostion and officials.

Silence for a place kicker should always be observed.

In the amateur era it was always respected , not so much in the professional era. Bad form for crowds to boo a place kicker. Not on.
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I'd strongly disagree as the only grounds I remember it being always silent were Thomond and Doradoyle.Whereas you might have a lull in noise as the kicker lined up the kick they was plenty of castcalls and booing as soon as he started his run up be it the Musgrave , Ravenhill , Templeville Road , the Sportsground or wherever. I think you might be looking at the amateur era crowds through some rose tinted glasses ( or Guinness filled pint glasses as it would have been then) there Olaf .

[Dinny Breen]

Love the revisionism, silence for the kickers is an IRISH tradition and is still observed at the RDS, Sportsground etc and every senior and junior rugby ground in Ireland.

The problem with Sunday was that every time Farrell went to kick a rendition of 'Sweet Chariot' started up and the response of the Irish support was to drown it out with boos and whistles.

[Hound]

A load of hypocritical shite. You can have someone screaming obscenities at an opposition player one moment, but being silent for the kick at goal the next, and its showing respect?! Me ballix. Munster fans show less respect for opponents than any other province. Silence for the kicker doesn't alter that. They're not as bad as the Toulouse fans, but it means they create fantastic atmospheres in their matches

[haze]

Love the revisionism, silence for the kickers is an IRISH tradition and is still observed at the RDS, Sportsground etc and every senior and junior rugby ground in Ireland.

The problem with Sunday was that every time Farrell went to kick a rendition of 'Sweet Chariot' started up and the response of the Irish support was to drown it out with boos and whistles.

Agreed. Farrell was respected on Sunday

The bigger issue is the atmosphere in the Aviva followers is not remotely close to what it was in Landsdowne - maybe some revisionism at play here on my part and there are other factors at play but for me the Munster/Leinster rivalry is affecting it big time. Last three times I have had to listen to petty squabbling between so called Munster/Leinster fans. Against Argentina 3 lads behind me moaned incessantly when Fields of Athenry was sung. Clowns

[GalwayBayBoy]

Article today on balls.ie on the current atmosphere at the Aviva actually.

What The Hell Has Happened To The Atmosphere At Ireland Home Matches?

    Posted on:February 11, 2013
    Author:Cian Tracey
   
Irish rugby fans long standing tradition of being one of the most respectful and passionate is increasingly worsening game by game.

The main gripe I have with Ireland supporters at the moment is their insistent need to boo and jeer opposition place kickers. Irish rugby grounds have always been ones that withhold the respectful tradition of staying silent for the opposition's kicker. Yesterday at the Aviva, Owen Farrell had six attempts at goal and for each one he was subject to mindless jeering from what seems to be a current crop of supporters who don't understand the traditions of Irish rugby.

Any supporter who thinks that booing and hurling insults at the opposition is going to put them off their game is sadly mistaken. Kickers are subject to the same treatment all around the world. What once made Irish rugby special was the eerie silence that descended upon Lansdowne Road (and other grounds around the country) while an opposing player lined up a kick. This is always going to have a longer lasting effect than shouting or whistling.

If the English fans had turned around and handed out the same treatment to Ronan O'Gara yesterday, the home supporters would have cried foul. Instead, they remained respectfully silent for Ireland's three place kicks.

The same treatment was dished out to Morgan Parra last December when Leinster played Clermont Auvergne but like Farrell, he effortlessly slotted the majority of his kicks, despite the 'hostile' treatment from partisan home crowd.

Thomond Park has continued its long standing tradition of observing silence for the kickers, despite the rise of a seemingly younger generation of supporters who might have been ignorant to what has gone before them. The decision to allocate school children in a designated area of the ground is one that is regularly questioned amongst the terraces by rugby fans. During the Heineken Cup pool clash between Munster and Edinburgh in October, the majority of the crowd remained quiet but behind the goal there were a few cries from squeaking voices.

The obvious solution seems to be to get rid of this designated school children zone. Perhaps the youngsters could learn a thing or two from spending time amongst the supporters responsible for this tradition.

That day in Thomond Park, the stadium announcer politely informed the ignorant of Munster's long standing tradition. On neither occasion on my last two trips to the Aviva Stadium did the stadium announcer try and encourage the home support to observe silence for kickers. He was probably more concerned with preparing the obscene music that is played after a home score, which brings me onto my next gripe.

When did Irish rugby attempt to generate an atmosphere at our home ground straight of an American sporting event? And who was responsible for this nonsensical decision?

That Dropkick Murphy's from the Departed has earned the title of the most annoying song of the last decade. As Ireland ran out on to the pitch yesterday to this pointless music, you couldn't help but feel it took something special away from the atmosphere.

Irish rugby has now unfortunately gone down the road of playing this ridiculous music after each time they score, much in the same vein as is seen on a Saturday afternoon across English soccer grounds. This has to stop. And soon.

But what was worse yesterday was the decision to repeatedly play a loud drum noise to entice a unified 'Ireland' roar at the end of the beat. Any rugby supporter that needs encouragement from a PA system to shout for their team should stay at home on the couch where they belong. It's another sure sign of taking the game away from its roots. If the younger generation are growing up with this as the norm, what state will Irish rugby support be in ten years' time?

Since Irish rugby has moved back to the redeveloped Lansdowne Road, it has far from been a fortress. From Ireland's fourteen games played at the Aviva stadium, they have won just six times. It is a damning statistic that highlights Ireland's apparent lack of home advantage.

With a packed house in attendance yesterday, it was the away supporters that were the loudest. The only times during the game that the Irish fans made themselves heard was when they whistled and jeered to drown out the cries of 'Swing Low' and when they did similar in their foolish attempts to put Farrell off his place kicks.

With the direction Irish support has been going in the last few years, is it any wonder that away teams don't fear their trip to Dublin anymore?

[michaelg]

The BBC panel had it right, was it a great game or a terrible game. They agreed it was a both. If you win those type of games, its great, lose and its terrible. Ireland just made the mistakes first and more regular, which handed England the scores at the right times. Also the changes had a negative affect on Ireland.

O'Gara isn't the future but you can't see Kidney been bold enough to change him.

Also, felt the crowds jeering of the English kicker was out of place when he was on penalties.

Was disappointed by that also.  In fairness though, quite a lot of the jeering seemed to be in response to the Engloid fans singing that hateful chariots shite.
By no means an expert, but I felt that the scrum half Murray was dreadful.  Really laboured, slow ball from him throughout the match.

Just curious but how exactly is the "Sweet Chariots" song/ hymn so "hateful"? How did it cause the booing of the kicker?

Hateful was a bit strong.  Annoying would be more appropriate.  Point I was making was that the jeering seemed to be aimed initially at the English fans' attempts to Chariots going, as opposed to booing the kicker. 

[AZOffaly]

A load of hypocritical shite. You can have someone screaming obscenities at an opposition player one moment, but being silent for the kick at goal the next, and its showing respect?! Me ballix. Munster fans show less respect for opponents than any other province. Silence for the kicker doesn't alter that. They're not as bad as the Toulouse fans, but it means they create fantastic atmospheres in their matches

Have to disagree Hound. I'm there every match, and from my perspective the silence for the kicker is born out of respect.

[Donnellys Hollow]

Love the revisionism, silence for the kickers is an IRISH tradition and is still observed at the RDS, Sportsground etc and every senior and junior rugby ground in Ireland.

The problem with Sunday was that every time Farrell went to kick a rendition of 'Sweet Chariot' started up and the response of the Irish support was to drown it out with boos and whistles.

Agreed. Farrell was respected on Sunday

The bigger issue is the atmosphere in the Aviva followers is not remotely close to what it was in Landsdowne - maybe some revisionism at play here on my part and there are other factors at play but for me the Munster/Leinster rivalry is affecting it big time. Last three times I have had to listen to petty squabbling between so called Munster/Leinster fans. Against Argentina 3 lads behind me moaned incessantly when Fields of Athenry was sung. Clowns

I'd agree with that. I go to the odd international when I get the chance and the amount of Leinster/Munster crap you'd hear has reached ridiculous levels recently. It was never an issue during the nineties and the atmosphere was way better even though we were competing for the wooden spoon annually.