Sam Maguire permutations

[An Fhairche Abu]

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/2023/06/07/darragh-o-se-dublin-are-being-written-off-and-thats-what-they-will-like/

Mayo kept tipping and tapping away against Louth, but struggled to kick points the way they did against Kerry. Sure, Matthew Ruane kicked a great point, Paddy Durcan later on too, but they didn't get the same spread of scorers, or range of kickers, as the last day.

That's still their Achilles heel and could come back to haunt them. They don't have the consistent range of kickers that Dublin or Galway have right now.

The talk of Galway depth upfront is overplayed.
In terms of the forwards, outside of Comer and Walsh, no one has put up a big match winning scoring contribution in a match that mattered in CP. Galway depth at the minute is in the middle eight, plenty of lads in HF line that can chip in with one or two points (maybe that's all that will be needed but we didn't get it in the final last year) but would be worried that Walsh is miles out of form. Galway really need another heavy scorer to step up, Finnerty could be that player but he's been injured all year basically, if the ankle has hobbled him again then forget any meaningful impact this year given how much of the IC season is left. Tierney has it in him but needs to do it more often, Ian Burke is never going to be that big scorer, Cooke will get scores but unrealistic to expect 4 points from him every day given his role. Galway are really poor at finishing goal chances this year as well, my biggest worry about the team is up front to be honest.

Mayo don't even have one marquee forward. They don't produce them, for some reason
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nFGkGbs4DE&t=1012s

They have the top scorer of all time, I'm no fan of O'Connor because of his other antics but he scores often and scores heavy, how is that not marquee?

He is some freetaker but at the business end in all of those finals Mayo always seemed to come up against a scoring ceiling. This problem is very old. A marquee forward would have fixed it with a bit of support.

He kicked the equaliser for the draw 2016 final and it was not some easy tap over free, just inside the 45 and as high pressure a kick as you'd get. Middling lads don't get that score, I don't think on mature reflection that he is the reason they lost any of the finals, you mention a lack of support for a "marquee", I'd say that's more the issue.
I can't believe I'm having to defend a player I absolutely can't stand but here we are.

[seafoid]

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/2023/06/07/darragh-o-se-dublin-are-being-written-off-and-thats-what-they-will-like/

Mayo kept tipping and tapping away against Louth, but struggled to kick points the way they did against Kerry. Sure, Matthew Ruane kicked a great point, Paddy Durcan later on too, but they didn't get the same spread of scorers, or range of kickers, as the last day.

That's still their Achilles heel and could come back to haunt them. They don't have the consistent range of kickers that Dublin or Galway have right now.

The talk of Galway depth upfront is overplayed.
In terms of the forwards, outside of Comer and Walsh, no one has put up a big match winning scoring contribution in a match that mattered in CP. Galway depth at the minute is in the middle eight, plenty of lads in HF line that can chip in with one or two points (maybe that's all that will be needed but we didn't get it in the final last year) but would be worried that Walsh is miles out of form. Galway really need another heavy scorer to step up, Finnerty could be that player but he's been injured all year basically, if the ankle has hobbled him again then forget any meaningful impact this year given how much of the IC season is left. Tierney has it in him but needs to do it more often, Ian Burke is never going to be that big scorer, Cooke will get scores but unrealistic to expect 4 points from him every day given his role. Galway are really poor at finishing goal chances this year as well, my biggest worry about the team is up front to be honest.

Mayo don't even have one marquee forward. They don't produce them, for some reason
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nFGkGbs4DE&t=1012s

They have the top scorer of all time, I'm no fan of O'Connor because of his other antics but he scores often and scores heavy, how is that not marquee?

He is some freetaker but at the business end in all of those finals Mayo always seemed to come up against a scoring ceiling. This problem is very old. A marquee forward would have fixed it with a bit of support.

He kicked the equaliser for the draw 2016 final and it was not some easy tap over free, just inside the 45 and as high pressure a kick as you'd get. Middling lads don't get that score, I don't think on mature reflection that he is the reason they lost any of the finals, you mention a lack of support for a "marquee", I'd say that's more the issue.
I can't believe I'm having to defend a player I absolutely can't stand but here we are.

The main problem is a lack of scoring forwards and no sign of a culture of producing them. Mayo would be morchuid runners, gannchuid shooters and that problem goes back to the 90s if not before. Something got lost post 1951.

The great struggle of Connacht football between 1995 and 1999 was settled by 2 scoring forwards- Joyce and Donnellan. Mayo got very close in 96 and 97 but no cigar.
You need scoring forwards to win stuff. Frees are not enough.

[larryin89]

Tommy conroy , James Carr & Ryan o donoghue might prove ya wrong someday sea food .

[seafoid]

Tommy conroy , James Carr & Ryan o donoghue might prove ya wrong someday sea food .

I would love to see it. 

[Cunny Funt]

Mayo had the championship top scoring forward in Cillian O'Connor and footballer of the year forward in Andy Moran.  Downfall in AI finals for Mayo especially under Horan was conceding goals.

2012 v Donegal 2-11 to 0-13 (13 scores each)
2013 v Dublin 2-12 to 1-14 (14 scores v 15)
2020 v Dublin 2-14 to 0-15 (16 scores v 15)
2021 v Tyrone 2-14 to 0-15 (16 scores v 15)

Then you had the drawn final under Rochford in 2016 where two OGs was conceded. He decided to change the keeper for the replay a gamble that didn't pay off as he gifted a penalty to Dublin in a match lost by 1 point.

[seafoid]

Mayo had the championship top scoring forward in Cillian O'Connor and footballer of the year forward in Andy Moran.  Downfall in AI finals for Mayo especially under Horan was conceding goals.

2012 v Donegal 2-11 to 0-13 (13 scores each)
2013 v Dublin 2-12 to 1-14 (14 scores v 15)
2020 v Dublin 2-14 to 0-15 (16 scores v 15)
2021 v Tyrone 2-14 to 0-15 (16 scores v 15)

Then you had the drawn final under Rochford in 2016 where two OGs was conceded. He decided to change the keeper for the replay a gamble that didn't pay off as he gifted a penalty to Dublin in a match lost by 1 point.

15 points was enough to win the all Ireland in only 5 of the last 22 finals.

[Cunny Funt]

Mayo had the championship top scoring forward in Cillian O'Connor and footballer of the year forward in Andy Moran.  Downfall in AI finals for Mayo especially under Horan was conceding goals.

2012 v Donegal 2-11 to 0-13 (13 scores each)
2013 v Dublin 2-12 to 1-14 (14 scores v 15)
2020 v Dublin 2-14 to 0-15 (16 scores v 15)
2021 v Tyrone 2-14 to 0-15 (16 scores v 15)

Then you had the drawn final under Rochford in 2016 where two OGs was conceded. He decided to change the keeper for the replay a gamble that didn't pay off as he gifted a penalty to Dublin in a match lost by 1 point.

15 points was enough to win the all Ireland in only 5 of the last 22 finals.

Yes because the opposition concedes too much and as highlighted Mayo more often than not in that regard. 

[imtommygunn]

Finnerty was excellent in the ai final last year. I thought it was a very underrated performance as he sent Walsh in a lot of quality ball whacked to his performance.

[Manning18]

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/2023/06/07/darragh-o-se-dublin-are-being-written-off-and-thats-what-they-will-like/

Mayo kept tipping and tapping away against Louth, but struggled to kick points the way they did against Kerry. Sure, Matthew Ruane kicked a great point, Paddy Durcan later on too, but they didn't get the same spread of scorers, or range of kickers, as the last day.

That's still their Achilles heel and could come back to haunt them. They don't have the consistent range of kickers that Dublin or Galway have right now.

The talk of Galway depth upfront is overplayed.
In terms of the forwards, outside of Comer and Walsh, no one has put up a big match winning scoring contribution in a match that mattered in CP. Galway depth at the minute is in the middle eight, plenty of lads in HF line that can chip in with one or two points (maybe that's all that will be needed but we didn't get it in the final last year) but would be worried that Walsh is miles out of form. Galway really need another heavy scorer to step up, Finnerty could be that player but he's been injured all year basically, if the ankle has hobbled him again then forget any meaningful impact this year given how much of the IC season is left. Tierney has it in him but needs to do it more often, Ian Burke is never going to be that big scorer, Cooke will get scores but unrealistic to expect 4 points from him every day given his role. Galway are really poor at finishing goal chances this year as well, my biggest worry about the team is up front to be honest.

Mayo don't even have one marquee forward. They don't produce them, for some reason
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nFGkGbs4DE&t=1012s

They have the top scorer of all time, I'm no fan of O'Connor because of his other antics but he scores often and scores heavy, how is that not marquee?

He is some freetaker but at the business end in all of those finals Mayo always seemed to come up against a scoring ceiling. This problem is very old. A marquee forward would have fixed it with a bit of support.

He kicked the equaliser for the draw 2016 final and it was not some easy tap over free, just inside the 45 and as high pressure a kick as you'd get. Middling lads don't get that score, I don't think on mature reflection that he is the reason they lost any of the finals, you mention a lack of support for a "marquee", I'd say that's more the issue.
I can't believe I'm having to defend a player I absolutely can't stand but here we are.

The main problem is a lack of scoring forwards and no sign of a culture of producing them. Mayo would be morchuid runners, gannchuid shooters and that problem goes back to the 90s if not before. Something got lost post 1951.

The great struggle of Connacht football between 1995 and 1999 was settled by 2 scoring forwards- Joyce and Donnellan. Mayo got very close in 96 and 97 but no cigar.
You need scoring forwards to win stuff. Frees are not enough.

Galway forwards outside of Shane Walsh and possibly Comer are unproven on the big day. Tierney and Larry Finnerty  big tallies in league and against minnows in Connacht.

You counting Roscommon in the minnows? Their top class performances have come against them I suppose to be fair

Ian Burke had top class performances v Kerry in Croker in 2017 and 2018. Was very lively v Dublin in 2018 semi in the first half, until Galway got killed in the second. Don't think he's played IC there since, only winning in club

[Blowitupref]

RTE selected games for round 3 are Sunday the 18th 1:45 Roscommon v Kildare and 4pm Armagh v Galway.  4 other games will be live on GAAGO.  Louth v Kerry and Derry v Clare not covered.

[seafoid]

Another team that was also dominant between 2015 and 2020

https://www.irishtimes.com/crime-law/2023/06/10/kinahan-cartel-collapse-theyre-in-disarray-because-they-dont-know-whats-next-and-whos-next/

[seafoid]

Dublin now 9/4 and Kerry now 7/2
They are slowly converging with the pack

https://www.oddschecker.com/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/all-ireland-senior-football-championship/winner

[Derryman forever]

Dublin now 9/4 and Kerry now 7/2
They are slowly converging with the pack

https://www.oddschecker.com/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/all-ireland-senior-football-championship/winner

How come Down are better odds than westmeath? When they are not even in the all ireland series?

[seafoid]

Dublin now 9/4 and Kerry now 7/2
They are slowly converging with the pack

https://www.oddschecker.com/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/all-ireland-senior-football-championship/winner

How come Down are better odds than westmeath? When they are not even in the all ireland series?

the numbers must have been compiled by a Presbyterian

[Jell 0 Biafra]

Dublin now 9/4 and Kerry now 7/2
They are slowly converging with the pack

https://www.oddschecker.com/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/all-ireland-senior-football-championship/winner

How come Down are better odds than westmeath? When they are not even in the all ireland series?

Tells you all you need to know about how they rate Westmeath's chances.