Once again an absolute thriller served up by these two fantastic teams.
I could not believe how Eoin McGrath did not take his point at the end. It could have been very very costly for Waterford. After all Donal Og saved Cork last year. Whatever the merits of the awarding of the free (and it was correct technically) Waterford were very lucky to get a point after Donal Og made the save. Considering what was at stake McGrath made a serious error not taking the point and is blessed that they had a reprieve.
I think that Paul Flynn should have taken that last free and gone for a goal.
Quote from: Onlooker on July 29, 2007, 11:08:30 PM
I think that Paul Flynn should have taken that last free and gone for a goal.
Thank f**k you are not a manager then numbskull........
Nah, fcuk it, he was just right - why take the boring option all the time - i'll stop short of saying that Flynn should have taken the last free and went for a goal - and it was definite free btw - but, i asked this earlier - why not a penalty? And if it had been a penalty, what should Waterford have done?
If Damien Fitzhenry could score a goal from a 20 metre free on Saturday, who can say that Paul Flynn could not have done the same on Sunday. If it had been a penalty I am sure that Flynn would have taken it and gone for a goal and he would probably have scored it. We will never know, but one opinion is as valid as the other.
The difference was that Wexford were two points down, so they had nothing to lose and took their chances on Fitz burying it.
Waterford had just got out of jail by being awarded the free after mcgrath rightly went for goal. However I think he should have either brought it closer to the goal before shooting or used the guys inside to walk it into the goal. At that stage they did the right thing by taing the point and having another crack at it next week.
Any fixture yet for the replay?
I think he had Flynn inside him and a hand pass would have left him an open goal. So I think he should have passed it.
No question on the free - the ref was 100% right IMO. Far too often refs give a free out to the goalie in that situation and if someone lays to the ball out field they throw the ball in. A penalty is only given for an aggressive foul. Taking the point from the free was the right call.
There would even been risks with the hand-pass, he should have taken the point and if Donal Og had cleared the ball he may well have been castigated by Waterford hurling folk for not doing so.
Confidence and winning mentality... do you thnk if Joe Deane or Henry S were in the same position they would have went for a point? I doubt it! One on one with the goalkeeper you would have to go for goal
He had to go for the goal, great finish to a game, fancy Waterford big time for the replay.
McGrath was shooting on his weak side. point was the sensible option. Flynn should have buried the rebound anyway!
wexford were level when got their free on the 21. Fair play to Fitzy!
Quote from: neilthemac on July 30, 2007, 08:43:47 AM
McGrath was shooting on his weak side. point was the sensible option. Flynn should have buried the rebound anyway!
Sensible? Pah! Sensible never won jack. I'm with Eminem on this one:
Look, if you had one shot, or one opportunity
To seize everything you ever wanted - one moment
Would you capture it or just let it slip?Fair play to Eoin McGrath for going for it.
when he first recieved the ball i thought he should have taken the point, once he wnet past the last defender i thought he had to go for the goal. in hindsight he pob should have carried it closer in and given donal og no chance. Great finish to a game, its amazing how these two constantly serve u epics. hopefully its a double header in croker next week,
No wonder cork are outraged by the decision to give the free, the "rock" has been lying on the ball for years and getting away with it. Great game to cap off a very entetaining weekends hurling.
Fabulous game. I think he did the right thing and thank God it worked out ok for him in the end.
Fantastic second half, once again these two teams provide me with the best hang over cure ever, Don't know about anyone but i didn't want it to end. hurling really is putting the big ball to shame regarding excitement etc. The game will bring Waterford further on, I fancy them to win the replay. If they fail they are surely the best team not to win an All-Ireland.
I felt McGrath had every right to go for goal and the rebound should have been netted anyway. Looking forward to the replay.
With the bookies this replay is 50 50. What odds would P Flynn have been to score a goal if he had taken the free. Probably odds on to score, he should have taken it and went for a goal.
the reason it wasn't a penalty is because it was a technical foul and a technical foul (foul on the ball) only warrants a 21 yeard free. a penalty is awarded when it is a foul on the player.
Mcgrath was dead right to go for the goal and in my opinion flynn should have taken the peno and gone for it. if waterford believe they are better than cork they should have finished it there and then.
i think waterford shot too many wides when the sensible option was to carry it in further or let it into the forwards. what was the story with eoin kelly, he was called out on the pa that he was being substituted and he never came off, was it a case of him saying no i aint coming off...
Eoin McGrath went for the right option at that time.Game is over now and i expect Waterford to edge it by couple of points the next day.
Quote from: cnoc16 on July 30, 2007, 10:32:41 AM
the reason it wasn't a penalty is because it was a technical foul and a technical foul (foul on the ball) only warrants a 21 yeard free. a penalty is awarded when it is a foul on the player.
Don't think that is right. If a defender picks the ball up off the ground inside the
small parellelogram, then it is a peno. A technical foul inside the small box is usually a peno.
Personally I think it was the right decision to go for goal, if he was confident of scoring. He had the winning of the game in his hands, it wasnt a difficult chance.
Should he have gone for it? Course he should. Think about it, this time five years ago Dara McGarty was through on Benny Tierney's goal, a goal to win, a point to draw. He took the point, and Armagh the All-Ireland. If the opportunity is there go fot it. Hopefully they'll do it next day out.
he had to go for goal in that position, and more often than not he would've scored it. Sensible enough to let Kelly point the free though
reminded me of the Leinster under-21 hurling final a couple of years back between Dublin and Wexford. Dublin were a goal up when Fergal Chambers got through on goal. Stick it over the bar and the ref blows up for full-time. He went for a goal instead. Wexford keeper Maty White pulls off a great save, ball rebounds out into play, Wexford move upfield and score an equalising goal. Game goes to extra time where Wexford win.
Waterford were lucky enough to come away with the point after that passage of play, though it was clearly a free. I can't believe anyone disputes that. It was a very black or white case and theres little doubt Donal Og covered the ball with his body to prevent Waterford players getting to it.
Quote from: Hound on July 30, 2007, 01:21:28 PM
Quote from: cnoc16 on July 30, 2007, 10:32:41 AM
the reason it wasn't a penalty is because it was a technical foul and a technical foul (foul on the ball) only warrants a 21 yeard free. a penalty is awarded when it is a foul on the player.
Don't think that is right. If a defender picks the ball up off the ground inside the small parellelogram, then it is a peno. A technical foul inside the small box is usually a peno.
That's the rule in football, not hurling. Only an agressive foul inside the large parallelogram is a penalty in hurling
Quote from: Hound on July 30, 2007, 01:21:28 PM
Quote from: cnoc16 on July 30, 2007, 10:32:41 AM
the reason it wasn't a penalty is because it was a technical foul and a technical foul (foul on the ball) only warrants a 21 yeard free. a penalty is awarded when it is a foul on the player.
Don't think that is right. If a defender picks the ball up off the ground inside the small parellelogram, then it is a peno. A technical foul inside the small box is usually a peno.
Personally I think it was the right decision to go for goal, if he was confident of scoring. He had the winning of the game in his hands, it wasnt a difficult chance.
as much as I hate to say it, our blinkered friend is right, a technical foul is only a 21-yard free in hurling.
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on July 30, 2007, 01:58:29 PM
reminded me of the Leinster under-21 hurling final a couple of years back between Dublin and Wexford. Dublin were a goal up when Fergal Chambers got through on goal. Stick it over the bar and the ref blows up for full-time. He went for a goal instead. Wexford keeper Maty White pulls off a great save, ball rebounds out into play, Wexford move upfield and score an equalising goal. Game goes to extra time where Wexford win.
Waterford were lucky enough to come away with the point after that passage of play, though it was clearly a free. I can't believe anyone disputes that. It was a very black or white case and theres little doubt Donal Og covered the ball with his body to prevent Waterford players getting to it.
IMO Chambers was wrong and McGrath was right.
Assuming time almost up, if you're two points up or three points up, then take your point. Any other score, go for goal. IMO!
Thanks for enlightng me on the difference in rules between hurling and football. Did not know that.
am i the blinkered friend bottlethrower??????????
Quoteonce again these two teams provide me with the best hang over cure ever
Spirit we are coming into the business end of the season and you are out on the rip on a saturday night. Your place at centre forward will be under threat if you dont buck your ideas up.
Quotewhat was the story with eoin kelly, he was called out on the pa that he was being substituted and he never came off, was it a case of him saying no i aint coming off...
i was in the canal end and waterford had a sub warmed up and standing beside the 4th official ready to come on. He held up the board with no9 on it and the announcer guy called out 'substitusion on the waterford team, no9 eoin kelly for...' I was surprised at this and looked over at Kelly and he shock finger as if to say no im not coming off. Maybe he got a knock and they thought he couldn't play on and he was just telling them he was fine to play on but he was definitely meant to come off. I dont think the waterford sub got on then at all. Can anyone shed light on this?
i reckon there is a chance that kelly just said no i'm not coming off. he wasn't having a vintage game and was disgruntled by justin and selectors suggesting he come off. not a whole lot that can be done if a player wont come off is there.
anyone any experience of this at club level, never heard of it at county level.
surely not
i think its more likely he got a knock and the management thought he needed to come off, it would seriously undermine a manager if a player refused to come off
but all im saying is that it is a possibility, what would happen if that was the case? anyone ever see it at club level, a fella just refusing to leave the field....
never seen a player refuse to come off, have seen players refuse to come on often enough
Seen plenty of lads refuse to leave when they've been sent off!
being a senior senior member of the club and managing reserve teams in the past, lads that i left doing the line have tried to take me off, taking the piss of course, and i've refused to go off.
obviously if it was a serious league game i'b be off, pissed off, but that's just they way it is.
watching the game i could not believe he went for goal, yes had he scored then he would have been a hero but he's a sub for a reason, quality player but, as was earlier done in the match, flynn knew Donal is a great keeper and when he shot for goal on the opposite side (IMO, and harder chance) he placed the ball low and boucing, very difficult for a keeper to judge, Eoin's was good height for keeper, quality save but keepers love that ball
McGrath should have taken the point. Does the fact that he missed not prove that?? ???
Id seriously question his decision making. Not only was he on his weak side but he was shooting off his hurley which seriously lessens his chances, and he's up against the best goalie in the country who only 2 minutes earlier has pulled off a point blank save from Flynn(arguably the hardest striker of a ball in the country at present) from 21 yards. It was complete madness.
Also as Cork were 4 up only 2 mins earlier a point and a draw at that stage would have given Waterford a great psychological advantage which has maybe swung the other way with Cork feeling cheated out of it, although it was a free.
My biggest gripe was with the corner back! Why didnt he pull him down after he knew he couldnt stop him?!