Ulster Senior football championship 2024

[screenexile]

Bookies only giving this one a 3pt handicap so they're wary of McGuinness and whatever shenanigans he comes up with.

I would love for us to beat Donegal this weekend but this is their AIF and do we really have the hunger to go after another Ulster title given the hardship it will entail? I don't doubt the team will be telling themselves they want to win every game but how realistic is that nowadays?

If we win that's great, but if we got beat without any big injuries I wouldn't be that disappointed.

[Armagh18]

This site is making the over projection of a Derry v Armagh final. I rather literally take it one game at a time, this Saturday could see us out on our ass very handy,

100%
I've been saying all along, Donegal could knock us out in the first round.
I'd love to see us win another Ulster - but if we get beaten on Saturday it wouldn't be a huge shock.
Donegal were in the final 2 years ago and we just beat them.

I think if it wasnt Harte in charge I'd be having Donegal as slight favourites given their need for a provincial is maybe greater than Derrys, but Harte is notorious for wanting to win everything so there'll be no peaking for the All Ireland.

[J70]

Bookies only giving this one a 3pt handicap so they're wary of McGuinness and whatever shenanigans he comes up with.

I would love for us to beat Donegal this weekend but this is their AIF and do we really have the hunger to go after another Ulster title given the hardship it will entail? I don't doubt the team will be telling themselves they want to win every game but how realistic is that nowadays?

If we win that's great, but if we got beat without any big injuries I wouldn't be that disappointed.

I understand the caution of you Derry lads and the bookies also, but to this point, this new Donegal team  are completely untested.

Leaving aside the injuries/fitness of a few of our key players (I haven't seen any update on McBrearty, McHugh, Ban or McCole), we're relying on a lot of lads who are either new to this high level of football or who haven't exactly passed the test with flying colours in the past. The likes of Langan and Thompson can swing point after point over the bar from the 45, but they can also be squeezed out of games completely. We didn't respond to the high pressure too well in games like Mayo 2019, Cavan 2020 or Derry/Armagh 2022 (I'll leave out Tyrone 2021 due to the Murphy penalty miss and red card!).

I think we'll give a good account of ourselves for 55-60 minutes, but Derry just look stronger, more experienced and battle-hardened across all the lines and will win by six or seven points in the end.

Time for healing ahead of the group stages for us.

[yellowcard]

Bookies only giving this one a 3pt handicap so they're wary of McGuinness and whatever shenanigans he comes up with.

I would love for us to beat Donegal this weekend but this is their AIF and do we really have the hunger to go after another Ulster title given the hardship it will entail? I don't doubt the team will be telling themselves they want to win every game but how realistic is that nowadays?

If we win that's great, but if we got beat without any big injuries I wouldn't be that disappointed.

This media led obsession with Jimmy McGuinness is getting tiresome. He can't play the match despite claims of him pulling rabbits out of hats, having tricks up his sleeve and coming up with something new (shenanigans). Gaelic football is different today than it was 12 years ago and opposition teams are being analysed to death so there will be no new major innovative breakthrough.

No doubt if Donegal manage to win (which I don't think they will) it will be put down to the genius of Jimmy. More likely it will just be your run of the mill arm wrestle though as he knows that he probably needs to reduce the game to a defensive slugfest in order to stand a chance. Pragmatism and a reversion to what he know best will take over as I didn't see anything majorly innovative during the League campaign, just a team that were better prepared than the previous season.

[JoG2]

Is it really? Most counties have goals at the start of the year, get promoted, avoid relegation, beat neighbours etc. do they really need a coping mechanism of devaluing competitions, I seriously doubt it.  There are about 26 counties under the new system never going win Sam, Derry don't need another Ulster but will probably win it, any other county would relish it.

I believe JoG2 was referring the fans attempting to devalue a competition as a defense mechanism for if they don't win it. Armagh will have failed this year (again) if they do not win Ulster. How anyone can think different is beyond me.

What if they lose Ulster but play in an All Ireland final. Is that a bigger failure than winning Ulster and then going out in the groups?

You're changing angles here. What is having a good year, which reaching an AI final for most teams is, got to do with questioning the value of the Anglo Celt cup which you did? A hypothetical appearance in an AI final shouldn't come into the equation.
You're Armagh yes, very surprising considering the last 15+ years winning nothing. Derry winning 2 years ago was incredible, winning back to back was, well incredible. The thought of winning a treble, well that's the stuff of dreams. Worry about any attack on a Sam after.

[JoG2]

From Kieran taking over until the past 2 years Armagh struggled for years to get a win or two in the Ulster championship and that has been the most disappointing thing for me.  Not being able to beat teams they could/should have been beating over 6 or 7 years.  That's not all down to lack of underage success.  We have though improved markedly in terms of conditioning and tightened up a good bit at the back. Seem better organised these past 2 years but the question is still very much out on whether they can take the next step, i.e. get through tight games and win something or get further than a quarter final.

Not being disrespectful, but 2 very lop sided draws in '23 and' 24 surely helped?

[JoG2]

This site is making the over projection of a Derry v Armagh final. I rather literally take it one game at a time, this Saturday could see us out on our ass very handy,

100%
I've been saying all along, Donegal could knock us out in the first round.
I'd love to see us win another Ulster - but if we get beaten on Saturday it wouldn't be a huge shock.
Donegal were in the final 2 years ago and we just beat them.

Couldn't agree more. A 1 or 2 point win for Donegal in a very physical / defensive game wouldn't be a huge surprise

[Armagh18]

From Kieran taking over until the past 2 years Armagh struggled for years to get a win or two in the Ulster championship and that has been the most disappointing thing for me.  Not being able to beat teams they could/should have been beating over 6 or 7 years.  That's not all down to lack of underage success.  We have though improved markedly in terms of conditioning and tightened up a good bit at the back. Seem better organised these past 2 years but the question is still very much out on whether they can take the next step, i.e. get through tight games and win something or get further than a quarter final.

Not being disrespectful, but 2 very lop sided draws in '23 and' 24 surely helped?

Absolutely, but seen the days where we were losing to Fermanagh and Cavan in Ulster first round games. (Did Down actually beat us under Geezer as well?)

[Itchy]

I just want to point out this stat. Cavan are unbeaten in championship against Tyrone in Breffni for more than 40 years.

[Blowitupref]

I just want to point out this stat. Cavan are unbeaten in championship against Tyrone in Breffni for more than 40 years.

How many Cavan v Tyrone championship matches has been played in Breffni the last 40 years?

[balladmaker]

Is it really? Most counties have goals at the start of the year, get promoted, avoid relegation, beat neighbours etc. do they really need a coping mechanism of devaluing competitions, I seriously doubt it.  There are about 26 counties under the new system never going win Sam, Derry don't need another Ulster but will probably win it, any other county would relish it.

I believe JoG2 was referring the fans attempting to devalue a competition as a defense mechanism for if they don't win it. Armagh will have failed this year (again) if they do not win Ulster. How anyone can think different is beyond me.

Armagh will have failed agreed, Armagh will continue to fail until the County Board grows a set and get rid of McGeeney but they aren't devaluing it.  Who's these fans devaluing it two people on a discussion board, most counties would love to win Ulster, doubt Fermanagh, Antrim and Monaghan are sitting there thinking as sure it means nothing.

Would be a failure for Armagh not to reach the Ulster final. Derry will be strong favourites to win the final should they reach it.  Armagh comfortably bounced back to Div 1 and in 2025 will be their 4th year in the last 5 years to play in Div 1 and the last two years they reached the All Ireland quarter final only losing out on penalty shootouts.

Would another manager have got much more out of Armagh than McGeeney has? I highly doubt it when you consider Armagh haven't won U20/21 Ulster title since 2007 and U17/18 Ulster title since 2009 plus club football especially Crossmaglen hasn't been as strong as they use to be.

theres an opinion within Armagh that we have left behind an Ulster and at least one AISF in the last 2 years due to the negative tactics we have seen. So maybe another manager might, and I stress might, have achieved more than McGeeney. Or we could have got thumped in all those games

It's a tough one for me. I think Geezer deserves a lot of credit for building a strong squad with 23/24 players who I would consider all to be good inter county footballers albeit without too many superstars.

That said I think he also deserves criticism for an ultra conservative approach to games against good teams. Is that because

a he doesn't think Armagh are good enough to go toe to toe with a big team.

B Armagh are not good enough and he's trying to cover weaknesses

Or

C He lacks the ability to take Armagh to the next level.

For me the jury is still out. I would love to see us really go for teams with a fast flowing direct style of attack that we showed in some games over the last three years (Dublin at Croke Park for example). That way I think Armagh and Geezer could be fairly analysed.

If you listen to Monday's GAA Social Podcast, you'll hear Paddy Burns saying that they're sent out to play attacking football every game, and for some reason it doesn't come to pass every time ... he was adamant Kieran McGeeney sends them out to attack, attack, attack. 

[armaghniac]

Absolutely, but seen the days where we were losing to Fermanagh and Cavan in Ulster first round games. (Did Down actually beat us under Geezer as well?)

Yes, the complete shame of being beaten by Down.
We are in the race now, but it is amazing that Geezer was kept on through Div 3 and not winning a game in Ulster.

[Wildweasel74]

Usually a 101 Tyrone posters around here, not saying much about Saturdays  game, lying in the long grass or what!

[Derryman forever]

Usually a 101 Tyrone posters around here, not saying much about Saturdays  game, lying in the long grass or what!

Like I said Beware Tyrone.
They are keeping their powder dry.

[David McKeown]

Is it really? Most counties have goals at the start of the year, get promoted, avoid relegation, beat neighbours etc. do they really need a coping mechanism of devaluing competitions, I seriously doubt it.  There are about 26 counties under the new system never going win Sam, Derry don't need another Ulster but will probably win it, any other county would relish it.

I believe JoG2 was referring the fans attempting to devalue a competition as a defense mechanism for if they don't win it. Armagh will have failed this year (again) if they do not win Ulster. How anyone can think different is beyond me.

What if they lose Ulster but play in an All Ireland final. Is that a bigger failure than winning Ulster and then going out in the groups?

You're changing angles here. What is having a good year, which reaching an AI final for most teams is, got to do with questioning the value of the Anglo Celt cup which you did? A hypothetical appearance in an AI final shouldn't come into the equation.
You're Armagh yes, very surprising considering the last 15+ years winning nothing. Derry winning 2 years ago was incredible, winning back to back was, well incredible. The thought of winning a treble, well that's the stuff of dreams. Worry about any attack on a Sam after.

The answer is the Ulster Championship is not viewed in isolation You've said Armagh will have failed this year if they don't win Ulster. I disagree. They could miss out on Ulster and make an All Ireland final which to me would be far less of a failure than winning Ulster and going out in the group stages. Similarly I'd rather have been promoted this year than win Ulster. That's not to say doing both wouldn't be nice but simply that Ulster can be viewed in isolation.

You are holding the Anglo Celt up as some kind of be all and end all for the season. It's not. For me If your county would prefer to win an Ulster and nothing else this year then it's extremely meaningful. If your county would prefer a deep run in the All Ireland series then Ulster is less meaningful.