Climate change

[BennyCake]

Its not just the governments.


- Airbus and Boeing don't build aircraft because governments told them to. They do it because Joe Public wants to fly from A to B.
- Car manufacturers are the same. Public demand shapes industry response.
- If the govts went full renewable electricity, we'd all be bitching (and out of work) 'cos of the price of electric.
- The Western world wastes almost as much food as it eats.

Yip wonder how many eco warriers have 3 or 4 flights a year, I haven't been on a plane since 2012 and hopefully never get on another one.

Is this because you just haven't had the chance to, or you're abstaining from flying?

Don't fly, the 2012 one was to London when I was forced to go for work, no problem with any one flying but do have an issue with someone telling me to how to save the planet when they are flying a lot and staying in hotels.

Heard some people said they're not going to fly again due to climate change. The planes are still going like, so whether you're sat in them or not, it's still creating pollution. Daft argument really.

[t_mac]

In which case every argument is daft. Let doomsday come sooner better most of educated world are selfish pricks.

[Ambrose]

There is a simple solution staring us in the face but no one wants to admit it. There are too many people on the planet. Sin é.

[t_mac]

Yip need a good plague, unfortunately it will be the poor and weak wiped out and the greedy selfish pricks will stay and fcuk the planet up.

[BennyCake]

In which case every argument is daft. Let doomsday come sooner better most of educated world are selfish pricks.

Yes every argument is daft. But do you see any less cars or planes flying? Nope. So, whatever. I won't be feeling guilty for driving, breathing, farting and lighting my coal fire.

[Silver hill]

In which case every argument is daft. Let doomsday come sooner better most of educated world are selfish pricks.

Yes every argument is daft. But do you see any less cars or planes flying? Nope. So, whatever. I won't be feeling guilty for driving, breathing, farting and lighting my coal fire.

Benny, a small piece of advice,  Read over your post before you post.

[omaghjoe]

Governments can have a huge impact on what industry builds. It took government to take the lead out of petrol and CFCs out of aerosol propellants. They're well able to regulate the fuel that burns in jet engines.

Are you proposing they take the carbon out of aviation fuel?

https://theicct.org/publications/long-term-aviation-fuel-decarbonization-progress-roadblocks-and-policy-opportunities

That article just basically outlines current problems and hypothetical solutions...doesnt really discuss the practicalities of the solution like this linked related article on the same website.

https://theicct.org/blog/staff/decarbonizing-aviation-through-low-carbon-fuels-will-be-beyond-difficult

Fact is there is no good practical solution to jet travel GHG emissions coming any time soon.

[BennyCake]

In which case every argument is daft. Let doomsday come sooner better most of educated world are selfish pricks.

Yes every argument is daft. But do you see any less cars or planes flying? Nope. So, whatever. I won't be feeling guilty for driving, breathing, farting and lighting my coal fire.

Benny, a small piece of advice,  Read over your post before you post.

Oh, is there a spelling mistake?

[trailer]

In which case every argument is daft. Let doomsday come sooner better most of educated world are selfish pricks.

Yes every argument is daft. But do you see any less cars or planes flying? Nope. So, whatever. I won't be feeling guilty for driving, breathing, farting and lighting my coal fire.

You should get into your coal fire once it's lit. Get the full benefit of it. 

[Silver hill]

In which case every argument is daft. Let doomsday come sooner better most of educated world are selfish pricks.

Yes every argument is daft. But do you see any less cars or planes flying? Nope. So, whatever. I won't be feeling guilty for driving, breathing, farting and lighting my coal fire.

Benny, a small piece of advice,  Read over your post before you post.

Oh, is there a spelling mistake?

Spelling's fine. But with comments like that, Are you per chance a member of the evangelical wing of the DUP's flat earth society?

[BennyCake]

In which case every argument is daft. Let doomsday come sooner better most of educated world are selfish pricks.

Yes every argument is daft. But do you see any less cars or planes flying? Nope. So, whatever. I won't be feeling guilty for driving, breathing, farting and lighting my coal fire.

Benny, a small piece of advice,  Read over your post before you post.

Oh, is there a spelling mistake?

Spelling's fine. But with comments like that, Are you per chance a member of the evangelical wing of the DUP's flat earth society?

No, they wouldn't let me in their club. Backstards!

At the end of the day, plenty of people are giving out, but people have to get to work and heat their homes. This climate crisis has been talked about since I was a child and what has happened in that time? More cars and more flights/runways etc etc, that's what. Nothings really changed, but now suddenly is all your and my fault. And soon we'll all be taxed more because it's our fault. That will solve it!

[J70]

In which case every argument is daft. Let doomsday come sooner better most of educated world are selfish pricks.

Yes every argument is daft. But do you see any less cars or planes flying? Nope. So, whatever. I won't be feeling guilty for driving, breathing, farting and lighting my coal fire.

Benny, a small piece of advice,  Read over your post before you post.

Oh, is there a spelling mistake?

Spelling's fine. But with comments like that, Are you per chance a member of the evangelical wing of the DUP's flat earth society?

No, they wouldn't let me in their club. Backstards!

At the end of the day, plenty of people are giving out, but people have to get to work and heat their homes. This climate crisis has been talked about since I was a child and what has happened in that time? More cars and more flights/runways etc etc, that's what. Nothings really changed, but now suddenly is all your and my fault. And soon we'll all be taxed more because it's our fault. That will solve it!

It IS all of our faults.

And I get your frustration with the futility of it all; no one wants to or is willing to give up their modern necessities of life or even conveniences, especially when the effects are so abstract and long term, particularly in rich western countries, and each generation grows up with a new normal that is seriously degraded, ecologically especially, compared to the last.

We have to start somewhere though. What the solutions are is an area I personally have no problem with serious people debating.

What IS a big problem (for me anyway) is the Trump wing of society who, for personal convenience, choose to demagogue and willfully misrepresent the well-documented reality of climate change.

[RadioGAAGAA]

I can see why people would be opposed to fission considering the risk of meltdown and the problem with radioactive waste. However all this needs to be squared with the risk level which is reducing all the time.. I think I read that fission is safer than solar in terms of deaths but of course it's hard to quantify. But the debate around fission needs to be much more objective and informed because at the minute its not

But folks are drawing absolute safety cases from technology designed in the 60s.

Compare a car from the 1960s to now and you'll quickly come to the conclusion the 60s car is a death trap! Its no different in reactor design - all modern designs are fail-safe - fukushima could not happen a modern reactor:

1. All modern reactors require a feedback loop of (a small amount of) power to keep the reaction ongoing (electromagnetics for the control rods). Withdraw that loop and the reaction safely shuts down as gravity pulls the control rods down.
2. All modern reactors can be cooled by passive means alone - so failure of the coolant pumps does not lead to an overheat scenario.

[RadioGAAGAA]

Governments can have a huge impact on what industry builds. It took government to take the lead out of petrol and CFCs out of aerosol propellants. They're well able to regulate the fuel that burns in jet engines.

Are you proposing they take the carbon out of aviation fuel?

https://theicct.org/publications/long-term-aviation-fuel-decarbonization-progress-roadblocks-and-policy-opportunities

Could go with cryoplanes (hydrogen) - but then that releases water vapour at high altitude which is not good either...

[J70]

I can see why people would be opposed to fission considering the risk of meltdown and the problem with radioactive waste. However all this needs to be squared with the risk level which is reducing all the time.. I think I read that fission is safer than solar in terms of deaths but of course it's hard to quantify. But the debate around fission needs to be much more objective and informed because at the minute its not

But folks are drawing absolute safety cases from technology designed in the 60s.

Compare a car from the 1960s to now and you'll quickly come to the conclusion the 60s car is a death trap! Its no different in reactor design - all modern designs are fail-safe - fukushima could not happen a modern reactor:

1. All modern reactors require a feedback loop of (a small amount of) power to keep the reaction ongoing (electromagnetics for the control rods). Withdraw that loop and the reaction safely shuts down as gravity pulls the control rods down.
2. All modern reactors can be cooled by passive means alone - so failure of the coolant pumps does not lead to an overheat scenario.

Why isn't the right, including Trump, all over this, instead of his futile "attempt" to save the coal industry.

It's not like they give a shit about the environmental constituency, never mind the more hysterical side that won't countenance even a discussion of nuclear energy production, but I'm sure there are a lot of people out there of all stripes who are nervous about nuclear but also ignorant about the advances and open to education and persuasion.