Not born that way

[trileacman]

There's some f**king shite wrote in this thread.

If Iceman is expected to accept his cousins lifestyle why can some of the posters not accept that Iceman doesn't accept his cousins lifestlyle.

As Yeats said with his Tongue firmly in his cheek " I can tolerate anything except intolerance."

Say it wasn't sexuality. Say it was religion. Someone Iceman knew wanted to be identified as Protestant. And Iceman couldn't accept it. What business is it of Iceman's ? 

Indeed. How does Iceman get to accept or reject whatever he is proposing to accept or reject? What does it mean if he doesn't accept? What happens?

You know neither Iceman or his cousin. What is it to you what one thinks of the other? This is all rhetorical and a discussion born to go in circles.

[No wides]

Regarding trans would there by that many that way inclined if the op wasn't available, nor the gaffer tape to hold it under the arse!

What a f**king pathetic post.  I can just imagine you giggling to yourself as you typed this juvenile, purile shite.

What is factually incorrect about said post. If you are a tranny care to answer?

[DrinkingHarp]

I'm still not sold on the nature argument but I appreciate your comments.
[/quote]

My sister has 3 boys and I love them all equally, one happens to be gay. Nurture or nature? - in my opinion it is nature. All three raised in a traditional family (father and mother) and all played sports growing up and did all extracurricular activities in school that they all attended. Never did I see any nurturing that was different between the three of them. At an early age (3-5yo) I did notice the one nephew was just a little different in his persona and thought nothing of it but by age of 12-13 you knew he was different than his two brothers. His older brother and younger brother both have gone on to play college level sports here in the US. and are not gay/homosexuals. I can only believe that all things being equal that the one who is gay, is gay by birth and not choice or environment.

From the article the author states that homosexuals have higher rates of mental health problems.

I wonder why?

Could it be:  that they are picked on and bullied by their classmates growing up- they don't understand why they are different from their siblings, parents, families and peers - they are condemned from political parties and religious organizations. If I felt everyone was against me I am sure it would affect my Psyche also.

I look at religions against homosexuality and can conclude that the reason they are against it comes down to one thing - procreation. Without procreation of the flock, the flock diminishes and the religious organization loses funding/authority over the flock.

[J70]

There's some f**king shite wrote in this thread.

If Iceman is expected to accept his cousins lifestyle why can some of the posters not accept that Iceman doesn't accept his cousins lifestlyle.

As Yeats said with his Tongue firmly in his cheek " I can tolerate anything except intolerance."

Say it wasn't sexuality. Say it was religion. Someone Iceman knew wanted to be identified as Protestant. And Iceman couldn't accept it. What business is it of Iceman's ? 

Indeed. How does Iceman get to accept or reject whatever he is proposing to accept or reject? What does it mean if he doesn't accept? What happens?

Paul Singer is a Scrooge McDuck financier in New York. Very religious. And he was vehemently opposed to homosexuality. Then his son revealed he was gay. Damascene conversion.

See Senator Rob Portman of Ohio for an identical about-face.
Or Nancy Reagan on stem cell research following her husband's Parkinson's.

It's amazing how putting a familiar human face on a hardline political problem can make people see that their bullshit position affects... actual people.

[The Iceman]

But surely any parent would look for ways to justify anything there child did or was to make it right in their minds?

The high profile case of the college kid who raped an unconscious girl... his Father tried to justify it because he couldn't believe his son was anything but normal and perfect.
i'm not comparing homosexuality to rape but I am using a high profile example to prove what many parents do, think and say in defense of their children.  Neither makes it right....

I still care for my cousin - that will never stop. Do I want to see him slow dancing with his boyfriend at the next family wedding or courting him? Nope. And nothing anyone says will ever change that. Do I have to acknowledge and accept his lifestyle choice? Nope. I will tolerate that it is who he is and love him still the same but I won't applaud it.

Appreciate everyone's input (minus the insults).

[michaelg]

Regarding trans would there by that many that way inclined if the op wasn't available, nor the gaffer tape to hold it under the arse!

What a f**king pathetic post.  I can just imagine you giggling to yourself as you typed this juvenile, purile shite.

What is factually incorrect about said post. If you are a tranny care to answer?

On reflection, your initial post was not worthy of a response (Perhaps why I was the only poster stupid enough to respond).  Take care.

[muppet]

But surely any parent would look for ways to justify anything there child did or was to make it right in their minds?

The high profile case of the college kid who raped an unconscious girl... his Father tried to justify it because he couldn't believe his son was anything but normal and perfect.
i'm not comparing homosexuality to rape but I am using a high profile example to prove what many parents do, think and say in defense of their children.  Neither makes it right....

I still care for my cousin - that will never stop. Do I want to see him slow dancing with his boyfriend at the next family wedding or courting him? Nope. And nothing anyone says will ever change that. Do I have to acknowledge and accept his lifestyle choice? Nope. I will tolerate that it is who he is and love him still the same but I won't applaud it.

Appreciate everyone's input (minus the insults).

I work with some 'not born that way' and have done so for years. At the start it was a bit of an eye-opener but I got slowly used to it over the years. I still don't appreciate some of the in-your-face attitude, but then I don't appreciate that from straight people either.

[trileacman]

But surely any parent would look for ways to justify anything there child did or was to make it right in their minds?

The high profile case of the college kid who raped an unconscious girl... his Father tried to justify it because he couldn't believe his son was anything but normal and perfect.
i'm not comparing homosexuality to rape but I am using a high profile example to prove what many parents do, think and say in defense of their children.  Neither makes it right....

I still care for my cousin - that will never stop. Do I want to see him slow dancing with his boyfriend at the next family wedding or courting him? Nope. And nothing anyone says will ever change that. Do I have to acknowledge and accept his lifestyle choice? Nope. I will tolerate that it is who he is and love him still the same but I won't applaud it.

Appreciate everyone's input (minus the insults).

I work with some 'not born that way' and have done so for years. At the start it was a bit of an eye-opener but I got slowly used to it over the years. I still don't appreciate some of the in-your-face attitude, but then I don't appreciate that from straight people either.

I'd be the same, I've no bother with gay people it's just that a lot of them are obnoxious wankers.

[J70]

But surely any parent would look for ways to justify anything there child did or was to make it right in their minds?

The high profile case of the college kid who raped an unconscious girl... his Father tried to justify it because he couldn't believe his son was anything but normal and perfect.
i'm not comparing homosexuality to rape but I am using a high profile example to prove what many parents do, think and say in defense of their children.  Neither makes it right....

I still care for my cousin - that will never stop. Do I want to see him slow dancing with his boyfriend at the next family wedding or courting him? Nope. And nothing anyone says will ever change that. Do I have to acknowledge and accept his lifestyle choice? Nope. I will tolerate that it is who he is and love him still the same but I won't applaud it.

Appreciate everyone's input (minus the insults).

The point is that it takes a loved one being affected to make those people see the human cost of what they're advocating. It's easier to be for or against something when you've no personal stake in the outcome of what you are advocating. Could be homosexuality. It could be a belief that wolves should be reintroduced to the hills of Donegal, sheep farmers be damned.

No one can force you to accept your cousin's sexuality and same-sex relationship, but we can advocate that your discomfort not be the cause of him being driven back into the closet. If it's a choice between you squirming in your seat or averting your eyes for a wee bit or him being allowed to live a full life, true to himself, there should be only one winner.

[No wides]

Regarding trans would there by that many that way inclined if the op wasn't available, nor the gaffer tape to hold it under the arse!

What a f**king pathetic post.  I can just imagine you giggling to yourself as you typed this juvenile, purile shite.

What is factually incorrect about said post. If you are a tranny care to answer?

On reflection, your initial post was not worthy of a response (Perhaps why I was the only poster stupid enough to respond).  Take care.

If anyone is not born that way it is someone who has operations to become a gay man with breasts and then other gay men have sexual relations with them and call them women, like that makes them somehow hetrosexual.

[No wides]

But surely any parent would look for ways to justify anything there child did or was to make it right in their minds?

The high profile case of the college kid who raped an unconscious girl... his Father tried to justify it because he couldn't believe his son was anything but normal and perfect.
i'm not comparing homosexuality to rape but I am using a high profile example to prove what many parents do, think and say in defense of their children.  Neither makes it right....

I still care for my cousin - that will never stop. Do I want to see him slow dancing with his boyfriend at the next family wedding or courting him? Nope. And nothing anyone says will ever change that. Do I have to acknowledge and accept his lifestyle choice? Nope. I will tolerate that it is who he is and love him still the same but I won't applaud it.

Appreciate everyone's input (minus the insults).

I work with some 'not born that way' and have done so for years. At the start it was a bit of an eye-opener but I got slowly used to it over the years. I still don't appreciate some of the in-your-face attitude, but then I don't appreciate that from straight people either.

I'd be the same, I've no bother with gay people it's just that a lot of them are obnoxious w**kers.

100 percent agree.

[J70]

Must be a very recent Irish thing.

I've never found gay people to be more or less obnoxious than society in general, either in the US or Ireland.

How awful for you.

[No wides]

Must be a very recent Irish thing.

I've never found gay people to be more or less obnoxious than society in general, either in the US or Ireland.

How awful for you.

Maybe you can't see the wood for the trees.

[J70]

Must be a very recent Irish thing.

I've never found gay people to be more or less obnoxious than society in general, either in the US or Ireland.

How awful for you.

Maybe you can't see the wood for the trees.

No, I think that more likely applies to your own selection bias through the more obnoxious of the gay people you encounter being the ones you notice.

[Syferus]

What a daft thread in 2016.