Anyone know what games are on TV this weekend?
Quote from: ck on February 18, 2020, 09:21:00 PM
Anyone know what games are on TV this weekend?
Judging from Gaago, Dub Wex (Sat) and Cork v Limerick (Sun) in hurling
Donegal v Dublin (Sat); Galway v Tyrone (Sun) and Mon v Mayo (Sun) in football.
Couldn't tell you what channel any of the games are on, but they will be televised
Good man, thanks.
Where do you find that info? How do you know which games are televised?
Quote from: Never beat the deeler on February 18, 2020, 09:33:59 PM
Quote from: ck on February 18, 2020, 09:21:00 PM
Anyone know what games are on TV this weekend?
Judging from Gaago, Dub Wex (Sat) and Cork v Limerick (Sun) in hurling
Donegal v Dublin (Sat); Galway v Tyrone (Sun) and Mon v Mayo (Sun) in football.
Couldn't tell you what channel any of the games are on, but they will be televised
The two Sunday ones are on TG4.
Quote from: ck on February 18, 2020, 09:43:35 PM
Good man, thanks.
Where do you find that info? How do you know which games are televised?
Hoganstand.com fixtures section is good for that info ck
Quote from: ck on February 18, 2020, 09:43:35 PM
Good man, thanks.
Where do you find that info? How do you know which games are televised?
GAAgo.ie shows all the games that are live in Ireland each week. Saturday is usually Eir Sport or RTE and Sunday is usually TG4. GAAgo streams them all but I think some are deferred in Ireland.
GAA.IE shows what channel is showing what game. You'd think that site would be the default for searching such info, but I guess not. I know I don't look at it too often...no great appeal in any of their content.
Saturday 22nd Feb
Allianz Hurling League Roinn 1 Group B
Dublin vs Wexford 5PM Eir Sport
Allianz Football League Roinn 1
Dublin vs Donegal 7PM Eir Sport
Sunday 23rd Feb
Allianz Football League Roinn 1
Galway vs Tyrone 2PM TG4
Monaghan vs Mayo 2PM TG4 (Deferred)
Allianz Hurling League Roinn 1 Group A
Cork Vs Limerick 2PM TG4 (Deferred)
Any on RTE?
Checked - there's none. People watching Wales v France will be annoying me in the pub so.
TG4 on Sunday
Tipperary v Waterford - Live
Galway v Cork
Donegal v Monaghan
Saturday 29nd Feb
Allianz Football League Roinn 1
Tyrone vs Dublin 7.15PM Eir Sport
Mayo Vs Kerry 7.15PM Eir Sport / RTE
Quote from: toby47 on February 28, 2020, 07:56:02 AM
Saturday 29nd Feb
Allianz Football League Roinn 1
Dublin vs Donegal 7.15PM Eir Sport
Mayo Vs Kerry 7.15PM Eir Sport / RTE
That should read Tyrone v Dublin.
indeed it should, by bad!
Is the Mayo v Kerry deferred today does anyone know?
Already started:
(1998 Connacht Championship)
Galway v Mayo iarbheo
(Ominous)
For Whom the Bell Tolls
4-00pm
https://www.gaa.ie/football/news/flashback-1997-leinster-sfc-semi-final-replay-meath-v-kildare
Full game of Meath vs Kildare replay from 1997
Includes Devine intervention and Martin Lynch diving trying to get John Mc sent off.
Link to whats on TG4, 2013 Dublin v Kerry semi final on this weekend
https://www.tg4.ie/en/irish-tv-schedule/sport-schedule/
Donegal Mayo 2012 on now
Quote from: BennyCake on April 12, 2020, 04:02:06 PM
Donegal Mayo 2012 on now
That's certainly a contender for best goal in final
How did COC manage to stay on the field?
3 punches within 5 seconds, and only yellow. E McGee yellow too for doing nothing. Deegan hagged out of that call.
Trying to set the old fella up with access to the GAA archive, but does anyone know what's the best way to get this on a TV for him.
Smart TV, Firestick are all options at the minute but need to keep the complexity down or he won't be able to use it.
Quote from: johnnycool on April 15, 2020, 10:08:23 AM
Trying to set the old fella up with access to the GAA archive, but does anyone know what's the best way to get this on a TV for him.
Smart TV, Firestick are all options at the minute but need to keep the complexity down or he won't be able to use it.
Are you using this link?
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1uTk-R4Tik_tD3dzG4Ph9RhN1j58DPMz5
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on April 15, 2020, 03:22:21 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on April 15, 2020, 10:08:23 AM
Trying to set the old fella up with access to the GAA archive, but does anyone know what's the best way to get this on a TV for him.
Smart TV, Firestick are all options at the minute but need to keep the complexity down or he won't be able to use it.
Are you using this link?
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1uTk-R4Tik_tD3dzG4Ph9RhN1j58DPMz5
No,
I'm using the GAA Archives one;
https://www.gaa.ie/gaa-now/archive/ (https://www.gaa.ie/gaa-now/archive/)
He'd be keen on the old stuff, but not sure I could download onto a folder from there and use USB to watch it on his TV.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on April 15, 2020, 03:22:21 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on April 15, 2020, 10:08:23 AM
Trying to set the old fella up with access to the GAA archive, but does anyone know what's the best way to get this on a TV for him.
Smart TV, Firestick are all options at the minute but need to keep the complexity down or he won't be able to use it.
Are you using this link?
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1uTk-R4Tik_tD3dzG4Ph9RhN1j58DPMz5
That's a good link how did you come across it, any simliar ones from other years?
Quote from: Blowitupref on April 16, 2020, 09:44:52 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on April 15, 2020, 03:22:21 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on April 15, 2020, 10:08:23 AM
Trying to set the old fella up with access to the GAA archive, but does anyone know what's the best way to get this on a TV for him.
Smart TV, Firestick are all options at the minute but need to keep the complexity down or he won't be able to use it.
Are you using this link?
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1uTk-R4Tik_tD3dzG4Ph9RhN1j58DPMz5
That's a good link how did you come across it, any simliar ones from other years?
Not sure was sent to me via WhatsApp
Quote from: thejuice on April 03, 2020, 09:00:27 AM
https://www.gaa.ie/football/news/flashback-1997-leinster-sfc-semi-final-replay-meath-v-kildare
Full game of Meath vs Kildare replay from 1997
Includes Devine intervention and Martin Lynch diving trying to get John Mc sent off.
Watched this match on TG4 this afternoon. Great game, but different standards in terms of hits and tackling.
Whatever happened to Trevor Giles' football career - did he get injured?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trevor_Giles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trevor_Giles)
He had a great career though now you mention it I guess retired reasonably early.
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 03, 2020, 09:31:43 PM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trevor_Giles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trevor_Giles)
He had a great career though now you mention it I guess retired reasonably early.
IMO, the most talented of that Meath team, an absolute class player
Quote from: thejuice on April 03, 2020, 09:00:27 AM
https://www.gaa.ie/football/news/flashback-1997-leinster-sfc-semi-final-replay-meath-v-kildare
Full game of Meath vs Kildare replay from 1997
Includes Devine intervention and Martin Lynch diving trying to get John Mc sent off.
So they are the things you remember most from the game? Twenty three years later. ::)
Quote from: mup on May 04, 2020, 09:29:13 AM
Quote from: thejuice on April 03, 2020, 09:00:27 AM
https://www.gaa.ie/football/news/flashback-1997-leinster-sfc-semi-final-replay-meath-v-kildare
Full game of Meath vs Kildare replay from 1997
Includes Devine intervention and Martin Lynch diving trying to get John Mc sent off.
So they are the things you remember most from the game? Twenty three years later. ::)
Watched some of this and the quality is very poor. Meath's 2nd goal a great example. Penalty saved and Kildare player (was it Buckley) boots it out of play when other Kildare players free to keep possession. High ball in and the Kildare full back drops it for Giles to bundle in.
Also there was a lot of blood for the Garda not to be called. Typical of that limited Meath team and Sean Boylan. Footballing ability in short supply.
Was refreshing to watch that game yesterday. Lots of kick passes and none of that defensive, keep ball crap we have these days.
You might say teams were tactically naive and all that, but I'd gladly go back to the football of the 90's.
Quote from: BennyCake on May 04, 2020, 02:15:13 PM
Was refreshing to watch that game yesterday. Lots of kick passes and none of that defensive, keep ball crap we have these days.
You might say teams were tactically naive and all that, but I'd gladly go back to the football of the 90's.
If by "kick passing" you mean hit and hope aimless hoofs forward then yes there was a lot more than you have now. That's not my cup of tea to be fair.
Quote from: trailer on May 05, 2020, 09:19:49 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 04, 2020, 02:15:13 PM
Was refreshing to watch that game yesterday. Lots of kick passes and none of that defensive, keep ball crap we have these days.
You might say teams were tactically naive and all that, but I'd gladly go back to the football of the 90's.
If by "kick passing" you mean hit and hope aimless hoofs forward then yes there was a lot more than you have now. That's not my cup of tea to be fair.
But holding on to the ball, playing it back to the keeper from midfield, having 15 players behind the ball with a thousand hand passes per game is? Interesting
Watching Armagh v Dublin AI semi-final 2002 again on TG4 there.
That was one of the games I enjoyed most over the years, close game and usually tit for tat, Whelan's goal was a cracker, hot August day, the first full house in the "new" Croke Park and Armagh was well supported in those days so while we were outnumbered by Dubs there were enough of us to make our presence felt, so great atmosphere.
And we should have won it with much more to spare. Far too many wides.
Armagh subs were much better than Dublin subs.
Dublin missed about four chances in the last number of minutes. They weren't composed enough though but I would have had them down to have missed more.
It's definitely one Dublin lost rather than armagh won
Lol. I wouldn't say that though.
Quote from: imtommygunn on May 10, 2020, 07:48:53 PM
Dublin missed about four chances in the last number of minutes. They weren't composed enough though but I would have had them down to have missed more.
Armagh had several bad wides though, from McConville, McDonnell who werewell capable of better.
Amazing that Cluxton was involved in that game and perhaps prevented another Armagh goal.
We were shaky in that game. Handling wasn't great from the forwards and shooting fairly average.
We were actually more composed in the closing stages of the final than in the semi.
Jaysus Tyrone were robbed that day. Robbed.
Was it later proved that o'neill hadn't got two yellow cards? Totally robbed by an inept refereeing performance but would we have won the big one if we had won that?
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 10, 2020, 09:02:00 PM
Jaysus Tyrone were robbed that day. Robbed.
Robbed me hole.
McMenamins foot block (that's a penalty), knees on McEntee, elbowing another, and still no red card?
McEntee through on goal fouled by Cavanagh, nothing given.
Take off your red tinted glasses
Mickey made a bad call sending Peter on when he did. Tyrone were leading by 4 and our forward line were doing ok.
Mugsy didn't affect the game when he came on at all.
Saying all that we won the All Ireland and Armagh didn't :)
Tyrone were absolutely robbed the 1st day as well. McConville lifted the ball clean off the ground for his goal. In saying that I think the defeat gave Tyrone a new emphasis, Armagh thought they were the better team. They were far to confident thereafter and the SF defeat finished them completely as any sort of force.
Watched both games yesterday.
Thought for long periods of the games, Dublin and Tyrone dominated, but Armagh were always there, and back in those days both teams kept trying to get another point, instead of holding the ball around the middle.
In the Tyrone game there was a lot of inconsistent referring decisions, not sure what Canavan got the road for, not sure how Ricey didn't?
O'Neil was some baller adn had some top scores.
Football has changed and really not for the better.
Quote from: An Watcher on May 10, 2020, 09:34:13 PM
Was it later proved that o'neill hadn't got two yellow cards? Totally robbed by an inept refereeing performance but would we have won the big one if we had won that?
Funny enough I was thinking that as the camera panned to ONeill sitting on the ground after getting the red.
I honestly think if we had won that game we wouldnt have won Sam - that loss seemed to refocus us and the hunger/anger/hurt drove us on
Quote from: BennyCake on May 10, 2020, 11:22:03 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 10, 2020, 09:02:00 PM
Jaysus Tyrone were robbed that day. Robbed.
Robbed me hole.
McMenamins foot block (that's a penalty), knees on McEntee, elbowing another, and still no red card?
McEntee through on goal fouled by Cavanagh, nothing given.
Take off your red tinted glasses
The advantage was played with McEntee. He narrowly missed his shot, so you can't have it both ways.
The knees and elbow incidents were in the final minutes when the game was over. Was a red, however it would not have affected the result. Armagh had won by that stage. What DID affect the result was canavan being sent off halfway through the second half for being dragged around by thugs and oneill being sent off for a first yellow.
Strange how I felt myself getting angry watching it even though its been 15 years, 2 all Irelands, and a division between us ;D
If you watch it again, Canavan manhandled/pushed the linesman so maybe that's what the red was for?
Quote from: Ethan Tremblay on May 11, 2020, 11:33:28 AM
Watched both games yesterday.
Thought for long periods of the games, Dublin and Tyrone dominated, but Armagh were always there, and back in those days both teams kept trying to get another point, instead of holding the ball around the middle.
In the Tyrone game there was a lot of inconsistent referring decisions, not sure what Canavan got the road for, not sure how Ricey didn't?
O'Neil was some baller adn had some top scores.
Football has changed and really not for the better.
Canavan got red because he was the instigator in that ruckus. He went in hard and aggressively on McGeeney. There was also a glove up around the neck of McG a second or so later, although it's inconclusive if it was Canavan or not, or whether there was a strike/grabbing of the neck.
Anyway, aggressive or not, it wasn't a red. But like the Mayo/Meath ruckus in 1996, the ref had to single out 1 from each, in order to gain some control over the game. So McKeever gave him an easy decision. Someone then had to go from Tyrone, and as the instigator, it probably had to be Canavan.
It was nasty and bitter though. Since both aren't contesting AI's now, some of that has gone. But I'm sure this thread will bring it back ;D
It was played at a frantic pace though. A bit like, see who can score the most before the ball owner's ma calls him (and his ball) in for his dinner.
Quote from: bamboo on May 11, 2020, 01:52:16 PM
If you watch it again, Canavan manhandled/pushed the linesman so maybe that's what the red was for?
It wasn't. Red was overturned later.
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 11, 2020, 01:18:57 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 10, 2020, 11:22:03 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 10, 2020, 09:02:00 PM
Jaysus Tyrone were robbed that day. Robbed.
Robbed me hole.
McMenamins foot block (that's a penalty), knees on McEntee, elbowing another, and still no red card?
McEntee through on goal fouled by Cavanagh, nothing given.
Take off your red tinted glasses
The advantage was played with McEntee. He narrowly missed his shot, so you can't have it both ways.
The knees and elbow incidents were in the final minutes when the game was over. Was a red, however it would not have affected the result. Armagh had won by that stage. What DID affect the result was canavan being sent off halfway through the second half for being dragged around by thugs and oneill being sent off for a first yellow.
Strange how I felt myself getting angry watching it even though its been 15 years, 2 all Irelands, and a division between us ;D
McEntee was shoved as he kicked the ball. Hardly an advantage
Afaik there was 1 point in it when McMen dropped the knees. Still time for Tyrone to get back into it.
So no Tyrone players were dragging in that scrap? Tyrone = innocent bystanders, Armagh = thugs? Aye, dead on.
What you're forgetting is both teams had a man sent off after it. So how was Tyrone unfairly treated and Armagh weren't?
Look at us, arguing over a match from 15 years ago. I miss those days. I think we can all agree the pace of the play back then was incredible. Proper gung ho go all out football. Some of those angled shots in that game, you'd be subbed off if you tried it now.
Quote from: BennyCake on May 11, 2020, 02:16:03 PM
Quote from: Ethan Tremblay on May 11, 2020, 11:33:28 AM
Watched both games yesterday.
Thought for long periods of the games, Dublin and Tyrone dominated, but Armagh were always there, and back in those days both teams kept trying to get another point, instead of holding the ball around the middle.
In the Tyrone game there was a lot of inconsistent referring decisions, not sure what Canavan got the road for, not sure how Ricey didn't?
O'Neil was some baller adn had some top scores.
Football has changed and really not for the better.
Canavan got red because he was the instigator in that ruckus. He went in hard and aggressively on McGeeney. There was also a glove up around the neck of McG a second or so later, although it's inconclusive if it was Canavan or not, or whether there was a strike/grabbing of the neck.
Anyway, aggressive or not, it wasn't a red. But like the Mayo/Meath ruckus in 1996, the ref had to single out 1 from each, in order to gain some control over the game. So McKeever gave him an easy decision. Someone then had to go from Tyrone, and as the instigator, it probably had to be Canavan.
It was nasty and bitter though. Since both aren't contesting AI's now, some of that has gone. But I'm sure this thread will bring it back ;D
It was played at a frantic pace though. A bit like, see who can score the most before the ball owner's ma calls him (and his ball) in for his dinner.
Or maybe see who can misplace the ball the most or shoot on sight the most.
Much better game as a viewing spectacle than nowadays
Quote from: BennyCake on May 10, 2020, 11:22:03 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 10, 2020, 09:02:00 PM
Jaysus Tyrone were robbed that day. Robbed.
Robbed me hole.
McMenamins foot block (that's a penalty), knees on McEntee, elbowing another, and still no red card?
McEntee through on goal fouled by Cavanagh, nothing given.
Take off your red tinted glasses
It's amazing people still talk about what Ricey did that day and barely a dickey bird on what Paul McGrane did. A filthy closed fist tackle on McGuigan that caught him around the face and should have been a straight red and later on in the game he left the knees in on Gormley after he was fouled.
Did McGrane get a ban after that match?
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 04:36:37 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 10, 2020, 11:22:03 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 10, 2020, 09:02:00 PM
Jaysus Tyrone were robbed that day. Robbed.
Robbed me hole.
McMenamins foot block (that's a penalty), knees on McEntee, elbowing another, and still no red card?
McEntee through on goal fouled by Cavanagh, nothing given.
Take off your red tinted glasses
It's amazing people still talk about what Ricey did that day and barely a dickey bird on what Paul McGrane did. A filthy closed fist tackle on McGuigan that caught him around the face and should have been a straight red and later on in the game he left the knees in on Gormley after he was fouled.
Did McGrane get a ban after that match?
McGrane's was during play. McMen's wasn't. Plenty of players tackle with a closed fist. But it was mistimed and it should have been red. I won't deny that. By the way, it was Jordan.
Don't recall the Gormley incident. Was it shown last night?
Tyrone got the lawyers in, and got their innocent lads off. McGrane ban was overturned too.
Quote from: BennyCake on May 11, 2020, 05:39:03 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 04:36:37 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 10, 2020, 11:22:03 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 10, 2020, 09:02:00 PM
Jaysus Tyrone were robbed that day. Robbed.
Robbed me hole.
McMenamins foot block (that's a penalty), knees on McEntee, elbowing another, and still no red card?
McEntee through on goal fouled by Cavanagh, nothing given.
Take off your red tinted glasses
It's amazing people still talk about what Ricey did that day and barely a dickey bird on what Paul McGrane did. A filthy closed fist tackle on McGuigan that caught him around the face and should have been a straight red and later on in the game he left the knees in on Gormley after he was fouled.
Did McGrane get a ban after that match?
McGrane's was during play. McMen's wasn't. Plenty of players tackle with a closed fist. But it was mistimed and it should have been red. I won't deny that. By the way, it was Jordan.
Don't recall the Gormley incident. Was it shown last night?
Tyrone got the lawyers in, and got their innocent lads off. McGrane ban was overturned too.
What difference does that make?
Both were done with intent and malice, the force of McGrane's swing was a lot more dangerous than McMenamin's if anything.
The Gormley incident was shown last night, McGrane went in with his knees on a prone Gormley rather than dropping on him, again very dangerous at the minimum.
Can't remember if McGrane got a ban at the time but it was reckless at the minimum and you don't tackle with a close fist with that kind of force unless you want to do a bit of damage.
Lots of players try to dislodge the ball from players hands using the fist. It was hard to know if that was what McGrane was trying to do, because Jordan was going to the floor (as usual). An upright player in that position might have got a dig in the ribs and carried on. We see it loads of times.
But McMenamin's was a deliberate and disgusting act.
Quote from: trailer on May 11, 2020, 10:50:55 AM
Tyrone were absolutely robbed the 1st day as well. McConville lifted the ball clean off the ground for his goal. In saying that I think the defeat gave Tyrone a new emphasis, Armagh thought they were the better team. They were far to confident thereafter and the SF defeat finished them completely as any sort of force.
Devine also stepped behind the line with A Kernan's Free kick.
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 05:57:33 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 11, 2020, 05:39:03 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 04:36:37 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 10, 2020, 11:22:03 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 10, 2020, 09:02:00 PM
Jaysus Tyrone were robbed that day. Robbed.
Robbed me hole.
McMenamins foot block (that's a penalty), knees on McEntee, elbowing another, and still no red card?
McEntee through on goal fouled by Cavanagh, nothing given.
Take off your red tinted glasses
It's amazing people still talk about what Ricey did that day and barely a dickey bird on what Paul McGrane did. A filthy closed fist tackle on McGuigan that caught him around the face and should have been a straight red and later on in the game he left the knees in on Gormley after he was fouled.
Did McGrane get a ban after that match?
McGrane's was during play. McMen's wasn't. Plenty of players tackle with a closed fist. But it was mistimed and it should have been red. I won't deny that. By the way, it was Jordan.
Don't recall the Gormley incident. Was it shown last night?
Tyrone got the lawyers in, and got their innocent lads off. McGrane ban was overturned too.
What difference does that make?
Both were done with intent and malice, the force of McGrane's swing was a lot more dangerous than McMenamin's if anything.
The Gormley incident was shown last night, McGrane went in with his knees on a prone Gormley rather than dropping on him, again very dangerous at the minimum.
Can't remember if McGrane got a ban at the time but it was reckless at the minimum and you don't tackle with a close fist with that kind of force unless you want to do a bit of damage.
You cannot for one second say for sure if McGrane meant to do damage or not with that tackle. He should have been red carded though, that's beyond doubt. McMenamin on the other hand....
I had also forgotten about some of your players tendency to grip an opponents arm and fall to ground winning a free. Sneaky. Refs should have been wise to it
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 11, 2020, 09:45:27 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 05:57:33 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 11, 2020, 05:39:03 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 04:36:37 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 10, 2020, 11:22:03 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 10, 2020, 09:02:00 PM
Jaysus Tyrone were robbed that day. Robbed.
Robbed me hole.
McMenamins foot block (that's a penalty), knees on McEntee, elbowing another, and still no red card?
McEntee through on goal fouled by Cavanagh, nothing given.
Take off your red tinted glasses
It's amazing people still talk about what Ricey did that day and barely a dickey bird on what Paul McGrane did. A filthy closed fist tackle on McGuigan that caught him around the face and should have been a straight red and later on in the game he left the knees in on Gormley after he was fouled.
Did McGrane get a ban after that match?
McGrane's was during play. McMen's wasn't. Plenty of players tackle with a closed fist. But it was mistimed and it should have been red. I won't deny that. By the way, it was Jordan.
Don't recall the Gormley incident. Was it shown last night?
Tyrone got the lawyers in, and got their innocent lads off. McGrane ban was overturned too.
What difference does that make?
Both were done with intent and malice, the force of McGrane's swing was a lot more dangerous than McMenamin's if anything.
The Gormley incident was shown last night, McGrane went in with his knees on a prone Gormley rather than dropping on him, again very dangerous at the minimum.
Can't remember if McGrane got a ban at the time but it was reckless at the minimum and you don't tackle with a close fist with that kind of force unless you want to do a bit of damage.
You cannot for one second say for sure if McGrane meant to do damage or not with that tackle. He should have been red carded though, that's beyond doubt. McMenamin on the other hand....
I had also forgotten about some of your players tendency to grip an opponents arm and fall to ground winning a free. Sneaky. Refs should have been wise to it
I can say it.
Tackling with a closed fist is absolutely illegal and incredibly dangerous, particularly with the force and height McGrane went at it with. It was an absolute nailed on red card and incredibly reckless which could have made a bloodbath of Jordans face if it connected properly.
You should have watched some of the Armagh player grabbing arms too, Brian Mallon was a great man to engineer a free in that manner, McConville as well.
What McMenamin did was nasty, what McGrane did was completely reckless and probably even more dangerous that McMenamin.
McGrane's was one of those cheap shots that regularly get passed off as macho stuff. They should be clamped down on and serious bans handed out because if they connect you're looking a lad getting 20 stitches or losing 3 or 4 teeth.
They were two great teams who were each capable of crossing the line, Tyrone just had that bit more of guile about them. It was clear as day though that Armagh were targetting an awful lot of Tyrone players with late hits off the ball in that game. McNulty, McGrane, McEntee and McKeever were all upending Tyrone runners coming through after they had played the ball.
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 10:00:25 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 11, 2020, 09:45:27 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 05:57:33 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 11, 2020, 05:39:03 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 04:36:37 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 10, 2020, 11:22:03 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 10, 2020, 09:02:00 PM
Jaysus Tyrone were robbed that day. Robbed.
Robbed me hole.
McMenamins foot block (that's a penalty), knees on McEntee, elbowing another, and still no red card?
McEntee through on goal fouled by Cavanagh, nothing given.
Take off your red tinted glasses
It's amazing people still talk about what Ricey did that day and barely a dickey bird on what Paul McGrane did. A filthy closed fist tackle on McGuigan that caught him around the face and should have been a straight red and later on in the game he left the knees in on Gormley after he was fouled.
Did McGrane get a ban after that match?
McGrane's was during play. McMen's wasn't. Plenty of players tackle with a closed fist. But it was mistimed and it should have been red. I won't deny that. By the way, it was Jordan.
Don't recall the Gormley incident. Was it shown last night?
Tyrone got the lawyers in, and got their innocent lads off. McGrane ban was overturned too.
What difference does that make?
Both were done with intent and malice, the force of McGrane's swing was a lot more dangerous than McMenamin's if anything.
The Gormley incident was shown last night, McGrane went in with his knees on a prone Gormley rather than dropping on him, again very dangerous at the minimum.
Can't remember if McGrane got a ban at the time but it was reckless at the minimum and you don't tackle with a close fist with that kind of force unless you want to do a bit of damage.
You cannot for one second say for sure if McGrane meant to do damage or not with that tackle. He should have been red carded though, that's beyond doubt. McMenamin on the other hand....
I had also forgotten about some of your players tendency to grip an opponents arm and fall to ground winning a free. Sneaky. Refs should have been wise to it
I can say it.
Tackling with a closed fist is absolutely illegal and incredibly dangerous, particularly with the force and height McGrane went at it with. It was an absolute nailed on red card and incredibly reckless which could have made a bloodbath of Jordans face if it connected properly.
You should have watched some of the Armagh player grabbing arms too, Brian Mallon was a great man to engineer a free in that manner, McConville as well.
What McMenamin did was nasty, what McGrane did was completely reckless and probably even more dangerous that McMenamin.
McGrane's was one of those cheap shots that regularly get passed off as macho stuff. They should be clamped down on and serious bans handed out because if they connect you're looking a lad getting 20 stitches or losing 3 or 4 teeth.
They were two great teams who were each capable of crossing the line, Tyrone just had that bit more of guile about them. It was clear as day though that Armagh were targetting an awful lot of Tyrone players with late hits off the ball in that game. McNulty, McGrane, McEntee and McKeever were all upending Tyrone runners coming through after they had played the ball.
Nah. You can't say it at all. Not with any certainty. Are we talking about MeMenamim dropping the knees on McEntee or elbowing McCann? That was some rivalry and I had a severe hatred of that Tyrone team at the time. Looking back on it you have to admire them. ONeill in particular was an amazing player. Dooher another though in a completely different way. However, ricey, Jordan and Cavanagh are irredeemable IMO. Obviously you will have different opinions to me but that's football
Jesus the players don't hold as much if a grudge as some of the supporters on both sides
Easy knowing some of ye never kicked a ball, if you did you would have done a few of them things yourselves
Quote from: redzone on May 11, 2020, 10:24:12 PM
Jesus the players don't hold as much if a grudge as some of the supporters on both sides
Easy knowing some of ye never kicked a ball, if you did you would have done a few of them things yourselves
Played plenty myself. Can't say I ever dropped the knees on anyone tho
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 11, 2020, 10:04:48 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 10:00:25 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 11, 2020, 09:45:27 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 05:57:33 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 11, 2020, 05:39:03 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 04:36:37 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 10, 2020, 11:22:03 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 10, 2020, 09:02:00 PM
Jaysus Tyrone were robbed that day. Robbed.
Robbed me hole.
McMenamins foot block (that's a penalty), knees on McEntee, elbowing another, and still no red card?
McEntee through on goal fouled by Cavanagh, nothing given.
Take off your red tinted glasses
It's amazing people still talk about what Ricey did that day and barely a dickey bird on what Paul McGrane did. A filthy closed fist tackle on McGuigan that caught him around the face and should have been a straight red and later on in the game he left the knees in on Gormley after he was fouled.
Did McGrane get a ban after that match?
McGrane's was during play. McMen's wasn't. Plenty of players tackle with a closed fist. But it was mistimed and it should have been red. I won't deny that. By the way, it was Jordan.
Don't recall the Gormley incident. Was it shown last night?
Tyrone got the lawyers in, and got their innocent lads off. McGrane ban was overturned too.
What difference does that make?
Both were done with intent and malice, the force of McGrane's swing was a lot more dangerous than McMenamin's if anything.
The Gormley incident was shown last night, McGrane went in with his knees on a prone Gormley rather than dropping on him, again very dangerous at the minimum.
Can't remember if McGrane got a ban at the time but it was reckless at the minimum and you don't tackle with a close fist with that kind of force unless you want to do a bit of damage.
You cannot for one second say for sure if McGrane meant to do damage or not with that tackle. He should have been red carded though, that's beyond doubt. McMenamin on the other hand....
I had also forgotten about some of your players tendency to grip an opponents arm and fall to ground winning a free. Sneaky. Refs should have been wise to it
I can say it.
Tackling with a closed fist is absolutely illegal and incredibly dangerous, particularly with the force and height McGrane went at it with. It was an absolute nailed on red card and incredibly reckless which could have made a bloodbath of Jordans face if it connected properly.
You should have watched some of the Armagh player grabbing arms too, Brian Mallon was a great man to engineer a free in that manner, McConville as well.
What McMenamin did was nasty, what McGrane did was completely reckless and probably even more dangerous that McMenamin.
McGrane's was one of those cheap shots that regularly get passed off as macho stuff. They should be clamped down on and serious bans handed out because if they connect you're looking a lad getting 20 stitches or losing 3 or 4 teeth.
They were two great teams who were each capable of crossing the line, Tyrone just had that bit more of guile about them. It was clear as day though that Armagh were targetting an awful lot of Tyrone players with late hits off the ball in that game. McNulty, McGrane, McEntee and McKeever were all upending Tyrone runners coming through after they had played the ball.
Nah. You can't say it at all. Not with any certainty. Are we talking about MeMenamim dropping the knees on McEntee or elbowing McCann? That was some rivalry and I had a severe hatred of that Tyrone team at the time. Looking back on it you have to admire them. ONeill in particular was an amazing player. Dooher another though in a completely different way. However, ricey, Jordan and Cavanagh are irredeemable IMO. Obviously you will have different opinions to me but that's football
You can say it fairly certainly.
Look at the motion of McGrane, if you're going for the ball you raise your hand up and slap it down. McGrane has drawn his arm back and with a closed fist has tried to burst Jordan as the term goes, there's no doubt about it there, he's tried to do him there and disguise it as a tackle. It wasn't mistimed, it was a completely illegal and reckless challenge that should have been a straight red card and could have caused Jordan a serious injury had it caught him flush.
Elbowing McCann was a retaliatory reaction to McCann dragging out of him after the free had been awarded and stopping him from taking the quick one.
It takes two to tango and Armagh got away with an awful lot more in that game than Tyrone did, it was clear as day that they went out to rough Tyrone up so it's a little rich that they draw so much anger over Ricey giving them a bit of it back.
In fact McGrane's hit on Jordan was almost a carbon copy of the hit that probably cost Armagh an All Ireland in 2004 when Enda McNulty did Marty McGrath on the sideline and got the line, it was the sort of act that would have you in prison if you did it on the street on a Saturday night. McGrath wasn't as lucky as Jordan though and was split open and played the remainder of the game with a bandage around his chin.
You are in absolute lala land if you think McGranes closed fist was worse than Riceys knee drop. Absolute bonkers.
Both should have been red cards and bans, and anyone that disputes that need to go away and have a word with themselves.
One was during play, and one was when play was stopped, their is a massive difference between these two incidents, but neither can be defended.
I think people are looking through their tinted glasses and don't want to sully the memory of their counties past heros, but its amazing to see the feeling of 15years ago still linger for some.
Quote from: Ethan Tremblay on May 12, 2020, 09:55:41 AM
You are in absolute lala land if you think McGranes closed fist was worse than Riceys knee drop. Absolute bonkers.
Both should have been red cards and bans, and anyone that disputes that need to go away and have a word with themselves.
One was during play, and one was when play was stopped, their is a massive difference between these two incidents, but neither can be defended.
I think people are looking through their tinted glasses and don't want to sully the memory of their counties past heros, but its amazing to see the feeling of 15years ago still linger for some.
It was more reckless and dangerous, for sure.
Why should it matter if it was during play or not? That's an extremely weak excuse, McGrane went to do Jordan, of that I have absolutley no doubt - what he did was a textbook illegal tackle with excessive force and he went to burst him.
You say neither can be defended after you're actually making a case to defend the McGrane one, absolutely bonkers indeed.
Both sides had plenty of players who crossed the line, all top teams do but don't let the narrartive get in the way of the truth.
How am I making a case to defend McGrane? Both should have been red cards and bans, I clearly stated that did I not?
I don't understand what you mean when you say "why should it matter if it was during play or not"?
Are you trying to say there is no difference in what Ricey done if it happened when the ball was live or not? is that it?
Again neither incidents can be excused in my eyes, but you misinterpret and argue away if it helps you sleep better at night Angelo!
Quote from: Ethan Tremblay on May 12, 2020, 09:55:41 AM
You are in absolute lala land if you think McGranes closed fist was worse than Riceys knee drop. Absolute bonkers.
Ethan, meet Angelo...
We've had some all star quality blinkeredness over the years. Syferus, Indiana, some of the real greats. But this guy could well top the lot.
Not a sliver of Tyrone minutiae ever escapes his revision. His county men must burst with pride reading these contributions.
Quote from: Ethan Tremblay on May 12, 2020, 11:26:40 AM
How am I making a case to defend McGrane? Both should have been red cards and bans, I clearly stated that did I not?
I don't understand what you mean when you say "why should it matter if it was during play or not"?
Are you trying to say there is no difference in what Ricey done if it happened when the ball was live or not? is that it?
Again neither incidents can be excused in my eyes, but you misinterpret and argue away if it helps you sleep better at night Angelo!
That's exactly what I'm saying - intent is intent whether the ball is there or not. They are both clearcut - they went to do their opponent - McGrane's was actually a lot more dangeorus such was the force he went at with a closed fist.
Saying that the ball was in play is as weak an excuse to defend McGrane as you could think. The ball was in play when Roy Keane went to end a fellow pros career so it's not a legitimate reason to downgrade what McGrane did.
Quote from: Ed Ricketts on May 12, 2020, 11:42:22 AM
Quote from: Ethan Tremblay on May 12, 2020, 09:55:41 AM
You are in absolute lala land if you think McGranes closed fist was worse than Riceys knee drop. Absolute bonkers.
Ethan, meet Angelo...
We've had some all star quality blinkeredness over the years. Syferus, Indiana, some of the real greats. But this guy could well top the lot.
Not a sliver of Tyrone minutiae ever escapes his revision. His county men must burst with pride reading these contributions.
So you have an issue with balance?
I've made no attempts to defend what McMenamin did, it's quite clearcut.
There's a few lads who have tried to defend what McGrane did, which is also fairly clearcut. I think you're preaching to the wrong choir here.
Quote from: Angelo on May 12, 2020, 11:56:22 AM
Quote from: Ed Ricketts on May 12, 2020, 11:42:22 AM
Quote from: Ethan Tremblay on May 12, 2020, 09:55:41 AM
You are in absolute lala land if you think McGranes closed fist was worse than Riceys knee drop. Absolute bonkers.
Ethan, meet Angelo...
We've had some all star quality blinkeredness over the years. Syferus, Indiana, some of the real greats. But this guy could well top the lot.
Not a sliver of Tyrone minutiae ever escapes his revision. His county men must burst with pride reading these contributions.
So you have an issue with balance?
I've made no attempts to defend what McMenamin did, it's quite clearcut.
There's a few lads who have tried to defend what McGrane did, which is also fairly clearcut. I think you're preaching to the wrong choir here.
Brian McGuigan getting a wee touch in another thread there. Go do your thing.
Quote from: Ed Ricketts on May 12, 2020, 12:07:29 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 12, 2020, 11:56:22 AM
Quote from: Ed Ricketts on May 12, 2020, 11:42:22 AM
Quote from: Ethan Tremblay on May 12, 2020, 09:55:41 AM
You are in absolute lala land if you think McGranes closed fist was worse than Riceys knee drop. Absolute bonkers.
Ethan, meet Angelo...
We've had some all star quality blinkeredness over the years. Syferus, Indiana, some of the real greats. But this guy could well top the lot.
Not a sliver of Tyrone minutiae ever escapes his revision. His county men must burst with pride reading these contributions.
So you have an issue with balance?
I've made no attempts to defend what McMenamin did, it's quite clearcut.
There's a few lads who have tried to defend what McGrane did, which is also fairly clearcut. I think you're preaching to the wrong choir here.
Brian McGuigan getting a wee touch in another thread there. Go do your thing.
I see you are completely unable to dispute the points.
Why do you have such an issue with balance?
Quote from: Ed Ricketts on May 12, 2020, 12:07:29 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 12, 2020, 11:56:22 AM
Quote from: Ed Ricketts on May 12, 2020, 11:42:22 AM
Quote from: Ethan Tremblay on May 12, 2020, 09:55:41 AM
You are in absolute lala land if you think McGranes closed fist was worse than Riceys knee drop. Absolute bonkers.
Ethan, meet Angelo...
We've had some all star quality blinkeredness over the years. Syferus, Indiana, some of the real greats. But this guy could well top the lot.
Not a sliver of Tyrone minutiae ever escapes his revision. His county men must burst with pride reading these contributions.
So you have an issue with balance?
I've made no attempts to defend what McMenamin did, it's quite clearcut.
There's a few lads who have tried to defend what McGrane did, which is also fairly clearcut. I think you're preaching to the wrong choir here.
Brian McGuigan getting a wee touch in another thread there. Go do your thing.
LMAO
Quote from: Ed Ricketts on May 12, 2020, 12:07:29 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 12, 2020, 11:56:22 AM
Quote from: Ed Ricketts on May 12, 2020, 11:42:22 AM
Quote from: Ethan Tremblay on May 12, 2020, 09:55:41 AM
You are in absolute lala land if you think McGranes closed fist was worse than Riceys knee drop. Absolute bonkers.
Ethan, meet Angelo...
We've had some all star quality blinkeredness over the years. Syferus, Indiana, some of the real greats. But this guy could well top the lot.
Not a sliver of Tyrone minutiae ever escapes his revision. His county men must burst with pride reading these contributions.
So you have an issue with balance?
I've made no attempts to defend what McMenamin did, it's quite clearcut.
There's a few lads who have tried to defend what McGrane did, which is also fairly clearcut. I think you're preaching to the wrong choir here.
Brian McGuigan getting a wee touch in another thread there. Go do your thing.
Here you go with your Tyrone persecution complex again. He's not getting 'a wee touch'. Just some people saying how much he was rated as a player. He's hardly being run out of town with pitchforks.
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 11:36:01 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 11, 2020, 10:04:48 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 10:00:25 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 11, 2020, 09:45:27 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 05:57:33 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 11, 2020, 05:39:03 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 04:36:37 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 10, 2020, 11:22:03 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 10, 2020, 09:02:00 PM
Jaysus Tyrone were robbed that day. Robbed.
Robbed me hole.
McMenamins foot block (that's a penalty), knees on McEntee, elbowing another, and still no red card?
McEntee through on goal fouled by Cavanagh, nothing given.
Take off your red tinted glasses
It's amazing people still talk about what Ricey did that day and barely a dickey bird on what Paul McGrane did. A filthy closed fist tackle on McGuigan that caught him around the face and should have been a straight red and later on in the game he left the knees in on Gormley after he was fouled.
Did McGrane get a ban after that match?
McGrane's was during play. McMen's wasn't. Plenty of players tackle with a closed fist. But it was mistimed and it should have been red. I won't deny that. By the way, it was Jordan.
Don't recall the Gormley incident. Was it shown last night?
Tyrone got the lawyers in, and got their innocent lads off. McGrane ban was overturned too.
What difference does that make?
Both were done with intent and malice, the force of McGrane's swing was a lot more dangerous than McMenamin's if anything.
The Gormley incident was shown last night, McGrane went in with his knees on a prone Gormley rather than dropping on him, again very dangerous at the minimum.
Can't remember if McGrane got a ban at the time but it was reckless at the minimum and you don't tackle with a close fist with that kind of force unless you want to do a bit of damage.
You cannot for one second say for sure if McGrane meant to do damage or not with that tackle. He should have been red carded though, that's beyond doubt. McMenamin on the other hand....
I had also forgotten about some of your players tendency to grip an opponents arm and fall to ground winning a free. Sneaky. Refs should have been wise to it
I can say it.
Tackling with a closed fist is absolutely illegal and incredibly dangerous, particularly with the force and height McGrane went at it with. It was an absolute nailed on red card and incredibly reckless which could have made a bloodbath of Jordans face if it connected properly.
You should have watched some of the Armagh player grabbing arms too, Brian Mallon was a great man to engineer a free in that manner, McConville as well.
What McMenamin did was nasty, what McGrane did was completely reckless and probably even more dangerous that McMenamin.
McGrane's was one of those cheap shots that regularly get passed off as macho stuff. They should be clamped down on and serious bans handed out because if they connect you're looking a lad getting 20 stitches or losing 3 or 4 teeth.
They were two great teams who were each capable of crossing the line, Tyrone just had that bit more of guile about them. It was clear as day though that Armagh were targetting an awful lot of Tyrone players with late hits off the ball in that game. McNulty, McGrane, McEntee and McKeever were all upending Tyrone runners coming through after they had played the ball.
Nah. You can't say it at all. Not with any certainty. Are we talking about MeMenamim dropping the knees on McEntee or elbowing McCann? That was some rivalry and I had a severe hatred of that Tyrone team at the time. Looking back on it you have to admire them. ONeill in particular was an amazing player. Dooher another though in a completely different way. However, ricey, Jordan and Cavanagh are irredeemable IMO. Obviously you will have different opinions to me but that's football
You can say it fairly certainly.
Look at the motion of McGrane, if you're going for the ball you raise your hand up and slap it down. McGrane has drawn his arm back and with a closed fist has tried to burst Jordan as the term goes, there's no doubt about it there, he's tried to do him there and disguise it as a tackle. It wasn't mistimed, it was a completely illegal and reckless challenge that should have been a straight red card and could have caused Jordan a serious injury had it caught him flush.
Elbowing McCann was a retaliatory reaction to McCann dragging out of him after the free had been awarded and stopping him from taking the quick one.
It takes two to tango and Armagh got away with an awful lot more in that game than Tyrone did, it was clear as day that they went out to rough Tyrone up so it's a little rich that they draw so much anger over Ricey giving them a bit of it back.
So McMenamin dropping the knees on McEntee was ok and it was ok to elbow McCann as McCann dragged him a bit. Okeydokey
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 12, 2020, 12:35:54 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 11:36:01 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 11, 2020, 10:04:48 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 10:00:25 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 11, 2020, 09:45:27 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 05:57:33 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 11, 2020, 05:39:03 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 04:36:37 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 10, 2020, 11:22:03 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 10, 2020, 09:02:00 PM
Jaysus Tyrone were robbed that day. Robbed.
Robbed me hole.
McMenamins foot block (that's a penalty), knees on McEntee, elbowing another, and still no red card?
McEntee through on goal fouled by Cavanagh, nothing given.
Take off your red tinted glasses
It's amazing people still talk about what Ricey did that day and barely a dickey bird on what Paul McGrane did. A filthy closed fist tackle on McGuigan that caught him around the face and should have been a straight red and later on in the game he left the knees in on Gormley after he was fouled.
Did McGrane get a ban after that match?
McGrane's was during play. McMen's wasn't. Plenty of players tackle with a closed fist. But it was mistimed and it should have been red. I won't deny that. By the way, it was Jordan.
Don't recall the Gormley incident. Was it shown last night?
Tyrone got the lawyers in, and got their innocent lads off. McGrane ban was overturned too.
What difference does that make?
Both were done with intent and malice, the force of McGrane's swing was a lot more dangerous than McMenamin's if anything.
The Gormley incident was shown last night, McGrane went in with his knees on a prone Gormley rather than dropping on him, again very dangerous at the minimum.
Can't remember if McGrane got a ban at the time but it was reckless at the minimum and you don't tackle with a close fist with that kind of force unless you want to do a bit of damage.
You cannot for one second say for sure if McGrane meant to do damage or not with that tackle. He should have been red carded though, that's beyond doubt. McMenamin on the other hand....
I had also forgotten about some of your players tendency to grip an opponents arm and fall to ground winning a free. Sneaky. Refs should have been wise to it
I can say it.
Tackling with a closed fist is absolutely illegal and incredibly dangerous, particularly with the force and height McGrane went at it with. It was an absolute nailed on red card and incredibly reckless which could have made a bloodbath of Jordans face if it connected properly.
You should have watched some of the Armagh player grabbing arms too, Brian Mallon was a great man to engineer a free in that manner, McConville as well.
What McMenamin did was nasty, what McGrane did was completely reckless and probably even more dangerous that McMenamin.
McGrane's was one of those cheap shots that regularly get passed off as macho stuff. They should be clamped down on and serious bans handed out because if they connect you're looking a lad getting 20 stitches or losing 3 or 4 teeth.
They were two great teams who were each capable of crossing the line, Tyrone just had that bit more of guile about them. It was clear as day though that Armagh were targetting an awful lot of Tyrone players with late hits off the ball in that game. McNulty, McGrane, McEntee and McKeever were all upending Tyrone runners coming through after they had played the ball.
Nah. You can't say it at all. Not with any certainty. Are we talking about MeMenamim dropping the knees on McEntee or elbowing McCann? That was some rivalry and I had a severe hatred of that Tyrone team at the time. Looking back on it you have to admire them. ONeill in particular was an amazing player. Dooher another though in a completely different way. However, ricey, Jordan and Cavanagh are irredeemable IMO. Obviously you will have different opinions to me but that's football
You can say it fairly certainly.
Look at the motion of McGrane, if you're going for the ball you raise your hand up and slap it down. McGrane has drawn his arm back and with a closed fist has tried to burst Jordan as the term goes, there's no doubt about it there, he's tried to do him there and disguise it as a tackle. It wasn't mistimed, it was a completely illegal and reckless challenge that should have been a straight red card and could have caused Jordan a serious injury had it caught him flush.
Elbowing McCann was a retaliatory reaction to McCann dragging out of him after the free had been awarded and stopping him from taking the quick one.
It takes two to tango and Armagh got away with an awful lot more in that game than Tyrone did, it was clear as day that they went out to rough Tyrone up so it's a little rich that they draw so much anger over Ricey giving them a bit of it back.
So McMenamin dropping the knees on McEntee was ok and it was ok to elbow McCann as McCann dragged him a bit. Okeydokey
Nowhere at all has that been said, I have reiterated from start to finish that there is no defending McMenamin dropping the knees, he knew what he was at, it's clearcut.
So you are now trying to imagine things that fit in with your narrative. The point I made was balance, there's no defending McMenamin - there is also no defending McGrane - even though the Armagh lads are doing a good job at defending the indefensible.
McMenamin knew what he was at, there's no defending it as did McGrane.
McMenamin was a p***k on and off the field. It was a cowards act and anyone defending him would want to have a word with themselves. There was no sportsmanship in him. Anytime him or Dromore were getting best he started a row.
Quote from: trailer on May 12, 2020, 02:05:15 PM
McMenamin was a p***k on and off the field. It was a cowards act and anyone defending him would want to have a word with themselves. There was no sportsmanship in him. Anytime him or Dromore were getting best he started a row.
Couldn't be further from the truth if you tried.
Quote from: GetOverTheBar on May 12, 2020, 02:55:49 PM
Quote from: trailer on May 12, 2020, 02:05:15 PM
McMenamin was a p***k on and off the field. It was a cowards act and anyone defending him would want to have a word with themselves. There was no sportsmanship in him. Anytime him or Dromore were getting best he started a row.
Couldn't be further from the truth if you tried.
I've heard he was a nice lad off the field. Never met him so couldn't comment
Quote from: Angelo on May 12, 2020, 01:03:35 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 12, 2020, 12:35:54 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 11:36:01 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 11, 2020, 10:04:48 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 10:00:25 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 11, 2020, 09:45:27 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 05:57:33 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 11, 2020, 05:39:03 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 11, 2020, 04:36:37 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 10, 2020, 11:22:03 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 10, 2020, 09:02:00 PM
Jaysus Tyrone were robbed that day. Robbed.
Robbed me hole.
McMenamins foot block (that's a penalty), knees on McEntee, elbowing another, and still no red card?
McEntee through on goal fouled by Cavanagh, nothing given.
Take off your red tinted glasses
It's amazing people still talk about what Ricey did that day and barely a dickey bird on what Paul McGrane did. A filthy closed fist tackle on McGuigan that caught him around the face and should have been a straight red and later on in the game he left the knees in on Gormley after he was fouled.
Did McGrane get a ban after that match?
McGrane's was during play. McMen's wasn't. Plenty of players tackle with a closed fist. But it was mistimed and it should have been red. I won't deny that. By the way, it was Jordan.
Don't recall the Gormley incident. Was it shown last night?
Tyrone got the lawyers in, and got their innocent lads off. McGrane ban was overturned too.
What difference does that make?
Both were done with intent and malice, the force of McGrane's swing was a lot more dangerous than McMenamin's if anything.
The Gormley incident was shown last night, McGrane went in with his knees on a prone Gormley rather than dropping on him, again very dangerous at the minimum.
Can't remember if McGrane got a ban at the time but it was reckless at the minimum and you don't tackle with a close fist with that kind of force unless you want to do a bit of damage.
You cannot for one second say for sure if McGrane meant to do damage or not with that tackle. He should have been red carded though, that's beyond doubt. McMenamin on the other hand....
I had also forgotten about some of your players tendency to grip an opponents arm and fall to ground winning a free. Sneaky. Refs should have been wise to it
I can say it.
Tackling with a closed fist is absolutely illegal and incredibly dangerous, particularly with the force and height McGrane went at it with. It was an absolute nailed on red card and incredibly reckless which could have made a bloodbath of Jordans face if it connected properly.
You should have watched some of the Armagh player grabbing arms too, Brian Mallon was a great man to engineer a free in that manner, McConville as well.
What McMenamin did was nasty, what McGrane did was completely reckless and probably even more dangerous that McMenamin.
McGrane's was one of those cheap shots that regularly get passed off as macho stuff. They should be clamped down on and serious bans handed out because if they connect you're looking a lad getting 20 stitches or losing 3 or 4 teeth.
They were two great teams who were each capable of crossing the line, Tyrone just had that bit more of guile about them. It was clear as day though that Armagh were targetting an awful lot of Tyrone players with late hits off the ball in that game. McNulty, McGrane, McEntee and McKeever were all upending Tyrone runners coming through after they had played the ball.
Nah. You can't say it at all. Not with any certainty. Are we talking about MeMenamim dropping the knees on McEntee or elbowing McCann? That was some rivalry and I had a severe hatred of that Tyrone team at the time. Looking back on it you have to admire them. ONeill in particular was an amazing player. Dooher another though in a completely different way. However, ricey, Jordan and Cavanagh are irredeemable IMO. Obviously you will have different opinions to me but that's football
You can say it fairly certainly.
Look at the motion of McGrane, if you're going for the ball you raise your hand up and slap it down. McGrane has drawn his arm back and with a closed fist has tried to burst Jordan as the term goes, there's no doubt about it there, he's tried to do him there and disguise it as a tackle. It wasn't mistimed, it was a completely illegal and reckless challenge that should have been a straight red card and could have caused Jordan a serious injury had it caught him flush.
Elbowing McCann was a retaliatory reaction to McCann dragging out of him after the free had been awarded and stopping him from taking the quick one.
It takes two to tango and Armagh got away with an awful lot more in that game than Tyrone did, it was clear as day that they went out to rough Tyrone up so it's a little rich that they draw so much anger over Ricey giving them a bit of it back.
So McMenamin dropping the knees on McEntee was ok and it was ok to elbow McCann as McCann dragged him a bit. Okeydokey
Nowhere at all has that been said, I have reiterated from start to finish that there is no defending McMenamin dropping the knees, he knew what he was at, it's clearcut.
So you are now trying to imagine things that fit in with your narrative. The point I made was balance, there's no defending McMenamin - there is also no defending McGrane - even though the Armagh lads are doing a good job at defending the indefensible.
McMenamin knew what he was at, there's no defending it as did McGrane.
You defended him elbowing McCann in the face. You also said Armagh players were at it and McMenamin gave a bit back. Or wasn't that you?
Haven't seen anyone defend McGrane. He should have been red carded
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 12, 2020, 06:28:46 PM
You defended him elbowing McCann in the face. You also said Armagh players were at it and McMenamin gave a bit back. Or wasn't that you?
Haven't seen anyone defend McGrane. He should have been red carded
I didn't defend him at all. I said it as it was, a retaliatory action to McCann dragging him back trying to stop him taking a quick free, as it was. Could have been a red card but a fairly common action in those situations to swing your arms back to free yourself. McCann wasn't caught, referee didn't take any action.
This is just absurd posting from you. You defended McGrane, now you're saying you didn't. You're accusing me of defending McMenamin when I've said from the very outset there is no defending him dropping the knees on McEntee. From the very outset I said McMenamin knew full well what he was doing and it can't be defended.
Meanwhile on McGrane who you are now saying you didn't defend him, you offered up the following excuses:
- McGrane's was during play.
- It was mistimed
- You cannot for one second say for sure if McGrane meant to do damage or not with that tackle
- Plenty of players tackle with a closed fist
Did Paul McGrane clothesline you with a closed fist challenge today or is there another reason why you've a bad case of short term amnesia?
Quote from: Angelo on May 12, 2020, 09:21:42 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 12, 2020, 06:28:46 PM
You defended him elbowing McCann in the face. You also said Armagh players were at it and McMenamin gave a bit back. Or wasn't that you?
Haven't seen anyone defend McGrane. He should have been red carded
I didn't defend him at all. I said it as it was, a retaliatory action to McCann dragging him back trying to stop him taking a quick free, as it was. Could have been a red card but a fairly common action in those situations to swing your arms back to free yourself. McCann wasn't caught, referee didn't take any action.
This is just absurd posting from you. You defended McGrane, now you're saying you didn't. You're accusing me of defending McMenamin when I've said from the very outset there is no defending him dropping the knees on McEntee. From the very outset I said McMenamin knew full well what he was doing and it can't be defended.
Meanwhile on McGrane who you are now saying you didn't defend him, you offered up the following excuses:
- McGrane's was during play.
- It was mistimed
- You cannot for one second say for sure if McGrane meant to do damage or not with that tackle
- Plenty of players tackle with a closed fist
Did Paul McGrane clothesline you with a closed fist challenge today or is there another reason why you've a bad case of short term amnesia?
At no stage did I defend McGrane. I said, and I stand by it, you cannot say for certain that McGrane meant to hurt Jordan. I said it should have been a red card. I never defended him. I didn't bring up the fact it was during play or that plenty of players tackle with a closed fist. They do but that's neither here nor there. McGrane should have picked up a second yellow for that tackle
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 12, 2020, 09:42:00 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 12, 2020, 09:21:42 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 12, 2020, 06:28:46 PM
You defended him elbowing McCann in the face. You also said Armagh players were at it and McMenamin gave a bit back. Or wasn't that you?
Haven't seen anyone defend McGrane. He should have been red carded
I didn't defend him at all. I said it as it was, a retaliatory action to McCann dragging him back trying to stop him taking a quick free, as it was. Could have been a red card but a fairly common action in those situations to swing your arms back to free yourself. McCann wasn't caught, referee didn't take any action.
This is just absurd posting from you. You defended McGrane, now you're saying you didn't. You're accusing me of defending McMenamin when I've said from the very outset there is no defending him dropping the knees on McEntee. From the very outset I said McMenamin knew full well what he was doing and it can't be defended.
Meanwhile on McGrane who you are now saying you didn't defend him, you offered up the following excuses:
- McGrane's was during play.
- It was mistimed
- You cannot for one second say for sure if McGrane meant to do damage or not with that tackle
- Plenty of players tackle with a closed fist
Did Paul McGrane clothesline you with a closed fist challenge today or is there another reason why you've a bad case of short term amnesia?
At no stage did I defend McGrane. I said, and I stand by it, you cannot say for certain that McGrane meant to hurt Jordan. I said it should have been a red card. I never defended him. I didn't bring up the fact it was during play or that plenty of players tackle with a closed fist. They do but that's neither here nor there. McGrane should have picked up a second yellow for that tackle
If you weren't defending him then why did you list 4 different excuses for him?
You can say for certain that a guy who uses an illegal tackle with excessive force with the incorrect striking action and goes absolutley nowhere near where the ball was simply going to do Jordan. Absolutely no doubt about. When you draw back a closed fist and bury it as hard as you can at an opponent coming through then you are trying to do him which is exactly what McGrane did.
Look I could come in here and try and defend McMenamin for his collapse on McEntee but there's no point, it's clear as day and so is McGrane's yet you're trying to defend it - through multiples layers. Just be brave enough to call McGrane's actions for what they were - a cheap hit that could have caused serious damage to Jordan.
McGrane should have picked up a straight red for the Jordan one and he could very easily have got another straight red about 10 minutes later for going in with his knees on a prone Gormley.
You need to reread everything here. You are capable of that aren't ye? I said you can't say for certain that McGrane went in to do Jordan. Unless you have actually talked to him and he told you or you are him. It doesn't matter tho, he should have been sent off. I haven't listed any excuses for him
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 13, 2020, 06:08:09 AM
You need to reread everything here. You are capable of that aren't ye? I said you can't say for certain that McGrane went in to do Jordan. Unless you have actually talked to him and he told you or you are him. It doesn't matter tho, he should have been sent off. I haven't listed any excuses for him
Why don't you apply your own logic to yourself as you're talking out both sides of your mouth. If you weren't trying to defend McGrane, you would not have offered any excuse up, you offered four.
I could offer the same "you don't know for certain" line with Ricey, but it wouldn't wash and it doesn't wash with McGrane. It wasn't some accident with McGrane, he knew full well what he was doing - he's tackled with a closed fist for a start - an illegal and very dangerous tackle, he's used all the force he had, he's high and absolutely nowhere near the ball. He was going to do Jordan, he wanted to leave something on him - Enda McNulty cost Armagh an All Ireland a year earlier by trying to do something similar to the Fermanagh player.
Quote from: Angelo on May 12, 2020, 09:21:42 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 12, 2020, 06:28:46 PM
You defended him elbowing McCann in the face. You also said Armagh players were at it and McMenamin gave a bit back. Or wasn't that you?
Haven't seen anyone defend McGrane. He should have been red carded
I didn't defend him at all. I said it as it was, a retaliatory action to McCann dragging him back trying to stop him taking a quick free, as it was. Could have been a red card but a fairly common action in those situations to swing your arms back to free yourself. McCann wasn't caught, referee didn't take any action.
This is just absurd posting from you. You defended McGrane, now you're saying you didn't. You're accusing me of defending McMenamin when I've said from the very outset there is no defending him dropping the knees on McEntee. From the very outset I said McMenamin knew full well what he was doing and it can't be defended.
Meanwhile on McGrane who you are now saying you didn't defend him, you offered up the following excuses:
- McGrane's was during play.
- It was mistimed
- You cannot for one second say for sure if McGrane meant to do damage or not with that tackle
- Plenty of players tackle with a closed fist
Did Paul McGrane clothesline you with a closed fist challenge today or is there another reason why you've a bad case of short term amnesia?
Swing your arms back maybe, but McM deliberately struck with the elbow. That's a red. Whether he connected or not is irrelevant. The intent was there.
This thread basically now represents everything that has gone wrong with football.
Once upon a time, men played Gaelic Football. Sometimes you took a bang, and sometimes you gave a bang. And all being well nobody got sent off.
But a combination of TV camera angles and increasing human timidity has seen 15-20 years of people discussing intent as though it's something that can be gauged through the naked eye, people demanding red cards for anything and everything, plus a never ending circle of whataboutery for every challenge. Put together, it has fed the illness that is feigning injury, as players know that referees are now now genuinely afraid of the blowback from being lenient.
So f**k you all.
Quote from: BennyCake on May 13, 2020, 09:33:54 AM
Quote from: Angelo on May 12, 2020, 09:21:42 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 12, 2020, 06:28:46 PM
You defended him elbowing McCann in the face. You also said Armagh players were at it and McMenamin gave a bit back. Or wasn't that you?
Haven't seen anyone defend McGrane. He should have been red carded
I didn't defend him at all. I said it as it was, a retaliatory action to McCann dragging him back trying to stop him taking a quick free, as it was. Could have been a red card but a fairly common action in those situations to swing your arms back to free yourself. McCann wasn't caught, referee didn't take any action.
This is just absurd posting from you. You defended McGrane, now you're saying you didn't. You're accusing me of defending McMenamin when I've said from the very outset there is no defending him dropping the knees on McEntee. From the very outset I said McMenamin knew full well what he was doing and it can't be defended.
Meanwhile on McGrane who you are now saying you didn't defend him, you offered up the following excuses:
- McGrane's was during play.
- It was mistimed
- You cannot for one second say for sure if McGrane meant to do damage or not with that tackle
- Plenty of players tackle with a closed fist
Did Paul McGrane clothesline you with a closed fist challenge today or is there another reason why you've a bad case of short term amnesia?
Swing your arms back maybe, but McM deliberately struck with the elbow. That's a red. Whether he connected or not is irrelevant. The intent was there.
It could be a red certainly but the context was it was a reactionary swingback as McCann was dragging long after the whistle was blown and free awarded. It was the last kick of the game so had no bearing. Also should be a yellow card offence for McCann.
Quote from: thewobbler on May 13, 2020, 09:50:24 AM
This thread basically now represents everything that has gone wrong with football.
Once upon a time, men played Gaelic Football. Sometimes you took a bang, and sometimes you gave a bang. And all being well nobody got sent off.
But a combination of TV camera angles and increasing human timidity has seen 15-20 years of people discussing intent as though it's something that can be gauged through the naked eye, people demanding red cards for anything and everything, plus a never ending circle of whataboutery got every challenge. Put together, it has fed the illness that is feigning injury, as players know that referees are now now genuinely afraid of the blowback from being lenient.
So f**k you all.
Look, I've no problem with that.
I just prefer a bit of balance, if Ricey is rightly castigated for what he did to McEntee then the same treatment should be meted out to Paul McGrane for what he did to Jordan.
You can't just pick and choose what your indignation and outrage applies to, if you're getting up on that soap box then you need to be consistent and some people just don't want to look at their own players and their actions with any degree of introspection but have absolutely no problem mouthing off about the opposition.
Both sides crossed the line in that game. Armagh were certainly the right side of most of the dubious refereeing decisions in that match however.
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 09:54:32 AM
Quote from: thewobbler on May 13, 2020, 09:50:24 AM
This thread basically now represents everything that has gone wrong with football.
Once upon a time, men played Gaelic Football. Sometimes you took a bang, and sometimes you gave a bang. And all being well nobody got sent off.
But a combination of TV camera angles and increasing human timidity has seen 15-20 years of people discussing intent as though it's something that can be gauged through the naked eye, people demanding red cards for anything and everything, plus a never ending circle of whataboutery got every challenge. Put together, it has fed the illness that is feigning injury, as players know that referees are now now genuinely afraid of the blowback from being lenient.
So f**k you all.
Look, I've no problem with that.
I just prefer a bit of balance, if Ricey is rightly castigated for what he did to McEntee then the same treatment should be meted out to Paul McGrane for what he did to Jordan.
You can't just pick and choose what your indignation and outrage applies to, if you're getting up on that soap box then you need to be consistent and some people just don't want to look at their own players and their actions with any degree of introspection but have absolutely no problem mouthing off about the opposition.
Both sides crossed the line in that game. Armagh were certainly the right side of most of the dubious refereeing decisions in that match however.
If I remember right McEntee wrote a letter in support of Ricey and Jordan wrote one in support of McGrane. That says it all really. The players moved on pretty quick perhaps we should.
That's it Trailer.
The only person who didn't have a public opinion on McMenamin ~ McEntee was McEntee.
I'd assume John's stance was along the lines of a) this one was one that looked worse that it was, b) this is a manly game.
And it was worse than it looked. When watching my son's play wrestle, they do stuff like that all the time. But when they throw punches, I know it's time to split them up.
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 09:50:51 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 13, 2020, 09:33:54 AM
Quote from: Angelo on May 12, 2020, 09:21:42 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 12, 2020, 06:28:46 PM
You defended him elbowing McCann in the face. You also said Armagh players were at it and McMenamin gave a bit back. Or wasn't that you?
Haven't seen anyone defend McGrane. He should have been red carded
I didn't defend him at all. I said it as it was, a retaliatory action to McCann dragging him back trying to stop him taking a quick free, as it was. Could have been a red card but a fairly common action in those situations to swing your arms back to free yourself. McCann wasn't caught, referee didn't take any action.
This is just absurd posting from you. You defended McGrane, now you're saying you didn't. You're accusing me of defending McMenamin when I've said from the very outset there is no defending him dropping the knees on McEntee. From the very outset I said McMenamin knew full well what he was doing and it can't be defended.
Meanwhile on McGrane who you are now saying you didn't defend him, you offered up the following excuses:
- McGrane's was during play.
- It was mistimed
- You cannot for one second say for sure if McGrane meant to do damage or not with that tackle
- Plenty of players tackle with a closed fist
Did Paul McGrane clothesline you with a closed fist challenge today or is there another reason why you've a bad case of short term amnesia?
Swing your arms back maybe, but McM deliberately struck with the elbow. That's a red. Whether he connected or not is irrelevant. The intent was there.
It could be a red certainly but the context was it was a reactionary swingback as McCann was dragging long after the whistle was blown and free awarded. It was the last kick of the game so had no bearing. Also should be a yellow card offence for McCann.
Ah come on now Angelo... You complain that some defend McGrane as his challenge was during play, but it's fine for McM to elbow a player in the head because "it was the last kick of the game"?
Many players get held up, dragged back and don't resort to a deliberate elbow being thrown. And no "could be a red" about it. It's a striking action. It's red.
Quote from: BennyCake on May 13, 2020, 11:41:00 AM
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 09:50:51 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 13, 2020, 09:33:54 AM
Quote from: Angelo on May 12, 2020, 09:21:42 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 12, 2020, 06:28:46 PM
You defended him elbowing McCann in the face. You also said Armagh players were at it and McMenamin gave a bit back. Or wasn't that you?
Haven't seen anyone defend McGrane. He should have been red carded
I didn't defend him at all. I said it as it was, a retaliatory action to McCann dragging him back trying to stop him taking a quick free, as it was. Could have been a red card but a fairly common action in those situations to swing your arms back to free yourself. McCann wasn't caught, referee didn't take any action.
This is just absurd posting from you. You defended McGrane, now you're saying you didn't. You're accusing me of defending McMenamin when I've said from the very outset there is no defending him dropping the knees on McEntee. From the very outset I said McMenamin knew full well what he was doing and it can't be defended.
Meanwhile on McGrane who you are now saying you didn't defend him, you offered up the following excuses:
- McGrane's was during play.
- It was mistimed
- You cannot for one second say for sure if McGrane meant to do damage or not with that tackle
- Plenty of players tackle with a closed fist
Did Paul McGrane clothesline you with a closed fist challenge today or is there another reason why you've a bad case of short term amnesia?
Swing your arms back maybe, but McM deliberately struck with the elbow. That's a red. Whether he connected or not is irrelevant. The intent was there.
It could be a red certainly but the context was it was a reactionary swingback as McCann was dragging long after the whistle was blown and free awarded. It was the last kick of the game so had no bearing. Also should be a yellow card offence for McCann.
Ah come on now Angelo... You complain that some defend McGrane as his challenge was during play, but it's fine for McM to elbow a player in the head because "it was the last kick of the game"?
Many players get held up, dragged back and don't resort to a deliberate elbow being thrown. And no "could be a red" about it. It's a striking action. It's red.
Many players get held back and dragged when the whistle has been long blown and they do retaliate and swing their arms back, they can have little complaint if they do get a red card but it happens but I'd say in the vast majority where there is no contact to a flailing arm then the referee just gets on with it.
That's just fact.
Could McMenamin have been sent off for this? Absolutely.
Was it a retaliatory action? Yes
Should McCann have also been yellow carded? Yes
When players are being held back and prevented from taking a quick free, it's natural reaction to swing your arms back to free yourself but one which players need to cognisant of that it could well and truly end up with them being given their marching orders.
Really it's a case where referees need to protect players who are the ones being provoked and this is a thing across the whole spectrum, sinners and sinned against.
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 08:06:28 AM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 13, 2020, 06:08:09 AM
You need to reread everything here. You are capable of that aren't ye? I said you can't say for certain that McGrane went in to do Jordan. Unless you have actually talked to him and he told you or you are him. It doesn't matter tho, he should have been sent off. I haven't listed any excuses for him
Why don't you apply your own logic to yourself as you're talking out both sides of your mouth. If you weren't trying to defend McGrane, you would not have offered any excuse up, you offered four.
I could offer the same "you don't know for certain" line with Ricey, but it wouldn't wash and it doesn't wash with McGrane. It wasn't some accident with McGrane, he knew full well what he was doing - he's tackled with a closed fist for a start - an illegal and very dangerous tackle, he's used all the force he had, he's high and absolutely nowhere near the ball. He was going to do Jordan, he wanted to leave something on him - Enda McNulty cost Armagh an All Ireland a year earlier by trying to do something similar to the Fermanagh player.
Are you really this thick? I didn't offer up any excuses for McGrane. I still think you bc annoy say for certain he meant to do Jordan. Maybe he did. Maybe he didn't. It was a red card either way. Try reading back through what I posted and see that it wasn't me who offered those excuses for McGrane. There's no excuse for that tackle
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 13, 2020, 12:35:40 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 08:06:28 AM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 13, 2020, 06:08:09 AM
You need to reread everything here. You are capable of that aren't ye? I said you can't say for certain that McGrane went in to do Jordan. Unless you have actually talked to him and he told you or you are him. It doesn't matter tho, he should have been sent off. I haven't listed any excuses for him
Why don't you apply your own logic to yourself as you're talking out both sides of your mouth. If you weren't trying to defend McGrane, you would not have offered any excuse up, you offered four.
I could offer the same "you don't know for certain" line with Ricey, but it wouldn't wash and it doesn't wash with McGrane. It wasn't some accident with McGrane, he knew full well what he was doing - he's tackled with a closed fist for a start - an illegal and very dangerous tackle, he's used all the force he had, he's high and absolutely nowhere near the ball. He was going to do Jordan, he wanted to leave something on him - Enda McNulty cost Armagh an All Ireland a year earlier by trying to do something similar to the Fermanagh player.
Are you really this thick? I didn't offer up any excuses for McGrane. I still think you bc annoy say for certain he meant to do Jordan. Maybe he did. Maybe he didn't. It was a red card either way. Try reading back through what I posted and see that it wasn't me who offered those excuses for McGrane. There's no excuse for that tackle
You offered up 4 different excuses. The fact that you can't actually see that you contradicted yourself is amazing.
It would have saved us all this hassle if you had just admitted that in the first place rather than trying to excuse McGrane.
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 11:55:32 AM
Many players get held back and dragged when the whistle has been long blown and they do retaliate and swing their arms back, they can have little complaint if they do get a red card but it happens but I'd say in the vast majority where there is no contact to a flailing arm then the referee just gets on with it.
That's just fact.
Could McMenamin have been sent off for this? Absolutely.
Was it a retaliatory action? Yes
Should McCann have also been yellow carded? Yes
When players are being held back and prevented from taking a quick free, it's natural reaction to swing your arms back to free yourself but one which players need to cognisant of that it could well and truly end up with them being given their marching orders.
Really it's a case where referees need to protect players who are the ones being provoked and this is a thing across the whole spectrum, sinners and sinned against.
Is it natural to do that though? I'm not sure it is.
A player who fouls an opponent, then holds on preventing a free being taken. If the ref stops play to book said player, he still achieves the stoppage as the free can't proceed until opponent is booked.
You do raise an interesting point though. A flailing arm has replaced a dig in the jaw, but I think it's still a striking action. Players always get away with it though, even if it connects with an opponent.
In the same way a forceful push/open hand strike to the neck/face has replaced a punch, as players also know they'd get red for a punch, but they won't get red for a push/open hand strike.
I've long said it, that we should follow soccers rule: any contact with the neck, face or head should be a straight red.
Yeah I'm not buying that someone swinging the arm has had enough and are swinging the arm back on purpose it's not a natural reaction.
It's happened me enough times and I have never swung the arm back so I don't think it's right to say it's a natural reaction.
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 12:55:57 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 13, 2020, 12:35:40 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 08:06:28 AM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 13, 2020, 06:08:09 AM
You need to reread everything here. You are capable of that aren't ye? I said you can't say for certain that McGrane went in to do Jordan. Unless you have actually talked to him and he told you or you are him. It doesn't matter tho, he should have been sent off. I haven't listed any excuses for him
Why don't you apply your own logic to yourself as you're talking out both sides of your mouth. If you weren't trying to defend McGrane, you would not have offered any excuse up, you offered four.
I could offer the same "you don't know for certain" line with Ricey, but it wouldn't wash and it doesn't wash with McGrane. It wasn't some accident with McGrane, he knew full well what he was doing - he's tackled with a closed fist for a start - an illegal and very dangerous tackle, he's used all the force he had, he's high and absolutely nowhere near the ball. He was going to do Jordan, he wanted to leave something on him - Enda McNulty cost Armagh an All Ireland a year earlier by trying to do something similar to the Fermanagh player.
Are you really this thick? I didn't offer up any excuses for McGrane. I still think you bc annoy say for certain he meant to do Jordan. Maybe he did. Maybe he didn't. It was a red card either way. Try reading back through what I posted and see that it wasn't me who offered those excuses for McGrane. There's no excuse for that tackle
You offered up 4 different excuses. The fact that you can't actually see that you contradicted yourself is amazing.
It would have saved us all this hassle if you had just admitted that in the first place rather than trying to excuse McGrane.
You're wrong. The only thing I said is you can't say for certain if he meant to do Jordan or not. Now, go have a read back over the thread. There's a good boy
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 12, 2020, 06:27:07 PM
Quote from: GetOverTheBar on May 12, 2020, 02:55:49 PM
Quote from: trailer on May 12, 2020, 02:05:15 PM
McMenamin was a p***k on and off the field. It was a cowards act and anyone defending him would want to have a word with themselves. There was no sportsmanship in him. Anytime him or Dromore were getting best he started a row.
Couldn't be further from the truth if you tried.
I've heard he was a nice lad off the field. Never met him so couldn't comment
McMenamin was a nasty one on the pitch, no doubt. He would tell you that - he even did, his Laochra Gael is excellent.
Off the pitch he'll take you completely by surprise, I'm not a Dromore man nor do I even know McMenamin personally but I've ended up taking a few beers in his company before. He couldn't be further from what you would think off the pitch from my experience. I'm sure that goes for everyone who has an adverse reputation on field, Galvin, O'Leary or whomever comes to mind.
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 13, 2020, 02:37:41 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 12:55:57 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 13, 2020, 12:35:40 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 08:06:28 AM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 13, 2020, 06:08:09 AM
You need to reread everything here. You are capable of that aren't ye? I said you can't say for certain that McGrane went in to do Jordan. Unless you have actually talked to him and he told you or you are him. It doesn't matter tho, he should have been sent off. I haven't listed any excuses for him
Why don't you apply your own logic to yourself as you're talking out both sides of your mouth. If you weren't trying to defend McGrane, you would not have offered any excuse up, you offered four.
I could offer the same "you don't know for certain" line with Ricey, but it wouldn't wash and it doesn't wash with McGrane. It wasn't some accident with McGrane, he knew full well what he was doing - he's tackled with a closed fist for a start - an illegal and very dangerous tackle, he's used all the force he had, he's high and absolutely nowhere near the ball. He was going to do Jordan, he wanted to leave something on him - Enda McNulty cost Armagh an All Ireland a year earlier by trying to do something similar to the Fermanagh player.
Are you really this thick? I didn't offer up any excuses for McGrane. I still think you bc annoy say for certain he meant to do Jordan. Maybe he did. Maybe he didn't. It was a red card either way. Try reading back through what I posted and see that it wasn't me who offered those excuses for McGrane. There's no excuse for that tackle
You offered up 4 different excuses. The fact that you can't actually see that you contradicted yourself is amazing.
It would have saved us all this hassle if you had just admitted that in the first place rather than trying to excuse McGrane.
You're wrong. The only thing I said is you can't say for certain if he meant to do Jordan or not. Now, go have a read back over the thread. There's a good boy
Nope you also said the following:
- McGrane's was in play
- It was mistimed
- Plenty of lads tackle with a closed fist
- And it's impossible to say if he meant it or not
I could say it's impossible to say if Ricey meant to collapse on McEntee on purpose, it wouldn't wash and neither does it wash with McGrane.
Are you now denying saying the 4 points above?
It seems to me that after spending a huge amount of time trying to defend McGrane that it is indefensible.
Quote from: BennyCake on May 13, 2020, 02:19:02 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 11:55:32 AM
Many players get held back and dragged when the whistle has been long blown and they do retaliate and swing their arms back, they can have little complaint if they do get a red card but it happens but I'd say in the vast majority where there is no contact to a flailing arm then the referee just gets on with it.
That's just fact.
Could McMenamin have been sent off for this? Absolutely.
Was it a retaliatory action? Yes
Should McCann have also been yellow carded? Yes
When players are being held back and prevented from taking a quick free, it's natural reaction to swing your arms back to free yourself but one which players need to cognisant of that it could well and truly end up with them being given their marching orders.
Really it's a case where referees need to protect players who are the ones being provoked and this is a thing across the whole spectrum, sinners and sinned against.
Is it natural to do that though? I'm not sure it is.
A player who fouls an opponent, then holds on preventing a free being taken. If the ref stops play to book said player, he still achieves the stoppage as the free can't proceed until opponent is booked.
You do raise an interesting point though. A flailing arm has replaced a dig in the jaw, but I think it's still a striking action. Players always get away with it though, even if it connects with an opponent.
In the same way a forceful push/open hand strike to the neck/face has replaced a punch, as players also know they'd get red for a punch, but they won't get red for a push/open hand strike.
I've long said it, that we should follow soccers rule: any contact with the neck, face or head should be a straight red.
It is fairly common if players want to get on with the game they will want to free themselves and they will swing their arms back to do so.
Of course they have to be careful as doing so could get them sent off and as you said players will adapt and find other ways and means but I think referees certainly give players some leeway with this, if you connect though there is a good chance you'll get the line.
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 04:06:54 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 13, 2020, 02:37:41 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 12:55:57 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 13, 2020, 12:35:40 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 08:06:28 AM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 13, 2020, 06:08:09 AM
You need to reread everything here. You are capable of that aren't ye? I said you can't say for certain that McGrane went in to do Jordan. Unless you have actually talked to him and he told you or you are him. It doesn't matter tho, he should have been sent off. I haven't listed any excuses for him
Why don't you apply your own logic to yourself as you're talking out both sides of your mouth. If you weren't trying to defend McGrane, you would not have offered any excuse up, you offered four.
I could offer the same "you don't know for certain" line with Ricey, but it wouldn't wash and it doesn't wash with McGrane. It wasn't some accident with McGrane, he knew full well what he was doing - he's tackled with a closed fist for a start - an illegal and very dangerous tackle, he's used all the force he had, he's high and absolutely nowhere near the ball. He was going to do Jordan, he wanted to leave something on him - Enda McNulty cost Armagh an All Ireland a year earlier by trying to do something similar to the Fermanagh player.
Are you really this thick? I didn't offer up any excuses for McGrane. I still think you bc annoy say for certain he meant to do Jordan. Maybe he did. Maybe he didn't. It was a red card either way. Try reading back through what I posted and see that it wasn't me who offered those excuses for McGrane. There's no excuse for that tackle
You offered up 4 different excuses. The fact that you can't actually see that you contradicted yourself is amazing.
It would have saved us all this hassle if you had just admitted that in the first place rather than trying to excuse McGrane.
You're wrong. The only thing I said is you can't say for certain if he meant to do Jordan or not. Now, go have a read back over the thread. There's a good boy
Nope you also said the following:
- McGrane's was in play
- It was mistimed
- Plenty of lads tackle with a closed fist
- And it's impossible to say if he meant it or not
I could say it's impossible to say if Ricey meant to collapse on McEntee on purpose, it wouldn't wash and neither does it wash with McGrane.
Are you now denying saying the 4 points above?
It seems to me that after spending a huge amount of time trying to defend McGrane that it is indefensible.
I suggest you go back and reread the thread. Pay attention to a post made on May 11th at 11:22. See who it was made by and then have a rethink.
I did say you can't say for certain if McGrane meant it. And you can't. That's not a defence. He made the tackle. It was a bad one. He should have been sent off
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 13, 2020, 04:33:03 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 04:06:54 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 13, 2020, 02:37:41 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 12:55:57 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 13, 2020, 12:35:40 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 08:06:28 AM
Quote from: tonto1888 on May 13, 2020, 06:08:09 AM
You need to reread everything here. You are capable of that aren't ye? I said you can't say for certain that McGrane went in to do Jordan. Unless you have actually talked to him and he told you or you are him. It doesn't matter tho, he should have been sent off. I haven't listed any excuses for him
Why don't you apply your own logic to yourself as you're talking out both sides of your mouth. If you weren't trying to defend McGrane, you would not have offered any excuse up, you offered four.
I could offer the same "you don't know for certain" line with Ricey, but it wouldn't wash and it doesn't wash with McGrane. It wasn't some accident with McGrane, he knew full well what he was doing - he's tackled with a closed fist for a start - an illegal and very dangerous tackle, he's used all the force he had, he's high and absolutely nowhere near the ball. He was going to do Jordan, he wanted to leave something on him - Enda McNulty cost Armagh an All Ireland a year earlier by trying to do something similar to the Fermanagh player.
Are you really this thick? I didn't offer up any excuses for McGrane. I still think you bc annoy say for certain he meant to do Jordan. Maybe he did. Maybe he didn't. It was a red card either way. Try reading back through what I posted and see that it wasn't me who offered those excuses for McGrane. There's no excuse for that tackle
You offered up 4 different excuses. The fact that you can't actually see that you contradicted yourself is amazing.
It would have saved us all this hassle if you had just admitted that in the first place rather than trying to excuse McGrane.
You're wrong. The only thing I said is you can't say for certain if he meant to do Jordan or not. Now, go have a read back over the thread. There's a good boy
Nope you also said the following:
- McGrane's was in play
- It was mistimed
- Plenty of lads tackle with a closed fist
- And it's impossible to say if he meant it or not
I could say it's impossible to say if Ricey meant to collapse on McEntee on purpose, it wouldn't wash and neither does it wash with McGrane.
Are you now denying saying the 4 points above?
It seems to me that after spending a huge amount of time trying to defend McGrane that it is indefensible.
I suggest you go back and reread the thread. Pay attention to a post made on May 11th at 11:22. See who it was made by and then have a rethink.
I did say you can't say for certain if McGrane meant it. And you can't. That's not a defence. He made the tackle. It was a bad one. He should have been sent off
How about you follow your own advice and go back and reread your posts?
You said the following:
- no way to say if he meant it
- plenty of players tackle with closed fists
- it was mistimed
- and it was in play
Now why not just hold yours hand up rather than roll out a list of excuses?
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 04:11:44 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 13, 2020, 02:19:02 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 11:55:32 AM
Many players get held back and dragged when the whistle has been long blown and they do retaliate and swing their arms back, they can have little complaint if they do get a red card but it happens but I'd say in the vast majority where there is no contact to a flailing arm then the referee just gets on with it.
That's just fact.
Could McMenamin have been sent off for this? Absolutely.
Was it a retaliatory action? Yes
Should McCann have also been yellow carded? Yes
When players are being held back and prevented from taking a quick free, it's natural reaction to swing your arms back to free yourself but one which players need to cognisant of that it could well and truly end up with them being given their marching orders.
Really it's a case where referees need to protect players who are the ones being provoked and this is a thing across the whole spectrum, sinners and sinned against.
Is it natural to do that though? I'm not sure it is.
A player who fouls an opponent, then holds on preventing a free being taken. If the ref stops play to book said player, he still achieves the stoppage as the free can't proceed until opponent is booked.
You do raise an interesting point though. A flailing arm has replaced a dig in the jaw, but I think it's still a striking action. Players always get away with it though, even if it connects with an opponent.
In the same way a forceful push/open hand strike to the neck/face has replaced a punch, as players also know they'd get red for a punch, but they won't get red for a push/open hand strike.
I've long said it, that we should follow soccers rule: any contact with the neck, face or head should be a straight red.
It is fairly common if players want to get on with the game they will want to free themselves and they will swing their arms back to do so.
Of course they have to be careful as doing so could get them sent off and as you said players will adapt and find other ways and means but I think referees certainly give players some leeway with this, if you connect though there is a good chance you'll get the line.
Refs give fouled players far too much leeway. Not even in terms of above, but also, how many times have attacking players kicked the ball against defender who can't get out of the way, to get 14 yards on a free? Or walk into a defender claiming they won't let them take the free?
Quote from: BennyCake on May 13, 2020, 05:49:01 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 04:11:44 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on May 13, 2020, 02:19:02 PM
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 11:55:32 AM
Many players get held back and dragged when the whistle has been long blown and they do retaliate and swing their arms back, they can have little complaint if they do get a red card but it happens but I'd say in the vast majority where there is no contact to a flailing arm then the referee just gets on with it.
That's just fact.
Could McMenamin have been sent off for this? Absolutely.
Was it a retaliatory action? Yes
Should McCann have also been yellow carded? Yes
When players are being held back and prevented from taking a quick free, it's natural reaction to swing your arms back to free yourself but one which players need to cognisant of that it could well and truly end up with them being given their marching orders.
Really it's a case where referees need to protect players who are the ones being provoked and this is a thing across the whole spectrum, sinners and sinned against.
Is it natural to do that though? I'm not sure it is.
A player who fouls an opponent, then holds on preventing a free being taken. If the ref stops play to book said player, he still achieves the stoppage as the free can't proceed until opponent is booked.
You do raise an interesting point though. A flailing arm has replaced a dig in the jaw, but I think it's still a striking action. Players always get away with it though, even if it connects with an opponent.
In the same way a forceful push/open hand strike to the neck/face has replaced a punch, as players also know they'd get red for a punch, but they won't get red for a push/open hand strike.
I've long said it, that we should follow soccers rule: any contact with the neck, face or head should be a straight red.
It is fairly common if players want to get on with the game they will want to free themselves and they will swing their arms back to do so.
Of course they have to be careful as doing so could get them sent off and as you said players will adapt and find other ways and means but I think referees certainly give players some leeway with this, if you connect though there is a good chance you'll get the line.
Refs give fouled players far too much leeway. Not even in terms of above, but also, how many times have attacking players kicked the ball against defender who can't get out of the way, to get 14 yards on a free? Or walk into a defender claiming they won't let them take the free?
Plenty but GAA refs tend to be suckers who consistently fall for the same old tricks.
You'll have lads lad Maurice Deegan seeing this happen in front of his nose and fall for it and he'll then be able to spot fouls 70 yards away at the other end of the pitch.
Angelo, as you are finding it hard to follow who said what I suggest you have a look at the conversation between you and Benny at replies 55-57. This is where it being during play and what not was brought up.
I have replies numbers 59 and 61. Read them
Ethan then come son at numbers 66 and 68. He also mentions during play and what not.
My next replies are 76 and 81. Read them. You reply at 82 saying I defended McGrane by saying it was during play, plenty of players tackle with a closed fist, it was mistimed. At this stage I haven't said anything of the sort. We exchange a few more messages 83-86. You double down on what you believe I said. We exchange more messages 95-96, 99, 101 and 103-104, during which we repeat the same thing. Go read through them and you will see you are mistaken. And it's ok to be mistaken. It's even ok to admit it. If I had said those things I would stand by them as I would have believed them. I didn't say those things and nor do I think any of them can be used as an excuse or to defend McGrane. They aren't and they can't.
That said I still stand by my statement that you cannot say for certain that McGrane meant to do Jordan. Maybe he did. Probably he did even. But maybe he didn't. That doesn't matter and it was a red card offence and he should have got the line.
Hope that clears things up for you pal.
And yes, I am bored hahaha.
Ye all look the same to me.
;D
Quote from: Angelo on May 13, 2020, 08:54:07 PM
Ye all look the same to me.
;D
It's the smell. Diesel and buckfast haha
Antrim v Offaly I think is on today! Oh to be back at Croker
Kerry fouled the fcuk outta Roscommon in that second half in 1980.
Quote from: ONeill on June 14, 2020, 08:57:21 PM
Kerry fouled the fcuk outta Roscommon in that second half in 1980.
Not the first time they fouled anyone I'd say.
The 1980 Armagh v Roscommon semi-final was an interesting one too.
Shame on me for not knowing, but who was the Armagh Manager? What was the reason for the collapse?
https://www.irishnews.com/sport/gaafootball/2020/05/16/news/from-nowhere-to-croker-how-gerry-o-neill-transformed-armagh-in-the-1970s-1940329/
Good read on Gerry O'Neill ,Armagh manager of that period and older brother of Martin..
On the match itself it's the forgotten classic semi of 1980..the one where Matt Connor scored 2-9 was entertaining but was never a contest with Kerry leading by double figures for long periods..final score was 2-20 to 3-11..
That Roscommon team scored 2-13 in the second half and were contesting their 4th semi in a row with many fine players especially in defense..they lost to a declining Dublin in '79 semi final which would have given them final experience like Offaly got in '81..that said we missed a great chance v Kerry who were missing the great Eoin Liston through appendicitis operation..that also got involved with Kerry which was a mistake because that great Kerry team could beat you anyway you wanted to play it and were overall physically tougher than us with Tim Keneally outstanding on the day..
We had three thrilling semi finals with Armagh in a 4 season period and there is always a great affinity between the two counties ...in fact in 1982 they played a 3 match series in New York and San Francisco which was a great trip by all accounts..
Were there many players on that good Roscommon side of that time who played for the fine Clann na Gael side a few years later?
The McManus brothers Eamon and Tony..both gave long service to club and county..
Have BBC released what league games they will be showing?
Quote from: toby47 on January 17, 2023, 08:57:50 AM
Have BBC released what league games they will be showing?
All I've seen so far is they're showing Armagh Monaghan on the I player next week. That game is down for 6.30 and Mayo/Galway on RTE at 7.30, you'd think they could have avoided the overlap and had Monaghan game at 6.