Down Club Hurling & Football

[Leo]

The fact is though the management have had 6 years and only won 1 trophy, granted it was the All-Ireland but we lost 2 Ulster championship finals.
Seniors can only be described as pathetic, stopped after 18 mins, Harte had the the measure of us from the sideline,

My only comment on the mnors is that at 8 points down and with the wind behind us we were still persisting with a sweeper!!!! Release these lads from negative tactics and let them express themselves as the good footballers they are.

The seniors were poor in the second half yet we had the scorable frees and goal chances that could have pput Tyrone away so keep that persepective. We have made progress with this team but our sideline were outfoxed by the master of the blanket game and the seasoned players on the Tyrone team had the guile to execute his plan to the letter - and still we were only a kick or two away. So take the positives, I believe we will do well in the qualifiers provided we allow Clarke & Benny to operate in the danger zone.
Is is jusy me or did we play better earlier in the season without Dan Gordon?
Maybe when he comes back to form he could stay at No. 8 and push Ambrose into a more forward role.
I think our full back line particularly McArdle & Rafferty is doing well enough to get rid of the sweeper and use Colgan in place of McKernan at wing back with Rooney at CHB. Maybe give McGovern another go in the corner.
Keep the faith - we are not far away.

[Down Mad]

I am going a bit off topic here, after the weekend's action but I hear that the two ex Aghaderg players that were transfered to Annaclone have had their transfered retracted. It has transpired that their transfers were illegal and they are now not permitted to play for Annaclone. This will surely have some serious repercussions for the 2 involved and the Annaclone club. If I am correct Annaclone gained 5 points out of a possible 6 with the players involvement, drawing with Saval and beating both Clann Na Banna and Tullylish. Surely these clubs will deem that Annaclone gained an unfair advantage during these 3 games and will want the County Board to act on this.

Does anyone have a comment on this?

[Banana Man]

what club are you with Down mad?

[johnneycool]

I am going a bit off topic here, after the weekend's action but I hear that the two ex Aghaderg players that were transfered to Annaclone have had their transfered retracted. It has transpired that their transfers were illegal and they are now not permitted to play for Annaclone. This will surely have some serious repercussions for the 2 involved and the Annaclone club. If I am correct Annaclone gained 5 points out of a possible 6 with the players involvement, drawing with Saval and beating both Clann Na Banna and Tullylish. Surely these clubs will deem that Annaclone gained an unfair advantage during these 3 games and will want the County Board to act on this.

Does anyone have a comment on this?

what happened, was their caravan not permanent enough?

[off the laces]

I am going a bit off topic here, after the weekend's action but I hear that the two ex Aghaderg players that were transfered to Annaclone have had their transfered retracted. It has transpired that their transfers were illegal and they are now not permitted to play for Annaclone. This will surely have some serious repercussions for the 2 involved and the Annaclone club. If I am correct Annaclone gained 5 points out of a possible 6 with the players involvement, drawing with Saval and beating both Clann Na Banna and Tullylish. Surely these clubs will deem that Annaclone gained an unfair advantage during these 3 games and will want the County Board to act on this.

Does anyone have a comment on this?

what happened, was their caravan not permanent enough?

They forgot to take the wheels of her............

[guevara]

The fact is though the management have had 6 years and only won 1 trophy, granted it was the All-Ireland but we lost 2 Ulster championship finals.
Seniors can only be described as pathetic, stopped after 18 mins, Harte had the the measure of us from the sideline,

My only comment on the mnors is that at 8 points down and with the wind behind us we were still persisting with a sweeper!!!! Release these lads from negative tactics and let them express themselves as the good footballers they are.

The seniors were poor in the second half yet we had the scorable frees and goal chances that could have pput Tyrone away so keep that persepective. We have made progress with this team but our sideline were outfoxed by the master of the blanket game and the seasoned players on the Tyrone team had the guile to execute his plan to the letter - and still we were only a kick or two away. So take the positives, I believe we will do well in the qualifiers provided we allow Clarke & Benny to operate in the danger zone.
Is is jusy me or did we play better earlier in the season without Dan Gordon?
Maybe when he comes back to form he could stay at No. 8 and push Ambrose into a more forward role.
I think our full back line particularly McArdle & Rafferty is doing well enough to get rid of the sweeper and use Colgan in place of McKernan at wing back with Rooney at CHB. Maybe give McGovern another go in the corner.
Keep the faith - we are not far away.

Gordon has been very poor since his return in my opinion. Many thought the move to put him in at FF was a great idea but my reservations were confirmed on Saturday. He doesnt make his stamp on games at all & to me doesnt look fit at all. Its ok lumping ball in if he is going to win it but he failed to do that either. To me it looks like James trying to accommodate players because of their name & not their performances.
We simply cant outfox teams like Tyrone using the sweeper system (Or even Armagh when it counts) especially when your sweeper Colgan causes no problems whatsoever to the opposition & is far safe to make any impact on the game! Look at Joe McMahon for Tyrone.....was getting skinned by Benny early doors then gets swithched out the field to act as their sweeper & runs down the field & thumps the ball over from 40 yards.
We have too many boys that turn up once every 3 or 4 games & not enough men who genuinely can take on their men & get scores.
It as clear that if Tyrone bottled up Coulter Down would struggle & in the end Tyrone didnt even have to do that as Down failed to put any sort of decent ball into him.
I sympathise with Martin Clarke at times. Us Down folk have him built up to be some Messiah & at the minute the fella is struggling to make any sort of contribution to games at all. He never once tried to run his man on Saturday & his selection of pass at times was very poor.
Tyrone were prepared to work like demons creating space until the right option was on  & this was evident through the contribution of Dooher who seemed to always find space. Down on the other hand preferred to keep 10-13  men behind the ball & ultimately this was a massive mistake.
Although Kinneavey was shockingly poor & dragged Tyrone back into it I felt that Down shouldve took off Colgan introduced another defender & went man for man in defense & took the game to Tyrone. But the second half just screamed negative football from both sides to me & was very hard to watch!!
But in a strange way maybe this is what is needed to expose some of the cracks that were being covered over against poorer teams & hopefully a good run in the qualifiers will come!!

[Mourne Rover]

It would be wrong to single out Colgan, as others had worse days than he did on Saturday, but he has not been particularly effective in our last three games. He did get injured at Croke Park, he was in and out in Ballybofey, and at best he produced a mixed display at Casement. He nearly always uses the ball well when he gets it, but pace - even in a free role - is a problem. Resting him, along with a couple of others, may freshen things up in the open draw.

It was very hard to watch in the second half on Saturday, but we simply did not have the know-how to deal with Tyrone either on the pitch or on the line. It may not be a fair comparison, but, on the last occasion when we played Tyrone in a USC semi at Casement, in 1999, they were an up and coming young side and we destroyed them. They went away, regrouped and were AI champions within four years. We are nowhere near that level, but a place in the last eight within the next couple of seasons is still a realistic target.

McVeigh did not have a great time with his kick-outs against Tyrone, but on balances deserves to stay in nets. Dan McCartan can be expected to return at corner back, and he deserves his chance on his league form. Rafferty is a certainty in the other corner, and it would be premature to drop McArdle when he is still learning the ropes at full back.

Rooney might make the switch to wing half, with Garvey worth a look at centre half, and Carr, assuming he is fit, coming in as the other wing half, where he would give us a useful option with his free-taking.

Big Dan has been poor since his return, but he must come good at some stage and would be worth another try at midfield with King.

Placing Ambrose and Fitzpatrick as wing half forwards would give us a solid platform, and both are capable of taking a score or moving back to midfield. Marty Clarke should really have been replaced at Casement, but it was still only his second championship match and he might benefit from having two ball winners outside him.

Maginn is one our our hardest workers, and gets back to cover the defence effectively, which leaves Benny and Hughes as a two man full forward line.

So it could be - McVeigh; McCartan, McArdle, Rafferty; Rooney, Garvey, Carr; King, Gordon; Rogers, M Clarke, Fitzpatrick; Hughes, Coulter, Maginn.

[Leo]

So it could be - McVeigh; McCartan, McArdle, Rafferty; Rooney, Garvey, Carr; King, Gordon; Rogers, M Clarke, Fitzpatrick; Hughes, Coulter, Maginn

As usual Mourne Rover you give us plenty to think about but I would definitely play young Clarke nearer the goal. Maginn is a better playmaker and will win breaking ball.

Rodgers, Maginn, Fitzpatrick begins to look like Carr, Blaney, Mason which was a fair enough half forward line in the days!
I think Daniel McCartan is out for season so corner back options might need a fresh look. I am assuming Howard is not near fit and that Cole (for why?) isn't figuring and that's why I'd take another look at McGovern.

A bench that includes Colgan, McKernan, John Clarke, Laverty, Poland and O'Hagan also looks strong and I'd still prefer Alder to McVeigh in goal.

[Brick Tamlin]

"Rodgers, Maginn, Fitzpatrick begins to look like Carr, Blaney, Mason"
Im gobsmacked.
i always thought we were a little short sighted us Down folk, but not fuckin blind.
Im failing to see the comparison.
For me Fitzpatrick isnt up to it YET.
Doesnt dominate club games the way an intercounty standard midfielder should.
If your not doing it week in week out for your club ie Murtagh, Hughes, Coulter, Rafferty then i dont know how your going to cope at intercounty senior.

[Town Gael]

"Rodgers, Maginn, Fitzpatrick begins to look like Carr, Blaney, Mason"
Im gobsmacked.
i always thought we were a little short sighted us Down folk, but not fuckin blind.
Im failing to see the comparison.
For me Fitzpatrick isnt up to it YET.
Doesnt dominate club games the way an intercounty standard midfielder should.
If your not doing it week in week out for your club ie Murtagh, Hughes, Coulter, Rafferty then i dont know how your going to cope at intercounty senior.

ha ha! You got it spot on! Blaney was a legend and the other 2 were pivitol to us winning 2 All-Irelands. Ambrose may have pushed for a place on that line but not the other 2, not yet anyway

[Leo]

"Rodgers, Maginn, Fitzpatrick begins to look like Carr, Blaney, Mason"
Im gobsmacked.
i always thought we were a little short sighted us Down folk, but not fuckin blind.
Im failing to see the comparison.
For me Fitzpatrick isnt up to it YET.
Doesnt dominate club games the way an intercounty standard midfielder should.
If your not doing it week in week out for your club ie Murtagh, Hughes, Coulter, Rafferty then i dont know how your going to cope at intercounty senior.

ha ha! You got it spot on! Blaney was a legend and the other 2 were pivitol to us winning 2 All-Irelands. Ambrose may have pushed for a place on that line but not the other 2, not yet anyway

Ha ha ha indeed.#
The whole county was gobsmacked when Pete pulled Carr from half back and Mason from corner back to compliment Blaney inwhat became the dynamic engine of out 2 All-Ireland wins. We will hardly ever unearth another Blaney but Maginn is the closest thing to a decent CHF we have seen in the county for some time, Ambrose goes without saying and the potential of Fitzpatrick will only be realised when he gets a run in the team.
How do we make winning team selections?
I think it's called vision.

[Leo]

Oh and by the way I said "begins to look like" .......

[guevara]

"Rodgers, Maginn, Fitzpatrick begins to look like Carr, Blaney, Mason"
Im gobsmacked.
i always thought we were a little short sighted us Down folk, but not fuckin blind.
Im failing to see the comparison.
For me Fitzpatrick isnt up to it YET.
Doesnt dominate club games the way an intercounty standard midfielder should.
If your not doing it week in week out for your club ie Murtagh, Hughes, Coulter, Rafferty then i dont know how your going to cope at intercounty senior.

ha ha! You got it spot on! Blaney was a legend and the other 2 were pivitol to us winning 2 All-Irelands. Ambrose may have pushed for a place on that line but not the other 2, not yet anyway

Spot on assesment!! When he played against my own Club only a few weeks ago Fitzpatrick got cleaned out around the middle by a young fella who wouldnt have started last year!!
You have to be dominating in club games otherwise you arent going to dominate your opponent in County games. Fitzpatrick has fantastic potential but like the majority of players that come through from U-21, he has found it a lot tougher at Senior level & I dont think he warrants a place. He is a bit like McComiskey in the sense that aas soon as a fella has a poor game he is mentioned as a replacement without ever backing it up with performances.

My team would be:

McVeigh
Rafferty
McArdle
McCartan (Or another)
Garvey
Carr
Rooney
King
Rodgers
Hughes
Maginn
Murtagh
Clarke
Coulter
Brown

[Brick Tamlin]

I think there may be a lack of vision in some cases on here, blindness in fact.
Forget about the past Down players, that breed of player is gone, its a different game now.
We should be looking to unearth a few Joe Mc Mahons more than anything else, players that are solid in a littany of positions, can play off both feet, are comfortable on the ball, can field, tackle, take scores. For Me Joe Mc Mahon epitomises what the Gaelic footballer of today should be all about.
Maybe its just me but i think that not enough of our players are dominating or standing out for their clubs (at mediocre levels in some cases). Im only using him as an example but for a potential intercounty midfielder someone like Peter Fitzpatrick would want to be dominating most opponents and games for his club.
It gets tiresome year after year talking about the potential of our players. Its high time some of them delivered upon potential, the majority have been around county teams quite a while and are yet to really deliver. Potential and speculation about players abilities have done f*ck all for us as far as i can see. Sorry to piss on your parade Leo but just dont agree with your post at all.

[Catch the high ball]

Didn't see the Irish News today, were there any underage hurling fixtures for the week ahead?