Author Topic: GPA's latest scam  (Read 17418 times)

Zulu

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Re: GPA's latest scam
« Reply #15 on: September 13, 2013, 02:27:23 PM »
Soccer has 5 a side and fustal, American football has Arena football, rugby has rugby 7's so I don't see the issue with trying out a modified version of hurling in a new market. I don't see why it will impact on hurling development either. I do think it's a waste of time and money but the GAA are past masters at that and will continue to do it for many years to come.

The whole "develop hurling here first" is nonsense too. There are a few counties that might deliver results with investment but Birmingham, Chicago and a hundred other cities around the world could deliver more hurlers with a proper plan and investment than most of Ireland.

orangeman

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Re: GPA's latest scam
« Reply #16 on: September 13, 2013, 02:37:09 PM »

AZOffaly

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Re: GPA's latest scam
« Reply #17 on: September 13, 2013, 03:03:58 PM »
Soccer has 5 a side and fustal, American football has Arena football, rugby has rugby 7's so I don't see the issue with trying out a modified version of hurling in a new market. I don't see why it will impact on hurling development either. I do think it's a waste of time and money but the GAA are past masters at that and will continue to do it for many years to come.

The whole "develop hurling here first" is nonsense too. There are a few counties that might deliver results with investment but Birmingham, Chicago and a hundred other cities around the world could deliver more hurlers with a proper plan and investment than most of Ireland.

I tend to agree with you to a point, but in this instance the game seems to appear significantly different to the game they want to promote. Donal Óg talks about it being living poetry, but what he is doing here is a different game entirely. Not so much about the 11 a side, that's fine, but why goals only? why this weird scoring system? All those other games you mention still maintain the same objective. 5 a side and futsal still have a goalie and scoring goals. Arena Football still has downs and Touchdowns. Rugby 7s still score tries. Essentially they are the same game with a smaller pitch and smaller teams. This seems to be a very different game. It's great they are on before Notre Dame and USC, but I think an 11 a side game of normal hurling would have been just as good, and would be more what they are trying to promote in the game of hurling.

Zulu

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Re: GPA's latest scam
« Reply #18 on: September 13, 2013, 03:21:01 PM »
I don't disagree AZ, but I don't get the outrage either. I accept this isn't hurling and the removal of points is perhaps to appeal to an American market more (I don't know) or maybe a feeling that with reduced numbers on a smaller pitch points would be too easy to score? Regardless, this is a waste of money and time but maybe it will have some success and I don't see why it isn't worth a try. I certainly don't think that people who are attracted to it would then be flummoxed when introduced to proper hurling.

AZOffaly

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Re: GPA's latest scam
« Reply #19 on: September 13, 2013, 03:24:01 PM »
Ah yeah, I'm not outraged, I just find the changes a bit puzzling and pointless.

Mind you, if I were involved in colleges GAA in the US, as EamonnCA is, I probably would be peeved a bit that we weren't consulted or involved in this. It strikes me as a great opportunity to at least showcase the teams (all collegiate) that are already playing the game Stanford, Cal, etc would all be names very familiar to Notre Dame and USC fans through collegiate sports already.

sheamy

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Re: GPA's latest scam
« Reply #20 on: September 13, 2013, 03:40:07 PM »
Why do we need to 'exploit' an American 'market'?

What is the purpose of this and what is the end goal?

AZOffaly

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Re: GPA's latest scam
« Reply #21 on: September 13, 2013, 03:42:38 PM »
Well, on the assumption that we'd like more people to understand, play and enjoy our games, I suppose it's a natural country to look at given the ties to Ireland and the relatively solid backbone that already exists there with clubs throughout the North American Board area.

Rossfan

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Re: GPA's latest scam
« Reply #22 on: September 13, 2013, 04:37:07 PM »
I don't disagree AZ, but I don't get the outrage either.

GPA, Dónal Óg.
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Zulu

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Re: GPA's latest scam
« Reply #23 on: September 13, 2013, 04:53:29 PM »
Ah yeah, I'm not outraged, I just find the changes a bit puzzling and pointless.

Mind you, if I were involved in colleges GAA in the US, as EamonnCA is, I probably would be peeved a bit that we weren't consulted or involved in this. It strikes me as a great opportunity to at least showcase the teams (all collegiate) that are already playing the game Stanford, Cal, etc would all be names very familiar to Notre Dame and USC fans through collegiate sports already.

Tbh I don't see why they should have been consulted, would the NFL consult the university football teams in Ireland if they were doing something in Ireland to develop Arena football here? Sure if you were to consult everyone involved in the different facets of the GAA in any country you'd be all year talking and end up the Frankenstein solutions we often get in the GAA.

IMO sustainable longterm development of the GAA internationally is only possible through focused development of primary school level children with a clear pathway for them to develop into playing adults (i.e. locally based clubs linked with primary and high schools, local competitions and an elite pathway for the better kids).

What Donal Og is doing is not going to work IMO but in the absence of any alternative, it's as worthwhile a waste of GAA resources as any.

orangeman

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Re: GPA's latest scam
« Reply #24 on: September 13, 2013, 05:10:13 PM »
Ah yeah, I'm not outraged, I just find the changes a bit puzzling and pointless.

Mind you, if I were involved in colleges GAA in the US, as EamonnCA is, I probably would be peeved a bit that we weren't consulted or involved in this. It strikes me as a great opportunity to at least showcase the teams (all collegiate) that are already playing the game Stanford, Cal, etc would all be names very familiar to Notre Dame and USC fans through collegiate sports already.

Tbh I don't see why they should have been consulted, would the NFL consult the university football teams in Ireland if they were doing something in Ireland to develop Arena football here? Sure if you were to consult everyone involved in the different facets of the GAA in any country you'd be all year talking and end up the Frankenstein solutions we often get in the GAA.

IMO sustainable longterm development of the GAA internationally is only possible through focused development of primary school level children with a clear pathway for them to develop into playing adults (i.e. locally based clubs linked with primary and high schools, local competitions and an elite pathway for the better kids).

What Donal Og is doing is not going to work IMO but in the absence of any alternative, it's as worthwhile a waste of GAA resources as any.


 :)

How closely would the GAA and GPA have discussed this new initiative ?.

AZOffaly

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Re: GPA's latest scam
« Reply #25 on: September 13, 2013, 05:22:25 PM »
Ah yeah, I'm not outraged, I just find the changes a bit puzzling and pointless.

Mind you, if I were involved in colleges GAA in the US, as EamonnCA is, I probably would be peeved a bit that we weren't consulted or involved in this. It strikes me as a great opportunity to at least showcase the teams (all collegiate) that are already playing the game Stanford, Cal, etc would all be names very familiar to Notre Dame and USC fans through collegiate sports already.

Tbh I don't see why they should have been consulted, would the NFL consult the university football teams in Ireland if they were doing something in Ireland to develop Arena football here? Sure if you were to consult everyone involved in the different facets of the GAA in any country you'd be all year talking and end up the Frankenstein solutions we often get in the GAA.

IMO sustainable longterm development of the GAA internationally is only possible through focused development of primary school level children with a clear pathway for them to develop into playing adults (i.e. locally based clubs linked with primary and high schools, local competitions and an elite pathway for the better kids).

What Donal Og is doing is not going to work IMO but in the absence of any alternative, it's as worthwhile a waste of GAA resources as any.

Well the NFL has no affiliate in Ireland. You can be sure they consulted with NFLUK before the international series was confirmed. The NACB is part of the GAA as much as any other county board so it seems a bit strange they were not involved a little. Why not use your (not an outside agency) expertise on the ground?

Zulu

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Re: GPA's latest scam
« Reply #26 on: September 13, 2013, 06:02:43 PM »
But is it expertise? I'm involved in the GAA abroad and while I or others could offer opinions based on our experiences it would be fairly irrelevant for an initiative like this. If the GAA were looking to develop hurling at University level then yes, discuss it with those currently involved to get a feel for what is needed to push it forward. But this isn't about that, I don't know what it's about really, but it ain't about developing University level hurling.

I'm not supporting this at all but I just don't see any real reason to complain about it other than it being daft, but when it comes to the international development of the GAA then daftness is at the very heart of most initiatives.

Eamonnca1

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Re: GPA's latest scam
« Reply #27 on: September 13, 2013, 06:13:41 PM »
The NACB has about 50 years of experience of developing Gaelic games in America and promoting the sports on short fields. The NCGAA has been marketing the game to first-time viewers for about 5 year and getting results. We know what works in America and what doesn't.  We know what the American audience likes about the game.  From this hare-brained scheme it's pretty clear that the GPA doesn't - they don't know the first thing about marketing our games in America.  If they'd given us the courtesy of consulting us we could have told them what a stupid idea this is and that they could have kept the essential core of the game without changing it to something unrecognizable.

Zulu

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Re: GPA's latest scam
« Reply #28 on: September 13, 2013, 06:30:49 PM »
Most of us here aren't in America and it seems we all feel it is a waste of time so I don't think they needed to speak with American GAA to get that opinion. I don't see how it will hinder GAA development in the US so, as I said, other than being daft then I don't see what the big deal is.

Quote
The NACB has about 50 years of experience of developing Gaelic games in America and promoting the sports on short fields. The NCGAA has been marketing the game to first-time viewers for about 5 year and getting results. We know what works in America and what doesn't.

I wouldn't accept that as a given, no more than I or British GAA know what is needed. In fact, the relative lack of success in GAA development both in Britain and America would indicate that we don't know what is needed. Considering the population and number of Irish in both countries I would argue that GAA development has been a notable failure in both countries so far.

easytiger95

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Re: GPA's latest scam
« Reply #29 on: September 14, 2013, 12:39:23 PM »
I hope I didn't come across as outraged but why should we settle for daft, when with a bit of forethought and consultation, we could immeasurably improve what is a brilliant promotional opportunity. I don't care if the North American board is put out, what annoys me is this presentation of a fait accompli, when most hurling people here and in American would question the usefulness of these new rules.

I'd also ask where is Pat Daly in all of this? Is anyone just allowed come up with a hare-brained hybrid and then bowl away with the GAA's approval? We should promote as a means to protecting the future and the heritage we already have in hurling. Nothing against the free style hurling though - think that is a very good initiative.