Test appetite for Irish Unity in Census 2021

[LCohen]

When are the lazy whiny whingy Nordies going to get off their lazy fat arses and do some work and generate some GDP for themselves?
Their biggest political party is actively pursuing a policy that will reduce their bit of an economy by 10 or 15%.
Their 2nd biggest party are going around chanting Border Poll Border Poll non stop.
Yet when Irish unity is suggested Unionists and Nationalists alike come out with -can you lot afford to give us loads of free money?

Time to start growing up lads and lassies - Scottish oil or 26 Co taxpayers don't owe ye lot a living.

Have a nice day now😀

It is indeed time to grow up. But no signs of it. And even if there were signs of it now how long would it take to be a non issue. It's a big problem for everyone in NI and a big problem for Irish Nationalists everywhere. So who has the solutions?

[seafoid]

Seafoid,

Have you any analysis on the prospects for the Irish economy post brexit? Or it's prospects if 1 or more of the foreign companies it relied upon started reporting its taxable profits elsewhere? Or it's prospects if both happened?

Can you name a less balanced western economy than RoI?

And as this is a UI debate have you any analysis that points to RoI being able to afford a UI as it currently stands and then sensitised said analysis in the light of the 2 risk factors I have outlined?

More importantly has anybody else who proposes a UI carried out this analysis and prepared to publish it?

As things stand LCohen  the economy will blow up when the US does.
A lot of companies are going to go to the wall.
The groupthink is nuts.
Assuming the money in the financial orgs could be saved and the economic system changed to focus on demand Ireland would have seveal advantages such as age profile, level of education, productivity.
The key thing is to hoard capital now before all hell breaks loose.

I am working on a  few things in this regard. I think the pension funds are key. NI needs massive investment and the funds do nothing with their money.

So you have nothing that suggests that RoI could afford a UI?

Can RoI generate another £9bn pa?
Can the £9bn be reduced via productivity improvements?

Yes and yes but not under this system

You do know that the real bill is substantially in excess of £9 bn?

But anyway, tell me how RoI could find £9bn p.a.?

It would need a lead in time but it could be done

By changing the focus of the economy away from asset bubbles
By improving the links between research and indigenous firms.
Via a national investment strategy
By harnessing the pension funds instead of having them invest in bonds
By reforming secondary education
By taking the finger out generally.

I don't think the Dublin only strategy  is particularly efficient
There is a lot of fat in the current model.

[LCohen]

Seafoid,

Have you any analysis on the prospects for the Irish economy post brexit? Or it's prospects if 1 or more of the foreign companies it relied upon started reporting its taxable profits elsewhere? Or it's prospects if both happened?

Can you name a less balanced western economy than RoI?

And as this is a UI debate have you any analysis that points to RoI being able to afford a UI as it currently stands and then sensitised said analysis in the light of the 2 risk factors I have outlined?

More importantly has anybody else who proposes a UI carried out this analysis and prepared to publish it?

As things stand LCohen  the economy will blow up when the US does.
A lot of companies are going to go to the wall.
The groupthink is nuts.
Assuming the money in the financial orgs could be saved and the economic system changed to focus on demand Ireland would have seveal advantages such as age profile, level of education, productivity.
The key thing is to hoard capital now before all hell breaks loose.

I am working on a  few things in this regard. I think the pension funds are key. NI needs massive investment and the funds do nothing with their money.

So you have nothing that suggests that RoI could afford a UI?

Can RoI generate another £9bn pa?
Can the £9bn be reduced via productivity improvements?

Yes and yes but not under this system

You do know that the real bill is substantially in excess of £9 bn?

But anyway, tell me how RoI could find £9bn p.a.?

It would need a lead in time but it could be done

By changing the focus of the economy away from asset bubbles
By improving the links between research and indigenous firms.
Via a national investment strategy
By harnessing the pension funds instead of having them invest in bonds
By reforming secondary education
By taking the finger out generally.

I don't think the Dublin only strategy  is particularly efficient
There is a lot of fat in the current model.

So what is your timeframe? 25 years, 50 years, 75 years? Or longer?

Nobody could accuse you of overdoing the specifics

[seafoid]

Seafoid,

Have you any analysis on the prospects for the Irish economy post brexit? Or it's prospects if 1 or more of the foreign companies it relied upon started reporting its taxable profits elsewhere? Or it's prospects if both happened?

Can you name a less balanced western economy than RoI?

And as this is a UI debate have you any analysis that points to RoI being able to afford a UI as it currently stands and then sensitised said analysis in the light of the 2 risk factors I have outlined?

More importantly has anybody else who proposes a UI carried out this analysis and prepared to publish it?

As things stand LCohen  the economy will blow up when the US does.
A lot of companies are going to go to the wall.
The groupthink is nuts.
Assuming the money in the financial orgs could be saved and the economic system changed to focus on demand Ireland would have seveal advantages such as age profile, level of education, productivity.
The key thing is to hoard capital now before all hell breaks loose.

I am working on a  few things in this regard. I think the pension funds are key. NI needs massive investment and the funds do nothing with their money.

So you have nothing that suggests that RoI could afford a UI?

Can RoI generate another £9bn pa?
Can the £9bn be reduced via productivity improvements?

Yes and yes but not under this system

You do know that the real bill is substantially in excess of £9 bn?

But anyway, tell me how RoI could find £9bn p.a.?

It would need a lead in time but it could be done

By changing the focus of the economy away from asset bubbles
By improving the links between research and indigenous firms.
Via a national investment strategy
By harnessing the pension funds instead of having them invest in bonds
By reforming secondary education
By taking the finger out generally.

I don't think the Dublin only strategy  is particularly efficient
There is a lot of fat in the current model.

So what is your timeframe? 25 years, 50 years, 75 years? Or longer?

Nobody could accuse you of overdoing the specifics

I didn't get paid for it so what is the point?
Neoliberalism is going to collapse within 10 years . We are in the equivalent of the 1930s. Conventional thinking in the 1930s couldn't predict the 50s.
If Ireland got organised I think 25 years could be doable.
But it depends on the deep state, doesn't it?

[LCohen]

Seafoid,

Have you any analysis on the prospects for the Irish economy post brexit? Or it's prospects if 1 or more of the foreign companies it relied upon started reporting its taxable profits elsewhere? Or it's prospects if both happened?

Can you name a less balanced western economy than RoI?

And as this is a UI debate have you any analysis that points to RoI being able to afford a UI as it currently stands and then sensitised said analysis in the light of the 2 risk factors I have outlined?

More importantly has anybody else who proposes a UI carried out this analysis and prepared to publish it?

As things stand LCohen  the economy will blow up when the US does.
A lot of companies are going to go to the wall.
The groupthink is nuts.
Assuming the money in the financial orgs could be saved and the economic system changed to focus on demand Ireland would have seveal advantages such as age profile, level of education, productivity.
The key thing is to hoard capital now before all hell breaks loose.

I am working on a  few things in this regard. I think the pension funds are key. NI needs massive investment and the funds do nothing with their money.

So you have nothing that suggests that RoI could afford a UI?

Can RoI generate another £9bn pa?
Can the £9bn be reduced via productivity improvements?

Yes and yes but not under this system

You do know that the real bill is substantially in excess of £9 bn?

But anyway, tell me how RoI could find £9bn p.a.?

It would need a lead in time but it could be done

By changing the focus of the economy away from asset bubbles
By improving the links between research and indigenous firms.
Via a national investment strategy
By harnessing the pension funds instead of having them invest in bonds
By reforming secondary education
By taking the finger out generally.

I don't think the Dublin only strategy  is particularly efficient
There is a lot of fat in the current model.

So what is your timeframe? 25 years, 50 years, 75 years? Or longer?

Nobody could accuse you of overdoing the specifics

I didn't get paid for it so what is the point?
Neoliberalism is going to collapse within 10 years . We are in the equivalent of the 1930s. Conventional thinking in the 1930s couldn't predict the 50s.
If Ireland got organised I think 25 years could be doable.
But it depends on the deep state, doesn't it?

Fair enough you don't have any specifics but are you aware of anybody who does?

Somebody out there who supports the idea of a UI must have some idea of what the burden the subvention of the NI treasury would place on the RoI economy? And the timescale within which that burden could start to be met?

People can talk about demographics in NI but that will do nothing to address the seeming impossibility of winning a referendum in RoI if it has been triggered by a referendum in NI where northern voters have been guaranteed no reduction in public spending as a result of voting for a UI

[seafoid]

Seafoid,

Have you any analysis on the prospects for the Irish economy post brexit? Or it's prospects if 1 or more of the foreign companies it relied upon started reporting its taxable profits elsewhere? Or it's prospects if both happened?

Can you name a less balanced western economy than RoI?

And as this is a UI debate have you any analysis that points to RoI being able to afford a UI as it currently stands and then sensitised said analysis in the light of the 2 risk factors I have outlined?

More importantly has anybody else who proposes a UI carried out this analysis and prepared to publish it?

As things stand LCohen  the economy will blow up when the US does.
A lot of companies are going to go to the wall.
The groupthink is nuts.
Assuming the money in the financial orgs could be saved and the economic system changed to focus on demand Ireland would have seveal advantages such as age profile, level of education, productivity.
The key thing is to hoard capital now before all hell breaks loose.

I am working on a  few things in this regard. I think the pension funds are key. NI needs massive investment and the funds do nothing with their money.

So you have nothing that suggests that RoI could afford a UI?

Can RoI generate another £9bn pa?
Can the £9bn be reduced via productivity improvements?

Yes and yes but not under this system

You do know that the real bill is substantially in excess of £9 bn?

But anyway, tell me how RoI could find £9bn p.a.?

It would need a lead in time but it could be done

By changing the focus of the economy away from asset bubbles
By improving the links between research and indigenous firms.
Via a national investment strategy
By harnessing the pension funds instead of having them invest in bonds
By reforming secondary education
By taking the finger out generally.

I don't think the Dublin only strategy  is particularly efficient
There is a lot of fat in the current model.

So what is your timeframe? 25 years, 50 years, 75 years? Or longer?

Nobody could accuse you of overdoing the specifics

I didn't get paid for it so what is the point?
Neoliberalism is going to collapse within 10 years . We are in the equivalent of the 1930s. Conventional thinking in the 1930s couldn't predict the 50s.
If Ireland got organised I think 25 years could be doable.
But it depends on the deep state, doesn't it?

Fair enough you don't have any specifics but are you aware of anybody who does?

Somebody out there who supports the idea of a UI must have some idea of what the burden the subvention of the NI treasury would place on the RoI economy? And the timescale within which that burden could start to be met?

People can talk about demographics in NI but that will do nothing to address the seeming impossibility of winning a referendum in RoI if it has been triggered by a referendum in NI where northern voters have been guaranteed no reduction in public spending as a result of voting for a UI

Peter Hitchens describes what needs to be done. A policy has to be devised, put to the people in an election, won and implemented.

https://youtu.be/QUjLmw4bgq0

It won't happen on its own. ImportaNT things generally don't. 

A start would be to calculate the cost of separation and the potential of NI.
Expressing it in terms of money would convince more people.

[LCohen]

So it's your policy to develop a policy. Is Irish Nationalism any further down the road than you on this one?

[Rossfan]

"Irish Nationalism" in all its political persuasions  hasn't got a policy other than "Border poll now, Border poll now " from one outfit.

[seafoid]

So it's your policy to develop a policy. Is Irish Nationalism any further down the road than you on this one?

Things will only change when the Euro collapses I imagine. Groupthink is a very powerful force. Change usually only happens when there is no alternative.
A lot of the structures of life in Ireland date from 100 years ago, the last time there was a serious change.   

[LCohen]

So it's your policy to develop a policy. Is Irish Nationalism any further down the road than you on this one?

Things will only change when the Euro collapses I imagine. Groupthink is a very powerful force. Change usually only happens when there is no alternative.
A lot of the structures of life in Ireland date from 100 years ago, the last time there was a serious change.

I am always amazed when a random selection of words is grammatically correct. A variant of the infinite monkey theory

[dec]

So it's your policy to develop a policy. Is Irish Nationalism any further down the road than you on this one?

Things will only change when the Euro collapses I imagine. Groupthink is a very powerful force. Change usually only happens when there is no alternative.
A lot of the structures of life in Ireland date from 100 years ago, the last time there was a serious change.

I am always amazed when a random selection of words is grammatically correct. A variant of the infinite monkey theory

I think it might be a bot

[seafoid]

So it's your policy to develop a policy. Is Irish Nationalism any further down the road than you on this one?

Things will only change when the Euro collapses I imagine. Groupthink is a very powerful force. Change usually only happens when there is no alternative.
A lot of the structures of life in Ireland date from 100 years ago, the last time there was a serious change.

I am always amazed when a random selection of words is grammatically correct. A variant of the infinite monkey theory

You are not thinking about the system. You think a UI will just happen, do you ?

[LCohen]

So it's your policy to develop a policy. Is Irish Nationalism any further down the road than you on this one?

Things will only change when the Euro collapses I imagine. Groupthink is a very powerful force. Change usually only happens when there is no alternative.
A lot of the structures of life in Ireland date from 100 years ago, the last time there was a serious change.

I am always amazed when a random selection of words is grammatically correct. A variant of the infinite monkey theory

You are not thinking about the system. You think a UI will just happen, do you ?

I don't it will happen in 100 years. And I'm certain it won't happen within 50 years

[Stan Laurel]

Brexit is a mess. But as a driver of UI it's a red herring

Not so, the undermining of the whole 1998 settlement and the NI economy is very definitely influential.

I agree. The UK is close to bankruptcy. The deficit is the difference between govt income and spending.  It is €1.7 Trillion pounds now. A no deal Brexit could be the end.
Unionists are in a very difficult situation.

Do you just pull figures out of the sky?

What is the true figure?

Between spending and revenue it is certainly not 1.7 Trillion but seafood loves the fake news, any post for him is a good post to rack up his posting count, nearly all of his posts are bullshit, cut and pasted from some web site or other.

In the last quarter the UK government broke even in terms of income and expenditure. So the current deficit has been brought under control and is zero.

However, the UK government debt is now around £1.7 trillion.

The debt is partly due to bailing out the banks and the remainder is running a government in most years in deficit between income and expenditure.

GDP growth in Q1 was 0.1%
The UK needs growth to repay the debt.
Tax receipt growth is related to pay rises. These are a function of investment.

Real wages in the UK are still 6.5% below where they were in February 2008. They are the same as they were two years ago

Look at investment. 
Cutting Govt spending is no.panacea either.
Demand is not being supported. The UK will probably default

All very well but despite your great ability to spout economic data you made the simple mistake of not knowing the difference between recurrent deficit and national debt.

UK is debt ridden but the cuts in public spending have brought the quarterly deficit virtually to an end but it may fluctuate for another while depending on tax income. 

However, the cost of removing the deficit has been borne by the public while companies revel in greatly lowered corporate tax as a bribe to stay in low tax UK after Brexit.

It was a mistake. So what.
The UK economy is stagnant. It needs to GROW to pay of all the debt.
And the level of investment is atrocious

This is a structural crisis . There is no way back to equilibrium.

Just read this, made my day, this is someone trying to give fiscal policy on this board, just as well you aren't in charge of anything important, if when you don't know the basics you say it was a mistake so what, heavens above. 

[seafoid]

Brexit is a mess. But as a driver of UI it's a red herring

Not so, the undermining of the whole 1998 settlement and the NI economy is very definitely influential.

I agree. The UK is close to bankruptcy. The deficit is the difference between govt income and spending.  It is €1.7 Trillion pounds now. A no deal Brexit could be the end.
Unionists are in a very difficult situation.

Do you just pull figures out of the sky?

What is the true figure?

Between spending and revenue it is certainly not 1.7 Trillion but seafood loves the fake news, any post for him is a good post to rack up his posting count, nearly all of his posts are bullshit, cut and pasted from some web site or other.

In the last quarter the UK government broke even in terms of income and expenditure. So the current deficit has been brought under control and is zero.

However, the UK government debt is now around £1.7 trillion.

The debt is partly due to bailing out the banks and the remainder is running a government in most years in deficit between income and expenditure.

GDP growth in Q1 was 0.1%
The UK needs growth to repay the debt.
Tax receipt growth is related to pay rises. These are a function of investment.

Real wages in the UK are still 6.5% below where they were in February 2008. They are the same as they were two years ago

Look at investment. 
Cutting Govt spending is no.panacea either.
Demand is not being supported. The UK will probably default

All very well but despite your great ability to spout economic data you made the simple mistake of not knowing the difference between recurrent deficit and national debt.

UK is debt ridden but the cuts in public spending have brought the quarterly deficit virtually to an end but it may fluctuate for another while depending on tax income. 

However, the cost of removing the deficit has been borne by the public while companies revel in greatly lowered corporate tax as a bribe to stay in low tax UK after Brexit.

It was a mistake. So what.
The UK economy is stagnant. It needs to GROW to pay of all the debt.
And the level of investment is atrocious

This is a structural crisis . There is no way back to equilibrium.

Just read this, made my day, this is someone trying to give fiscal policy on this board, just as well you aren't in charge of anything important, if when you don't know the basics you say it was a mistake so what, heavens above. 

FFS
You don't know anything about the UK economy.