Surely merits a thread of his own...
Be really interesting to see who is next. He did some job.
A remarkable achievement winning 5 in a row and 6 AI's in a decade. Huge pressure given their financial and home advantage. There is a huge expectation to succeed with such advantages. Managers like Mancini, Mourinho, Guardiola have shown that it takes a good managers to deal with such pressures and get you team over the line. It's not as easy as it looks. Others would have failed. Would have been Manager of 7 in a row except for complacency against Donegal in 2014. I suppose that was the last time he was caught off guard and it ensured the drive for 5 in a row.
The end of an era, and what a privilege for all football fans to have lived through it. Jim will be a legend for a long as Gaelic football is played. Thanks for the memories Jim and good luck in whatever you may now turn your hand to.
I will remember him for the interviews.
It wasn't his fault that Gaelic football was no longer a sport.
Quote from: The Hill is Blue on November 30, 2019, 02:32:20 PM
The end of an era, and what a privilege for all football fans to have lived through it. Jim will be a legend for a long as Gaelic football is played. Thanks for the memories Jim and good luck in whatever you may now turn your hand to.
+1 A legend and a gentleman to boot.
I have seen many great managers come and go but Jim was the best of them all.
His will be a hard act to follow.
No surprise really although was expecting it in October rather than now. The pressure of the 5 in a row probably took a lot out of him. He'll have a rest and be back in a few years.
Job is probably between Clarke, Sherlock and Farrell.
This will prompt another few retirements starting with Cluxton.
Quote from: seafoid on November 30, 2019, 03:11:31 PM
I will remember him for the interviews.
It wasn't his fault that Gaelic football was no longer a sport.
He'll be remembered for his man management skills and how he kept his players so motivated. His interviews before and after matches were scripted dross.
Just looking at the odds Paddyower have on Dublin over the next few years, for anyone who thinks this is going to severely impact on Dublin's dominance.
November 2019
To win 6 AISF championships in a row in 2020 4/7 (.571)
To win 10 AISF championships in a row in 2024 15/2 (7.5)
Today (after Gavin made his announcement)
To win 6 AISF championships in a row in 2020 4/6 (0.666)
To win 10 AISF championships in a row in 2024 9/1 (9)
Overrated
Super manager, nice fella too.
Quote from: blanketattack on November 30, 2019, 03:20:37 PM
No surprise really although was expecting it in October rather than now. The pressure of the 5 in a row probably took a lot out of him. He'll have a rest and be back in a few years.
Job is probably between Clarke, Sherlock and Farrell.
This will prompt another few retirements starting with Cluxton.
Aye. I thought when he hadn't stepped down in the weeks after the final that he would stay on. Agree regarding Cluxton too
Great to see, might give other teams a very slight chance now
Fair play to him, the record speaks for itself. Hopefully the start of Dublin becoming beatable again.
Will miss those interviews...
X are a very good team and put it up to us. Luckily we managed to scrape through by 30 points in the end.
His successor will have 39,000 players to choose from, around 25 All Ireland winners there already, most games at home, HQ looking after them etc etc.
Maybe they'll slip back to only winning 5 out of every 7 now.
Anyway enjoy your retirement Jim and if you've time on your hands in a few years time you could give Ros CB a shout.
A game changer for Dublin.
Brilliant manager.
Opens up the 2020 Championship a little...
Would Jim Gavin win an All Ireland with any other county ?
Quote from: seafoid on November 30, 2019, 07:08:22 PM
Would Jim Gavin win an All Ireland with any other county ?
No. And he won't be stupid enough to find out.
Quote from: seafoid on November 30, 2019, 07:08:22 PM
Would Jim Gavin win an All Ireland with any other county ?
Of course he would? You are talking about the best Manager of this current era. If I was Meath County Board I would hunt him down and offer him any money (although he is not interested in money). Success would be instant, he won Dublin an All Ireland in his first year.
He'd never win one with Mayo! They are cursed! And curses go beyond brilliance.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on November 30, 2019, 06:24:32 PM
A game changer for Dublin.
Brilliant manager.
Opens up the 2020 Championship a little...
This exactly.
Quote from: Farrandeelin on November 30, 2019, 07:28:09 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on November 30, 2019, 06:24:32 PM
A game changer for Dublin.
Brilliant manager.
Opens up the 2020 Championship a little...
This exactly.
It does? Paddy Power thinks otherwise!
Did I not heard a news report of Dublin chairman saying Jim had confirmed for 2020? Maybe I'm goin mad or did something happen?
Leinster is anyone's now!!
;D
;D
;D
;D
;D
:D
:D
:-\
:-\
:(
:(
>:(
>:(
:'(
Quote from: WT4E on November 30, 2019, 09:12:07 PM
Did I not heard a news report of Dublin chairman saying Jim had confirmed for 2020? Maybe I'm goin mad or did something happen?
No!
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/jim-gavin-set-to-commit-for-eighth-season-with-dublin-960332.html (https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/jim-gavin-set-to-commit-for-eighth-season-with-dublin-960332.html)
Quote from: From the Bunker on November 30, 2019, 09:28:26 PM
Quote from: WT4E on November 30, 2019, 09:12:07 PM
Did I not heard a news report of Dublin chairman saying Jim had confirmed for 2020? Maybe I'm goin mad or did something happen?
No!
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/jim-gavin-set-to-commit-for-eighth-season-with-dublin-960332.html (https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/jim-gavin-set-to-commit-for-eighth-season-with-dublin-960332.html)
Usually these things are about money but surely this can't be the case considering what Jim has delivered and the bottomless supply of cash Dublin have for GAA and all irelands??
Quote from: WT4E on November 30, 2019, 09:42:26 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on November 30, 2019, 09:28:26 PM
Quote from: WT4E on November 30, 2019, 09:12:07 PM
Did I not heard a news report of Dublin chairman saying Jim had confirmed for 2020? Maybe I'm goin mad or did something happen?
No!
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/jim-gavin-set-to-commit-for-eighth-season-with-dublin-960332.html (https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/jim-gavin-set-to-commit-for-eighth-season-with-dublin-960332.html)
Usually these things are about money but surely this can't be the case considering what Jim has delivered and the bottomless supply of cash Dublin have for GAA and all irelands??
Jim is a volunteer. He never received money!
Quote from: Dinny Breen on November 30, 2019, 06:24:32 PM
A game changer for Dublin.
Brilliant manager.
Opens up the 2020 Championship a little...
Does it really? Let's not waste time - who's going to win the All Ireland in, say.....2070?
Quote from: seafoid on November 30, 2019, 07:08:22 PM
Would Jim Gavin win an All Ireland with any other county ?
Give him a few bob, bring him up to Belfast & let's see how he gets on with the current exciting crop in Antrim.
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on November 30, 2019, 10:04:42 PM
Quote from: seafoid on November 30, 2019, 07:08:22 PM
Would Jim Gavin win an All Ireland with any other county ?
Give him a few bob, bring him up to Belfast & let's see how he gets on with the current exciting crop in Antrim.
He used to dealing with the players from a large city. Should be second nature to get Antrim up and running. How is Casement Park Development coming along. He'll need a couple of home games!
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on November 30, 2019, 10:01:52 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on November 30, 2019, 06:24:32 PM
A game changer for Dublin.
Brilliant manager.
Opens up the 2020 Championship a little...
Does it really? Let's not waste time - who's going to win the All Ireland in, say.....2070?
East Leinster.
Quote from: Farrandeelin on November 30, 2019, 07:28:09 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on November 30, 2019, 06:24:32 PM
A game changer for Dublin.
Brilliant manager.
Opens up the 2020 Championship a little...
This exactly.
Gives Kerry a chance. No-one else.
For all his boring interviews etc. I think we can all agree he was a phenomenal manager and an even better man. Brolly's article about him basically says it all!
I'm telling you he will be very difficult to replace I think it leave this year wide open (obvs when I say wide open I mean Kerry have a slight chance).
Good luck to him he has had some managerial career... I wonder though was it his call or had something happened?? We'll see I guess!
His record speaks for itself and he will deservedly go down as one of the all time greats. For all the praise he gets, I think his greatest quality often got overlooked, which was his on-field decision making/team selection. While he obviously had a talented management team around him, he had the final say and he almost always seemed to get it right...2016-throwing in a relatively unknown Cormac Costello who proceeded to single-handedly win it for them, 2017-Not starting Connolly and then unleashing him when the game was in the melting pot, deciding to start Eoin Murchan in the replay this year, the list goes on.
For me though, I'll remember him as the man who sucked the life out of Gaelic football. The endless platitude infested interviews, the lack of even a smile after wining the three in a row in 2017, the way his ruthlessly efficient, yet robotic team tore away any element of surprise or competitiveness from the Leinster championship before essentially doing the same thing to the AI Championship (bar 1 game a year against Kerry or Mayo).
His two faced utterances about playing 'honest open' football while his team brought cynicism to new levels. There is no way that the co-ordinated pull down of several Mayo defenders at the exact same time at the end of that final was a spur the moment decision by the Dublin players. I don't blame the Dublin management for organising it (I would have gladly taken an All-Ireland win had the Mayo management done the same) however I do think Gavin's deceitful shite in the media needed to be called out a lot more.
So despite his great qualities as a manger, I can't help but think that his departure will be a positive thing for Gaelic football as a whole.
Quote from: Dubhaltach on December 01, 2019, 01:54:17 AM
There is no way that the co-ordinated pull down of several Mayo defenders at the exact same time at the end of that final was a spur the moment decision by the Dublin players. I don't blame the Dublin management for organising it (I would have gladly taken an All-Ireland win had the Mayo management done the same)
Gas how bitterness can make people lose their memory/sense.
The pull down played no part in Dublin winning the All Ireland. Touch tight was what the plan was, not wrestling Keegan to the ground, regardless of GPS throwing. Gavin was annoyed at that. Meant the ref added on an extra minute and Mayo had an extra man to get the equalizer. Thankfully Clarke sailed his kick out right over the sideline!!
Phenomenal manager and a great man.
I personally think there must have been a change in circumstances in his personal life that has caused the re-think. The very best of luck to him for his future
Quote from: Hound on December 01, 2019, 07:38:04 AM
Quote from: Dubhaltach on December 01, 2019, 01:54:17 AM
There is no way that the co-ordinated pull down of several Mayo defenders at the exact same time at the end of that final was a spur the moment decision by the Dublin players. I don't blame the Dublin management for organising it (I would have gladly taken an All-Ireland win had the Mayo management done the same)
Gas how bitterness can make people lose their memory/sense.
The pull down played no part in Dublin winning the All Ireland. Touch tight was what the plan was, not wrestling Keegan to the ground, regardless of GPS throwing. Gavin was annoyed at that. Meant the ref added on an extra minute and Mayo had an extra man to get the equalizer. Thankfully Clarke sailed his kick out right over the sideline!!
Gas how victory can make people lose their memory/sense.
Maybe Clarke might have got his kickout to a mayo player if Keegan, Durcan, Harrison and Stephen Coen hadn't all been wrestled as soon as soon as Rock's free went over? Mayo were always going to get one last chance regardless of the stoppage, that's how referees work it and it will stay the same until a stopclock is brought in and this timing farce is ended.
Look, Dublin deserved the win, they took more of their scoring opportunities. I was merely using the above example to highlight Gavin's two-faced shite about Dublin playing 'honest' football. It is possible to highlight things like this while also acknowledging his obvious talents as a manager.
The context is all wrong. He got a lot out of his panel. 5 in a row. 36 match unbeaten streak. But we are not in football as usual.
The Dubs won their first Sam of the decade in 2011 after a long period of mediocrity. Mayo reached their first final in 2012.
That Mayo team is past it now. The Dubs aren't
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/jim-gavin-leaves-dublin-with-history-made-and-gaelic-football-transformed-1.4100789?mode=amp
« Paul Flynn, Bernard Brogan and Diarmuid Connolly were pillars of his teams over the first three or four years. Didn't matter. Over time, they were replaced by Niall Scully, Con O'Callaghan and Brian Howard. Philly McMahon was the only Dublin defender to play every minute of every final under Gavin between 2013 and 2018. Didn't matter. This year he didn't feature in the drawn game at all and only saw the last 15 minutes of the replay. Davy Byrne and Eoin Murchan have both passed him. »
They can do this because they have the biggest production line in the sport. They can prime players to replace superstars without changing the performance levels of the team. That is what the funding allowed. This can go on indefinitely
Mayo were mortal
The Dubs have a perpetual football motion machine
The GAA have no idea what to do now.
Quote from: From the Bunker on November 30, 2019, 02:27:42 PM
A remarkable achievement winning 5 in a row and 6 AI's in a decade. Huge pressure given their financial and home advantage. There is a huge expectation to succeed with such advantages. Managers like Mancini, Mourinho, Guardiola have shown that it takes a good managers to deal with such pressures and get you team over the line. It's not as easy as it looks. Others would have failed. Would have been Manager of 7 in a row except for complacency against Donegal in 2014. I suppose that was the last time he was caught off guard and it ensured the drive for 5 in a row.
The loss to Donegal in 2014 was more hubris than complacency. Gavin's only real error in his tenure with the Dublin seniors.
It will be interesting to see how Dublin get on.
Gavin has done a fantastic job with them but I do think people go overboard about him, time will tell whether I'm wrong here or not. Dublin GAA had got its grassroots and structures right from the bottom level when Gavin took over and with that in place it's extremely difficult to compete with Dublin given the superior natural advantages they have over all their competition in playing numbers and finances and also in terms of keeping their biggest talents both from the lurches of the AFL and emigration.
If his predecessor can keep the same level of domination for Dublin in the subsequent years it will more or less dampen a little bite of the adulation of Gavin. There's no doubt Gavin is a good manager and has done a great job with Dublin but it will be time that will tell us just how great Gavin was with Dublin.
Quote from: seafoid on December 01, 2019, 01:40:52 PM
The context is all wrong. He got a lot out of his panel. 5 in a row. 36 match unbeaten streak. But we are not in football as usual.
The Dubs won their first Sam of the decade in 2011 after a long period of mediocrity. Mayo reached their first final in 2012.
That Mayo team is past it now. The Dubs aren't
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/jim-gavin-leaves-dublin-with-history-made-and-gaelic-football-transformed-1.4100789?mode=amp
« Paul Flynn, Bernard Brogan and Diarmuid Connolly were pillars of his teams over the first three or four years. Didn't matter. Over time, they were replaced by Niall Scully, Con O'Callaghan and Brian Howard. Philly McMahon was the only Dublin defender to play every minute of every final under Gavin between 2013 and 2018. Didn't matter. This year he didn't feature in the drawn game at all and only saw the last 15 minutes of the replay. Davy Byrne and Eoin Murchan have both passed him. »
They can do this because they have the biggest production line in the sport. They can prime players to replace superstars without changing the performance levels of the team. That is what the funding allowed. This can go on indefinitely
Mayo were mortal
The Dubs have a perpetual football motion machine
The GAA have no idea what to do now.
If that Mayo team are past it now, then surely 'that' Dublin team are also past it. The reality is both counties have 2 totally different teams playing at the moment.
Quote from: Angelo on December 01, 2019, 02:01:32 PM
It will be interesting to see how Dublin get on.
Gavin has done a fantastic job with them but I do think people go overboard about him, time will tell whether I'm wrong here or not. Dublin GAA had got its grassroots and structures right from the bottom level when Gavin took over and with that in place it's extremely difficult to compete with Dublin given the superior natural advantages they have over all their competition in playing numbers and finances and also in terms of keeping their biggest talents both from the lurches of the AFL and emigration.
If his predecessor can keep the same level of domination for Dublin in the subsequent years it will more or less dampen a little bite of the adulation of Gavin. There's no doubt Gavin is a good manager and has done a great job with Dublin but it will be time that will tell us just how great Gavin was with Dublin.
I think you mean successor
Dublin wouldn't get out of the Tyrone senior championship
Quote from: Dubhaltach on December 01, 2019, 02:34:17 PM
Quote from: seafoid on December 01, 2019, 01:40:52 PM
The context is all wrong. He got a lot out of his panel. 5 in a row. 36 match unbeaten streak. But we are not in football as usual.
The Dubs won their first Sam of the decade in 2011 after a long period of mediocrity. Mayo reached their first final in 2012.
That Mayo team is past it now. The Dubs aren't
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/jim-gavin-leaves-dublin-with-history-made-and-gaelic-football-transformed-1.4100789?mode=amp
« Paul Flynn, Bernard Brogan and Diarmuid Connolly were pillars of his teams over the first three or four years. Didn't matter. Over time, they were replaced by Niall Scully, Con O'Callaghan and Brian Howard. Philly McMahon was the only Dublin defender to play every minute of every final under Gavin between 2013 and 2018. Didn't matter. This year he didn't feature in the drawn game at all and only saw the last 15 minutes of the replay. Davy Byrne and Eoin Murchan have both passed him. »
They can do this because they have the biggest production line in the sport. They can prime players to replace superstars without changing the performance levels of the team. That is what the funding allowed. This can go on indefinitely
Mayo were mortal
The Dubs have a perpetual football motion machine
The GAA have no idea what to do now.
If that Mayo team are past it now, then surely 'that' Dublin team are also past it. The reality is both counties have 2 totally different teams playing at the moment.
Keegan and AOS will get old. Or pick 2 Limerick hurlers. It's not about Mayo. Mayo won't be able to replace the 2 with new players of equal talent. It would take time to develop. That is how it works for most teams. The Dubs can replace stars without impeding the performance of the team because of the machine they have in place.
That's why they are such a threat to the GAA. It's why Kerry now are focusing on the roll of honour.
Quote from: HiMucker on December 01, 2019, 06:43:44 PM
Dublin wouldn't get out of the Tyrone senior championship
lol 😂
Quote from: screenexile on December 01, 2019, 12:43:16 AM
For all his boring interviews etc. I think we can all agree he was a phenomenal manager and an even better man. Brolly's article about him basically says it all!
I'm telling you he will be very difficult to replace I think it leave this year wide open (obvs when I say wide open I mean Kerry have a slight chance).
Good luck to him he has had some managerial career... I wonder though was it his call or had something happened?? We'll see I guess!
His record as manager will be better judged in a few years time. For me he is the greatest manager of all time. A lot of people question his qualities as they say dublin had big advantages. I think Dublin will now struggle to dominate and I can see teams like Kerry in particular, Mayo, Galway and even Cork having opportunities to win all irelands over the next few years.
Quote from: lenny on December 01, 2019, 08:32:44 PM
Quote from: screenexile on December 01, 2019, 12:43:16 AM
For all his boring interviews etc. I think we can all agree he was a phenomenal manager and an even better man. Brolly's article about him basically says it all!
I'm telling you he will be very difficult to replace I think it leave this year wide open (obvs when I say wide open I mean Kerry have a slight chance).
Good luck to him he has had some managerial career... I wonder though was it his call or had something happened?? We'll see I guess!
His record as manager will be better judged in a few years time. For me he is the greatest manager of all time. A lot of people question his qualities as they say dublin had big advantages. I think Dublin will now struggle to dominate and I can see teams like Kerry in particular, Mayo, Galway and even Cork having opportunities to win all irelands over the next few years.
Cork have a lot of ground to make up and will be more than a few years before they are challenging for a senior All Ireland again.
Quote from: lenny on December 01, 2019, 08:32:44 PM
Quote from: screenexile on December 01, 2019, 12:43:16 AM
For all his boring interviews etc. I think we can all agree he was a phenomenal manager and an even better man. Brolly's article about him basically says it all!
I'm telling you he will be very difficult to replace I think it leave this year wide open (obvs when I say wide open I mean Kerry have a slight chance).
Good luck to him he has had some managerial career... I wonder though was it his call or had something happened?? We'll see I guess!
His record as manager will be better judged in a few years time. For me he is the greatest manager of all time. A lot of people question his qualities as they say dublin had big advantages. I think Dublin will now struggle to dominate and I can see teams like Kerry in particular, Mayo, Galway and even Cork having opportunities to win all irelands over the next few years.
I agree. Currently, he has to go down as a great manager but what happens to Dublin in the next 5-10 years may affect how he's judged. If Dublin win say 8/10, then he'll be a very good manager in charge of an unstoppable machine. If Dublin "only" win 3/10, then he'll be remembered as a great manager.
Had the privilege of meeting Jim on one occasion.
A genuine decent Dub with a passion, pride and commitment. Fair play.
I think it's a bit late in the day/early in the morning to turn this thread into yet another Dubs vs the rest all over again but Malachy Clerkin has set me thinking.....Mayo are past it now; they could only put it up to Dublin for a limited period and the same can be said for any other team in the land.
Kerry may well manage an AI sometime as Dublin are only mortal. They may get caught like in 2014 but as Seafóid might say, an rud is annamh, is iontach or seldom is wonderful as the rest of us might say.
NO county can or will ever manage to match Dublin's production line of talented young players coming through. Mayo couldn't keep up: Dublin show no sign of easing up; as their key players age, there are multiple choices on hand for whoever replaces Gavin.
Right now, Kerry are the most likely side to have a hope of beating Dublin. IMO, they might in a one off sooner or later but not anytime soon.
Back around the turn of the century, there was a great levelling out in standards across the country. Sligo were most unlucky not to make a major breakthrough. Wexford were serious contenders for a Leinster at the very least and Laois managed to go a step further. Limerick, Clare, Tipp all made headlines and so did Fermanagh. There were probably a few others who show a marked increase in form. I'd say the period 1995-2005 five saw the most notable period of levelling of in standards throughout the country in the history of the association. Maybe it's a coincidence that it was during this period the backdoor system was introduced. Duno really but it's open to debate.
IMO again, the county with the most reason to feel uneasy at this time was Dublin.
It was a county with first class resources but with second class standards at the very best. Dublin clubs were haemorrhaging young players and the Strategic Review Committee of 2002 put this issue at the top of its agenda. Their proposal that Dublin should be split in two was blown out of the water and the committee's proposal were shelved
But Dublin's internal problems still remained. That's why the late John Bailey turned to Bertie Ahern for help and inspiration. That's when Dublin started getting financial aid from the Sports Council and the slide back to mediocrity for many other counties began.
Dublin managed to fine tune their plans with the Blue Wave initiative about five years later or so, but back then, nobody, Bertie included, thought that Dublin would ever become totally dominant. Bertie figured that at best, Dublin could win 3 out of 5 and that this would incentivise enough kids to play club football to keep the club scene thriving.
( And before anyone asks, I know what Berie was thinking because that's what the hoor told me.)
That's why I think money alone was not the main reason for Jim Gavin's success. It certainly helped but the sheer size of the population was an even bigger factor. Of course, IMO again, his man management skills were second to no other.
But Dublin only need to come up with maybe one out of every 200 to produce a top class player, whereas Mayo or any other county would need a strike rate of one out of 20 or better.
So anybody who thinks Dublin's dominance will end with Gavin's departure probably still believes in the tooth fairy. The structures will still be there and the production line will keep churning out enough young hopefuls to keep everyone on the team looking over his shoulder.
No reasonable person should deny Gavin's exceptional qualities as a tactician and his man management ability but he did not operate in a vacuum and there is no reason to believe, or hope, that Dublin will go off the boil in a dramatic fashion once his successor takes over.
Quote from: Lar Naparka on December 02, 2019, 01:49:15 AM
I think it's a bit late in the day/early in the morning to turn this thread into yet another Dubs vs the rest all over again but Malachy Clerkin has set me thinking.....Mayo are past it now; they could only put it up to Dublin for a limited period and the same can be said for any other team in the land.
Kerry may well manage an AI sometime as Dublin are only mortal. They may get caught like in 2014 but as Seafóid might say, an rud is annamh, is iontach or seldom is wonderful as the rest of us might say.
NO county can or will ever manage to match Dublin's production line of talented young players coming through. Mayo couldn't keep up: Dublin show no sign of easing up; as their key players age, there are multiple choices on hand for whoever replaces Gavin.
Right now, Kerry are the most likely side to have a hope of beating Dublin. IMO, they might in a one off sooner or later but not anytime soon.
Back around the turn of the century, there was a great levelling out in standards across the country. Sligo were most unlucky not to make a major breakthrough. Wexford were serious contenders for a Leinster at the very least and Laois managed to go a step further. Limerick, Clare, Tipp all made headlines and so did Fermanagh. There were probably a few others who show a marked increase in form. I'd say the period 1995-2005 five saw the most notable period of levelling of in standards throughout the country in the history of the association. Maybe it's a coincidence that it was during this period the backdoor system was introduced. Duno really but it's open to debate.
IMO again, the county with the most reason to feel uneasy at this time was Dublin.
It was a county with first class resources but with second class standards at the very best. Dublin clubs were haemorrhaging young players and the Strategic Review Committee of 2002 put this issue at the top of its agenda. Their proposal that Dublin should be split in two was blown out of the water and the committee's proposal were shelved
But Dublin's internal problems still remained. That's why the late John Bailey turned to Bertie Ahern for help and inspiration. That's when Dublin started getting financial aid from the Sports Council and the slide back to mediocrity for many other counties began.
Dublin managed to fine tune their plans with the Blue Wave initiative about five years later or so, but back then, nobody, Bertie included, thought that Dublin would ever become totally dominant. Bertie figured that at best, Dublin could win 3 out of 5 and that this would incentivise enough kids to play club football to keep the club scene thriving.
( And before anyone asks, I know what Berie was thinking because that's what the hoor told me.)
That's why I think money alone was not the main reason for Jim Gavin's success. It certainly helped but the sheer size of the population was an even bigger factor. Of course, IMO again, his man management skills were second to no other.
But Dublin only need to come up with maybe one out of every 200 to produce a top class player, whereas Mayo or any other county would need a strike rate of one out of 20 or better.
So anybody who thinks Dublin's dominance will end with Gavin's departure probably still believes in the tooth fairy. The structures will still be there and the production line will keep churning out enough young hopefuls to keep everyone on the team looking over his shoulder.
No reasonable person should deny Gavin's exceptional qualities as a tactician and his man management ability but he did not operate in a vacuum and there is no reason to believe, or hope, that Dublin will go off the boil in a dramatic fashion once his successor takes over.
What Dublin have post-Gavin is something like an industrial process or a business school approach to produce high spec footballers who can kick off both feet, pass off either hand and run all day. They also know a few dark arts and fit straight away into the team. Coaching levels are extremely high. Nothing like this ever existed in the sport before.
Teams are put away with ease. It's a really impressive machine but the game is in trouble.
Agree with my fellow Connachtmen.
That oul 1.4m population will always come in handy.
Quote from: screenexile on December 01, 2019, 12:43:16 AM
For all his boring interviews etc. I think we can all agree he was a phenomenal manager and an even better man. Brolly's article about him basically says it all!
I'm telling you he will be very difficult to replace I think it leave this year wide open (obvs when I say wide open I mean Kerry have a slight chance).
Good luck to him he has had some managerial career... I wonder though was it his call or had something happened?? We'll see I guess!
Will Brolly do as much eulogising when Gavin takes his spot on The Sunday Game???
Quote from: greatpoint on December 01, 2019, 01:47:02 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on November 30, 2019, 02:27:42 PM
A remarkable achievement winning 5 in a row and 6 AI's in a decade. Huge pressure given their financial and home advantage. There is a huge expectation to succeed with such advantages. Managers like Mancini, Mourinho, Guardiola have shown that it takes a good managers to deal with such pressures and get you team over the line. It's not as easy as it looks. Others would have failed. Would have been Manager of 7 in a row except for complacency against Donegal in 2014. I suppose that was the last time he was caught off guard and it ensured the drive for 5 in a row.
The loss to Donegal in 2014 was more hubris than complacency. Gavin's only real error in his tenure with the Dublin seniors.
That's a bit harsh on Donegal.
Dublin had been playing brilliant attacking football up to that game, and the first 15-20 minutes they were on fire with Connolly and Flynn kicking 4 or 5 long range points between them. Donegal had a plan, and despite the early setback, they stuck with it. And while the plan was a very good one, it would have been worth feck all had the Donegal players not been at the top of their game. Their tackling, their pace, their passing, their support play had us in disarray. And then their total composure when their good play led to scoring chances. They refused to miss. They were simply too good on the day.
Quote from: Rossfan on December 02, 2019, 09:10:51 AM
Agree with my fellow Connachtmen.
That oul 1.4m population will always come in handy.
The more successful the Dubs are, the more likely the country will be broken up
The comparison between 2013 and 2019 shows how the Dublin system is completely different to that of any other county, football or hurling
Dublin 2013 : S Cluxton (0-1, a 45); J Cooper, R O'Carroll, P McMahon; J McCarthy, G Brennan (0-1), J McCaffrey; MD Macauley, C O'Sullivan (0-1); P Flynn (0-1), C Kilkenny, D Connolly (0-1); P Mannion, P Andrews (0-1), B Brogan (2-3, one free).
Dublin 2019 : 1.S Cluxton (capt.); 24. E Murchan (1-0), 3. M Fitzsimons, 2. D Byrne (0-1); 7. J Small, 4. J Cooper, 5. J McCaffrey; 8. B Fenton, 6. J McCarthy (0-1); 10. N Scully (0-1), 11. C Kilkenny (0-4), 12. B Howard; 13. P Mannion (0-4), 14. C O'Callaghan (0-4), 15. D Rock (0-3, one 45).
Quote from: seafoid on December 02, 2019, 07:14:41 AM
high spec footballers who can kick off both feet, pass off either hand and run all day.
As soon as kids have learned to kick with one foot the coaches should start working on kicking with the other foot as well, the same goes for handpasses. Those skills should be second nature by the time they are playing competitive games.
Quote from: seafoid on December 02, 2019, 01:50:59 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on December 02, 2019, 09:10:51 AM
Agree with my fellow Connachtmen.
That oul 1.4m population will always come in handy.
The more successful the Dubs are, the more likely the country will be broken up
Do you really think that Dublin will be split up? Really?
If that were to happen I doubt it would be in this lifetime.
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 02, 2019, 05:44:04 PM
Quote from: seafoid on December 02, 2019, 01:50:59 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on December 02, 2019, 09:10:51 AM
Agree with my fellow Connachtmen.
That oul 1.4m population will always come in handy.
The more successful the Dubs are, the more likely the country will be broken up
Do you really think that Dublin will be split up? Really?
If that were to happen I doubt it would be in this lifetime.
When the life is completely sucked out of the AI Championship. The GAA will create a Intercounty competition based on the Kerry Model. There will be six to eight main counties. The rest will be made of an amalgamation of tier two counties based on area.
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 02, 2019, 05:44:04 PM
Quote from: seafoid on December 02, 2019, 01:50:59 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on December 02, 2019, 09:10:51 AM
Agree with my fellow Connachtmen.
That oul 1.4m population will always come in handy.
The more successful the Dubs are, the more likely the country will be broken up
Do you really think that Dublin will be split up? Really?
If that were to happen I doubt it would be in this lifetime.
Will be shocked if it doesn't happen within the next decade.
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 02, 2019, 05:44:04 PM
Quote from: seafoid on December 02, 2019, 01:50:59 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on December 02, 2019, 09:10:51 AM
Agree with my fellow Connachtmen.
That oul 1.4m population will always come in handy.
The more successful the Dubs are, the more likely the country will be broken up
Do you really think that Dublin will be split up? Really?
If that were to happen I doubt it would be in this lifetime.
If the Dubs keep
winning , something will have to give.
At the moment is any other county anywhere near them?
How do you see this playing out? They have won 7 of the last 9 and 5 of the last 5. Are Meath going to come up with an all Ireland team
within 3 years?
Meath aren't but there are thirty other counties one of which is Kerry with a very good record at underage and that is is still coming through. I don't know why you pick Meath out...
Splitting etc would be a massive shift. You talk like it is a matter of course. It isn't.
Moving from the super eights to proper knockout would help too.
How the thing pans out post gavin a big factor too.
Quote from: Hound on December 02, 2019, 01:19:51 PM
Quote from: greatpoint on December 01, 2019, 01:47:02 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on November 30, 2019, 02:27:42 PM
A remarkable achievement winning 5 in a row and 6 AI's in a decade. Huge pressure given their financial and home advantage. There is a huge expectation to succeed with such advantages. Managers like Mancini, Mourinho, Guardiola have shown that it takes a good managers to deal with such pressures and get you team over the line. It's not as easy as it looks. Others would have failed. Would have been Manager of 7 in a row except for complacency against Donegal in 2014. I suppose that was the last time he was caught off guard and it ensured the drive for 5 in a row.
The loss to Donegal in 2014 was more hubris than complacency. Gavin's only real error in his tenure with the Dublin seniors.
That's a bit harsh on Donegal.
Dublin had been playing brilliant attacking football up to that game, and the first 15-20 minutes they were on fire with Connolly and Flynn kicking 4 or 5 long range points between them. Donegal had a plan, and despite the early setback, they stuck with it. And while the plan was a very good one, it would have been worth feck all had the Donegal players not been at the top of their game. Their tackling, their pace, their passing, their support play had us in disarray. And then their total composure when their good play led to scoring chances. They refused to miss. They were simply too good on the day.
Dublin missed several goal chances that they'd have scored on any other day, if they go in, Donegal are toast
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 02, 2019, 07:51:04 PM
Meath aren't but there are thirty other counties one of which is Kerry with a very good record at underage and that is is still coming through. I don't know why you pick Meath out...
Splitting etc would be a massive shift. You talk like it is a matter of course. It isn't.
Moving from the super eights to proper knockout would help too.
How the thing pans out post gavin a big factor too.
I think it's not a matter of if Dublin is going to be split but more a question of when this will happen. It isn't just a question of All Irelands won but of the size of the county's population. toio
Right now, the Dublin region has approximately one third of the population of the republic and, just as importantly, roughly 40% of the national resources. (Recent govt. estimates, not mine.)
By 2040, the population will have increased to 40% of the state and the share of the resources or the country's wealth will have risen to 50% of the total.
I think those figures understated. Dublin is outstriping the rest of the country by a greater rate than govt. Figures indicate. That's not got anything directly to do with Dublin GAA, you can put it down to social, political and economic factors but it does have a knock on effect on the way the GAA interacts with the general population.
Every county has a county board, regardless of the county's population. So it will have just one senior intercounty team, one senior club championship etc. Dublin have a fairly small number of very big clubs but only a single premier team. All counties have the same setup but the difference between underage and senior clubs isn't as great.
Na Fianna club claims to have 2,000 kids involved at weekends but how many of them will ever get to play for the club at senior level? If other counties had the same dropout rate,the GAA would be banjaxed long before now. The number of clubs in Dublin is not increasing and the price of land means the clubs in existence can't afford to acquire new land so forget the ballyhoo about increasing numbers of kids joining GAA clubs, Dublin is losing its market share of active membership.
Dunno the exact figure but it was stated on another thread on this board that Dublin has less than 100 registered clubs. According to the county website, Cavan has 41 clubs.
Now, you don't need to be a rocket scientist to work out that Dublin has 18 times the population of Cavan but less than three times the number of Gaelic clubs.
Like every other sport, THe GAA has to fight for its market share of active members and to increase it if possible. Cavan has a far higher percentage of the population involved in its affairs than Dublin has and it hasn't won an All Ireland since 1952.
Awards at the highest level doesn't always lead to higher participation numbers down the line and Dublin is a prime example of this. That is one reason why Dublin needs every cent it gets from HQ or anywhere else to keep its crazy club structure operating.
Sooner or later, reality bites or the GAA is going to go tits up. Right now, I reckon it's an each way bet.
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 02, 2019, 07:51:04 PM
Meath aren't but there are thirty other counties one of which is Kerry with a very good record at underage and that is is still coming through. I don't know why you pick Meath out...
Splitting etc would be a massive shift. You talk like it is a matter of course. It isn't.
Moving from the super eights to proper knockout would help too.
How the thing pans out post gavin a big factor too.
The inter county system is out of balance because Dublin are ahead of everyone else and have a system that leverages their population advantage.
I think that change depends on how GAA punters react. The GAA is very sensitive to revenues. If attendances collapse you might see a showdown between Dublin and the GAA. The situation won't suddenly go back to normal.
Those "thirty other Counties" have won how many All Irelands between them?
Quote from: Rossfan on December 02, 2019, 11:47:38 PM
Those "thirty other Counties" have won how many All Irelands between them?
Well given I said one of them was Kerry then more than Dublin...
What you're talking about here Sf is a radical change. The GAA won't even admit Croke Park is the home venue for Dublin and wouldn't even take their "neutral" games out of it. To completely rip everything up and tear Dublin apart is many steps down the line from a baby step of number one which they won't even take.
To assume it's a matter of course that Dublin will be broken down I think is a bit pie in the sky just...
Quote from: macdanger2 on December 02, 2019, 08:27:23 PM
Quote from: Hound on December 02, 2019, 01:19:51 PM
Quote from: greatpoint on December 01, 2019, 01:47:02 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on November 30, 2019, 02:27:42 PM
A remarkable achievement winning 5 in a row and 6 AI's in a decade. Huge pressure given their financial and home advantage. There is a huge expectation to succeed with such advantages. Managers like Mancini, Mourinho, Guardiola have shown that it takes a good managers to deal with such pressures and get you team over the line. It's not as easy as it looks. Others would have failed. Would have been Manager of 7 in a row except for complacency against Donegal in 2014. I suppose that was the last time he was caught off guard and it ensured the drive for 5 in a row.
The loss to Donegal in 2014 was more hubris than complacency. Gavin's only real error in his tenure with the Dublin seniors.
That's a bit harsh on Donegal.
Dublin had been playing brilliant attacking football up to that game, and the first 15-20 minutes they were on fire with Connolly and Flynn kicking 4 or 5 long range points between them. Donegal had a plan, and despite the early setback, they stuck with it. And while the plan was a very good one, it would have been worth feck all had the Donegal players not been at the top of their game. Their tackling, their pace, their passing, their support play had us in disarray. And then their total composure when their good play led to scoring chances. They refused to miss. They were simply too good on the day.
Dublin missed several goal chances that they'd have scored on any other day, if they go in, Donegal are toast
You can apply that to nearly any match and look at what-ifs but it's a reductive way of viewing things in my opinion.
In terms of Hound's post, I actually think Donegal were full value for that win but there's no denying that Gavin's refusal to employ a defensive system played directly into McGuinness and Donegal's hands. It wasn't until 2015 that he began to tighten things up defensively and look what happened after that.
Quote from: greatpoint on December 03, 2019, 02:30:46 PM
Quote from: macdanger2 on December 02, 2019, 08:27:23 PM
Quote from: Hound on December 02, 2019, 01:19:51 PM
Quote from: greatpoint on December 01, 2019, 01:47:02 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on November 30, 2019, 02:27:42 PM
A remarkable achievement winning 5 in a row and 6 AI's in a decade. Huge pressure given their financial and home advantage. There is a huge expectation to succeed with such advantages. Managers like Mancini, Mourinho, Guardiola have shown that it takes a good managers to deal with such pressures and get you team over the line. It's not as easy as it looks. Others would have failed. Would have been Manager of 7 in a row except for complacency against Donegal in 2014. I suppose that was the last time he was caught off guard and it ensured the drive for 5 in a row.
The loss to Donegal in 2014 was more hubris than complacency. Gavin's only real error in his tenure with the Dublin seniors.
That's a bit harsh on Donegal.
Dublin had been playing brilliant attacking football up to that game, and the first 15-20 minutes they were on fire with Connolly and Flynn kicking 4 or 5 long range points between them. Donegal had a plan, and despite the early setback, they stuck with it. And while the plan was a very good one, it would have been worth feck all had the Donegal players not been at the top of their game. Their tackling, their pace, their passing, their support play had us in disarray. And then their total composure when their good play led to scoring chances. They refused to miss. They were simply too good on the day.
Dublin missed several goal chances that they'd have scored on any other day, if they go in, Donegal are toast
You can apply that to nearly any match and look at what-ifs but it's a reductive way of viewing things in my opinion.
In terms of Hound's post, I actually think Donegal were full value for that win but there's no denying that Gavin's refusal to employ a defensive system played directly into McGuinness and Donegal's hands. It wasn't until 2015 that he began to tighten things up defensively and look what happened after that.
To a point Dublin had a defensive system it was just Jim McGuinness exploiting the weakness Dublin had on the counter attack. A problem area Jim Gavin corrected after that game. Donegal certainly deserved their win the better team for 50 minutes of that game and ended up winning by a bit to spare.
Dublin should remain strong for the foreseeable future however how strong will their challengers be in the next 3 or 4 years. The last 7 years we have watched Kerry and Tyrone teams reach finals v Dublin that weren't a patch on their All Ireland winning teams and Mayo where a few finals was there to be won for them but they found different ways to lose them.
Do you know what helped Dublin after 2014? The hiring of a professional basketball coach to break down tight defences and create their possession game. Of course, a coach of that standard didn't come cheap, either does the huge backroom team. This is all after the multi million euro player development system Dublin have been operating for near 2 decades. For these reasons, Gavin can never be referred to as the greatest manager in Gaelic Football. Is Michelle Smith's manager the greatest ever Irish swimming coach? Is the US Postal team manager with Lance Armstrong on board the greatest ever cycling manager? I could go on.
Just as there's an asterisk beside all Dublin titles post doping, there's an asterisk beside Jim Gavin's record at underage and senior.
that is a grossly unfair comparison.
He used the resources at his disposal therefore he is as bad as a drugs cheat?
I don't disagree with the comments about it having gone too far etc but the likes of that post is too far.
Quote from: priceyreilly on December 03, 2019, 03:56:08 PM
Do you know what helped Dublin after 2014? The hiring of a professional basketball coach to break down tight defences and create their possession game. Of course, a coach of that standard didn't come cheap, either does the huge backroom team. This is all after the multi million euro player development system Dublin have been operating for near 2 decades. For these reasons, Gavin can never be referred to as the greatest manager in Gaelic Football. Is Michelle Smith's manager the greatest ever Irish swimming coach? Is the US Postal team manager with Lance Armstrong on board the greatest ever cycling manager? I could go on.
Just as there's an asterisk beside all Dublin titles post doping, there's an asterisk beside Jim Gavin's record at underage and senior.
lol, I don't know what record books or websites you're looking at but I haven't seen any asterisks and nor will I. If you've created some in your own head then you just stick to that but you won't have much support apart from a few bitter begrudgers.
https://punditarena.com/features/emackenna/mackenna-jim-gavin-dublin/ (https://punditarena.com/features/emackenna/mackenna-jim-gavin-dublin/)
I wonder does Ewan see any irony in writing that it's hard to warm to somebody...
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 03, 2019, 05:44:27 PM
I wonder does Ewan see any irony in writing that it's hard to warm to somebody...
If he was not on the Twitter machine he'd be held in higher esteem.
Good to see someone not go down the Brolly brown nosing route with Galvin and Dublin.
He's a ridiculous individual to be honest so if he has a point somewhere it gets lost because of who he is IMO.
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 03, 2019, 04:28:13 PM
that is a grossly unfair comparison.
He used the resources at his disposal therefore he is as bad as a drugs cheat?
I don't disagree with the comments about it having gone too far etc but the likes of that post is too far.
I didn't say Gavin was as bad as a drugs cheat. I said his accomplishments come with an asterisk because of the doping. Not his fault, of course, he was just a small player in the overall disgusting scheme of things.
Quote from: lenny on December 03, 2019, 05:25:25 PM
Quote from: priceyreilly on December 03, 2019, 03:56:08 PM
Do you know what helped Dublin after 2014? The hiring of a professional basketball coach to break down tight defences and create their possession game. Of course, a coach of that standard didn't come cheap, either does the huge backroom team. This is all after the multi million euro player development system Dublin have been operating for near 2 decades. For these reasons, Gavin can never be referred to as the greatest manager in Gaelic Football. Is Michelle Smith's manager the greatest ever Irish swimming coach? Is the US Postal team manager with Lance Armstrong on board the greatest ever cycling manager? I could go on.
Just as there's an asterisk beside all Dublin titles post doping, there's an asterisk beside Jim Gavin's record at underage and senior.
lol, I don't know what record books or websites you're looking at but I haven't seen any asterisks and nor will I. If you've created some in your own head then you just stick to that but you won't have much support apart from a few bitter begrudgers.
There's no asterisk beside Michelle Smith's name in the record books, she still has her Olympic medals, we all know better. It's the same with Dublin GAA. Doping of any form shouldn't be celebrated.
Quote from: priceyreilly on December 03, 2019, 06:12:51 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 03, 2019, 04:28:13 PM
that is a grossly unfair comparison.
He used the resources at his disposal therefore he is as bad as a drugs cheat?
I don't disagree with the comments about it having gone too far etc but the likes of that post is too far.
I didn't say Gavin was as bad as a drugs cheat. I said his accomplishments come with an asterisk because of the doping. Not his fault, of course, he was just a small player in the overall disgusting scheme of things.
Maybe you didn't but you compared him. So Michelle Smith has no asterisk beside her name and now gavin has so not only are you comparing him you are saying he's worse??
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 03, 2019, 06:18:52 PM
Quote from: priceyreilly on December 03, 2019, 06:12:51 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 03, 2019, 04:28:13 PM
that is a grossly unfair comparison.
He used the resources at his disposal therefore he is as bad as a drugs cheat?
I don't disagree with the comments about it having gone too far etc but the likes of that post is too far.
I didn't say Gavin was as bad as a drugs cheat. I said his accomplishments come with an asterisk because of the doping. Not his fault, of course, he was just a small player in the overall disgusting scheme of things.
Maybe you didn't but you compared him. So Michelle Smith has no asterisk beside her name and now gavin has so not only are you comparing him you are saying he's worse??
Comprehension is not a strength of yours.
;D
Rationale is not one of yours.
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 03, 2019, 06:45:50 PM
;D
Rationale is not one of yours.
Go do your homework like a good lad and let the adults have a discussion.
;D
I'll leave you to rewriting the history books. Let me know when I can get a copy.
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 03, 2019, 07:01:27 PM
;D
I'll leave you to rewriting the history books. Let me know when I can get a copy.
Come back to me when you've done your junior cert at the earliest. :D
Quote from: priceyreilly on December 03, 2019, 07:54:58 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 03, 2019, 07:01:27 PM
;D
I'll leave you to rewriting the history books. Let me know when I can get a copy.
Come back to me when you've done your junior cert at the earliest. :D
They don't do junior cert up here ;D
Quote from: priceyreilly on December 03, 2019, 06:26:08 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 03, 2019, 06:18:52 PM
Quote from: priceyreilly on December 03, 2019, 06:12:51 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 03, 2019, 04:28:13 PM
that is a grossly unfair comparison.
He used the resources at his disposal therefore he is as bad as a drugs cheat?
I don't disagree with the comments about it having gone too far etc but the likes of that post is too far.
I didn't say Gavin was as bad as a drugs cheat. I said his accomplishments come with an asterisk because of the doping. Not his fault, of course, he was just a small player in the overall disgusting scheme of things.
Maybe you didn't but you compared him. So Michelle Smith has no asterisk beside her name and now gavin has so not only are you comparing him you are saying he's worse??
Comprehension is not a strength of yours.
While the majority of people accept Michelle Smith doped to win in the Olympics this was never proven so there is no "asterix" beside her name in the record books.
Jim Gavin and the dubs won't have any asterix beside their names in the history books either , but Jim Gavin is far more respected and admired.
If you really are concerned about real doping sport why not spend your time looking into Salazar and Mo Farrah rather than making up s**t about Dublin and Jim Gavin
Quote from: dublin7 on December 03, 2019, 08:43:15 PM
Quote from: priceyreilly on December 03, 2019, 06:26:08 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 03, 2019, 06:18:52 PM
Quote from: priceyreilly on December 03, 2019, 06:12:51 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 03, 2019, 04:28:13 PM
that is a grossly unfair comparison.
He used the resources at his disposal therefore he is as bad as a drugs cheat?
I don't disagree with the comments about it having gone too far etc but the likes of that post is too far.
I didn't say Gavin was as bad as a drugs cheat. I said his accomplishments come with an asterisk because of the doping. Not his fault, of course, he was just a small player in the overall disgusting scheme of things.
Maybe you didn't but you compared him. So Michelle Smith has no asterisk beside her name and now gavin has so not only are you comparing him you are saying he's worse??
Comprehension is not a strength of yours.
While the majority of people accept Michelle Smith doped to win in the Olympics this was never proven so there is no "asterix" beside her name in the record books.
Jim Gavin and the dubs won't have any asterix beside their names in the history books either , but Jim Gavin is far more respected and admired.
If you really are concerned about real doping sport why not spend your time looking into Salazar and Mo Farrah rather than making up s**t about Dublin and Jim Gavin
There will be no asterix after any of Dublin's titles. To have such an asterix would show that the GAA have made a mistake. As we stand, the Gaa will not admit to over funding Dublin. They will not admit to giving them so many home games. They will not admit to destroying Leinster. The Present President is from Dublin which adds to the conundrum. Anyway, Looking forward to next years AI already. Will be shouting for Dublin again!..............By the way where is Zulu these days?
Quote from: From the Bunker on December 03, 2019, 09:16:11 PM
Quote from: dublin7 on December 03, 2019, 08:43:15 PM
Quote from: priceyreilly on December 03, 2019, 06:26:08 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 03, 2019, 06:18:52 PM
Quote from: priceyreilly on December 03, 2019, 06:12:51 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 03, 2019, 04:28:13 PM
that is a grossly unfair comparison.
He used the resources at his disposal therefore he is as bad as a drugs cheat?
I don't disagree with the comments about it having gone too far etc but the likes of that post is too far.
I didn't say Gavin was as bad as a drugs cheat. I said his accomplishments come with an asterisk because of the doping. Not his fault, of course, he was just a small player in the overall disgusting scheme of things.
Maybe you didn't but you compared him. So Michelle Smith has no asterisk beside her name and now gavin has so not only are you comparing him you are saying he's worse??
Comprehension is not a strength of yours.
While the majority of people accept Michelle Smith doped to win in the Olympics this was never proven so there is no "asterix" beside her name in the record books.
Jim Gavin and the dubs won't have any asterix beside their names in the history books either , but Jim Gavin is far more respected and admired.
If you really are concerned about real doping sport why not spend your time looking into Salazar and Mo Farrah rather than making up s**t about Dublin and Jim Gavin
There will be no asterix after any of Dublin's titles. To have such an asterix would show that the GAA have made a mistake. As we stand, the Gaa will not admit to over funding Dublin. They will not admit to giving them so many home games. They will not admit to destroying Leinster. The Present President is from Dublin which adds to the conundrum. Anyway, Looking forward to next years AI already. Will be shouting for Dublin again!..............By the way where is Zulu these days?
In 2070 a 10 year old is looking at the records and notices that Dublin won 15 in a row. He or she might ask an adult what happened given that no other team did it. By then it will be commonly accepted that...
Quote from: priceyreilly on December 03, 2019, 06:54:58 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 03, 2019, 06:45:50 PM
;D
Rationale is not one of yours.
Go do your homework like a good lad and let the adults have a discussion.
The irony!!!
Quote from: Dinny Breen on November 30, 2019, 06:24:32 PM
A game changer for Dublin.
Brilliant manager.
Opens up the 2020 Championship a little...
Well said Dinny. A serious amount of rubbish on this thread unfortuntely and Dinny as he often does is a shining light in the midst of the crap. Obviously Dinny has issues with Dublin's perceived advantages but he can still be sensible and rational in his appraisal of a great of the GAA.
Quote from: magpie seanie on December 04, 2019, 11:32:17 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on November 30, 2019, 06:24:32 PM
A game changer for Dublin.
Brilliant manager.
Opens up the 2020 Championship a little...
Well said Dinny. A serious amount of rubbish on this thread unfortuntely and Dinny as he often does is a shining light in the midst of the crap. Obviously Dinny has issues with Dublin's perceived advantages but he can still be sensible and rational in his appraisal of a great of the GAA.
Two good posts. Fully agree.
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/jim-gavin-leaves-dublin-with-history-made-and-gaelic-football-transformed-1.4100789
Jim Gavin honours as Dublin manager
6 All-Irelands
7 Leinster titles
5 National Leagues
49 All Stars
4 Footballers of the Year
Overall Record - Played 107 Won 86 Lost 11 Drew 10
Championship - Played 48 Won 44 Lost 1 Drew 3
League - Played 59 Won 42 Lost 10 Drew 7
Quote from: seafoid on December 04, 2019, 12:00:38 PM
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/jim-gavin-leaves-dublin-with-history-made-and-gaelic-football-transformed-1.4100789
Jim Gavin honours as Dublin manager
6 All-Irelands
7 Leinster titles
5 National Leagues
49 All Stars
4 Footballers of the Year
Overall Record - Played 107 Won 86 Lost 11 Drew 10
Championship - Played 48 Won 44 Lost 1 Drew 3
League - Played 59 Won 42 Lost 10 Drew 7
The U21 sides he managed to All Ireland titles in 2010 and 2012 had plenty of players who would go on to star in his senior teams. R O Carroll, J Cooper, J McCarthy, D Rock, J McCaffrey, C Kilkenny, P Mannion to name but a few.
Quote from: seafoid on December 04, 2019, 12:00:38 PM
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/jim-gavin-leaves-dublin-with-history-made-and-gaelic-football-transformed-1.4100789
Jim Gavin honours as Dublin manager
6 All-Irelands
7 Leinster titles
5 National Leagues
49 All Stars
4 Footballers of the Year
Overall Record - Played 107 Won 86 Lost 11 Drew 10
Championship - Played 48 Won 44 Lost 1 Drew 3
League - Played 59 Won 42 Lost 10 Drew 7
Out of interest how many of those 48 championship games were played in Croke park???
42 I'd hazard a guess at.
Only ever played 2 away championship games. Gas!
Quote from: From the Bunker on December 04, 2019, 04:44:42 PM
Only ever played 2 away championship games. Gas!
And one of those was a Dead Rubber!
Better not say much more or I'll be accused of being divisive and mean spirited!
You have to admit Dublin have a great home record!
But but but.... sure the poor devils never get to play at home.
The bad oul GAA force them to play in a big Stadium miles away.......
2 miles or so ;D
Quote from: From the Bunker on December 04, 2019, 07:38:10 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on December 04, 2019, 04:44:42 PM
Only ever played 2 away championship games. Gas!
And one of those was a Dead Rubber!
Better not say much more or I'll be accused of being divisive and mean spirited!
You have to admit Dublin have a great home record!
They won the majority of their away games in the national league as well. Last year was the 1st time Gavin didn't try to win the national league. Even travelled to Leitrim to play Roscommon
Quote from: Blowitupref on December 04, 2019, 12:27:34 PM
Quote from: seafoid on December 04, 2019, 12:00:38 PM
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/jim-gavin-leaves-dublin-with-history-made-and-gaelic-football-transformed-1.4100789
Jim Gavin honours as Dublin manager
6 All-Irelands
7 Leinster titles
5 National Leagues
49 All Stars
4 Footballers of the Year
Overall Record - Played 107 Won 86 Lost 11 Drew 10
Championship - Played 48 Won 44 Lost 1 Drew 3
League - Played 59 Won 42 Lost 10 Drew 7
The U21 sides he managed to All Ireland titles in 2010 and 2012 had plenty of players who would go on to star in his senior teams. R O Carroll, J Cooper, J McCarthy, D Rock, J McCaffrey, C Kilkenny, P Mannion to name but a few.
I'd predict that in the next 10 years dublin will win at the most 2 all ireland's, possibly even 0 or 1. At that point everyone will recognise Gavin as the greatest manager of all time.
Total devastation here, i said it here before, my biggest fear is the day Jim Gavins leaves the team.
The most important thing to remember, its not all about the winning, its the legacy and culture he leaves in place and the men he made. All future players will aspire to this era as the template.
The team still has the players to win a couple of more, however some slight cracks are appearing and who will also follow him in retirement.
My choice for successor is Cluxton.
Quote from: dublin7 on December 05, 2019, 05:35:42 AM
Quote from: From the Bunker on December 04, 2019, 07:38:10 PM
Quote from: From the Bunker on December 04, 2019, 04:44:42 PM
Only ever played 2 away championship games. Gas!
And one of those was a Dead Rubber!
Better not say much more or I'll be accused of being divisive and mean spirited!
You have to admit Dublin have a great home record!
They won the majority of their away games in the national league as well. Last year was the 1st time Gavin didn't try to win the national league. Even travelled to Leitrim to play Roscommon
Yeah but wasn't willing to shoot the breeze with Kevin McStay in the process. Bad form!
Quote from: lenny on December 05, 2019, 07:31:13 AM
Quote from: Blowitupref on December 04, 2019, 12:27:34 PM
Quote from: seafoid on December 04, 2019, 12:00:38 PM
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/jim-gavin-leaves-dublin-with-history-made-and-gaelic-football-transformed-1.4100789
Jim Gavin honours as Dublin manager
6 All-Irelands
7 Leinster titles
5 National Leagues
49 All Stars
4 Footballers of the Year
Overall Record - Played 107 Won 86 Lost 11 Drew 10
Championship - Played 48 Won 44 Lost 1 Drew 3
League - Played 59 Won 42 Lost 10 Drew 7
The U21 sides he managed to All Ireland titles in 2010 and 2012 had plenty of players who would go on to star in his senior teams. R O Carroll, J Cooper, J McCarthy, D Rock, J McCaffrey, C Kilkenny, P Mannion to name but a few.
I'd predict that in the next 10 years dublin will win at the most 2 all ireland's, possibly even 0 or 1. At that point everyone will recognise Gavin as the greatest manager of all time.
If you actually believe that, you can make a fortune at the bookies. Trust me they will line up to take the money of you.
Quote from: TheGreatest on December 05, 2019, 08:50:13 AM
Total devastation here, i said it here before, my biggest fear is the day Jim Gavins leaves the team.
The most important thing to remember, its not all about the winning, its the legacy and culture he leaves in place and the men he made. All future players will aspire to this era as the template.
The team still has the players to win a couple of more, however some slight cracks are appearing and who will also follow him in retirement.
My choice for successor is Cluxton.
Pass me a bucket! You only appear on here to crow about how great Dublin are (look at your username ffs) and to insult others.
Quote from: Tubberman on December 05, 2019, 09:59:06 AM
Quote from: TheGreatest on December 05, 2019, 08:50:13 AM
Total devastation here, i said it here before, my biggest fear is the day Jim Gavins leaves the team.
The most important thing to remember, its not all about the winning, its the legacy and culture he leaves in place and the men he made. All future players will aspire to this era as the template.
The team still has the players to win a couple of more, however some slight cracks are appearing and who will also follow him in retirement.
My choice for successor is Cluxton.
Pass me a bucket! You only appear on here to crow about how great Dublin are (look at your username ffs) and to insult others.
It's like he's done media training and treats this as the media but got it all wrong ;D
To be fair though I find some of the criticism of Gavin a bit harsh. Yes he has clear advantages but he is clearly an exceptional guy too. It will be very interesting to see how they follow up now. You would expect them to still dominate but how much so will tell us how good he is / was.
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 05, 2019, 12:23:14 PM
Quote from: Tubberman on December 05, 2019, 09:59:06 AM
Quote from: TheGreatest on December 05, 2019, 08:50:13 AM
Total devastation here, i said it here before, my biggest fear is the day Jim Gavins leaves the team.
The most important thing to remember, its not all about the winning, its the legacy and culture he leaves in place and the men he made. All future players will aspire to this era as the template.
The team still has the players to win a couple of more, however some slight cracks are appearing and who will also follow him in retirement.
My choice for successor is Cluxton.
Pass me a bucket! You only appear on here to crow about how great Dublin are (look at your username ffs) and to insult others.
It's like he's done media training and treats this as the media but got it all wrong ;D
To be fair though I find some of the criticism of Gavin a bit harsh. Yes he has clear advantages but he is clearly an exceptional guy too. It will be very interesting to see how they follow up now. You would expect them to still dominate but how much so will tell us how good he is / was.
That will depend on the quality of the opposition. Will Kerry get closer ? Will anyone else step up?
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/john-costello-questions-standards-of-prime-time-reporting-on-dublin-football-1.4105652
John Costello, the Dublin GAA chief executive, has questioned the "standards" and "editorial choice" adopted by RTÉ's Prime Time programme in the immediate aftermath of the capital football team clinching a historic five-in-a-row of All-Ireland titles.
In Costello's wide ranging annual missive he addresses Prime Time's suggestion that due to Dublin's "abundant resources of population and sponsorship there will never again be real equality in the game."
RTÉ followed this up with a report noting ill feeling around the country about Dublin's "financial advantage" and how it may have "paved the road" for recent success.
"Dublin football teams have 'raised the passions' of supporters, commentators and viewers for a long time," Costello wrote this morning. "There is just something about that jersey that creates lively debate! The success of the team of the 1970s brought with it some derision. The more things change
***********************************
What is interesting is the dissent
"We are, unfortunately, becoming familiar with the increasingly twisted manner of public discourse and I genuinely believe that a large part of the contorted debate about funding for Dublin falls into this category.~"
"Without moderation, what happens on social media where attention and populist outrage are craved is largely beyond our control and unworthy in many instances of rational debate. "
I was somewhat shocked when, with the dust not even settled on our historic All-Ireland football success, RTÉ's flagship investigative programme Prime Time included the debate as an 'issue' worth covering"
This will only increase. Because the sport also belongs to 33 other counties.
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 05, 2019, 12:23:14 PM
Quote from: Tubberman on December 05, 2019, 09:59:06 AM
Quote from: TheGreatest on December 05, 2019, 08:50:13 AM
Total devastation here, i said it here before, my biggest fear is the day Jim Gavins leaves the team.
The most important thing to remember, its not all about the winning, its the legacy and culture he leaves in place and the men he made. All future players will aspire to this era as the template.
The team still has the players to win a couple of more, however some slight cracks are appearing and who will also follow him in retirement.
My choice for successor is Cluxton.
Pass me a bucket! You only appear on here to crow about how great Dublin are (look at your username ffs) and to insult others.
It's like he's done media training and treats this as the media but got it all wrong ;D
To be fair though I find some of the criticism of Gavin a bit harsh. Yes he has clear advantages but he is clearly an exceptional guy too. It will be very interesting to see how they follow up now. You would expect them to still dominate but how much so will tell us how good he is / was.
;) :D 8)
Ok it is about the winning and putting and keeping the rest of the country in their place, is that better for you.
Quote from: seafoid on December 05, 2019, 01:12:40 PM
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/john-costello-questions-standards-of-prime-time-reporting-on-dublin-football-1.4105652
John Costello, the Dublin GAA chief executive, has questioned the "standards" and "editorial choice" adopted by RTÉ's Prime Time programme in the immediate aftermath of the capital football team clinching a historic five-in-a-row of All-Ireland titles.
In Costello's wide ranging annual missive he addresses Prime Time's suggestion that due to Dublin's "abundant resources of population and sponsorship there will never again be real equality in the game."
RTÉ followed this up with a report noting ill feeling around the country about Dublin's "financial advantage" and how it may have "paved the road" for recent success.
"Dublin football teams have 'raised the passions' of supporters, commentators and viewers for a long time," Costello wrote this morning. "There is just something about that jersey that creates lively debate! The success of the team of the 1970s brought with it some derision. The more things change
***********************************
What is interesting is the dissent
"We are, unfortunately, becoming familiar with the increasingly twisted manner of public discourse and I genuinely believe that a large part of the contorted debate about funding for Dublin falls into this category.~"
"Without moderation, what happens on social media where attention and populist outrage are craved is largely beyond our control and unworthy in many instances of rational debate. "
I was somewhat shocked when, with the dust not even settled on our historic All-Ireland football success, RTÉ's flagship investigative programme Prime Time included the debate as an 'issue' worth covering"
This will only increase. Because the sport also belongs to 33 other counties.
Fake news!
(https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/8b53ce6e41d7549101bca328275d13a79fa87ce0/0_154_4633_2779/master/4633.jpg?width=300&quality=85&auto=format&fit=max&s=7b62dfbf03aa563a3daf48db2e8c7c72)
Quote from: seafoid on December 05, 2019, 01:12:40 PM
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/john-costello-questions-standards-of-prime-time-reporting-on-dublin-football-1.4105652
John Costello, the Dublin GAA chief executive, has questioned the "standards" and "editorial choice" adopted by RTÉ's Prime Time programme in the immediate aftermath of the capital football team clinching a historic five-in-a-row of All-Ireland titles.
In Costello's wide ranging annual missive he addresses Prime Time's suggestion that due to Dublin's "abundant resources of population and sponsorship there will never again be real equality in the game."
RTÉ followed this up with a report noting ill feeling around the country about Dublin's "financial advantage" and how it may have "paved the road" for recent success.
"Dublin football teams have 'raised the passions' of supporters, commentators and viewers for a long time," Costello wrote this morning. "There is just something about that jersey that creates lively debate! The success of the team of the 1970s brought with it some derision. The more things change
***********************************
What is interesting is the dissent
"We are, unfortunately, becoming familiar with the increasingly twisted manner of public discourse and I genuinely believe that a large part of the contorted debate about funding for Dublin falls into this category.~"
"Without moderation, what happens on social media where attention and populist outrage are craved is largely beyond our control and unworthy in many instances of rational debate. "
I was somewhat shocked when, with the dust not even settled on our historic All-Ireland football success, RTÉ's flagship investigative programme Prime Time included the debate as an 'issue' worth covering"
This will only increase. Because the sport also belongs to 33 other counties.
There's a famous legal quote "If the facts are against you, argue the law. If the law is against you, argue the facts. If the law and the facts are against you, pound the table and yell like hell"
Costello pounding the table and yelling like hell here with his moaning about Prime Time's coverage and social media.
He's trying to do his best to keep the whole Dublin funding issue off the agenda for as long as possible with his claim to be shocked that Prime Time covered the issue.
Quote from: TheGreatest on December 05, 2019, 01:20:43 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 05, 2019, 12:23:14 PM
Quote from: Tubberman on December 05, 2019, 09:59:06 AM
Quote from: TheGreatest on December 05, 2019, 08:50:13 AM
Total devastation here, i said it here before, my biggest fear is the day Jim Gavins leaves the team.
The most important thing to remember, its not all about the winning, its the legacy and culture he leaves in place and the men he made. All future players will aspire to this era as the template.
The team still has the players to win a couple of more, however some slight cracks are appearing and who will also follow him in retirement.
My choice for successor is Cluxton.
Pass me a bucket! You only appear on here to crow about how great Dublin are (look at your username ffs) and to insult others.
It's like he's done media training and treats this as the media but got it all wrong ;D
To be fair though I find some of the criticism of Gavin a bit harsh. Yes he has clear advantages but he is clearly an exceptional guy too. It will be very interesting to see how they follow up now. You would expect them to still dominate but how much so will tell us how good he is / was.
;) :D 8)
Ok it is about the winning and putting and keeping the rest of the country in their place, is that better for you.
probably a bit more honest.
Quote from: twohands!!! on December 05, 2019, 04:21:48 PM
Quote from: seafoid on December 05, 2019, 01:12:40 PM
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/john-costello-questions-standards-of-prime-time-reporting-on-dublin-football-1.4105652
John Costello, the Dublin GAA chief executive, has questioned the "standards" and "editorial choice" adopted by RTÉ's Prime Time programme in the immediate aftermath of the capital football team clinching a historic five-in-a-row of All-Ireland titles.
In Costello's wide ranging annual missive he addresses Prime Time's suggestion that due to Dublin's "abundant resources of population and sponsorship there will never again be real equality in the game."
RTÉ followed this up with a report noting ill feeling around the country about Dublin's "financial advantage" and how it may have "paved the road" for recent success.
"Dublin football teams have 'raised the passions' of supporters, commentators and viewers for a long time," Costello wrote this morning. "There is just something about that jersey that creates lively debate! The success of the team of the 1970s brought with it some derision. The more things change
***********************************
What is interesting is the dissent
"We are, unfortunately, becoming familiar with the increasingly twisted manner of public discourse and I genuinely believe that a large part of the contorted debate about funding for Dublin falls into this category.~"
"Without moderation, what happens on social media where attention and populist outrage are craved is largely beyond our control and unworthy in many instances of rational debate. "
I was somewhat shocked when, with the dust not even settled on our historic All-Ireland football success, RTÉ's flagship investigative programme Prime Time included the debate as an 'issue' worth covering"
This will only increase. Because the sport also belongs to 33 other counties.
There's a famous legal quote "If the facts are against you, argue the law. If the law is against you, argue the facts. If the law and the facts are against you, pound the table and yell like hell"
Costello pounding the table and yelling like hell here with his moaning about Prime Time's coverage and social media.
He's trying to do his best to keep the whole Dublin funding issue off the agenda for as long as possible with his claim to be shocked that Prime Time covered the issue.
He talks about social media as if it's a tribe from Papua New guinea
Social media when it comes to funding the Dubs is mainly GAA patrons. Whether or not those people continue to pay to watch championship football is the big question which possibly keeps the CFO of the GAA awake in the small hours.
The model is very fragile.
Quote from: seafoid on December 05, 2019, 04:37:45 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on December 05, 2019, 04:21:48 PM
Quote from: seafoid on December 05, 2019, 01:12:40 PM
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/john-costello-questions-standards-of-prime-time-reporting-on-dublin-football-1.4105652
John Costello, the Dublin GAA chief executive, has questioned the "standards" and "editorial choice" adopted by RTÉ's Prime Time programme in the immediate aftermath of the capital football team clinching a historic five-in-a-row of All-Ireland titles.
In Costello's wide ranging annual missive he addresses Prime Time's suggestion that due to Dublin's "abundant resources of population and sponsorship there will never again be real equality in the game."
RTÉ followed this up with a report noting ill feeling around the country about Dublin's "financial advantage" and how it may have "paved the road" for recent success.
"Dublin football teams have 'raised the passions' of supporters, commentators and viewers for a long time," Costello wrote this morning. "There is just something about that jersey that creates lively debate! The success of the team of the 1970s brought with it some derision. The more things change
***********************************
What is interesting is the dissent
"We are, unfortunately, becoming familiar with the increasingly twisted manner of public discourse and I genuinely believe that a large part of the contorted debate about funding for Dublin falls into this category.~"
"Without moderation, what happens on social media where attention and populist outrage are craved is largely beyond our control and unworthy in many instances of rational debate. "
I was somewhat shocked when, with the dust not even settled on our historic All-Ireland football success, RTÉ's flagship investigative programme Prime Time included the debate as an 'issue' worth covering"
This will only increase. Because the sport also belongs to 33 other counties.
There's a famous legal quote "If the facts are against you, argue the law. If the law is against you, argue the facts. If the law and the facts are against you, pound the table and yell like hell"
Costello pounding the table and yelling like hell here with his moaning about Prime Time's coverage and social media.
He's trying to do his best to keep the whole Dublin funding issue off the agenda for as long as possible with his claim to be shocked that Prime Time covered the issue.
He talks about social media as if it's a tribe from Papua New guinea
Social media when it comes to funding the Dubs is mainly GAA patrons. Whether or not those people continue to pay to watch championship football is the big question which possibly keeps the CFO of the GAA awake in the small hours.
The model is very fragile.
The thing is ''The Prime time'' programme covered very little. It butchered a 10 minute Skype interview with Ewan McKenna down to 90 seconds. It gave little or no facts or figures. There was nobody of note interviewed. It was a nothing part segment of their show. Half arsed comes to mind!
Quote from: lenny on December 05, 2019, 07:31:13 AM
Quote from: Blowitupref on December 04, 2019, 12:27:34 PM
Quote from: seafoid on December 04, 2019, 12:00:38 PM
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/jim-gavin-leaves-dublin-with-history-made-and-gaelic-football-transformed-1.4100789
Jim Gavin honours as Dublin manager
6 All-Irelands
7 Leinster titles
5 National Leagues
49 All Stars
4 Footballers of the Year
Overall Record - Played 107 Won 86 Lost 11 Drew 10
Championship - Played 48 Won 44 Lost 1 Drew 3
League - Played 59 Won 42 Lost 10 Drew 7
The U21 sides he managed to All Ireland titles in 2010 and 2012 had plenty of players who would go on to star in his senior teams. R O Carroll, J Cooper, J McCarthy, D Rock, J McCaffrey, C Kilkenny, P Mannion to name but a few.
I'd predict that in the next 10 years dublin will win at the most 2 all ireland's, possibly even 0 or 1. At that point everyone will recognise Gavin as the greatest manager of all time.
Best of luck with that prediction if you happen to place money on it. (you'll need it)
Quote from: From the Bunker on December 05, 2019, 05:51:53 PM
Quote from: seafoid on December 05, 2019, 04:37:45 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on December 05, 2019, 04:21:48 PM
Quote from: seafoid on December 05, 2019, 01:12:40 PM
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/john-costello-questions-standards-of-prime-time-reporting-on-dublin-football-1.4105652
John Costello, the Dublin GAA chief executive, has questioned the "standards" and "editorial choice" adopted by RTÉ's Prime Time programme in the immediate aftermath of the capital football team clinching a historic five-in-a-row of All-Ireland titles.
In Costello's wide ranging annual missive he addresses Prime Time's suggestion that due to Dublin's "abundant resources of population and sponsorship there will never again be real equality in the game."
RTÉ followed this up with a report noting ill feeling around the country about Dublin's "financial advantage" and how it may have "paved the road" for recent success.
"Dublin football teams have 'raised the passions' of supporters, commentators and viewers for a long time," Costello wrote this morning. "There is just something about that jersey that creates lively debate! The success of the team of the 1970s brought with it some derision. The more things change
***********************************
What is interesting is the dissent
"We are, unfortunately, becoming familiar with the increasingly twisted manner of public discourse and I genuinely believe that a large part of the contorted debate about funding for Dublin falls into this category.~"
"Without moderation, what happens on social media where attention and populist outrage are craved is largely beyond our control and unworthy in many instances of rational debate. "
I was somewhat shocked when, with the dust not even settled on our historic All-Ireland football success, RTÉ's flagship investigative programme Prime Time included the debate as an 'issue' worth covering"
This will only increase. Because the sport also belongs to 33 other counties.
There's a famous legal quote "If the facts are against you, argue the law. If the law is against you, argue the facts. If the law and the facts are against you, pound the table and yell like hell"
Costello pounding the table and yelling like hell here with his moaning about Prime Time's coverage and social media.
He's trying to do his best to keep the whole Dublin funding issue off the agenda for as long as possible with his claim to be shocked that Prime Time covered the issue.
He talks about social media as if it's a tribe from Papua New guinea
Social media when it comes to funding the Dubs is mainly GAA patrons. Whether or not those people continue to pay to watch championship football is the big question which possibly keeps the CFO of the GAA awake in the small hours.
The model is very fragile.
The thing is ''The Prime time'' programme covered very little. It butchered a 10 minute Skype interview with Ewan McKenna down to 90 seconds. It gave little or no facts or figures. There was nobody of note interviewed. It was a nothing part segment of their show. Half arsed comes to mind!
Even so, what is most striking about that rant is the sensitivity.
The 5 in a row is tainted and he is not happy about it.
A Cluxton approach would ignore the barbs and keep emotion out of it but Costello can't.
Hound would say it was all jealousy but Costello can't because he knows he wouldn't be able to pull it off.
Absolutely fascinating.
Jim Gavin would make a great crooner with songs such as "Every year I've been involved, I have given it my all", "More importantly what's best for the players" and "I reflect on the season that has gone by"
Dinner dances up and down the country would lap it up.
Dickie Rock , eat your heart out.
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/decision-to-step-down-in-interests-of-dublin-says-gavin-1.4106154
Alot of what passes for debate on social media is nonsense. Twitter can be useful at times, but alot of it hate fueled rubnish best ignored.
Whatever about the production quality of the prime time show, its fair enough to ask why the need to show it right after the dubs won the All Ireland.
Quote from: dublin7 on December 06, 2019, 08:56:47 AM
Alot of what passes for debate on social media is nonsense. Twitter can be useful at times, but alot of it hate fueled rubnish best ignored.
Whatever about the production quality of the prime time show, its fair enough to ask why the need to show it right after the dubs won the All Ireland.
Why do you think the real reasons for Dublin's success should be silenced? It's a national scandal. Disgraced former Taoiseach Bertie Ahern is at the centre of it, along with the Bailey family. We've seen recent evidence of their dodginess.
Are we all supposed to just pretend we don't know about the millions upon millions of euro that has transformed Dublin GAA? Money taken from government funds and handed to Berties county. A full investigation should take place, we need this exposed just like the FAI are getting exposed now.
Quote from: priceyreilly on December 06, 2019, 08:03:33 PM
Quote from: dublin7 on December 06, 2019, 08:56:47 AM
Alot of what passes for debate on social media is nonsense. Twitter can be useful at times, but alot of it hate fueled rubnish best ignored.
Whatever about the production quality of the prime time show, its fair enough to ask why the need to show it right after the dubs won the All Ireland.
Why do you think the real reasons for Dublin's success should be silenced? It's a national scandal. Disgraced former Taoiseach Bertie Ahern is at the centre of it, along with the Bailey family. We've seen recent evidence of their dodginess.
Are we all supposed to just pretend we don't know about the millions upon millions of euro that has transformed Dublin GAA? Money taken from government funds and handed to Berties county. A full investigation should take place, we need this exposed just like the FAI are getting exposed now.
Some deadly bitter conspiracy theorists on here. When Kerry win 6 out of the next 7 or 8 all Ireland's will there be as much outrage? Bottom line is we've seen one of the best teams of all time managed by an all time great manager. Many of those players are coming to the end together which will mean a transition period. My opinion is that the replacements won't have the same quality.
Was Micko a brilliant manager/trainer or was he lucky? Why did he not keep winning when the great Kerry side aged?
Same for Gavin. Or is it? Seems like Gavin oversaw at least 2 different sides in a short space of time.
If the new Dublin manager wins another 3/4 All Irelands in next 5 years....how do we judge Gavin?
Quote from: lenny on December 06, 2019, 09:23:49 PM
Quote from: priceyreilly on December 06, 2019, 08:03:33 PM
Quote from: dublin7 on December 06, 2019, 08:56:47 AM
Alot of what passes for debate on social media is nonsense. Twitter can be useful at times, but alot of it hate fueled rubnish best ignored.
Whatever about the production quality of the prime time show, its fair enough to ask why the need to show it right after the dubs won the All Ireland.
Why do you think the real reasons for Dublin's success should be silenced? It's a national scandal. Disgraced former Taoiseach Bertie Ahern is at the centre of it, along with the Bailey family. We've seen recent evidence of their dodginess.
Are we all supposed to just pretend we don't know about the millions upon millions of euro that has transformed Dublin GAA? Money taken from government funds and handed to Berties county. A full investigation should take place, we need this exposed just like the FAI are getting exposed now.
Some deadly bitter conspiracy theorists on here. When Kerry win 6 out of the next 7 or 8 all Ireland's will there be as much outrage? Bottom line is we've seen one of the best teams of all time managed by an all time great manager. Many of those players are coming to the end together which will mean a transition period. My opinion is that the replacements won't have the same quality.
Ah, bejaysus Lenny, you are being a bit hard on Dublin! ;D ;D
Why do you say they are only "one of the best teams of all time?"
Name me any other to compare with them.
Also, I think you are sticking your neck out far to predict that Kerry will win next year's AI, never mind 6 out of the next 7 or 8.
What makes you think they improve by miraculous means to beat Dublin next year? After all they were a beaten docket a quarter of an hour before the end of the replay this year and Dublin don't do replays. Mayo know all about that.
Don't recall Kerry scoring in the last 10 minutes and wonderkid David Clifford was shagged out long before the end. On fitness alone, no one can compare with the Dubs. If you don't take your chances, they won't come around again.
Kerry only started coming good during the championships this year. They were rubbish during the league and indeed for a few years past. They have two good 20 somethings, a passable midfield and the rest are no more than work horses.
I think you should be looking west or maybe northwest for the next champions.
Buy you could wait another 10 years for that to happen.
Quote from: ONeill on December 06, 2019, 10:16:06 PM
Was Micko a brilliant manager/trainer or was he lucky? Why did he not keep winning when the great Kerry side aged?
Same for Gavin. Or is it? Seems like Gavin oversaw at least 2 different sides in a short space of time.
If the new Dublin manager wins another 3/4 All Irelands in next 5 years....how do we judge Gavin?
Being serious for a change, he was both. Why didn't he keep on winning when his great team aged? I think the answer is obvious; he had not got adequate replacements coming through. He had been faced with a difficult choice as he freely admitted. Did he persist with those he knew could deliver for a further limited period or did he try to shore up cracks that were beginning to appear by introducing younger, freshers players and hoping they'd measure up.
He played it safe and opted for the first former..
In hindsight, I think history has proved him right. His luck ran out with the 5 in a row in sight but he still managed remarkably well with the limited pool of quality players he had. Kerry did manage three in a row in '84, '85 and '86, when he finally had to introduce new blood and he was later to take Kildare to an AI final, for the first time since 1928.
With due respect to Jim Gavin, Micko still leads the way.
When Gavin manages to win it with Tyrone he will be the greatest.
How do you judge the greatest ever in sport any code?
What went on in the 70/80s for example cant be compared to standards today and that applies to all sports. Jim Gavin was the dubs greatest football manager end of story. Is he the greatest overall?
That's for historians to judge not idiots like pricereilly
Preserving a focussed humble yet ambitious environment in the Dublin camp despite all the success is something very few GAA managers have ever had to deal with Perhaps Cody /Dwyer/ Boylan / Heffernan and Harte. I think Gavin tips the tree, but his key next step is to really prove himself when he takes the Tyrone gig. 😜
Quote from: lenny on December 06, 2019, 09:23:49 PM
Quote from: priceyreilly on December 06, 2019, 08:03:33 PM
Quote from: dublin7 on December 06, 2019, 08:56:47 AM
Alot of what passes for debate on social media is nonsense. Twitter can be useful at times, but alot of it hate fueled rubnish best ignored.
Whatever about the production quality of the prime time show, its fair enough to ask why the need to show it right after the dubs won the All Ireland.
Why do you think the real reasons for Dublin's success should be silenced? It's a national scandal. Disgraced former Taoiseach Bertie Ahern is at the centre of it, along with the Bailey family. We've seen recent evidence of their dodginess.
Are we all supposed to just pretend we don't know about the millions upon millions of euro that has transformed Dublin GAA? Money taken from government funds and handed to Berties county. A full investigation should take place, we need this exposed just like the FAI are getting exposed now.
Some deadly bitter conspiracy theorists on here. When Kerry win 6 out of the next 7 or 8 all Ireland's will there be as much outrage? Bottom line is we've seen one of the best teams of all time managed by an all time great manager. Many of those players are coming to the end together which will mean a transition period. My opinion is that the replacements won't have the same quality.
You look at players that have retired since 2011. There has been a trickle every year. Every year is a slight transition period. Flynn, Brogan, O'Gara, Connolly have only been bit players the last three seasons, hardly needed. Their retirements mean little or nothing to the dynamic of the present group.
Quote from: dublin7 on December 07, 2019, 01:35:19 AM
How do you judge the greatest ever in sport any code?
What went on in the 70/80s for example cant be compared to standards today and that applies to all sports. Jim Gavin was the dubs greatest football manager end of story. Is he the greatest overall?
That's for historians to judge not idiots like pricereilly
+1
I teetotally agree.
Quote from: dublin7 on December 07, 2019, 01:35:19 AM
How do you judge the greatest ever in sport any code?
What went on in the 70/80s for example cant be compared to standards today and that applies to all sports. Jim Gavin was the dubs greatest football manager end of story. Is he the greatest overall?
That's for historians to judge not idiots like pricereilly
Heffo revived football in the city . Was there not something about all Ireland teams before him being mostly made up of culchies?
Heffo inspired a generation of kids including Gavin. Without him there would have been no 95. Without the influence of the 95 team there might not have been the current team.
Bookies have suspended betting on the next Dublin manager as punters have placed bucket loads of cash on Tommy Conroy to replace Jim Gavin.
Great choice as I thought he was treated Poorly by the fans the last time. Given more time he could have achieved the success that piller caffrey did afterwards. Nice to see the woulda healed in Dublin. There were some rumours during the week of Banty making a play as well but supposedly he is happy at Monaghan.
I'm just back from DCU and the conferring of an Honorary Doctorate on Jim Gavin. It was a memorable event attended by over eight hundred people.
The College President summed up the feelings of all those present with the following words:
"As President, I am delighted that Dublin City University is paying tribute to Jim Gavin, a truly exceptional individual who, through his outstanding leadership, has made an immeasurable contribution to Irish sport, and the GAA in particular. He serves as an inspiration to all of us and I am very pleased that we have the opportunity today to formally recognise his achievements and to welcome him into the DCU family".
Well done Dr. Jim Gavin on receiving yet another well-deserved accolade.
Dessie Farrell's the man, just announced!
Quote from: Sandy Hill on December 12, 2019, 07:42:25 PM
Dessie Farrell's the man, just announced!
Dr. Dessie Farrell to all of ye in 5 years time!