The IRISH RUGBY thread

Started by Donnellys Hollow, October 27, 2009, 05:26:16 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

seafoid

Quote from: Dinny Breen on January 18, 2018, 09:45:35 AM
Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 09:21:10 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on January 18, 2018, 09:16:49 AM
Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 09:04:17 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on January 18, 2018, 08:34:25 AM
Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 08:24:50 AM
Chris Henry says signing the steroid South African is unacceptable. But look at the size of Henry. He reminds me of those cheap chickens bred for their fillets. Size FF . Organic chickens might be a B.

https://m.independent.ie/sport/rugby/international-rugby/it-is-unacceptable-ireland-international-hits-out-at-signing-of-gerbrandt-grobler-36501599.html

How big was Chris Henry when he was 20? I doubt he took any shortcuts, I say doubt because who the f**k knows really! Look at the size of some of the Galway hurlers!!!
I think rugby is grotesque at this stage  . It is a freak show .
Pro sports are always going to be more extreme.

Freak show I don't know, backs are getting bigger sure but forwards now need to be more athletic as the ball is in play longer and too much bulk is causing an issue. Suspect more Rugby players will test positive for EPO or any PED than can improve aerobic and anaerobic performance.

Does society reflect Pro-Sports or does Pros-Sports reflect society? Go to any gym and have a look around at the size of some of the guys in there and remind yourself these are just guys who want to look good!!
What proportion of people go to gyms? How many rugby players would look normal in a suit ??

21%

https://twitter.com/SportforBusines/status/953911297363664896


Seriously you mustn't know many rugby if you think they are all behemoths



I would be worried about the forwards in later life.
The young lad did a few Leinster rugby camps a few years ago and 2 of the scrum dudes came along to sign autographs and  I thought they were freaky.  Fullbacks probably wouldn't be too different to GAA sizes.
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

magpie seanie

I'll take your word for it as I really respect your opinion though I'm not convinced. I'm a casual rugby fan TBH but I was at the Leinster/Exeter game and there were 3 HIA's in the first 10 minutes I think. Including Sexton who despite the insistence that he's grand I'd be seriously worried about (his tackling technique is suicidal).

I had a few concussions playing gaelic football - once I finished the game and the second time my vision went blurry so I put my hand up and asked to be taken off. I went into the dressing room and togged in on my own when I was subbed. It's an issue I'm very interested in across all sports and one I'm afraid will be much worse than we realise at this time.

Dinny Breen

Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 10:34:47 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on January 18, 2018, 09:45:35 AM
Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 09:21:10 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on January 18, 2018, 09:16:49 AM
Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 09:04:17 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on January 18, 2018, 08:34:25 AM
Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 08:24:50 AM
Chris Henry says signing the steroid South African is unacceptable. But look at the size of Henry. He reminds me of those cheap chickens bred for their fillets. Size FF . Organic chickens might be a B.

https://m.independent.ie/sport/rugby/international-rugby/it-is-unacceptable-ireland-international-hits-out-at-signing-of-gerbrandt-grobler-36501599.html

How big was Chris Henry when he was 20? I doubt he took any shortcuts, I say doubt because who the f**k knows really! Look at the size of some of the Galway hurlers!!!
I think rugby is grotesque at this stage  . It is a freak show .
Pro sports are always going to be more extreme.

Freak show I don't know, backs are getting bigger sure but forwards now need to be more athletic as the ball is in play longer and too much bulk is causing an issue. Suspect more Rugby players will test positive for EPO or any PED than can improve aerobic and anaerobic performance.

Does society reflect Pro-Sports or does Pros-Sports reflect society? Go to any gym and have a look around at the size of some of the guys in there and remind yourself these are just guys who want to look good!!
What proportion of people go to gyms? How many rugby players would look normal in a suit ??

21%

https://twitter.com/SportforBusines/status/953911297363664896


Seriously you mustn't know many rugby if you think they are all behemoths



I would be worried about the forwards in later life.
The young lad did a few Leinster rugby camps a few years ago and 2 of the scrum dudes came along to sign autographs and  I thought they were freaky.  Fullbacks probably wouldn't be too different to GAA sizes.

I'd say if you were to do a survey on this board you will find a lot of older guys have long term injuries from playing competitive sport but if you were to ask them would they change any of it so they could have a healthy and fit body now I would I say the majority will say no, same with pro players living the moment enjoying the moment, it's what life is about.

Me personally, 2 prolapsed discs, 2 torn meniscus with cysts front and back of both knees, all from playing competitive sport into my late 30s. No regrets though.
#newbridgeornowhere

Dinny Breen

Quote from: magpie seanie on January 18, 2018, 10:41:02 AM
I'll take your word for it as I really respect your opinion though I'm not convinced. I'm a casual rugby fan TBH but I was at the Leinster/Exeter game and there were 3 HIA's in the first 10 minutes I think. Including Sexton who despite the insistence that he's grand I'd be seriously worried about (his tackling technique is suicidal).

I had a few concussions playing gaelic football - once I finished the game and the second time my vision went blurry so I put my hand up and asked to be taken off. I went into the dressing room and togged in on my own when I was subbed. It's an issue I'm very interested in across all sports and one I'm afraid will be much worse than we realise at this time.

That Exeter game was brutal but I think those games are becoming the exception whereas a couple of years ago it looked liked they were becoming the norm. The 6 nations will be interesting in that respect so hopefully we see a reduction in head knocks and high and dangerous tackle being heavily penalized because what happens at the highest level is mimicked all the way down.

Also I agree, I think concussion education is very important. I coach a lot of rugby but I coach football as well, minor and u7 (baby-sitting) this year so heavily involved in both clubs so we discovered that when the season's overlapped that players with a head injury in one sport were still playing the other sport without informing their coach. Madness, we really needed to educate parents and players in all sports and at all levels.

#newbridgeornowhere

seafoid

Quote from: Dinny Breen on January 18, 2018, 10:49:43 AM
Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 10:34:47 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on January 18, 2018, 09:45:35 AM
Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 09:21:10 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on January 18, 2018, 09:16:49 AM
Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 09:04:17 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on January 18, 2018, 08:34:25 AM
Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 08:24:50 AM
Chris Henry says signing the steroid South African is unacceptable. But look at the size of Henry. He reminds me of those cheap chickens bred for their fillets. Size FF . Organic chickens might be a B.

https://m.independent.ie/sport/rugby/international-rugby/it-is-unacceptable-ireland-international-hits-out-at-signing-of-gerbrandt-grobler-36501599.html

How big was Chris Henry when he was 20? I doubt he took any shortcuts, I say doubt because who the f**k knows really! Look at the size of some of the Galway hurlers!!!
I think rugby is grotesque at this stage  . It is a freak show .
Pro sports are always going to be more extreme.

Freak show I don't know, backs are getting bigger sure but forwards now need to be more athletic as the ball is in play longer and too much bulk is causing an issue. Suspect more Rugby players will test positive for EPO or any PED than can improve aerobic and anaerobic performance.

Does society reflect Pro-Sports or does Pros-Sports reflect society? Go to any gym and have a look around at the size of some of the guys in there and remind yourself these are just guys who want to look good!!
What proportion of people go to gyms? How many rugby players would look normal in a suit ??

21%

https://twitter.com/SportforBusines/status/953911297363664896


Seriously you mustn't know many rugby if you think they are all behemoths



I would be worried about the forwards in later life.
The young lad did a few Leinster rugby camps a few years ago and 2 of the scrum dudes came along to sign autographs and  I thought they were freaky.  Fullbacks probably wouldn't be too different to GAA sizes.

I'd say if you were to do a survey on this board you will find a lot of older guys have long term injuries from playing competitive sport but if you were to ask them would they change any of it so they could have a healthy and fit body now I would I say the majority will say no, same with pro players living the moment enjoying the moment, it's what life is about.

Me personally, 2 prolapsed discs, 2 torn meniscus with cysts front and back of both knees, all from playing competitive sport into my late 30s. No regrets though.
Lads might have dodgy knees or whatever but they don't expose themselves to serious risk week after week.
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

Milltown Row2

be different if it wasnt like for like, so if a forward rugby player tackled a hurler he'd crush him, forward on a forward or a back in rugby will be like for like, they are the same weight and size so the impacts will be realitive..
None of us are getting out of here alive, so please stop treating yourself like an after thought. Ea

johnneycool

Quote from: Dinny Breen on January 18, 2018, 08:34:25 AM
Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 08:24:50 AM
Chris Henry says signing the steroid South African is unacceptable. But look at the size of Henry. He reminds me of those cheap chickens bred for their fillets. Size FF . Organic chickens might be a B.

https://m.independent.ie/sport/rugby/international-rugby/it-is-unacceptable-ireland-international-hits-out-at-signing-of-gerbrandt-grobler-36501599.html

How big was Chris Henry when he was 20? I doubt he took any shortcuts, I say doubt because who the f**k knows really! Look at the size of some of the Galway hurlers!!!


Can roids make a 20 something year old taller?

Galway hurlers are lean but not bulky in the way a Cian Healy would be.

magpie seanie

Quote from: johnneycool on January 18, 2018, 11:45:49 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on January 18, 2018, 08:34:25 AM
Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 08:24:50 AM
Chris Henry says signing the steroid South African is unacceptable. But look at the size of Henry. He reminds me of those cheap chickens bred for their fillets. Size FF . Organic chickens might be a B.

https://m.independent.ie/sport/rugby/international-rugby/it-is-unacceptable-ireland-international-hits-out-at-signing-of-gerbrandt-grobler-36501599.html

How big was Chris Henry when he was 20? I doubt he took any shortcuts, I say doubt because who the f**k knows really! Look at the size of some of the Galway hurlers!!!


Can roids make a 20 something year old taller?

Galway hurlers are lean but not bulky in the way a Cian Healy would be.

Not as aggressive either.

Bord na Mona man

Quote from: johnneycool on January 18, 2018, 11:45:49 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on January 18, 2018, 08:34:25 AM
Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 08:24:50 AM
Chris Henry says signing the steroid South African is unacceptable. But look at the size of Henry. He reminds me of those cheap chickens bred for their fillets. Size FF . Organic chickens might be a B.

https://m.independent.ie/sport/rugby/international-rugby/it-is-unacceptable-ireland-international-hits-out-at-signing-of-gerbrandt-grobler-36501599.html

How big was Chris Henry when he was 20? I doubt he took any shortcuts, I say doubt because who the f**k knows really! Look at the size of some of the Galway hurlers!!!


Can roids make a 20 something year old taller?

Galway hurlers are lean but not bulky in the way a Cian Healy would be.
I'd say the Cuala hurlers are more likely to avail of roids.
Down in Galway, they'd be partaking in more traditional rides.

johnneycool

Quote from: Dinny Breen on January 18, 2018, 10:31:32 AM
Quote from: magpie seanie on January 18, 2018, 10:13:52 AM
Why do young players have a 3 week to return to play protocol but older (who you'd imagine are getting hit harder) players don't? While there has been some steps to address high tackles it's nowhere near strong enough. It's not just about direct impact to the head.......the brain can get a fair jolt from a collision also. Tackles aimed at stopping the offload will have to be outlawed.

The NFL was forced into taking radical steps. Money was the thing that made it happen. Rugby will be the same at some point. Guys are going into car crashes multiple times and then doing it again the following week.

Young players are still developing physically, so they get a month out. It's 21 days for an adult player before they can play. Every concussion is reported to the IRFU at every level. Referees will remove a player if he suspects any kind of head injury and he will report that as well.

In the professional game they have strict return to play protocols, player cognitive responses are bench marked at the start of the season and are used as a guideline when returning to play but by no means only requirement to pass before you can play.

The choke, wrap tackles are being addressed at every level and if you make any contact with the end even if initial contact is below the shoulders it's a penalty and a good chance of a yellow card, it's a change in culture it doesn't happen immediately. Anecdotally speaking there has been a lot less head injuries this season at all levels, however it will take a few years of collecting data before a proper trend can be identified.

That's the key bit there. It's all well and good having rules in place but sure as night follows day someone will try to find a way round it. Players deliberately not having HIA brought into action as they got a "shoulder" injury or whatever to get away with not sitting out the 21 days even if it is for their own benefit.
Independent doctors along the line is the only answer.

seafoid

In the northern hemisphere, rugby is a game of attrition. Bosh , bosh, bosh.
Players are much bulkier than they used to be. So the hits are harder.
The concussions are scary. No sport is worth brain damage.
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

Dinny Breen

Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 11:58:05 AM
In the northern hemisphere, rugby is a game of attrition. Bosh , bosh, bosh.
Players are much bulkier than they used to be. So the hits are harder.
The concussions are scary. No sport is worth brain damage.

Rugby is trying to do something about it, what is the GAA doing, should that not be more your focus now? GAA is miles behind the ball here.
#newbridgeornowhere

Dinny Breen

Quote from: johnneycool on January 18, 2018, 11:45:49 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on January 18, 2018, 08:34:25 AM
Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 08:24:50 AM
Chris Henry says signing the steroid South African is unacceptable. But look at the size of Henry. He reminds me of those cheap chickens bred for their fillets. Size FF . Organic chickens might be a B.

https://m.independent.ie/sport/rugby/international-rugby/it-is-unacceptable-ireland-international-hits-out-at-signing-of-gerbrandt-grobler-36501599.html

How big was Chris Henry when he was 20? I doubt he took any shortcuts, I say doubt because who the f**k knows really! Look at the size of some of the Galway hurlers!!!


Can roids make a 20 something year old taller?

Galway hurlers are lean but not bulky in the way a Cian Healy would be.

Ha! My sport is clean, every sport is dirty, those Galway hurlers aren't skinny.

Galway forwards.     Height                  Weight                   

Cathal Mannion -          6 ft 1 in.                    88 kg.

Joe Canning -                 6ft 2 in.                     92 kg.

Joseph Cooney -            6 ft 4 in.                    96 kg.

Conor Whelan -             6 ft 0 in.                    88 kg.

Niall Burke -                   6 ft 0 in.                   94 kg.

Conor Cooney -              6 ft 4 in.                    94 kg.

#newbridgeornowhere

seafoid

Quote from: Dinny Breen on January 18, 2018, 12:31:16 PM
Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 11:58:05 AM
In the northern hemisphere, rugby is a game of attrition. Bosh , bosh, bosh.
Players are much bulkier than they used to be. So the hits are harder.
The concussions are scary. No sport is worth brain damage.

Rugby is trying to do something about it, what is the GAA doing, should that not be more your focus now? GAA is miles behind the ball here.
Sure the GAA could do more but rugby is far more of concern.
The main problem in rugby is size.

https://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/six-nations/neil-francis-the-french-bench-was-just-freakish-in-size-uini-atonio-is-big-enough-to-have-his-own-post-code-31011167.html

The other problem is excessive aggression

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/neurosurgeon-critical-of-rugby-s-excessive-aggression-1.2060907

"Anyone who has spent an hour picking skull fragments out of the contused frontal lobes of a teenage rugby player is entitled to an opinion on the safety of youth rugby. As a paediatric neurosurgeon, I've done this on several occasions. As a 'rugby parent', I've observed the school and club game at close quarters, from both sides of the touchline. What I've seen and heard suggests that our thinking on the subject may not be altogether rational."

The biggest risks are in rugby.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/six-nations/video-neil-francis-and-tony-ward-itll-need-a-fatality-before-people-take-cognisance-of-concussion-30984103.html

The rate of concussion in rugby is far higher. I think it is a structural problem. 
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

Dinny Breen

Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 12:49:58 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on January 18, 2018, 12:31:16 PM
Quote from: seafoid on January 18, 2018, 11:58:05 AM
In the northern hemisphere, rugby is a game of attrition. Bosh , bosh, bosh.
Players are much bulkier than they used to be. So the hits are harder.
The concussions are scary. No sport is worth brain damage.

Rugby is trying to do something about it, what is the GAA doing, should that not be more your focus now? GAA is miles behind the ball here.
Sure the GAA could do more but rugby is far more of concern.
The main problem in rugby is size.

https://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/six-nations/neil-francis-the-french-bench-was-just-freakish-in-size-uini-atonio-is-big-enough-to-have-his-own-post-code-31011167.html

The other problem is excessive aggression

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/neurosurgeon-critical-of-rugby-s-excessive-aggression-1.2060907

"Anyone who has spent an hour picking skull fragments out of the contused frontal lobes of a teenage rugby player is entitled to an opinion on the safety of youth rugby. As a paediatric neurosurgeon, I've done this on several occasions. As a 'rugby parent', I've observed the school and club game at close quarters, from both sides of the touchline. What I've seen and heard suggests that our thinking on the subject may not be altogether rational."

The biggest risks are in rugby.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/six-nations/video-neil-francis-and-tony-ward-itll-need-a-fatality-before-people-take-cognisance-of-concussion-30984103.html

The rate of concussion in rugby is far higher. I think it is a structural problem.

Rugby is addressing it, the GAA is not though. How many ex-hurlers suffered concussions and just played on?
#newbridgeornowhere