Well lads....watching Laochra Gael tonight featuring Nicky....I want to ask you was he as good as DJ?
I've seen both of them and as a bogballer...if I was asked... Nicky was the tops for me...and I have watched both of them... Nicky through the mid to late 80s etc and then DJ through the 90s and 00s..am I wrong??...if so why??
Ack f**k i forgot about that tonight, is it repeated?
Quote from: 5 Sams on May 09, 2008, 11:55:09 PM
Well lads....watching Laochra Gael tonight featuring Nicky....I want to ask you was he as good as DJ?
No.
Nicky wasn't even the best hurler of his era IMO. Joe Cooney was. That said he was a super hurler.
Sorry I missed that. English was a great hurler IMo but not as good a DJ. He was very unlucky with the injuries and missed a lot of important games.
DJ wins hands down imho there was no better..
DJ was also a gentleman and always had time for you when you met him,I met English a few times and i thought he was a auld bollix
DJ better, but Nicky (bow) my favourite player. He was the 1st real superstar i noticed. i met after Tipp threw away 10 point lead last summer against Limerick, he was a pleasure to meet. I have to say he was probably foulded (assaulted) much more than anyone else...... good auld Silvie. On another note, Is there somewhere you can get those loachra gaels ive seen a few but missed Nicky . I know alot of people looking for them. Very interesting especially the backgorund stuff , training etc
Quote from: squareballz on May 10, 2008, 06:49:12 PM
DJ better, but Nicky (bow) my favourite player. He was the 1st real superstar i noticed. i met after Tipp threw away 10 point lead last summer against Limerick, he was a pleasure to meet. I have to say he was probably foulded (assaulted) much more than anyone else...... good auld Silvie.
Nicky wasn't a stranger to taking a dive either. ;)
Quote from: The Real Laoislad on May 10, 2008, 04:35:06 PM
DJ wins hands down imho there was no better..
DJ was also a gentleman and always had time for you when you met him,I met English a few times and i thought he was a auld bollix
thats harsh. I've met Nicky a few times and he was always the perfect gentleman.
I concur with what was said here. Cooney was better than Nicky by a street. DJ was better too, in my biased opinion. But they were different types of players really so its probably not a valid comparison.
i've also met Nicky English, and I thought he was a very nice fella.
As for his relative merits vis a vis DJ Carey, I would have to give the nod to DJ. Joe Cooney was also special but being biased, I would put Brian Whelehan ahead of them all from this loose era. If we are talking about forwards though, I think Joe Cooney was the best natural hurler, DJ the best scoring machine and I would even put Nicky's teammate Pat Fox on a par if not ahead of him.
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on May 10, 2008, 08:07:41 PM
Quote from: squareballz on May 10, 2008, 06:49:12 PM
DJ better, but Nicky (bow) my favourite player. He was the 1st real superstar i noticed. i met after Tipp threw away 10 point lead last summer against Limerick, he was a pleasure to meet. I have to say he was probably foulded (assaulted) much more than anyone else...... good auld Silvie.
Nicky wasn't a stranger to taking a dive either. ;)
Nicky was an exception hurler who just didn't have a good team around him as Tipp were in the throws of 'the famine' for most of his career. He must of been in his early thirties when he lifted his first AI against Antrim in 89 and subsequent one in 91 when DJ was a youngster on the opposing team. A fortuitous goal from a mishit Micheal Cleary free won the game for Tipp that day. Nicky then won a famous Munster championship when he came on 'smiling' against Clare who received a drubbing so don't ask a Clare man about Nicky.
DJ started out very young on the Kilkenny team and picked up AI's on a regular basis throughout that period. Was he helped by having a good team and a weak Leinster in the latter years is up for debate, but there's no doubt he knew how to get scores when they were most needed. He was always accused of not performing well in an AI final and he did have a few quiet ones especially against Cork but he had an exceptional touch, vision and pace but he had difficulty counting steps for some of his goals!!
Two good hurlers but I'd just think DJ had the greater impact.
Now Joe Cooney was some spud also but that's for another day ;)
Quote from: johnneycool on May 12, 2008, 11:18:53 AM
Nicky was an exception hurler who just didn't have a good team around him as Tipp were in the throws of 'the famine' for most of his career. He must of been in his early thirties when he lifted his first AI against Antrim in 89 and subsequent one in 91 when DJ was a youngster on the opposing team. A fortuitous goal from a mishit Micheal Cleary free won the game for Tipp that day. Nicky then won a famous Munster championship when he came on 'smiling' against Clare who received a drubbing so don't ask a Clare man about Nicky.
that was all a lot of bullshit really. Who really thought twice about the fact that nicky was smiling that day against Clare when they were watching the game? Fact is that players will frequently display the fact that they're happy when they're winning a match. It was a typical Loughnane ploy, to invent something out of nothing, to try and spur on his own shower. Nicky was very hard-done by with the treatment he got at the hands of Clare (off-field treatment I mean). Nicky was no angel on the field. Not a dirty hurler by any means, but taking that dive against poor old Slyvie wasn't right. Still, he was blackguarded himself. In the drawn Munster final in 1996 Nicky was practically molested by Limerick. The collar of his jersey was covered in blood, yet he didn't get a single free from Joe O'Leary. Limerick went to the all-Ireland final that year, but should never have gotten past either Clare or Tipp (the first day).
Quote
DJ started out very young on the Kilkenny team and picked up AI's on a regular basis throughout that period. Was he helped by having a good team and a weak Leinster in the latter years is up for debate, but there's no doubt he knew how to get scores when they were most needed. He was always accused of not performing well in an AI final and he did have a few quiet ones especially against Cork but he had an exceptional touch, vision and pace but he had difficulty counting steps for some of his goals!!
thats not true either. DJ practically carried the Kilkenny team after 1993, until they re-emerged in 2000 under Brian Cody (lets forget about 1999 - an abherratton if ever there was one!). In his latter career it was certainly easier for him. He was given space during league campaigns to train at his own pace, he had Shefflin to take over free-taking, and had plenty of others to carry the can if he had a bad day. It wasn't all plain sailing for him though.
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on May 12, 2008, 11:30:06 AM
Quote from: johnneycool on May 12, 2008, 11:18:53 AM
Nicky was an exception hurler who just didn't have a good team around him as Tipp were in the throws of 'the famine' for most of his career. He must of been in his early thirties when he lifted his first AI against Antrim in 89 and subsequent one in 91 when DJ was a youngster on the opposing team. A fortuitous goal from a mishit Micheal Cleary free won the game for Tipp that day. Nicky then won a famous Munster championship when he came on 'smiling' against Clare who received a drubbing so don't ask a Clare man about Nicky.
that was all a lot of bullshit really. Who really thought twice about the fact that nicky was smiling that day against Clare when they were watching the game? Fact is that players will frequently display the fact that they're happy when they're winning a match. It was a typical Loughnane ploy, to invent something out of nothing, to try and spur on his own shower.
Nicky smiling? he was laughing, at the Clare lads "ahhh haa haa haaa" he was going, took the helmet off and laughed at them all, "ha ha!"
He never wore a helmet......
As Kevin Cashman said in another context to compare Nickey English to DJ Carey is to compare the Sydney Operahouse to the Cork Operahouse. English by a country mile. Cooney became far too fat and slow too early to be considered great.
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on May 12, 2008, 11:30:06 AM
that was all a lot of bullshit really. Who really thought twice about the fact that nicky was smiling that day against Clare when they were watching the game? Fact is that players will frequently display the fact that they're happy when they're winning a match. It was a typical Loughnane ploy, to invent something out of nothing, to try and spur on his own shower. Nicky was very hard-done by with the treatment he got at the hands of Clare (off-field treatment I mean). Nicky was no angel on the field. Not a dirty hurler by any means, but taking that dive against poor old Slyvie wasn't right. Still, he was blackguarded himself. In the drawn Munster final in 1996 Nicky was practically molested by Limerick. The collar of his jersey was covered in blood, yet he didn't get a single free from Joe O'Leary. Limerick went to the all-Ireland final that year, but should never have gotten past either Clare or Tipp (the first day).
That was tongue in cheek, BT7, I think Nicky got a bad press from Loughnane for next to nothing as he used it as motivation in 95 and in subsequent years after that. He as you righlty said didn't do anything that any other player would have done.
Obviously im biased(a blood splattered,sweat drenched Nicky English jersey takes pride of place above my desk in head office,in a glass case obviously!) but i would vote Nicky every time over DJ,just as any Kilkennyman worth his salt would argue the opposite,in fairness its difficult to compare the pair as they were such different hurlers.
The thing about Nicky is that his best hurling was done before live televised matches were the norm,those of us who were lucky enough to watch him in the early days will never forget his brilliance in 83,84 and especially in the 85 Munster final against Cork when he was as close to unmarkable as i've ever seen.
He was pretty close to the perfect hurler imho,the fluidity of his stroke off either side was an utter joy,he had blistering pace early on in his career before those damned flat feet started to affect his hamstrings,he was a powerful man for his build,not many could shoulder him off the ball,he was tough,he had to be in the days when lads like Seamie Hannon could perform amateur dentistry on a man without giving away as much as a free ;) but above all he had wit,vision and intelligence on the field like no other imho.
Quote from: TBT on May 12, 2008, 01:10:55 PM
As Kevin Cashman said in another context to compare Nickey English to DJ Carey is to compare the Sydney Operahouse to the Cork Operahouse. English by a country mile. Cooney became far too fat and slow too early to be considered great.
Joe Cooney was always in good shape in his prime as you would imagine given he was a farmer. He only started to put on timber in the latter years of his career from around 1995 on when he hit his 30's. Besides Christy Ring was a fat hoor all his life so extra poundage shouldn't come into assessing a hurler's merits.
Quote from: AZOffaly on May 12, 2008, 10:29:36 AM
I would even put Nicky's teammate Pat Fox on a par if not ahead of him.
AZ,we will have to meet up for a pint some day so i can have a chat with you about the above statement and prove to you that it is just plain wrong on so many levels ;) Anyone who knows me on here and other boards will attest to my sore spot in the English v Fox debate.
Quote from: turk on May 12, 2008, 11:50:35 AM
Nicky smiling? he was laughing, at the Clare lads "ahhh haa haa haaa" he was going, took the helmet off and laughed at them all, "ha ha!"
Lougnane knew fine well Nicky wasnt laughing at Clare,he was joking around with Declan Ryan who had basically eschewed numerous opportunities to score himself to set Nicky up for a score just after his introduction from the bench,in his haste to fire up his troops by demonising Nicky Loughnane failed to think about the consequences for the entirely innocent English who to this day has to put up with jibes from Clare yahoos.
Quote from: TBT on May 12, 2008, 01:10:55 PM
As Kevin Cashman said in another context to compare Nickey English to DJ Carey is to compare the Sydney Operahouse to the Cork Operahouse. English by a country mile. Cooney became far too fat and slow too early to be considered great.
As much as i admired the incomparable Cashman he undoubtedly had a blind spot when it came to DJ,once famously suggesting that Ciaran Carey was a better hurler than DJ,and he was serious as i discovered in The County in Thurles when he listed his reasons why,each more ludicrous than the last ! Cashman also had a major soft spot for English since his Fitzgibbon exploits with UCC.
Agree with AZ that Whelehan was the best of his era. Rather more difficult to compare English, Carey and Cooney as each was subtly different; to use an analogy from another sport, English was a Van Nistlerooy, DJ a Henry and Cooney a Zidane. Cooney was a superb playmaker and game-reader; current comparisons between he and Joe Canning are not at all far off the mark.
Quote from: homeofhurling8 on May 12, 2008, 03:34:19 PM
Quote from: TBT on May 12, 2008, 01:10:55 PM
As Kevin Cashman said in another context to compare Nickey English to DJ Carey is to compare the Sydney Operahouse to the Cork Operahouse. English by a country mile. Cooney became far too fat and slow too early to be considered great.
As much as i admired the incomparable Cashman he undoubtedly had a blind spot when it came to DJ,once famously suggesting that Ciaran Carey was a better hurler than DJ,and he was serious as i discovered in The County in Thurles when he listed his reasons why,each more ludicrous than the last ! Cashman also had a major soft spot for English since his Fitzgibbon exploits with UCC.
In fairness to Cashman, it had to be galling for any Corkman who had seen the majesty of Ring, to see the Kilkenny propaganda machine spinning out of control wrt to as flawed a hurler as Carey. Schadenfreude at Carey's woefull performences v Cork in recent All Ire finalswas had by all in Cork.THe Carey spin machine has certainly forever soured Cork views on him. As you mention English was clearly the best hurler hurler in the Country from the early 80s but got v little recognition because of how poor Tipp were at the the time.He had above any other hurler I saw the ability to deliever a a score when it was most needed. The Killarney equaliser the perfect example of his class. Given the l context, this score would have to go down as one of the greatest Tipp scores of all time.
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on May 12, 2008, 03:04:59 PM
Quote from: TBT on May 12, 2008, 01:10:55 PM
As Kevin Cashman said in another context to compare Nickey English to DJ Carey is to compare the Sydney Operahouse to the Cork Operahouse. English by a country mile. Cooney became far too fat and slow too early to be considered great.
Joe Cooney was always in good shape in his prime as you would imagine given he was a farmer. He only started to put on timber in the latter years of his career from around 1995 on when he hit his 30's. Besides Christy Ring was a fat hoor all his life so extra poundage shouldn't come into assessing a hurler's merits.
Cooney was in freefall from around 89 on. Ring started to put on weight in his early 40s Up untill his late 30s he was exceptionally fit as any team photo would show. btw he was still the best club hurler in Cork in 66 at 46 yrs of age.
Quote from: TBT on May 12, 2008, 05:17:57 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on May 12, 2008, 03:04:59 PM
Quote from: TBT on May 12, 2008, 01:10:55 PM
As Kevin Cashman said in another context to compare Nickey English to DJ Carey is to compare the Sydney Operahouse to the Cork Operahouse. English by a country mile. Cooney became far too fat and slow too early to be considered great.
Joe Cooney was always in good shape in his prime as you would imagine given he was a farmer. He only started to put on timber in the latter years of his career from around 1995 on when he hit his 30's. Besides Christy Ring was a fat hoor all his life so extra poundage shouldn't come into assessing a hurler's merits.
Cooney was in freefall from around 89 on.
Yet put in a virtuoso performance in the 1990 All -Ireland final and led his club almost single-handedly to two All-Ireland club titles in 93 and 94. Not bad for a man in freefall. That Galway team was getting old by 1990 but Cooney was still a great hurler well into the mid-1990's.
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on May 12, 2008, 10:25:46 AM
Quote from: The Real Laoislad on May 10, 2008, 04:35:06 PM
DJ wins hands down imho there was no better..
DJ was also a gentleman and always had time for you when you met him,I met English a few times and i thought he was a auld bollix
thats harsh. I've met Nicky a few times and he was always the perfect gentleman.
I concur with what was said here. Cooney was better than Nicky by a street. DJ was better too, in my biased opinion. But they were different types of players really so its probably not a valid comparison.
Not harsh at all,I met him a few times thru work i done back then and always found him to be a bollix thats just my opinion on the man,Carey on the otherhand was always a gentleman
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on May 12, 2008, 05:23:50 PM
Quote from: TBT on May 12, 2008, 05:17:57 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on May 12, 2008, 03:04:59 PM
Quote from: TBT on May 12, 2008, 01:10:55 PM
As Kevin Cashman said in another context to compare Nickey English to DJ Carey is to compare the Sydney Operahouse to the Cork Operahouse. English by a country mile. Cooney became far too fat and slow too early to be considered great.
Joe Cooney was always in good shape in his prime as you would imagine given he was a farmer. He only started to put on timber in the latter years of his career from around 1995 on when he hit his 30's. Besides Christy Ring was a fat hoor all his life so extra poundage shouldn't come into assessing a hurler's merits.
Cooney was in freefall from around 89 on.
Yet put in a virtuoso performance in the 1990 All -Ireland final and led his club almost single-handedly to two All-Ireland club titles in 93 and 94. Not bad for a man in freefall. That Galway team was getting old by 1990 but Cooney was still a great hurler well into the mid-1990's.
He mixed the brilliant with the awfull in the 90 final. Club hurling is irrelevant to this. Given his age he should have been the dominant player of the early 90s . No Galway person could argue he fulfilled his potential in his late 20s.
Quote from: TBT on May 12, 2008, 05:47:04 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on May 12, 2008, 05:23:50 PM
Quote from: TBT on May 12, 2008, 05:17:57 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on May 12, 2008, 03:04:59 PM
Quote from: TBT on May 12, 2008, 01:10:55 PM
As Kevin Cashman said in another context to compare Nickey English to DJ Carey is to compare the Sydney Operahouse to the Cork Operahouse. English by a country mile. Cooney became far too fat and slow too early to be considered great.
Joe Cooney was always in good shape in his prime as you would imagine given he was a farmer. He only started to put on timber in the latter years of his career from around 1995 on when he hit his 30's. Besides Christy Ring was a fat hoor all his life so extra poundage shouldn't come into assessing a hurler's merits.
Cooney was in freefall from around 89 on.
Yet put in a virtuoso performance in the 1990 All -Ireland final and led his club almost single-handedly to two All-Ireland club titles in 93 and 94. Not bad for a man in freefall. That Galway team was getting old by 1990 but Cooney was still a great hurler well into the mid-1990's.
He mixed the brilliant with the awfull in the 90 final. Club hurling is irrelevant to this. Given his age he should have been the dominant player of the early 90s . No Galway person could argue he fulfilled his potential in his late 20s.
Come on now. Be serious. He was brilliant in the 1990 final. Less brilliant in the second half admitedly but he was not to blame for Galway losing. It was the fact that the Galway full-back line had bus sized holes in it during the entire second half and couldn't stop leaking goals. To say he was at any stage "awful" is just nonsense.
Galway as a whole were going slowly downhill after 1990 simply because they were losing many of the players that kept them at the top during the 1980's and their replacements weren't as good. Galway weren't good enough to win titles at that time so I'm not sure how that is Joe Cooney's fault who was still their best player during this period. If he didn't fulfill his potential during his late 20's it certainly wasn't his fault. He hadn't the supporting cast around him like he had in the mid to late 80's.
Certainly by 1995 Cooney was showing signs of serious milage on the clock and probably played on a little too long seeing as he only retired in 2000 but in his late 20's he was still producing great hurling. That in itself wasn't enough for Galway at the time.
As for club hurling being irrelevant I suspect it only is as it doesn't suit your argument.
Quote from: TBT on May 12, 2008, 05:12:34 PM
Quote from: homeofhurling8 on May 12, 2008, 03:34:19 PM
Quote from: TBT on May 12, 2008, 01:10:55 PM
As Kevin Cashman said in another context to compare Nickey English to DJ Carey is to compare the Sydney Operahouse to the Cork Operahouse. English by a country mile. Cooney became far too fat and slow too early to be considered great.
As much as i admired the incomparable Cashman he undoubtedly had a blind spot when it came to DJ,once famously suggesting that Ciaran Carey was a better hurler than DJ,and he was serious as i discovered in The County in Thurles when he listed his reasons why,each more ludicrous than the last ! Cashman also had a major soft spot for English since his Fitzgibbon exploits with UCC.
In fairness to Cashman, it had to be galling for any Corkman who had seen the majesty of Ring, to see the Kilkenny propaganda machine spinning out of control wrt to as flawed a hurler as Carey. Schadenfreude at Carey's woefull performences v Cork in recent All Ire finalswas had by all in Cork.THe Carey spin machine has certainly forever soured Cork views on him. As you mention English was clearly the best hurler hurler in the Country from the early 80s but got v little recognition because of how poor Tipp were at the the time.He had above any other hurler I saw the ability to deliever a a score when it was most needed. The Killarney equaliser the perfect example of his class. Given the l context, this score would have to go down as one of the greatest Tipp scores of all time.
TBT,im a huge fan of Cashman,he simply had no peers when it came to hurling writing imho but he had the odd headstagger every now and then,Dj was one of them,his little spat with skippy Cleary was another but thats another discussion.
My own take on the Dj situation is that the whole hype thing that surrounded him(through no fault of his own) probably pissed people off to such an extent that in the end the wood obscured the trees to a certain extent,he was a great hurler and whatever his faults he most certainly shouldnt be spoken of in the same terms as the likes of Ciaran Carey who was a fine hurler but not in the same league as his namesake noreside.
I thoroughly agree with you on Nickys point at the end of normal time in Killarney in 87,i remember having an arguement on this board about its merits years ago,to my mind it was the ballsiest Tipp score I've seen in my lifetime,not just to win the most "must win" puck out in 16 years for a tipp player through a forest of Cork jersies but to have the guts and foresight to take the point when half of Killarney was screaming for a goal took incredible intestinal fortitude,had he done what Leahy did in Croke park 10 years later against Clare and missed when going for goal God only knows when the famine would have ended !
always thought cashman was a cantankerous old b**** to be honest. some of the stuff he wrote about DJ was a disgrace quite frankly. Think DJ was a mile better than them to be honest. English had too many injuries unfortunately but was still a brilliant hurler as was Cooney. DJ was the most marked man in the game,for all his undoubted skill and talent he got no credit for his sheer bravery at times when he was being broken up in games. yeah he has others to help him out but he had no more than english or cooney did to help them out. DJ is the best modern day hurler i 've seen , i didn't see Ring so i don't know.
I though English was a gentleman to be honest when i met him. wouldn't agree that he was anything else.
Quote from: TBT on May 12, 2008, 01:10:55 PM
As Kevin Cashman said in another context to compare Nickey English to DJ Carey is to compare the Sydney Operahouse to the Cork Operahouse. English by a country mile. Cooney became far too fat and slow too early to be considered great.
By that logic George Best and Maradona dont rate in the other game.
Quote from: TBT on May 12, 2008, 05:12:34 PM
In fairness to Cashman, it had to be galling for any Corkman who had seen the majesty of Ring, to see the Kilkenny propaganda machine spinning out of control wrt to as flawed a hurler as Carey. Schadenfreude at Carey's woefull performences v Cork in recent All Ire finalswas had by all in Cork.THe Carey spin machine has certainly forever soured Cork views on him.
I don't think anyone would argue that the 'Carey spin machine' went a little out of control. As HOH said, none of that was of his making. And to somehow imply that his was anything less than a great hurler, for this reason, is very narrow-minded (but whats new there, eh Tomas?). In my book, Carey is the finest hurler of my lifetime. Whelehan was certainly more consistent, but Carey more talented in my view. Again, this is apples and oranges stuff, only my opinion, but there ya go.
Back to the 'spin machine'. This is the self-same 'spin machine' that would have us believe that Cork would be winning anything and everything under the sun, had Setanta O'hAlpin not turned his back on his county, the same 'spin machine' that would have us believe that Diarmaid O'Sullivan is a good hurler, and the same 'spin machine' that would glorify horribly average players like Sean McGrath (and to a lesser extent) Joe Deane.
People in glass houses Tomas.......
Quote from: bottlethrower7 on May 13, 2008, 10:09:39 AM
Back to the 'spin machine'. This is the self-same 'spin machine' that would have us believe that Cork would be winning anything and everything under the sun, had Setanta O'hAlpin not turned his back on his county, the same 'spin machine' that would have us believe that Diarmaid O'Sullivan is a good hurler, and the same 'spin machine' that would glorify horribly average players like Sean McGrath (and to a lesser extent) Joe Deane.
And Setanta's older brother!!!
I'm part of the English brigade as well but I'll concede to anyone who reckons there is bias to my opinion. Because they're probably right
Its marginal, but I think Nicky had the greater finesse, on his day there was something otherworldly about his hurling game. Finesse alone would seperate the two; I think Carey's reputation really only took off in his latter years, and by taking off I mean the panelgiac stuff that is often written about him being an equal of Ring, Keher or Doyle (Jimmy). Remember the jibing he often (with some justification to be fair) DJ had to ship for large parts of his career about being effectively a "choker" on All Ireland Final day.
I'll see you that and raise you Nicky v. Conor Hayes in 1988 I hear you say. Whats more widely known now and was really only half known then is that Nicky and his family took an incredible amount of abuse in the week before that All Ireland. I've often thought it may have been a factor in him later decided to move to Dublin to live.
As for Cooney, I think glorious and all as he was in his pomp., there was a slide in his career towards the end.
Well I'm not from a hurling county obviously but ...
I have always argued the point that DJ was overrated. I just can't understand why so many people think he was so great. The media always had a hard on for him but thats a different issue.
I just don't see why people consider him so good ? To me Henry Shefflin and Eoin Kelly (Tipp) are much better even at this early stage. I won't keep going because I really like Kilkenny hurling and kilkenny people and I always end up in an argument over this. I was even told before that DJ was better then Eddie Keher and as proof of this the lad said that Keher said DJ was better then him.
Well Eddie might well have said but it doesn't make it true. Best Kilkenny hurler to date -> Eddie Keher.
As for Nicky, I believe he was better then DJ but the best of his time ? I don't know.
Nicky was fantastic, I only had the pleasure of watching him a few times. Himself and Pat Fox were fantastic players.
I think Carey was somewhat overrated, but remember he arrived around the time that coverage of hurling exploded in the media.
What probably clouded the debate further was how offended Cork people got about comparisons to Christy Ring, so naturally they would tend to go overdrive at highlighting Carey's flaws.
I don't think we was ultimate all round hurler, but he was a devastating finisher and goal scorer.
When he'd take possession anywhere close to goals, the gasp of expectation from the crowd is something that no other player has generated in my lifetime.
Like HOH mentioned, English missed a lot of the television era. Before the 90s, Munster clashes didn't get televised live. After that, English was injury hit and often playing cameo roles.
My memories of English was that he could sweet points from distance, even with his marker breathing down his neck.
If you needed someone to dig a team out of a hole with a last minute goal, I'd give Carey the nod. To win the game with a scatter of points, then I'd go for English.
Quote from: Bord na Mona man on May 20, 2008, 12:09:12 PM
I think Carey was somewhat overrated, but remember he arrived around the time that coverage of hurling exploded in the media.
What probably clouded the debate further was how offended Cork people got about comparisons to Christy Ring, so naturally they would tend to go overdrive at highlighting Carey's flaws.
don't forget though, at that time TG4 started reshowing old all-Irelands. A lot of people had never seen those games, and it was fairly apparent that the standard wasn't all that hot. I think Carey was being held up in the context of the standard of his day against Ring relative to his.
But, comparing any 2 players is a pointless exercise. In saying that, Carey was far better than Ring!