Antrim Football Thread

[Maximus Marillius]

Bannside....the club is the first port of call when establishing good coaching and this is where in my opinion the weakness ls. No doubt you will point to St Galls and cargin, but after that what do you have....very poor quality. To me the evidence of good club coaching is producing 2/3 players able to progress into senior club football year in and year out. And i guess this is the subjective part of the discussion. For many clubs what they have been producing is not good enough in quality and numbers, although they might thing that it is good enough. It is the clubs responsibility to ensure that they have better coaches and this means a strategy and a drive to up the knowledge base of their club coaches and also to ensure that they just dont give the u12 team to some young lads da because he is interested. I know at our own club we went through a recent period where or coaching was poor and that reflected in the quality of our last two minor sides, but we identified the problem and have successful sorted it out and now have an excellent coaching structure all the way down to 6 yr olds. It meant approaching the right people and making sure there were lots of sessions over 10 months of the year. I will be interested to hear how you think these squads make a difference and also what evidence you will use to back it up

[imtommygunn]

Some interesting points Bannside.

One thing which I found worrying from a Belfast perspective was the fact St Endas saw the need to move to SW leagues rather than the south antrim ones. It seems clear that the north antrim hurling structures are better than the south antrim ones. However I'm surprised in the football.

However Belfast seems to be making greater strides in schools football than the teams in the south west. It was interesting to note that about 80% of the minors this year were from Belfast and some were from Glenavy who are most likely schooled in Belfast.  To me a school like St Louis should be competing at a higher level in football. They have the pick of the south west. With Paul McFlynn in there maybe that will change.(However he was in a couple of years ago - not 100% sure he still is).

I think we lack the fundamentals in our coaching - whether that be clubs or schools not stepping up to the mark I don't know. I felt that even though the minors ran Cavan close this year they were a good bit short in some of the skills. Even going back to good minor teams of 97 / 98 I felt we were fortunate to have an abundance of big men and perhaps lacked the fundamentals then too.

I would ten to agree with Max - clubs need to step up though I think a few definitely are. I think someone like Creggan is a fine example. In the south west we also need more input from schools.

BTW Bannsider- are you a full time coach??

Incidentally I think from a progression perspective McSparran is doing  great job. I think he can be somewhat naive in his football / hurling opinions but I think he is setting some excellent structures in place with the development at dunsilly being a prime example.

[playwiththewind1st]

North Antrim is almost entirely devoted to hurling & South West would be almost entirely given over to football, so there isn't a great deal of conflict between the 2 games, which probably leads to smoother organisation. In South Antrim, a major problem would be that clubs are entering teams into competitions, particularly at under age level, when they clearly don't have the numbers, leading to a lot of failures to field.

Given the geographical situation of St. Enda's, it's as quick to get to North Antrim or South West Antrim venues as it is to get across Belfast. There's probably a multitude of reasons why St. Enda's moved, but I think it was done with the longer term motivation of developing the club further.

It's going to be a big challenge for the County Board - how to arrest the decline of Gaelic games in Belfast, but this is happening in all major urban centres. We should not be so insular & should look at other sports - 1 of the prime reasons that people are falling away is the fact that there are regular & lengthy periods of inactivity in the GAA calendar & people are just going elsewhere, if they're guaranteed regular competitive activity. I don't profess to be any sort of guru & don't want to write a thesis, but maybe we need to look at all structures within the County & replace those that are no longer fit for purpose. That & get people in who know what they're doing, in terms of providing top notch coaching at club / school level. I know it's easy pontificating here, getting it done will require resources & people are reluctant to give up a lot of time, especially when the county is in the doldrums.

[imtommygunn]

I would agree with most of what you say pwtw. The question probably needs to be asked if Belfast has too many clubs. St Brigids will be good for the game I think though. You had a large untapped resource in south belfast which is fortunately now being tapped. I know they have ringers too but they are new so to be expected.

However more also needs to be done in the south west - particularly in schools.

[playwiththewind1st]

Don't forget though that there are a couple of other clubs within the South Belfast catchment area, e.g. Bredagh & Carryduff & these aren't Antrim clubs, although I'm well aware that they have many people in their ranks that were originally Antrim GAA people. That tells you something.

On the question of schools, it's a fact that many teachers are turning away from all sorts of extra curricular activities such as sports. They aren't interested in anything outside school hours & the whole child protection / health & safety regime has served to put many people off. Schools without a dedicated PE teacher are going to struggle to get anybody to take gaelic games coaching I would think.

[imtommygunn]

True to a point but the teachers issue is the same for other counties. I dunno if the county board could help out here?

[Gold]

on a positive note for the county --was good to see St Brigids beat Cargin in the league, Cargin rarely are beaten in the league and St brigids matched them all the way in this one--it may only be the league but anyone making any headway into breaking or attempting to break the big 2 has to be good for antrim football--surely some of those boys may in the coming years add to the county team

[Casements08]

Hi everyone!

Anyone know when the Antrim Champion first round is?

Who will win/not turn up/kick 40wides.  Use this page to debate your thoughts & views.

Up Casements! 

[armaghniac]

I expect the people in the Antrim thread in the Local gaa discussion section know all about it.

[playwiththewind1st]

Antrim SFC - 2008

St. Brigids  Cargin  Corrigan Park 08/08/2008 19:30 TBC Qtr Final 
Creggan Kickhams  Lamh Dhearg  Ahoghill 08/08/2008 19:30 TBC Qtr Final 
Rasharkin  Dunloy  Portglenone 09/08/2008 19:00 TBC Preliminary 
St. Pauls  Gort Na Mona  Casement Park 09/08/2008 19:00 TBC Preliminary 
St. Galls  Portglenone  Casement Park 10/08/2008 15:00 TBC Preliminary

[CSC]

Bannside....the club is the first port of call when establishing good coaching and this is where in my opinion the weakness ls. No doubt you will point to St Galls and cargin, but after that what do you have....very poor quality. To me the evidence of good club coaching is producing 2/3 players able to progress into senior club football year in and year out. And i guess this is the subjective part of the discussion. For many clubs what they have been producing is not good enough in quality and numbers, although they might thing that it is good enough. It is the clubs responsibility to ensure that they have better coaches and this means a strategy and a drive to up the knowledge base of their club coaches and also to ensure that they just dont give the u12 team to some young lads da because he is interested. I know at our own club we went through a recent period where or coaching was poor and that reflected in the quality of our last two minor sides, but we identified the problem and have successful sorted it out and now have an excellent coaching structure all the way down to 6 yr olds. It meant approaching the right people and making sure there were lots of sessions over 10 months of the year. I will be interested to hear how you think these squads make a difference and also what evidence you will use to back it up

Maximus Marillius,

I think that you spot on with the issue affecting Antrim football. Club coaching is the most important issue affecting developing Antrim into a contender in football. Cargin and St Gall's aren't the only two clubs with good caoching structures, Creggan, St Brigids, Sean Stinsons and Gort na mona have good programs in place which is reflected in the clubs progress from the lower divisions to div 1, but all the clubs need to step up.
I coached underage teams with my club from a number of years, and to be honest the biggest obstacles in developing the squads was 1) county development teams, 2) Facilitating hurling training / matches.

The problem with the CD squads was that I was taking club training without my best players so the rest of the squad suffered. Regarding facilitating hurling, working in dual club means that you are limited in what you can do with the teams because some of my players could have four games during the week.

The answer, CD squads should be trained at the end / before underage leagues start. 2) The gaa should seriously consider defining football periods and hurling periods where one sport takes preference over the other. In the states, the four major sports in America is defined by the seasons of the year, so a kid can play football (fall), basketball (winter), soccer (spring) baseball (summer) with out the fear of burn out.

Tommygun,
regarding the southwest and colleges, the lads from sw represent St Mary's Magherafelt and St. Pats Maghera. Ballymena doesn't have a full SW selection to pick from, but they should still be aiming for A grade football.

[bannside]

Max, busy today, just getting a chance to respond.

I have to agree that the club SHOULD be the basis for proper coaching. Also CSC point that at times CD squads actually hamper what you are trying to do at club level.

I cant imagine Max that too many potentially goodplayers in Bellaghy slip through the net. Thats because your structures are good now, and as a club you worked hard to put these structures in place.

However in Antrim we wouldnt have that many clubs really doing the development thing properly. An earlier poster named four or five, and if there are a couple more that would be the height of it. Truthfully I wouldnt be worried about a decent prospect getting a good education at half a dozen clubs, and now include Glenavy in that bracket too. But few of these would be on the scale of Ballinderry, Bellaghy, Kilrea or Magherafelt for example.

If the county dev squads are badly organised, then there is no benefit to them at all. But if they are run properly, on a systemised basis, with individual sessions dedicated to all the basic and relevant skills of the game, where there is enjoyment, reward and status, then I think that quite a few individuals would benefit from them.

Where they can be assessed for the stronger/weaker parts of their game, introducing strength and conditioning where appropriate.

In conclusion I see the proper resources being put in to making this a priority, where the county can take outright responsibility for the proper development of its potentially elite, rather than leave that huge responsibility to a handful of clubs who are still a long way off the four Derry clubs you would have dealings with or against.

And on another note, with the opening of Croke park, and the extra money for urban development, and Antrim now obviously the weak link in Ulster, how hard would it be to put a FULL TIME coach into three or four of our larger schools. These coaches to be employed not by Antrim, but by Ulster.

A strong Antrim would be a massive lift for the game in Ulster, with massive crowds sure to get behind any successful senior team.

[ONeill]

And sales of pastie baps would go through the roof. And shell suits. And fake bling.

[playwiththewind1st]

And sales of pastie baps would go through the roof. And shell suits. And fake bling.

Antrim referees are going to have to take a stand then & stop allowing teams to come out onto the pitch with these items.

[Square Ball]

when I was over at the St Galls tournament on May day I was having a word with a few of the other u10 coaches, some of them were stating that they had to start putiting their own coaches into some of the primary schools as they didn't do football. I think it would be more important to get the basics right from an early stage, as opposed to have to correct these at a later stage.