Brexit.

Started by T Fearon, November 01, 2015, 06:04:06 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

TabClear

#3690
Quote from: OgraAnDun on December 08, 2017, 01:05:05 PM
Quote from: screenexile on December 08, 2017, 12:37:57 PM
Brexiters feel shit. . . Remainers feel a small bit of relief.

Not exactly a victory for anyone!!

The sign of a good compromise.

This is what the DUP just dont get in "negotiations". Act like a spoilt kid (i.e. Sammy/Gregory/Nigel etc smug faces and triumphalism) when you have a "win" and the people you are dealing with say "never again". The deal this morning has just kicked the can down the road to a time when there are more factors that can be thrown in the mix to do with specifics around trade to get the bigger deal. All in all a decent result for the North.

vallankumous

Quote from: HiMucker on December 08, 2017, 12:26:31 PM
This wee scenario makes some sense apart from the British PM being completely embarrassed on the international stage.  I may even buy that, as a crafty political move if she had been a strong leader up to that point and had the points to recover from it.  But she didn't, she has been through embarrassment after embarrassment, and I would struggle to accept that she put herself through a charade that she will get pummelled for quite a while to come.  There is no way she deliberately done that.

When the deal is done I think she will be vindicated. I think labour shouting and roaring is just making hay.

Main Street

Quote from: OgraAnDun on December 08, 2017, 01:05:05 PM
Quote from: screenexile on December 08, 2017, 12:37:57 PM
Brexiters feel shit. . . Remainers feel a small bit of relief.

Not exactly a victory for anyone!!

The sign of a good compromise.
Both sides were not that far apart, were they? i.e. apart from the DUP being stuck somewhere in the old testament. The brexiteer side had no special agenda to have it any other way. The minor complicated factor which stalled this particular issue was that the DUP have some status in Westminster. And like most every other related brexit issue, the Brits hadn't put much forethought into it, toss and coin merchants versus chess grandmasters.
In most every other aspect of this divorce from the EU, the Brits have taken a hammering, nicely illustrated by Seán Clarke in The Guardian
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/ng-interactive/2017/jul/20/where-are-we-up-to-in-these-brexit-talks

AQMP

Does anyone in the DUP give a flying fcuk about poor Gibraltar (96% Remain)!

"As it stands, Gibraltar will not enjoy the cushion a transition period, EU officials confirmed, and will drop out of the Single Market and the Customs Union when the UK leaves the bloc on 29 March 2019.

EU officials confirmed that an arrangement over the future of the rock needs to be struck between Spain and the UK, if the transition arrangement is to be extended to Gibraltar."


Syferus

This looks very much like the DUP were told to take their medicine and shut up.

AQMP

Quote from: Syferus on December 08, 2017, 04:04:07 PM
This looks very much like the DUP were told to take their medicine and shut up.

Yep, I think that's fair comment.

NetNitrate

Quote from: vallankumous on December 08, 2017, 02:09:35 PM
Quote from: HiMucker on December 08, 2017, 12:26:31 PM
This wee scenario makes some sense apart from the British PM being completely embarrassed on the international stage.  I may even buy that, as a crafty political move if she had been a strong leader up to that point and had the points to recover from it.  But she didn't, she has been through embarrassment after embarrassment, and I would struggle to accept that she put herself through a charade that she will get pummelled for quite a while to come.  There is no way she deliberately done that.

When the deal is done I think she will be vindicated. I think labour shouting and roaring is just making hay.

Vindicated in the sense that it will be a very watered down Brexit. However, it got to that place because of the hardline stance taken by Ireland - ie the guarantee of no border. However, no border can only be guaranteed if the 6 county regulations are aligned with the 26. Then the DUP stepped in and an untended consequence of this is that for the six counties to be aligned with the 26, the six need to be aligned with Great Britain. And for Britain to do that, Britain has to be back aligned with EU rules. The whole thing is self-referential. The UK did not arrive in this place through any strategic thinking but rather accidentally. If they want the Brexit they voted for, it's becoming clear that the six counties are a big problem. The agreement is written ambigiously enough that the border still ends up again in the Irish sea. That is perhaps the one area where the British side were not found wanting.


seafoid

Quote from: Syferus on December 08, 2017, 04:04:07 PM
This looks very much like the DUP were told to take their medicine and shut up.
Put back in their wee place
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

randomusername

Quote from: seafoid on December 08, 2017, 05:57:42 PM
Quote from: Syferus on December 08, 2017, 04:04:07 PM
This looks very much like the DUP were told to take their medicine and shut up.
Put back in their wee place

You sure about this?

https://twitter.com/paulfrewDUP/status/939053054166552576

Syferus

Quote from: randomusername on December 08, 2017, 06:31:35 PM
Quote from: seafoid on December 08, 2017, 05:57:42 PM
Quote from: Syferus on December 08, 2017, 04:04:07 PM
This looks very much like the DUP were told to take their medicine and shut up.
Put back in their wee place

You sure about this?

https://twitter.com/paulfrewDUP/status/939053054166552576

Any DUP lad can live in the realm of fantasy if they wish but the fact remains they're stuck in the single market with us, and all are entitled to EU citizenship. Bluster is just that and facts aren't as easy to wash away.

The grandest irony is if the DUP end up having hitched the rest of the UK to the single market too they will have done Ireland a massive favour as it will make trade far easier for us than a UK that would have their hands untied when it comes to regulations. This was always a win-win negotiation for Ireland.

Rossfan

Foster says she was looking for more time for "more clarification" but May told her there was no more time and she was going with the text as it was.
In other words ya've had yar  fun Arlene now the big girls are going out to play.
That Frew is in some parallel universe.
Davy's given us a dream to cling to
We're going to bring home the SAM

seafoid

If you go back 18 months to the vote and see what people were saying about the challenge facing the Irish diplomats today is a massive achievement . They had to convince the EU 27 first and then use that leverage to put smacht over the Tories . Events helped but this was some result.

It also looks like the referendum result is now irrelevant. 17m people were ignorant of the real costs . Farage goes back to the referendum but he is wasting his time.
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

Captain Scarlet

Quote from: Rossfan on December 08, 2017, 06:47:26 PM
Foster says she was looking for more time for "more clarification" but May told her there was no more time and she was going with the text as it was.
In other words ya've had yar  fun Arlene now the big girls are going out to play.
That Frew is in some parallel universe.

Listening to the radio and commentators are saying they can't belive the DUP are saying there wasn't enogh time as their usual gig is to stall until the 11th hour and get what they want.
The fact that are talking like that means their hand was forced.

Also any tweets from Borris or any Brexiter or DUP person is surely just saving face and keeping up the stupid bluster that has us all where we are.
them mysterons are always killing me but im grand after a few days.sickenin aul dose all the same.

Dubh driocht

Fair play to wee Leo and Big Simon. " You can have any kind of Brexit you want as long as it's green!" Indeed Fintan, indeed.
https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/fintan-o-toole-ireland-has-just-saved-the-uk-from-the-madness-of-a-hard-brexit-1.3320096