Amateurism

[seafoid]

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/se%25C3%25A1n-moran-time-for-the-other-side-of-the-amateurism-coin-to-come-under-scrutiny-1.4691872%3fmode=amp


Next year, all going to plan in the post-pandemic world, we'll be finished with All-Irelands in mid-July (hurling) and the end of the month (football). When the now defunct Club Players' Association argued for such a timetable just four years ago, it was declared a fantasy but Covid taught us otherwise.The report of the 1997 'Amateur Status sub-committee' makes quaint reading now but it was a serious attempt to get to grips with an issue that has prompted almost as much agonising in the years since as club fixtures.

If intercounty activity is a runaway train, it's flattened a few territories. Anecdotal evidence is that counties are finding it increasingly difficult to find people who want to be involved in management.

Alongside a proper closed season – it's now likely that collective training will only be allowed from December 15th onwards– it means the intensive intercounty 'training' season will run from mid-December to mid-June for most counties, six months, or seven for All-Ireland semi-finalists and finalists

[seafoid]

This ESRI report is very interesting

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/se%25C3%25A1n-moran-time-for-the-other-side-of-the-amateurism-coin-to-come-under-scrutiny-1.4691872%3fmode=amp

Dr Elish Kelly's watershed 2018 ESRI report 'Playing Senior Inter-County Games: Experiences, Realities and Consequences' laid bare the life of intercounty players and the outsized demands placed on them.

The headline finding was that players were dedicating 31 hours a week to their involvement – but scepticism amongst the rest of us that anything would be done to address the issue.

In terms of easing all the pressures on players highlighted in the ESRI report, it should go a long way.

"There are obviously associated benefits in terms of costs for county boards too: a six-month expense window versus an eight- or nine-month one is hugely significant and much more manageable."


https://www.esri.ie/publications/playing-senior-inter-county-gaelic-games-experiences-realities-and-consequences

[Itchy]

What happens when the county manager calls a lad in October and gives him a training plan to be at X level of fitness by Dec 15th?

[johnnycool]

What happens when the county manager calls a lad in October and gives him a training plan to be at X level of fitness by Dec 15th?

exactly.

The intercounty players will be still training away during this "off season" and no doubt the CB's are paying their gym fees and the likes, so that expense will be ongoing.

[Rossfan]

This pampered soccer pr**k finding out who the real dinosaurs are.
Maybe of players and CEOs weren't grabbing sp much money they might have better facilities.
Hopefully his kids go on to play fir Wicklow!

https://m.independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/league-of-ireland-facilities-horrific-when-you-compare-it-to-gaa-new-shels-boss-damien-duff-41015274.html

[Saffronaldo]

This pampered soccer pr**k finding out who the real dinosaurs are.
Maybe of players and CEOs weren't grabbing sp much money they might have better facilities.
Hopefully his kids go on to play fir Wicklow!

https://m.independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/league-of-ireland-facilities-horrific-when-you-compare-it-to-gaa-new-shels-boss-damien-duff-41015274.html

It came across as Duff admiring the GAA for what they've done rather than criticising them. Don't think there's any need for the insults.

He's hardly pampered either, Duff was a brilliant footballer and I'd say growing up in Ireland he has played on some horrible surfaces with horrible facilities. To have endured the kickings he'd have got and all the rest of it deserves praise. God knows we haven't produced a player like him since.

[Itchy]

This pampered soccer pr**k finding out who the real dinosaurs are.
Maybe of players and CEOs weren't grabbing sp much money they might have better facilities.
Hopefully his kids go on to play fir Wicklow!

https://m.independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/league-of-ireland-facilities-horrific-when-you-compare-it-to-gaa-new-shels-boss-damien-duff-41015274.html

I am involved in both a GAA and Soccer at the moment in the county I live. Its definitely a county with a relatively equal split between soccer and GAA in that it has almost equal levels of hot spots for both sports. The biggest difference is the facilities, without a question. The soccer crowd are so reliant on community/council provided pitches it isn't funny. I would say as low as 15-20% of the soccer clubs here have actually developed there own grounds while with GAA I cannot think of one club that doesn't have their own grounds with dressings rooms etc. And this is not based on government hand downs, its based on hard community work. The soccer club I am with is actually an exception to the rule here with fine facilities but some of the grounds we visit are an embarrassment. I have a mate who is a FAI coach in the area and he admits the GAA are miles ahead of them and he says he brings it up a lot with his bosses and colleagues but there is a chip on the shoulder element there that wont acknowledge it, they think they are actually cutting edge as an organisation. Some of the top coaches in FAI think they are admired by other big countries in Europe - I have heard it said on courses I have attended. The FAI is a mess and although there is plenty wrong in the GAA too, we can be thankful we get a lot of things right.

[Baile Brigín 2]

This pampered soccer pr**k finding out who the real dinosaurs are.
Maybe of players and CEOs weren't grabbing sp much money they might have better facilities.
Hopefully his kids go on to play fir Wicklow!

https://m.independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/league-of-ireland-facilities-horrific-when-you-compare-it-to-gaa-new-shels-boss-damien-duff-41015274.html

It came across as Duff admiring the GAA for what they've done rather than criticising them. Don't think there's any need for the insults.

He's hardly pampered either, Duff was a brilliant footballer and I'd say growing up in Ireland he has played on some horrible surfaces with horrible facilities. To have endured the kickings he'd have got and all the rest of it deserves praise. God knows we haven't produced a player like him since.

I think he caught himself criticising Shels facilities and had to expand it out to deflect. And here you are talkimg about it.

There is no way the worst GAA facility is better than the best soccer one.

[Rossfan]

This pampered soccer pr**k finding out who the real dinosaurs are.
Maybe of players and CEOs weren't grabbing sp much money they might have better facilities.
Hopefully his kids go on to play fir Wicklow!

https://m.independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/league-of-ireland-facilities-horrific-when-you-compare-it-to-gaa-new-shels-boss-damien-duff-41015274.html

It came across as Duff admiring the GAA for what they've done rather than criticising them. Don't think there's any need for the insults.

He's hardly pampered either, Duff was a brilliant footballer and I'd say growing up in Ireland he has played on some horrible surfaces with horrible facilities. To have endured the kickings he'd have got and all the rest of it deserves praise. God knows we haven't produced a player like him since.

He was well paid for it too, probably getting twice an ICU nurse's annual salary per week.
Good to see him getting his eyes open after his disgraceful insults of the Cork Co Board.

[Saffronaldo]

This pampered soccer pr**k finding out who the real dinosaurs are.
Maybe of players and CEOs weren't grabbing sp much money they might have better facilities.
Hopefully his kids go on to play fir Wicklow!

https://m.independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/league-of-ireland-facilities-horrific-when-you-compare-it-to-gaa-new-shels-boss-damien-duff-41015274.html

It came across as Duff admiring the GAA for what they've done rather than criticising them. Don't think there's any need for the insults.

He's hardly pampered either, Duff was a brilliant footballer and I'd say growing up in Ireland he has played on some horrible surfaces with horrible facilities. To have endured the kickings he'd have got and all the rest of it deserves praise. God knows we haven't produced a player like him since.

He was well paid for it too, probably getting twice an ICU nurse's annual salary per week.
Good to see him getting his eyes open after his disgraceful insults of the Cork Co Board.

He earned what he was able to and what his employers were happy to pay him. Nurses being underpaid is not his fault any more than it's your own fault.

You seem a bit highly strung, not sure why you're getting so worked up about something so innocuous.

[Baile Brigín 2]

This pampered soccer pr**k finding out who the real dinosaurs are.
Maybe of players and CEOs weren't grabbing sp much money they might have better facilities.
Hopefully his kids go on to play fir Wicklow!

https://m.independent.ie/sport/soccer/league-of-ireland/league-of-ireland-facilities-horrific-when-you-compare-it-to-gaa-new-shels-boss-damien-duff-41015274.html

It came across as Duff admiring the GAA for what they've done rather than criticising them. Don't think there's any need for the insults.

He's hardly pampered either, Duff was a brilliant footballer and I'd say growing up in Ireland he has played on some horrible surfaces with horrible facilities. To have endured the kickings he'd have got and all the rest of it deserves praise. God knows we haven't produced a player like him since.

He was well paid for it too, probably getting twice an ICU nurse's annual salary per week.
Good to see him getting his eyes open after his disgraceful insults of the Cork Co Board.

You need to read the actual quotes. He doubled down on his dinosaur comment - it helped embarrass them into helping etc.

He criticised Shels facilities, realised it and then said that the worst club GAA ground is better than the best soccer one.

[Silver hill]

It's very simple. At the higher levels of soccer in Ireland (throughout the 32) up to 90% of income from gate or sponsor/benefactor goes on chasing a piped dream via payment to players. It stands to reason then that facilitates will deteriorate with zero investment.
Compare that to the GAA model, whereby there is only really an outside management fee to cover for some clubs and factor in the love of place that the GAA is built around. A smallish club might raise 100k in a raffle or corporate dinner; soccer just does not have that culture of volunteerism, where members will walk the highways and byways knocking doors and selling tickets. Add in members providing professional services for free or below cost combined with a professional approach to seeking and obtaining grants and you can see how facilities in Gaa are built.
Local sponsorship is also more freely available as the sponsor can see on the ground, the work and investment going on for minimal personal return for the members.
For me though, the greatest single factor contributing to the quality of Gaa facilities at present is tribal jealousy.
As Patrick Kavanagh once famously said, 'why is it, that all the greatest bastards in the world, are born in the next parish'😂
If then hoots are building a covered 4g with underfloor heating then be god, ours will be 5G

[Baile Brigín 2]

It's very simple. At the higher levels of soccer in Ireland (throughout the 32) up to 90% of income from gate or sponsor/benefactor goes on chasing a piped dream via payment to players. It stands to reason then that facilitates will deteriorate with zero investment.
Compare that to the GAA model, whereby there is only really an outside management fee to cover for some clubs and factor in the love of place that the GAA is built around. A smallish club might raise 100k in a raffle or corporate dinner; soccer just does not have that culture of volunteerism, where members will walk the highways and byways knocking doors and selling tickets. Add in members providing professional services for free or below cost combined with a professional approach to seeking and obtaining grants and you can see how facilities in Gaa are built.
Local sponsorship is also more freely available as the sponsor can see on the ground, the work and investment going on for minimal personal return for the members.
For me though, the greatest single factor contributing to the quality of Gaa facilities at present is tribal jealousy.
As Patrick Kavanagh once famously said, 'why is it, that all the greatest bastards in the world, are born in the next parish'😂
If then hoots are building a covered 4g with underfloor heating then be god, ours will be 5G

Patronising bullshit. No culture of volunteerism in soccer?

65% of revenue can go on wages. Thats there years and thats 20 clubs out of 6,000 in the 26.

Some GAA clubs are superb with top facilities. Same with soccer. Some are shite. Same with soccer. Some are well run. Some are a shambles.

There are two differences. One. Many multiples of soccer clubs than GAA ones. They need to share facilities or even merge. Two. The GAA got 100% of all sports grants until about 20 years ago. There was a tax on rugby and soccer tickets ringfenced for the GAA until the 60's. It's a blind spot for too many to appreciate just how much more help the GAA got from successive governments.

Or put another way. What Presidential candidate could soccer clubs bung 5k to to guarantee their grant was accepted? The playing field is not level, never has been.

They have their problems, but volunteerism isn't one of them.

[thewobbler]

It's very simple. At the higher levels of soccer in Ireland (throughout the 32) up to 90% of income from gate or sponsor/benefactor goes on chasing a piped dream via payment to players. It stands to reason then that facilitates will deteriorate with zero investment.
Compare that to the GAA model, whereby there is only really an outside management fee to cover for some clubs and factor in the love of place that the GAA is built around. A smallish club might raise 100k in a raffle or corporate dinner; soccer just does not have that culture of volunteerism, where members will walk the highways and byways knocking doors and selling tickets. Add in members providing professional services for free or below cost combined with a professional approach to seeking and obtaining grants and you can see how facilities in Gaa are built.
Local sponsorship is also more freely available as the sponsor can see on the ground, the work and investment going on for minimal personal return for the members.
For me though, the greatest single factor contributing to the quality of Gaa facilities at present is tribal jealousy.
As Patrick Kavanagh once famously said, 'why is it, that all the greatest bastards in the world, are born in the next parish'😂
If then hoots are building a covered 4g with underfloor heating then be god, ours will be 5G

Patronising bullshit. No culture of volunteerism in soccer?

65% of revenue can go on wages. Thats there years and thats 20 clubs out of 6,000 in the 26.

Some GAA clubs are superb with top facilities. Same with soccer. Some are shite. Same with soccer. Some are well run. Some are a shambles.

There are two differences. One. Many multiples of soccer clubs than GAA ones. They need to share facilities or even merge. Two. The GAA got 100% of all sports grants until about 20 years ago. There was a tax on rugby and soccer tickets ringfenced for the GAA until the 60's. It's a blind spot for too many to appreciate just how much more help the GAA got from successive governments.

Or put another way. What Presidential candidate could soccer clubs bung 5k to to guarantee their grant was accepted? The playing field is not level, never has been.

They have their problems, but volunteerism isn't one of them.

The quality and frequency of GAA facilities in the six counties really should help you understand that no matter how much you want to believe something, you aren't entitled to your own "facts".

[Rossfan]

He's just being his usual "Gah bad soccer good" self.