NFL Division 1 2024

Started by Blowitupref, January 16, 2023, 08:23:27 PM

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tallorder

I am not mad about penalties personally - think about the Dublin/Meath saga 1991, there would only have been 1 game if penalties in situ.
But in a chaotic fixtures system it is probably the only answer.

Maybe penalties after the 3rd replay?  ;D

lurganblue

Quote from: gallsman on April 03, 2024, 03:09:28 PM
Quote from: lurganblue on April 03, 2024, 02:58:40 PMToss a coin to decide direction of play. Youve played a whole match with that ref, deal with it.

You've had a whole match and extra time with the opposition team and that ref. Why should you keep playing?
for a golden score

seafoid

Quote from: marty34 on April 02, 2024, 08:44:47 PM
Quote from: seafoid on April 02, 2024, 08:33:58 PM
Quote from: HiMucker on April 02, 2024, 05:19:50 PM
Quote from: seafoid on April 02, 2024, 04:16:08 PM
Quote from: Derryman forever on April 02, 2024, 04:11:10 PM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on April 02, 2024, 04:03:52 PMIf they do win the ulster 1st seed. They be destined to met Dublin in a semi if they top the group qualifiers and win their quarter final. If they lost in Ulster and did draw in Kerry Dublin section in the qualifiers they might be better placed to avoid Dublin to the final If they managed to progress that far, food for thought.
My thoughts:
You might be able to manage to lose a game here or there.
But that will only make the management of winning them more problematic.
Try to win every game and you will lose the unwinnable  anyway
Trying to win every game isn't necessarily the best approach in the new system
There is a not a single team that won't be trying to win every single championship match they are involved in. This talk around peaking at the right time is getting a bit mental. It's far more to do with training load than matches. If it's impact injuries you are worried about, you are nearly as likely to sustain them in training as a match, given the intensity teams be going at it in training.
That is incorrect, hi.
Amateur teams cannot go at full tilt from now until the Hogan steps. There is no recovery time. Padraic Joyce said on RTE that a team playing pre season and ending up in the all Ireland final would play 18 matches in around 25 weeks.

Explain to me recovery time.
Players are more likely to get injured. When they do , they are less likely to recover in time for whenever they are needed. Last year teams playing the preliminary qf played 3 weekends out 4.
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

seafoid

Quote from: imtommygunn on April 02, 2024, 08:51:15 PM
Quote from: seafoid on April 02, 2024, 08:33:58 PM
Quote from: HiMucker on April 02, 2024, 05:19:50 PM
Quote from: seafoid on April 02, 2024, 04:16:08 PM
Quote from: Derryman forever on April 02, 2024, 04:11:10 PM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on April 02, 2024, 04:03:52 PMIf they do win the ulster 1st seed. They be destined to met Dublin in a semi if they top the group qualifiers and win their quarter final. If they lost in Ulster and did draw in Kerry Dublin section in the qualifiers they might be better placed to avoid Dublin to the final If they managed to progress that far, food for thought.
My thoughts:
You might be able to manage to lose a game here or there.
But that will only make the management of winning them more problematic.
Try to win every game and you will lose the unwinnable  anyway
Trying to win every game isn't necessarily the best approach in the new system
There is a not a single team that won't be trying to win every single championship match they are involved in. This talk around peaking at the right time is getting a bit mental. It's far more to do with training load than matches. If it's impact injuries you are worried about, you are nearly as likely to sustain them in training as a match, given the intensity teams be going at it in training.
That is incorrect, hi.
Amateur teams cannot go at full tilt from now until the Hogan steps. There is no recovery time. Padraic Joyce said on RTE that a team playing pre season and ending up in the all Ireland final would play 18 matches in around 25 weeks.

It is far from incorrect. Do you think any team will go out to lose a game? Teams may be at different points in their training cycle and able to peak at different times. Better teams, or teams with more fortuitous draws, will aim to peak later as they know they'll be there whereas teams who will be scrapping from the start will have to peak as early as possible.
There are 5 Ulster teams between NFL Division 1 and the top 2 in divison 2.
Only one can win ulster. The others will have no control over which round robin group they end up in. They may end up in a preliminary qf and have to play a few weekends in a row. Round Robin Group winners get a break between the last group game and the quarter final. 3 out of 4 Round Robin group winners won their qf last year. Armagh were beaten on penalties.
"f**k it, just score"- Donaghy   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbxG2WwVRjU

tbrick18

Quote from: lurganblue on April 03, 2024, 02:58:40 PM
Quote from: tbrick18 on April 03, 2024, 02:52:11 PM
Quote from: Taylor on April 03, 2024, 02:19:20 PM
Quote from: lurganblue on April 03, 2024, 11:59:31 AMI'd be an advocate of playing a period of extra time and then if it is a draw, restart on a golden score. I realise that this would bring issues in terms of "soft" frees and the players are completely wrecked... but I really hate penalties  ;D

Wouldnt be much fun trying to get a golden score if you are playing into a gale force wind

Or with an inconsistent referee who blows a free incorrectly and the game is lost based on that.
Penalties have much less risk of allowing other factors influence the result.

And is a golden score (goal) not something that used to exist in soccer? Surely we wouldn't be going down the soccer road!  ;D

Toss a coin to decide direction of play. Youve played a whole match with that ref, deal with it.

You've played a whole match with a ref, weather conditions, injuries etc and neither one of you could win.
Penalties to decide it - deal with it.

Truthsayer

#4175
Quote from: tonto1888 on April 03, 2024, 02:41:31 PM
Quote from: Truthsayer on April 03, 2024, 02:28:26 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on April 03, 2024, 12:20:42 PM
Quote from: Truthsayer on April 03, 2024, 10:28:03 AMThey killed the golden goose with too many games in too short a time. Rem 2005 Tyrone replay against Down in the Marshes great game especially if you were a Down supporter! 2003 brilliant Ulster final went to a replay, Dublin-Meath epic 4 games in '91. Penalties are an aberration on Gaelic games, apeing soccer. People went to the replays.

The Tyrone- Armagh first game in 2005 got 60k.
The replay got 30k in a nearly two thirds empty Croke Park.
People did not go to the replays in anywhere near the same numbers.
Only 30,000! That's quite a crowd. Would have filled Clones rightly for an Ulster final replay.

or 50% of people who went to the original didnt go to the replay. Not a good stat
50% is not a good stat if there were 30,000 at the first game! Lies, damn lies and statistics!

armaghniac

Quote from: Truthsayer on April 03, 2024, 04:58:10 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on April 03, 2024, 02:41:31 PM
Quote from: Truthsayer on April 03, 2024, 02:28:26 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on April 03, 2024, 12:20:42 PM
Quote from: Truthsayer on April 03, 2024, 10:28:03 AMThey killed the golden goose with too many games in too short a time. Rem 2005 Tyrone replay against Down in the Marshes great game especially if you were a Down supporter! 2003 brilliant Ulster final went to a replay, Dublin-Meath epic 4 games in '91. Penalties are an aberration on Gaelic games, apeing soccer. People went to the replays.

The Tyrone- Armagh first game in 2005 got 60k.
The replay got 30k in a nearly two thirds empty Croke Park.
People did not go to the replays in anywhere near the same numbers.
Only 30,000! That's quite a crowd. Would have filled Clones rightly for an Ulster final replay.

or 50% of people who went to the original didnt go to the replay. Not a good stat
50% not a good stat if there were 30,000 at the first game! Lies, damn lies and statistics!

The first game was on Sunday, the second on Saturday. The first had a minor game, the second did not.
If at first you don't succeed, then goto Plan B

tonto1888

Quote from: Truthsayer on April 03, 2024, 04:58:10 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on April 03, 2024, 02:41:31 PM
Quote from: Truthsayer on April 03, 2024, 02:28:26 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on April 03, 2024, 12:20:42 PM
Quote from: Truthsayer on April 03, 2024, 10:28:03 AMThey killed the golden goose with too many games in too short a time. Rem 2005 Tyrone replay against Down in the Marshes great game especially if you were a Down supporter! 2003 brilliant Ulster final went to a replay, Dublin-Meath epic 4 games in '91. Penalties are an aberration on Gaelic games, apeing soccer. People went to the replays.

The Tyrone- Armagh first game in 2005 got 60k.
The replay got 30k in a nearly two thirds empty Croke Park.
People did not go to the replays in anywhere near the same numbers.
Only 30,000! That's quite a crowd. Would have filled Clones rightly for an Ulster final replay.

or 50% of people who went to the original didnt go to the replay. Not a good stat
50% is not a good stat if there were 30,000 at the first game! Lies, damn lies and statistics!

50% is not a good stat when it means 30000 did not bother with the replay

yellowcard

Quote from: armaghniac on April 03, 2024, 05:07:56 PM
Quote from: Truthsayer on April 03, 2024, 04:58:10 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on April 03, 2024, 02:41:31 PM
Quote from: Truthsayer on April 03, 2024, 02:28:26 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on April 03, 2024, 12:20:42 PM
Quote from: Truthsayer on April 03, 2024, 10:28:03 AMThey killed the golden goose with too many games in too short a time. Rem 2005 Tyrone replay against Down in the Marshes great game especially if you were a Down supporter! 2003 brilliant Ulster final went to a replay, Dublin-Meath epic 4 games in '91. Penalties are an aberration on Gaelic games, apeing soccer. People went to the replays.

The Tyrone- Armagh first game in 2005 got 60k.
The replay got 30k in a nearly two thirds empty Croke Park.
People did not go to the replays in anywhere near the same numbers.
Only 30,000! That's quite a crowd. Would have filled Clones rightly for an Ulster final replay.

or 50% of people who went to the original didnt go to the replay. Not a good stat
50% not a good stat if there were 30,000 at the first game! Lies, damn lies and statistics!

The first game was on Sunday, the second on Saturday. The first had a minor game, the second did not.

Replays will not be coming back (certainly at least in the early rounds of championship) so its probably pointless trying to make an argument for them based on nostalgia. We are going back to an era when you might only have 2 championship games per year and there was at least some kind of an appetite for replays in certain quarters. This is no longer the case and there is nothing as anti climactic as a draw in a big championship match knowing that you may have to expend the same time and incur the same expense one week later if you want to watch the same two teams again.   

thebigfullforward

Quote from: Hound on March 31, 2024, 05:43:17 PMKey moment, bar the very soft penalty, was the Derry lad going for goal from a tight enough angle instead of tapping over and putting them in a probable unassailable 4 point lead.
Agreed. Hear the likes of James O'Donaghue saying if the goals on you have to go for it. No you dont and thats an example of why. Goes for goal from a silly angle instead of taking the simple point and putting Derry 4 points clear. He's only young and he had a brilliant game so hopefully he'll learn

statto

Quote from: armaghniac on April 03, 2024, 05:07:56 PM
Quote from: Truthsayer on April 03, 2024, 04:58:10 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on April 03, 2024, 02:41:31 PM
Quote from: Truthsayer on April 03, 2024, 02:28:26 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on April 03, 2024, 12:20:42 PM
Quote from: Truthsayer on April 03, 2024, 10:28:03 AMThey killed the golden goose with too many games in too short a time. Rem 2005 Tyrone replay against Down in the Marshes great game especially if you were a Down supporter! 2003 brilliant Ulster final went to a replay, Dublin-Meath epic 4 games in '91. Penalties are an aberration on Gaelic games, apeing soccer. People went to the replays.

The Tyrone- Armagh first game in 2005 got 60k.
The replay got 30k in a nearly two thirds empty Croke Park.
People did not go to the replays in anywhere near the same numbers.
Only 30,000! That's quite a crowd. Would have filled Clones rightly for an Ulster final replay.

or 50% of people who went to the original didnt go to the replay. Not a good stat
50% not a good stat if there were 30,000 at the first game! Lies, damn lies and statistics!

The first game was on Sunday, the second on Saturday. The first had a minor game, the second did not.
Don't think minor game would have much of a
Quote from: yellowcard on April 04, 2024, 08:54:11 AM
Quote from: armaghniac on April 03, 2024, 05:07:56 PM
Quote from: Truthsayer on April 03, 2024, 04:58:10 PM
Quote from: tonto1888 on April 03, 2024, 02:41:31 PM
Quote from: Truthsayer on April 03, 2024, 02:28:26 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on April 03, 2024, 12:20:42 PM
Quote from: Truthsayer on April 03, 2024, 10:28:03 AMThey killed the golden goose with too many games in too short a time. Rem 2005 Tyrone replay against Down in the Marshes great game especially if you were a Down supporter! 2003 brilliant Ulster final went to a replay, Dublin-Meath epic 4 games in '91. Penalties are an aberration on Gaelic games, apeing soccer. People went to the replays.

The Tyrone- Armagh first game in 2005 got 60k.
The replay got 30k in a nearly two thirds empty Croke Park.
People did not go to the replays in anywhere near the same numbers.
Only 30,000! That's quite a crowd. Would have filled Clones rightly for an Ulster final replay.

or 50% of people who went to the original didnt go to the replay. Not a good stat
50% not a good stat if there were 30,000 at the first game! Lies, damn lies and statistics!

The first game was on Sunday, the second on Saturday. The first had a minor game, the second did not.
The minor game wouldn't have had much of an impact on the attendance surely.

Replays will not be coming back (certainly at least in the early rounds of championship) so its probably pointless trying to make an argument for them based on nostalgia. We are going back to an era when you might only have 2 championship games per year and there was at least some kind of an appetite for replays in certain quarters. This is no longer the case and there is nothing as anti climactic as a draw in a big championship match knowing that you may have to expend the same time and incur the same expense one week later if you want to watch the same two teams again.   
Very relevant point would say possibly replays at semi final/final stage if at all. 

JoG2

Quote from: thebigfullforward on April 04, 2024, 08:59:41 AM
Quote from: Hound on March 31, 2024, 05:43:17 PMKey moment, bar the very soft penalty, was the Derry lad going for goal from a tight enough angle instead of tapping over and putting them in a probable unassailable 4 point lead.
Agreed. Hear the likes of James O'Donaghue saying if the goals on you have to go for it. No you dont and thats an example of why. Goes for goal from a silly angle instead of taking the simple point and putting Derry 4 points clear. He's only young and he had a brilliant game so hopefully he'll learn

Ryan O'Toole v Tyrone, went for the jugular and won the game for his county at the death. That's the kind of fearless risk we want to see more of?

Mario

Quote from: JoG2 on April 04, 2024, 11:33:30 AM
Quote from: thebigfullforward on April 04, 2024, 08:59:41 AM
Quote from: Hound on March 31, 2024, 05:43:17 PMKey moment, bar the very soft penalty, was the Derry lad going for goal from a tight enough angle instead of tapping over and putting them in a probable unassailable 4 point lead.
Agreed. Hear the likes of James O'Donaghue saying if the goals on you have to go for it. No you dont and thats an example of why. Goes for goal from a silly angle instead of taking the simple point and putting Derry 4 points clear. He's only young and he had a brilliant game so hopefully he'll learn

Ryan O'Toole v Tyrone, went for the jugular and won the game for his county at the death. That's the kind of fearless risk we want to see more of?
Not really comparable. Monaghan needed the goal as they were behind. Derry did not.

tonto1888

Quote from: Mario on April 04, 2024, 11:51:38 AM
Quote from: JoG2 on April 04, 2024, 11:33:30 AM
Quote from: thebigfullforward on April 04, 2024, 08:59:41 AM
Quote from: Hound on March 31, 2024, 05:43:17 PMKey moment, bar the very soft penalty, was the Derry lad going for goal from a tight enough angle instead of tapping over and putting them in a probable unassailable 4 point lead.
Agreed. Hear the likes of James O'Donaghue saying if the goals on you have to go for it. No you dont and thats an example of why. Goes for goal from a silly angle instead of taking the simple point and putting Derry 4 points clear. He's only young and he had a brilliant game so hopefully he'll learn

Ryan O'Toole v Tyrone, went for the jugular and won the game for his county at the death. That's the kind of fearless risk we want to see more of?
Not really comparable. Monaghan needed the goal as they were behind. Derry did not.

Jarly Og Burns in the Ulster final last year is an example. Goal was on and he took the easy option of a point. I knew at that stage we wouldnt win

lurganblue

Quote from: tonto1888 on April 04, 2024, 12:23:51 PM
Quote from: Mario on April 04, 2024, 11:51:38 AM
Quote from: JoG2 on April 04, 2024, 11:33:30 AM
Quote from: thebigfullforward on April 04, 2024, 08:59:41 AM
Quote from: Hound on March 31, 2024, 05:43:17 PMKey moment, bar the very soft penalty, was the Derry lad going for goal from a tight enough angle instead of tapping over and putting them in a probable unassailable 4 point lead.
Agreed. Hear the likes of James O'Donaghue saying if the goals on you have to go for it. No you dont and thats an example of why. Goes for goal from a silly angle instead of taking the simple point and putting Derry 4 points clear. He's only young and he had a brilliant game so hopefully he'll learn

Ryan O'Toole v Tyrone, went for the jugular and won the game for his county at the death. That's the kind of fearless risk we want to see more of?
Not really comparable. Monaghan needed the goal as they were behind. Derry did not.

Jarly Og Burns in the Ulster final last year is an example. Goal was on and he took the easy option of a point. I knew at that stage we wouldnt win

100%.

That wasn't even a difficult angle.