China Coronavirus

[lenny]

Come on trueblue ......a drug which has data going back 40 years showing it is extremely safe was not worth trying (just to see given the lack of risk) when people are dying in IC wards? In war setting which it was ... this is exactly what should have happened.

Why would they when there was little evidence to say it was effective? We obviously differ in views but I see no reason why they would have started widespread delivery of ivermectin. You don't start prescribing a drug across the board without strong evidence of success. I don't understand how you don't get that.

It cracks me up the way these people cried bloody murder about an "untested vaccine" yet wanted to give ivermectin to the whole population!

Utter gobshites

Because there would have been little or no risk as the drug itself has been in use since the mid 80s and is known to be very safe, therefore worth a go. As opposed to new drugs costing billions and which the efficacy is not certain nor are all the side effects known. It should have been a matter of personal choice. If you are aged, frightened, obese(even a little), on the diabetic/metabolic spectrum you should probably take a punt on the new stuff and whatever else you can do to improve your lot for that matter.

The efficacy of the vaccine was proven. Some don't want to accept that, but the facts are out there. Ivermercim had nothing like the same success rates in any trials to date.

A very recent and major study has just been published in medical journals which shows that ivermectin was associated with higher mortality than not getting ivermectin ie it was worse than useless. That's why listening to non medical people isn't very smart but listening to experts is sensible.

[J70]

Come on trueblue ......a drug which has data going back 40 years showing it is extremely safe was not worth trying (just to see given the lack of risk) when people are dying in IC wards? In war setting which it was ... this is exactly what should have happened.

Why would they when there was little evidence to say it was effective? We obviously differ in views but I see no reason why they would have started widespread delivery of ivermectin. You don't start prescribing a drug across the board without strong evidence of success. I don't understand how you don't get that.

It cracks me up the way these people cried bloody murder about an "untested vaccine" yet wanted to give ivermectin to the whole population!

Utter gobshites

Because there would have been little or no risk as the drug itself has been in use since the mid 80s and is known to be very safe, therefore worth a go. As opposed to new drugs costing billions and which the efficacy is not certain nor are all the side effects known. It should have been a matter of personal choice. If you are aged, frightened, obese(even a little), on the diabetic/metabolic spectrum you should probably take a punt on the new stuff and whatever else you can do to improve your lot for that matter.

The efficacy of the vaccine was proven. Some don't want to accept that, but the facts are out there. Ivermercim had nothing like the same success rates in any trials to date.

A very recent and major study has just been published in medical journals which shows that ivermectin was associated with higher mortality than not getting ivermectin ie it was worse than useless. That's why listening to non medical people isn't very smart but listening to experts is sensible.

It mind boggling that this is even up for "debate".

[imtommygunn]

It's how the world has become - pick a topic any topic from climate change to vaccines to ukraine / russia war to god knows what next 

[Last Man]

Yet the general population has never been so obese and metabolically unhealthy. Levels of chronic disease are at unprecedented levels. Go figure, but you boys keep listening to the good doctors and experts. If you still can't fit in the same size jeans when you were 18 then you are not putting your best foot forward. No doubt you've been following all the guidelines, doesn't make any sense does it. Getting old plus fat is not a just a fact of life.

[PadraicHenryPearse]

Yet the general population has never been so obese and metabolically unhealthy. Levels of chronic disease are at unprecedented levels. Go figure, but you boys keep listening to the good doctors and experts. If you still can't fit in the same size jeans when you were 18 then you are not putting your best foot forward. No doubt you've been following all the guidelines, doesn't make any sense does it. Getting old plus fat is not a just a fact of life.

the doctors i listen too are smarter than doctors you listen too...

[J70]

Yet the general population has never been so obese and metabolically unhealthy. Levels of chronic disease are at unprecedented levels. Go figure, but you boys keep listening to the good doctors and experts. If you still can't fit in the same size jeans when you were 18 then you are not putting your best foot forward. No doubt you've been following all the guidelines, doesn't make any sense does it. Getting old plus fat is not a just a fact of life.

Has anyone said that doctors and experts know "everything"?

Science, medical or otherwise, is about the knowledge that's accumulated to that point in time. Everything is up for correction and fine tuning as more data is accumulated.

Yet, they still know a lot more than the layperson on their chosen field. Which is the point. Whether what they're advocating turns out to be ultimately incomplete or actually wrong, it is still based on data and analysis. What is the "common sense" approach based on?

And things like public policy on food and so on are not just a function of public health science, unfortunately.

[grounded]

Come on trueblue ......a drug which has data going back 40 years showing it is extremely safe was not worth trying (just to see given the lack of risk) when people are dying in IC wards? In war setting which it was ... this is exactly what should have happened.

Why would they when there was little evidence to say it was effective? We obviously differ in views but I see no reason why they would have started widespread delivery of ivermectin. You don't start prescribing a drug across the board without strong evidence of success. I don't understand how you don't get that.

It cracks me up the way these people cried bloody murder about an "untested vaccine" yet wanted to give ivermectin to the whole population!

Utter gobshites

Because there would have been little or no risk as the drug itself has been in use since the mid 80s and is known to be very safe, therefore worth a go. As opposed to new drugs costing billions and which the efficacy is not certain nor are all the side effects known. It should have been a matter of personal choice. If you are aged, frightened, obese(even a little), on the diabetic/metabolic spectrum you should probably take a punt on the new stuff and whatever else you can do to improve your lot for that matter.

The efficacy of the vaccine was proven. Some don't want to accept that, but the facts are out there. Ivermercim had nothing like the same success rates in any trials to date.

A very recent and major study has just been published in medical journals which shows that ivermectin was associated with higher mortality than not getting ivermectin ie it was worse than useless. That's why listening to non medical people isn't very smart but listening to experts is sensible.

There is a whole host of studies of Ivermectin and Covid 19 treatments both for and against.
    I would wait for the findings of the NHS backed Oxford University Principle Trial, before making any definitive conclusions on its use in relation to Covid 19 treatment. I'm not advocating its use btw, but as you say, wait for the expert's opinion after this trial is complete.

https://www.principletrial.org/news

[Last Man]

Yet the general population has never been so obese and metabolically unhealthy. Levels of chronic disease are at unprecedented levels. Go figure, but you boys keep listening to the good doctors and experts. If you still can't fit in the same size jeans when you were 18 then you are not putting your best foot forward. No doubt you've been following all the guidelines, doesn't make any sense does it. Getting old plus fat is not a just a fact of life.

the doctors i listen too are smarter than doctors you listen too...

[Last Man]

Yet the general population has never been so obese and metabolically unhealthy. Levels of chronic disease are at unprecedented levels. Go figure, but you boys keep listening to the good doctors and experts. If you still can't fit in the same size jeans when you were 18 then you are not putting your best foot forward. No doubt you've been following all the guidelines, doesn't make any sense does it. Getting old plus fat is not a just a fact of life.

Has anyone said that doctors and experts know "everything"?

Science, medical or otherwise, is about the knowledge that's accumulated to that point in time. Everything is up for correction and fine tuning as more data is accumulated.

Yet, they still know a lot more than the layperson on their chosen field. Which is the point. Whether what they're advocating turns out to be ultimately incomplete or actually wrong, it is still based on data and analysis. What is the "common sense" approach based on?

And things like public policy on food and so on are not just a function of public health science, unfortunately.

Turns out that the data and analysis bit is not really on point, unfortunately it's like turning a supertanker to get many of these people to change tack. But hey if you are happy with the current standard full your boots.

[Gmac]

Were doctors in Ireland paid per patient for vaccinations ?

[From the Bunker]

Nobody could blame Doctors, Pharmacists and Nurses for the vaccine. They were only administrators of the vaccine. They knew little above the basics of what they are giving out. How could they know otherwise? Any Doctor who says otherwise is sort of bluffing. They had to be as the Pharmaceutical companies provided them with little detail as they had a confidentiality clause.

[Last Man]

Nobody could blame Doctors, Pharmacists and Nurses for the vaccine. They were only administrators of the vaccine. They knew little above the basics of what they are giving out. How could they know otherwise? Any Doctor who says otherwise is sort of bluffing. They had to be as the Pharmaceutical companies provided them with little detail as they had a confidentiality clause.

Any word of the rates of pay for the administrators. Will those accounts ever be published?

[From the Bunker]

Nobody could blame Doctors, Pharmacists and Nurses for the vaccine. They were only administrators of the vaccine. They knew little above the basics of what they are giving out. How could they know otherwise? Any Doctor who says otherwise is sort of bluffing. They had to be as the Pharmaceutical companies provided them with little detail as they had a confidentiality clause.

Any word of the rates of pay for the administrators. Will those accounts ever be published?

Of course they were on the gravy train. Nobody is going to look at those accounts, they were doing their Patriotic Duty with a handsome financial handshake.

[armaghniac]

Were doctors in Ireland paid per patient for vaccinations ?

In the 26 counties yes , they were also paid per patient for Covid cases.
Doctors did modest numbers of vaccinations, mainly people over 70.

[From the Bunker]

Were doctors in Ireland paid per patient for vaccinations ?

In the 26 counties yes , they were also paid per patient for Covid cases.
Doctors did modest numbers of vaccinations, mainly people over 70.

Yes, they modestly bombarded us in the south with text messages of their services.