FAI...New Manager Hunt continues

[imtommygunn]

or get over the first defender at corners.

[JPGJOHNNYG]

Yes, insane to suggest that Roy Keane was anything other than a highly skilled footballer. You don't spend a decade in the engine room of one of Europe's top clubs without outstanding technical ability.

Perhaps the poster means flair rather than skill.

Skill is a necessity, flair is a luxury.

I thought I was clear that I meant the type of footwork that is very unusual in an Irish footballer save for Best or Brady. Giles was a brilliant footballer, so was Keane, so was Whelan, so was McGrath. But had any of them the type of skills of a Dragan Stojković. That was more than flair. Doesn't seem to come naturally to Irish players. Keane didn't have that level of class nor Giles, Whelan, etc. Of course, had other great qualities.


https://youtu.be/Is-wcs6zM8I?si=6-luYVNDf-q0qg4_

Be careful of those youtube highlights reels. Lee trundle has a load of them. You watch them and think he is better than Messi yet spent most of his career in the lower leagues

[seafoid]

GAA is a good framework in which to analyse Irish soccer. Some GAA teams have very long cycles.  Antrim hurlers reach the all Ireland final once every 60 years. Leitrim footballers win Connacht once every 50 years. Irish soccer is on a similar cycle.

[Sportacus]

GAA is a good framework in which to analyse Irish soccer. Some GAA teams have very long cycles.  Antrim hurlers reach the all Ireland final once every 60 years. Leitrim footballers win Connacht once every 50 years. Irish soccer is on a similar cycle.

The normal cycles have probably been upended by the money in the Premier League. In the Charlton years the team were almost all playing for United, Liverpool, Arsenal, Everton etc.  Nowadays those teams are all buying in instant success and we're left with a squad of second tier players. That will surely extend the doldrum and it's hard to see what will break it unless we just get lucky with another half doze exceptions like Ferguson, highly unlikely.

[weareros]

Yes, insane to suggest that Roy Keane was anything other than a highly skilled footballer. You don't spend a decade in the engine room of one of Europe's top clubs without outstanding technical ability.

Perhaps the poster means flair rather than skill.

Skill is a necessity, flair is a luxury.

I thought I was clear that I meant the type of footwork that is very unusual in an Irish footballer save for Best or Brady. Giles was a brilliant footballer, so was Keane, so was Whelan, so was McGrath. But had any of them the type of skills of a Dragan Stojković. That was more than flair. Doesn't seem to come naturally to Irish players. Keane didn't have that level of class nor Giles, Whelan, etc. Of course, had other great qualities.


https://youtu.be/Is-wcs6zM8I?si=6-luYVNDf-q0qg4_

Be careful of those youtube highlights reels. Lee trundle has a load of them. You watch them and think he is better than Messi yet spent most of his career in the lower leagues

I picked him because he was one of many technically gifted players on Red Star Belgrade, and Yugoslavia team that were kicked out of Euro 92. Brilliant in 1990 WC, he scored 2 to knock Spain out in last 16 and unfortunate to go out on pens to Argentina. The team that came second in their qualifying group Denmark went on to win Euro 92. Definitely not a Lee Trundle. Manager now, he's taken Serbia to their first Euros as an independent nation.

[seafoid]

GAA is a good framework in which to analyse Irish soccer. Some GAA teams have very long cycles.  Antrim hurlers reach the all Ireland final once every 60 years. Leitrim footballers win Connacht once every 50 years. Irish soccer is on a similar cycle.

The normal cycles have probably been upended by the money in the Premier League. In the Charlton years the team were almost all playing for United, Liverpool, Arsenal, Everton etc.  Nowadays those teams are all buying in instant success and we're left with a squad of second tier players. That will surely extend the doldrum and it's hard to see what will break it unless we just get lucky with another half doze exceptions like Ferguson, highly unlikely.

it is linked to the economic system. The richest 1% control 50% of all money and have control of soccer.  Player prices are insane. Success is bought. Players are trawled all over the world.  Irish players cannot compete. But nothing lasts forever.

[mouview]

Do Irish people really make good soccer players. We rarely produce a player at international level standard that can leave a player dead with skill. Liam Brady and Damien Duff are the only two that come to mind, and Georgie Best who was on another level. A Roy Keane was a great player but very limited skill wise. When it comes to nimbleness and skill, as a race we are great at the fiddle, tin whistle, bodhrán, Uileann pipe, guitar, boxing, plastering and the pen. We seem to have been overly blessed with movement in the elbow, fists and fingers, but useless with the feet. Even Irish dancers look very stiff compared to the Latins and the few lads who venture out onto the floorboards and get too ambitious are in danger of tripping over themselves. Our best chance is immigrants adding to our gene pool. We are seeing that in Athletics and the beginnings of that in soccer. There's hope yet.

I made a similar point to that here some time ago. For some reason, maybe it's just not in our DNA, but we don't produce players with much flair or creativity. We've never played any kind of winning or even 'attractive' soccer, not even in that most overrated era of Irish sport, the time of Big Jack. Maybe Eoin Hand's grossly unlucky 1982 WC qualifying campaign was as good as I remember us getting. All the home nations are variations on a theme; bar 1966, they all get found out sooner or later in tournament football. Maybe it's a Celt/ Anglo-Saxon failing of some sort.

And yes, Keane was a very effective player, but very ordinary skill and ability wise. You wouldn't confuse him with Liam Brady, much less a Messi or Ronaldo.

[imtommygunn]

How many do England even produce though? Realistically that is where our best players are learning their trade. I think they produce solid players but not many in terms of flair either. They compete at a higher level yes but if they don't we don't have that much chance.

[rodney trotter]

England have lots of flair players, Maddison,Foden,Saka Bellingham,Grealish.
They are held back by a conservative manager in Southgate.

[Captain Obvious]

How many do England even produce though? Realistically that is where our best players are learning their trade. I think they produce solid players but not many in terms of flair either. They compete at a higher level yes but if they don't we don't have that much chance.

Not many over the last few decades if you happen to have the view Roy Keane was very ordinary in the terms of skill and ability wise.

[manfromdelmonte]

Kids don't play sport in most schools at break time

Never mind play sports out in the street or estate green areas

Everything is now organized for them by adults, whereas they learned more from impromptu 2 v 2 or 3 v 3 games

[An Watcher]

Sad state of affairs.  I remember kicking football constantly.  First to 20 and once that ended, straight into another game.  When we didn't have a ball it was a can or a stone or whatever.  God I'm getting old

[Armagh18]

Do Irish people really make good soccer players. We rarely produce a player at international level standard that can leave a player dead with skill. Liam Brady and Damien Duff are the only two that come to mind, and Georgie Best who was on another level. A Roy Keane was a great player but very limited skill wise. When it comes to nimbleness and skill, as a race we are great at the fiddle, tin whistle, bodhrán, Uileann pipe, guitar, boxing, plastering and the pen. We seem to have been overly blessed with movement in the elbow, fists and fingers, but useless with the feet. Even Irish dancers look very stiff compared to the Latins and the few lads who venture out onto the floorboards and get too ambitious are in danger of tripping over themselves. Our best chance is immigrants adding to our gene pool. We are seeing that in Athletics and the beginnings of that in soccer. There's hope yet.

I made a similar point to that here some time ago. For some reason, maybe it's just not in our DNA, but we don't produce players with much flair or creativity. We've never played any kind of winning or even 'attractive' soccer, not even in that most overrated era of Irish sport, the time of Big Jack. Maybe Eoin Hand's grossly unlucky 1982 WC qualifying campaign was as good as I remember us getting. All the home nations are variations on a theme; bar 1966, they all get found out sooner or later in tournament football. Maybe it's a Celt/ Anglo-Saxon failing of some sort.

And yes, Keane was a very effective player, but very ordinary skill and ability wise. You wouldn't confuse him with Liam Brady, much less a Messi or Ronaldo.

Roy Keane ordinary. Come on now. One of the best ever to do it.

[imtommygunn]

How many do England even produce though? Realistically that is where our best players are learning their trade. I think they produce solid players but not many in terms of flair either. They compete at a higher level yes but if they don't we don't have that much chance.

Not many over the last few decades if you happen to have the view Roy Keane was very ordinary in the terms of skill and ability wise.

Yeah tbh thinking Keane is ordinary is ridiculous.

Flair wise England had Gazza but duff near as good for flair as anything England have produced though he appears a tube now.

[rodney trotter]

Keane was very good but wouldn't be counted as a flair player who could dribble past 3 or 4 players. That wasn't his game.