All Ireland U21 football championship 2017

[ck]

Ignorant means making statements without knowing the facts. Exactly as you have done.
I hate defensive football and everything about it but was surprised to be entertained last night. The fact was that when Donegal attacked, by god they attacked. So did Derry in fairness.
Really looking firward to both semi finals.

[RedHandTom]

I was at the Ulster final the other night and the difference in the teams was less than people might think. Derry had an attacking tactic that almost worked but Donegal were better organised and every player seemed to know exactly what they had to do. Donegal most certainly are going to be tough to beat but knowing Ulster underage football over past few years I think we are the weakest province in this age group. Tyrone did test Donegal but no-one else has. Dublin will ask bigger questions of them.

[BluestackBoy]

Donegal style of football is absolute dung to watch. Its like a form of rugby league. Team moving up the field with ball in hand trying to break lines, recycling the ball, try to break the next line or force the opposition into giving away a cheap penalty. Yes, its getting them results but its horrid to watch and it forces teams they play against into a defensive system so they don't get caught on the break.

Bit of an ignorant statement this criostlinn. I watched the game on-line and thought Donegal were very attacking. They leave a lot of men up and attack with serious pace. Ok they get back but unlike the McGuinness era they get back rather than stay back. This u21 side is a very well organised unit but I can't see them having enough to stop the Dubs.

Ignorant. Really. I bow to your superior knowledge. I think its pretty obvious from the scoreline Donegal were attacking last night. I never said they weren't but its not true to say they leave a lot of men up

Sorry but I actually watched the game. Did you? Yes they get a lot of men back at times but at others I counted 5 men ahead of the ball. They seem to rotate their gameplan well.

Wow. 5 ahead of the ball. No way. They've really come on since I last saw them. Don't get me wrong. I know some people may enjoy this kinda thing. Sure the Irish rugby team could attract 82000 into croke park. It's just not my cup of tea. Doesn't mean my opinion is ignorant.

Fair enough, but what is silly is to brand something as "dung" just because it is "not my cup of tea" & that is when you haven't even watched them!!

I'm not a great fan of sean nos singing, badminton or gymnastics, not my cup of tea if you like, but that doesn't mean I have to slag them off.  Every man to his own.

[greatpoint]

Donegal style of football is absolute dung to watch. Its like a form of rugby league. Team moving up the field with ball in hand trying to break lines, recycling the ball, try to break the next line or force the opposition into giving away a cheap penalty. Yes, its getting them results but its horrid to watch and it forces teams they play against into a defensive system so they don't get caught on the break.

Bit of an ignorant statement this criostlinn. I watched the game on-line and thought Donegal were very attacking. They leave a lot of men up and attack with serious pace. Ok they get back but unlike the McGuinness era they get back rather than stay back. This u21 side is a very well organised unit but I can't see them having enough to stop the Dubs.

Ignorant. Really. I bow to your superior knowledge. I think its pretty obvious from the scoreline Donegal were attacking last night. I never said they weren't but its not true to say they leave a lot of men up

Sorry but I actually watched the game. Did you? Yes they get a lot of men back at times but at others I counted 5 men ahead of the ball. They seem to rotate their gameplan well.

Wow. 5 ahead of the ball. No way. They've really come on since I last saw them. Don't get me wrong. I know some people may enjoy this kinda thing. Sure the Irish rugby team could attract 82000 into croke park. It's just not my cup of tea. Doesn't mean my opinion is ignorant.

Astounding ignorance. You surely must be trying to wind people up?

[criostlinn]

No, I'm not on the wind up and I cant understand why you are getting so hot under the collar. Like you've never heard anyone suggest that Donegal play shite football before. Now you may find this hard to believe but there are actually people in Donegal that agree with me. Yes they are happy to endure this kind of football if it brings a sniff of success but lets be honest. This is a bastardised version of rugby. Sometimes we have high scoring rugby matches, sometimes defensive games, but  no matter what, if you arent into rugby you wont give a damn if a team puts up 50 points.

But there are people in Donegal and also people around the country (mainly Tyrone) who disagree with me and that's fine too. Different people get enjoyment from different things. I believe that rules should have been brought in a few years ago to change the game and stop it turning out like this. People in more powerful positions then me have decided to leave things as they are. And that's also fine, it is doesn't change my opinion and it doesn't make my opinion ignorant just because its not the same as yours

And for those who want to say these comments are ignorant because I didn't see last nights game. I'm basing my opinion on what I've seen the last couple of years but in particular the 2 times I've seen Donegal u21's this year and the 2 times I've seen Donegal seniors this year. I simply don't like this style of football and I don't like how the sport is turning out because of it. 

But I'm sure Declan Bonner or Rory Gallagher couldnt give two hoots about what I think and I suggest the sensitive souls on here have the same attitude and keep on enjoying it if its your things

[DuffleKing]

Donegal style of football is absolute dung to watch. Its like a form of rugby league. Team moving up the field with ball in hand trying to break lines, recycling the ball, try to break the next line or force the opposition into giving away a cheap penalty. Yes, its getting them results but its horrid to watch and it forces teams they play against into a defensive system so they don't get caught on the break.

Bit of an ignorant statement this criostlinn. I watched the game on-line and thought Donegal were very attacking. They leave a lot of men up and attack with serious pace. Ok they get back but unlike the McGuinness era they get back rather than stay back. This u21 side is a very well organised unit but I can't see them having enough to stop the Dubs.

They categorically do not "leave a lot of men up". Before anyone asks - I've seen them plenty. This is not a criticism in itself, just plain fact that they attack onto a single out and put forward in case anyone ever decided to kick the ball - which they don't.

[Il Bomber Destro]

No, I'm not on the wind up and I cant understand why you are getting so hot under the collar. Like you've never heard anyone suggest that Donegal play shite football before. Now you may find this hard to believe but there are actually people in Donegal that agree with me. Yes they are happy to endure this kind of football if it brings a sniff of success but lets be honest. This is a bastardised version of rugby. Sometimes we have high scoring rugby matches, sometimes defensive games, but  no matter what, if you arent into rugby you wont give a damn if a team puts up 50 points.

But there are people in Donegal and also people around the country (mainly Tyrone) who disagree with me and that's fine too. Different people get enjoyment from different things. I believe that rules should have been brought in a few years ago to change the game and stop it turning out like this. People in more powerful positions then me have decided to leave things as they are. And that's also fine, it is doesn't change my opinion and it doesn't make my opinion ignorant just because its not the same as yours

And for those who want to say these comments are ignorant because I didn't see last nights game. I'm basing my opinion on what I've seen the last couple of years but in particular the 2 times I've seen Donegal u21's this year and the 2 times I've seen Donegal seniors this year. I simply don't like this style of football and I don't like how the sport is turning out because of it. 

But I'm sure Declan Bonner or Rory Gallagher couldnt give two hoots about what I think and I suggest the sensitive souls on here have the same attitude and keep on enjoying it if its your things

For what it's worth, Mayo don't exactly use a lot of foot passing. They might be a bit more adventurous in leaving more attackers in the opposition half but they mainly rely on running the ball and fist passing. The key to their relative success in the past few years has been their physicality and athleticism. They only seem to have two players in their team who are comfortable with taking shots on with their weaker foot - Andy Moran and Lee Keegan.

So if you're wanting to come across as a purveyor of the game's skills and the way it should be played then look closer to home.

[From the Bunker]

No, I'm not on the wind up and I cant understand why you are getting so hot under the collar. Like you've never heard anyone suggest that Donegal play shite football before. Now you may find this hard to believe but there are actually people in Donegal that agree with me. Yes they are happy to endure this kind of football if it brings a sniff of success but lets be honest. This is a bastardised version of rugby. Sometimes we have high scoring rugby matches, sometimes defensive games, but  no matter what, if you arent into rugby you wont give a damn if a team puts up 50 points.

But there are people in Donegal and also people around the country (mainly Tyrone) who disagree with me and that's fine too. Different people get enjoyment from different things. I believe that rules should have been brought in a few years ago to change the game and stop it turning out like this. People in more powerful positions then me have decided to leave things as they are. And that's also fine, it is doesn't change my opinion and it doesn't make my opinion ignorant just because its not the same as yours

And for those who want to say these comments are ignorant because I didn't see last nights game. I'm basing my opinion on what I've seen the last couple of years but in particular the 2 times I've seen Donegal u21's this year and the 2 times I've seen Donegal seniors this year. I simply don't like this style of football and I don't like how the sport is turning out because of it. 

But I'm sure Declan Bonner or Rory Gallagher couldnt give two hoots about what I think and I suggest the sensitive souls on here have the same attitude and keep on enjoying it if its your things

For what it's worth, Mayo don't exactly use a lot of foot passing. They might be a bit more adventurous in leaving more attackers in the opposition half but they mainly rely on running the ball and fist passing. The key to their relative success in the past few years has been their physicality and athleticism. They only seem to have two players in their team who are comfortable with taking shots on with their weaker foot - Andy Moran and Lee Keegan.

So if you're wanting to come across as a purveyor of the game's skills and the way it should be played then look closer to home.

Mayo for this League campaign have been one of the Market leaders in the foot pass. Under Roachford last year Mayo were encouraged to foot pass more. The goal against Tyrone in the league was from foot passing the ball.

[Il Bomber Destro]

No, I'm not on the wind up and I cant understand why you are getting so hot under the collar. Like you've never heard anyone suggest that Donegal play shite football before. Now you may find this hard to believe but there are actually people in Donegal that agree with me. Yes they are happy to endure this kind of football if it brings a sniff of success but lets be honest. This is a bastardised version of rugby. Sometimes we have high scoring rugby matches, sometimes defensive games, but  no matter what, if you arent into rugby you wont give a damn if a team puts up 50 points.

But there are people in Donegal and also people around the country (mainly Tyrone) who disagree with me and that's fine too. Different people get enjoyment from different things. I believe that rules should have been brought in a few years ago to change the game and stop it turning out like this. People in more powerful positions then me have decided to leave things as they are. And that's also fine, it is doesn't change my opinion and it doesn't make my opinion ignorant just because its not the same as yours

And for those who want to say these comments are ignorant because I didn't see last nights game. I'm basing my opinion on what I've seen the last couple of years but in particular the 2 times I've seen Donegal u21's this year and the 2 times I've seen Donegal seniors this year. I simply don't like this style of football and I don't like how the sport is turning out because of it. 

But I'm sure Declan Bonner or Rory Gallagher couldnt give two hoots about what I think and I suggest the sensitive souls on here have the same attitude and keep on enjoying it if its your things

For what it's worth, Mayo don't exactly use a lot of foot passing. They might be a bit more adventurous in leaving more attackers in the opposition half but they mainly rely on running the ball and fist passing. The key to their relative success in the past few years has been their physicality and athleticism. They only seem to have two players in their team who are comfortable with taking shots on with their weaker foot - Andy Moran and Lee Keegan.

So if you're wanting to come across as a purveyor of the game's skills and the way it should be played then look closer to home.

Mayo for this League campaign have been one of the Market leaders in the foot pass. Under Roachford last year Mayo were encouraged to foot pass more. The goal against Tyrone in the league was from foot passing the ball.

Have you an actual quantifiable measure for that or is it a subjective opinion?

[From the Bunker]

No, I'm not on the wind up and I cant understand why you are getting so hot under the collar. Like you've never heard anyone suggest that Donegal play shite football before. Now you may find this hard to believe but there are actually people in Donegal that agree with me. Yes they are happy to endure this kind of football if it brings a sniff of success but lets be honest. This is a bastardised version of rugby. Sometimes we have high scoring rugby matches, sometimes defensive games, but  no matter what, if you arent into rugby you wont give a damn if a team puts up 50 points.

But there are people in Donegal and also people around the country (mainly Tyrone) who disagree with me and that's fine too. Different people get enjoyment from different things. I believe that rules should have been brought in a few years ago to change the game and stop it turning out like this. People in more powerful positions then me have decided to leave things as they are. And that's also fine, it is doesn't change my opinion and it doesn't make my opinion ignorant just because its not the same as yours

And for those who want to say these comments are ignorant because I didn't see last nights game. I'm basing my opinion on what I've seen the last couple of years but in particular the 2 times I've seen Donegal u21's this year and the 2 times I've seen Donegal seniors this year. I simply don't like this style of football and I don't like how the sport is turning out because of it. 

But I'm sure Declan Bonner or Rory Gallagher couldnt give two hoots about what I think and I suggest the sensitive souls on here have the same attitude and keep on enjoying it if its your things

For what it's worth, Mayo don't exactly use a lot of foot passing. They might be a bit more adventurous in leaving more attackers in the opposition half but they mainly rely on running the ball and fist passing. The key to their relative success in the past few years has been their physicality and athleticism. They only seem to have two players in their team who are comfortable with taking shots on with their weaker foot - Andy Moran and Lee Keegan.

So if you're wanting to come across as a purveyor of the game's skills and the way it should be played then look closer to home.

Mayo for this League campaign have been one of the Market leaders in the foot pass. Under Roachford last year Mayo were encouraged to foot pass more. The goal against Tyrone in the league was from foot passing the ball.

Have you an actual quantifiable measure for that or is it a subjective opinion?

Observation from all the games I have been at, there has been a lot (mountains of kick passes into Andy Moran). Also players like McLoughlin, Kirby, Boland, Nally, Durcan, Coen, Cillian are good foot Passers (kickers).

To our detriment we tried to play open foot passing game v Monahan and Cavan. They just set up the blanket and just picked us off!  It' was the right thing to do during the League. That's the time to find out what system tactics work for later on in the year. I think Management under-rated both teams to a degree, but hopefully the lessons learned can be used.

[Il Bomber Destro]

No, I'm not on the wind up and I cant understand why you are getting so hot under the collar. Like you've never heard anyone suggest that Donegal play shite football before. Now you may find this hard to believe but there are actually people in Donegal that agree with me. Yes they are happy to endure this kind of football if it brings a sniff of success but lets be honest. This is a bastardised version of rugby. Sometimes we have high scoring rugby matches, sometimes defensive games, but  no matter what, if you arent into rugby you wont give a damn if a team puts up 50 points.

But there are people in Donegal and also people around the country (mainly Tyrone) who disagree with me and that's fine too. Different people get enjoyment from different things. I believe that rules should have been brought in a few years ago to change the game and stop it turning out like this. People in more powerful positions then me have decided to leave things as they are. And that's also fine, it is doesn't change my opinion and it doesn't make my opinion ignorant just because its not the same as yours

And for those who want to say these comments are ignorant because I didn't see last nights game. I'm basing my opinion on what I've seen the last couple of years but in particular the 2 times I've seen Donegal u21's this year and the 2 times I've seen Donegal seniors this year. I simply don't like this style of football and I don't like how the sport is turning out because of it. 

But I'm sure Declan Bonner or Rory Gallagher couldnt give two hoots about what I think and I suggest the sensitive souls on here have the same attitude and keep on enjoying it if its your things

For what it's worth, Mayo don't exactly use a lot of foot passing. They might be a bit more adventurous in leaving more attackers in the opposition half but they mainly rely on running the ball and fist passing. The key to their relative success in the past few years has been their physicality and athleticism. They only seem to have two players in their team who are comfortable with taking shots on with their weaker foot - Andy Moran and Lee Keegan.

So if you're wanting to come across as a purveyor of the game's skills and the way it should be played then look closer to home.

Mayo for this League campaign have been one of the Market leaders in the foot pass. Under Roachford last year Mayo were encouraged to foot pass more. The goal against Tyrone in the league was from foot passing the ball.

Have you an actual quantifiable measure for that or is it a subjective opinion?

Observation from all the games I have been at, there has been a lot (mountains of kick passes into Andy Moran). Also players like McLoughlin, Kirby, Boland, Nally, Durcan, Coen, Cillian are good foot Passers (kickers).

To our detriment we tried to play open foot passing game v Monahan and Cavan. They just set up the blanket and just picked us off!  It' was the right thing to do during the League. That's the time to find out what system tactics work for later on in the year. I think Management under-rated both teams to a degree, but hopefully the lessons learned can be used.

Most teams will utilise kick passes when they're on but putting a ball into a place it's likely to come straight back at you. The thing that annoys me about the commentary around defensive styles and negative tactics in the game is that it consistently neglects the route cause - the negativity and athleticism of modern day players. Teams will use kick passing but only as much as those they play against allow them to do so.

Players are so much fitter, faster, stronger now. If you play your traditional six defenders, two midfielders and six forwards today you will be destroyed. Imagine trying to defend a guy like Aidan O'Shea running through the middle at momentum with that much space, it's a goal chance every time. A guy with momentum on the run who has speed, size and power is going to just run through. Defensive football is a necessity now for competitiveness and to be honest there is not much between the top sides in the way they play the game, they just do it to varying levels of their attack/defence balance.

It's unfortunate in many ways but that's just a product of the times, it's a product of all sports really. How wold someone like George Best get on in football today against a whack of African lads chasing him all over the pitch.

Give me the 2011 AI semi-final between Dublin and Donegal over the massacres like the Tyrone - Cavan replay last year or the 2015 Connacht final between Mayo and Sligo. That is the kind of thing that will happen when weaker teams go out and try and play open football against a stronger team.

Kind of deviated off point but the reason the game has gone the way it is has not been down to defensive football, defensive football is the reaction to the dominance of pace, power and size - it's the only way certain teams can keep themselves competitive. You look at some players today who would have been top class 10-15 years ago. I look at lads like McCurry and Bradley for us and the talent is there to see but they're really going to struggle due to their size whereas in the past they would have lit big games up. It's no surprise that the best forwards around now are 6ft+ strong lads who can win their own ball - think of the likes of Geaney, McManus, McBrearty, Quinlavin etc.

[Blowitupref]

No, I'm not on the wind up and I cant understand why you are getting so hot under the collar. Like you've never heard anyone suggest that Donegal play shite football before. Now you may find this hard to believe but there are actually people in Donegal that agree with me. Yes they are happy to endure this kind of football if it brings a sniff of success but lets be honest. This is a bastardised version of rugby. Sometimes we have high scoring rugby matches, sometimes defensive games, but  no matter what, if you arent into rugby you wont give a damn if a team puts up 50 points.

But there are people in Donegal and also people around the country (mainly Tyrone) who disagree with me and that's fine too. Different people get enjoyment from different things. I believe that rules should have been brought in a few years ago to change the game and stop it turning out like this. People in more powerful positions then me have decided to leave things as they are. And that's also fine, it is doesn't change my opinion and it doesn't make my opinion ignorant just because its not the same as yours

And for those who want to say these comments are ignorant because I didn't see last nights game. I'm basing my opinion on what I've seen the last couple of years but in particular the 2 times I've seen Donegal u21's this year and the 2 times I've seen Donegal seniors this year. I simply don't like this style of football and I don't like how the sport is turning out because of it. 

But I'm sure Declan Bonner or Rory Gallagher couldnt give two hoots about what I think and I suggest the sensitive souls on here have the same attitude and keep on enjoying it if its your things

For what it's worth, Mayo don't exactly use a lot of foot passing. They might be a bit more adventurous in leaving more attackers in the opposition half but they mainly rely on running the ball and fist passing. The key to their relative success in the past few years has been their physicality and athleticism. They only seem to have two players in their team who are comfortable with taking shots on with their weaker foot - Andy Moran and Lee Keegan.

So if you're wanting to come across as a purveyor of the game's skills and the way it should be played then look closer to home.

Mayo for this League campaign have been one of the Market leaders in the foot pass. Under Roachford last year Mayo were encouraged to foot pass more. The goal against Tyrone in the league was from foot passing the ball.

Have you an actual quantifiable measure for that or is it a subjective opinion?

Observation from all the games I have been at, there has been a lot (mountains of kick passes into Andy Moran). Also players like McLoughlin, Kirby, Boland, Nally, Durcan, Coen, Cillian are good foot Passers (kickers).

To our detriment we tried to play open foot passing game v Monahan and Cavan. They just set up the blanket and just picked us off!  It' was the right thing to do during the League. That's the time to find out what system tactics work for later on in the year. I think Management under-rated both teams to a degree, but hopefully the lessons learned can be used.

Most teams will utilise kick passes when they're on but putting a ball into a place it's likely to come straight back at you. The thing that annoys me about the commentary around defensive styles and negative tactics in the game is that it consistently neglects the route cause - the negativity and athleticism of modern day players. Teams will use kick passing but only as much as those they play against allow them to do so.

Players are so much fitter, faster, stronger now. If you play your traditional six defenders, two midfielders and six forwards today you will be destroyed. Imagine trying to defend a guy like Aidan O'Shea running through the middle at momentum with that much space, it's a goal chance every time. A guy with momentum on the run who has speed, size and power is going to just run through. Defensive football is a necessity now for competitiveness and to be honest there is not much between the top sides in the way they play the game, they just do it to varying levels of their attack/defence balance.

It's unfortunate in many ways but that's just a product of the times, it's a product of all sports really. How wold someone like George Best get on in football today against a whack of African lads chasing him all over the pitch.

Give me the 2011 AI semi-final between Dublin and Donegal over the massacres like the Tyrone - Cavan replay last year or the 2015 Connacht final between Mayo and Sligo. That is the kind of thing that will happen when weaker teams go out and try and play open football against a stronger team.

Kind of deviated off point but the reason the game has gone the way it is has not been down to defensive football, defensive football is the reaction to the dominance of pace, power and size - it's the only way certain teams can keep themselves competitive. You look at some players today who would have been top class 10-15 years ago. I look at lads like McCurry and Bradley for us and the talent is there to see but they're really going to struggle due to their size whereas in the past they would have lit big games up. It's no surprise that the best forwards around now are 6ft+ strong lads who can win their own ball - think of the likes of Geaney, McManus, McBrearty, Quinlavin etc.

So Peter Canavan the best forward you have seen play the game would also struggle in todays defensive minded and lack of space football?

[Il Bomber Destro]

No, I'm not on the wind up and I cant understand why you are getting so hot under the collar. Like you've never heard anyone suggest that Donegal play shite football before. Now you may find this hard to believe but there are actually people in Donegal that agree with me. Yes they are happy to endure this kind of football if it brings a sniff of success but lets be honest. This is a bastardised version of rugby. Sometimes we have high scoring rugby matches, sometimes defensive games, but  no matter what, if you arent into rugby you wont give a damn if a team puts up 50 points.

But there are people in Donegal and also people around the country (mainly Tyrone) who disagree with me and that's fine too. Different people get enjoyment from different things. I believe that rules should have been brought in a few years ago to change the game and stop it turning out like this. People in more powerful positions then me have decided to leave things as they are. And that's also fine, it is doesn't change my opinion and it doesn't make my opinion ignorant just because its not the same as yours

And for those who want to say these comments are ignorant because I didn't see last nights game. I'm basing my opinion on what I've seen the last couple of years but in particular the 2 times I've seen Donegal u21's this year and the 2 times I've seen Donegal seniors this year. I simply don't like this style of football and I don't like how the sport is turning out because of it. 

But I'm sure Declan Bonner or Rory Gallagher couldnt give two hoots about what I think and I suggest the sensitive souls on here have the same attitude and keep on enjoying it if its your things

For what it's worth, Mayo don't exactly use a lot of foot passing. They might be a bit more adventurous in leaving more attackers in the opposition half but they mainly rely on running the ball and fist passing. The key to their relative success in the past few years has been their physicality and athleticism. They only seem to have two players in their team who are comfortable with taking shots on with their weaker foot - Andy Moran and Lee Keegan.

So if you're wanting to come across as a purveyor of the game's skills and the way it should be played then look closer to home.

Mayo for this League campaign have been one of the Market leaders in the foot pass. Under Roachford last year Mayo were encouraged to foot pass more. The goal against Tyrone in the league was from foot passing the ball.

Have you an actual quantifiable measure for that or is it a subjective opinion?

Observation from all the games I have been at, there has been a lot (mountains of kick passes into Andy Moran). Also players like McLoughlin, Kirby, Boland, Nally, Durcan, Coen, Cillian are good foot Passers (kickers).

To our detriment we tried to play open foot passing game v Monahan and Cavan. They just set up the blanket and just picked us off!  It' was the right thing to do during the League. That's the time to find out what system tactics work for later on in the year. I think Management under-rated both teams to a degree, but hopefully the lessons learned can be used.

Most teams will utilise kick passes when they're on but putting a ball into a place it's likely to come straight back at you. The thing that annoys me about the commentary around defensive styles and negative tactics in the game is that it consistently neglects the route cause - the negativity and athleticism of modern day players. Teams will use kick passing but only as much as those they play against allow them to do so.

Players are so much fitter, faster, stronger now. If you play your traditional six defenders, two midfielders and six forwards today you will be destroyed. Imagine trying to defend a guy like Aidan O'Shea running through the middle at momentum with that much space, it's a goal chance every time. A guy with momentum on the run who has speed, size and power is going to just run through. Defensive football is a necessity now for competitiveness and to be honest there is not much between the top sides in the way they play the game, they just do it to varying levels of their attack/defence balance.

It's unfortunate in many ways but that's just a product of the times, it's a product of all sports really. How wold someone like George Best get on in football today against a whack of African lads chasing him all over the pitch.

Give me the 2011 AI semi-final between Dublin and Donegal over the massacres like the Tyrone - Cavan replay last year or the 2015 Connacht final between Mayo and Sligo. That is the kind of thing that will happen when weaker teams go out and try and play open football against a stronger team.

Kind of deviated off point but the reason the game has gone the way it is has not been down to defensive football, defensive football is the reaction to the dominance of pace, power and size - it's the only way certain teams can keep themselves competitive. You look at some players today who would have been top class 10-15 years ago. I look at lads like McCurry and Bradley for us and the talent is there to see but they're really going to struggle due to their size whereas in the past they would have lit big games up. It's no surprise that the best forwards around now are 6ft+ strong lads who can win their own ball - think of the likes of Geaney, McManus, McBrearty, Quinlavin etc.

So Peter Canavan the best forward you have seen play the game would also struggle in todays defensive minded and lack of space football?

Every forward will struggle in today's game but the bigger guys have a much better chance. Canavan was a fighter though and I don't think it would deter him or knock his confidence the way it might others, he'd find it more difficult but Canavan nearly always found a way, he nearly carried a team on his back to an All Ireland in 95.

If you're using it as a comparison to Gooch. I would say the mass defence game started with Donegal in 2011 and didn't really feed through to other counties until 2013 when others saw it could work so you're really looking at 3 years of Gooch's career where he may have had to intermittently deal with it. Kerry also made the decision in that time to withdraw him out the pitch and use him at 11 where he had more space and access to impact on the game.

[J70]

Donegal style of football is absolute dung to watch. Its like a form of rugby league. Team moving up the field with ball in hand trying to break lines, recycling the ball, try to break the next line or force the opposition into giving away a cheap penalty. Yes, its getting them results but its horrid to watch and it forces teams they play against into a defensive system so they don't get caught on the break.

Bit of an ignorant statement this criostlinn. I watched the game on-line and thought Donegal were very attacking. They leave a lot of men up and attack with serious pace. Ok they get back but unlike the McGuinness era they get back rather than stay back. This u21 side is a very well organised unit but I can't see them having enough to stop the Dubs.

You think?

They had enough to stop them three years ago in the minor semi, albeit by the narrowest of margins.

We didn't "stay back" in the McGuinness era BTW, at least not after that first season. That team charged forward after turnovers, with backs constantly popping up with scores and assists, especially the likes of McGlynn and Anthony Thompson. Some of that football was a joy to watch, most notably the two AI semis they won.

As a gameplan, it became much less effective over the past two years as other teams adopted similar tactics and the players aged and lost much of their speed and fitness. Last year's Ulster Final was the nadir, when Tyrone simply sat on their 45 and watched us recycle endless, futile, handpassing exercises  back and forth across the field in the zone between the 45s before eventually turning the ball over and hitting US on the break. Hopefully now, with all these speedy, skillful youngsters, who are used to a bit of success from underage, the seniors will become a bit more expansive and potent. Rory Gallagher is on record this year as saying he wanted to get away from the defensive stuff a bit, as we weren't scoring enough to win these games anyway. He should use this year to work on that first and foremost.

[greatpoint]

I simply don't like this style of football and I don't like how the sport is turning out because of it.

It pains me to see so many words written with such little thought put into them.

So if it was just Donegal playing this style of football that you're morally opposed to you wouldn't have a problem with it?

As you've admitted yourself it's clearly prevalent with all the top teams, so can you explain why it's only Donegal that are damaging the sport? It must absolutely break you heart to see your own county forced to resort to that "style" to stay competitive.