Casement Park in line for major overhaul - 40,000 all seater Stadium.

[tyssam5]

Maguire you are really missing the crux of it here which is the GAA may be getting £50M to redevelop Casement, not Clones from the British government

I'm not missing the point at all. I understand exactly where the money is going and why. That doesn't mean the pros and cons of Casement can't be debated.

Transport links in and out of Belfast simply can't be compared to the roads in and out of Clones.

Maybe not, but my main point is that you're still going to have substantial delays at games in Casement. Or anywhere where you have 35,000 people all trying to get in or out at the same time. Yes, the motorway is handy when you get out onto it - a definite plus for Casement. But this idea that you hop in your car and drive straight out after a match at Casement is largely a myth.

Also, I'm not convinced as to how many do/would travel by rail to Casement - anyone got any details? And RTF even mentioned the airports which was very amusing, but pretty irrelevant for Ulster GAA games.

Why? A good few lads would come home from England and elsewhere to see an Ulster Final

[ardmhachaabu]

Maybe not, but my main point is that you're still going to have substantial delays at games in Casement. Or anywhere where you have 35,000 people all trying to get in or out at the same time. Yes, the motorway is handy when you get out onto it - a definite plus for Casement. But this idea that you hop in your car and drive straight out after a match at Casement is largely a myth.

Also, I'm not convinced as to how many do/would travel by rail to Casement - anyone got any details? And RTF even mentioned the airports which was very amusing, but pretty irrelevant for Ulster GAA games.

Some delays yes, though not as bad as getting out of Clones.  I was thinking of the other motorway as well
There would be a right few from North Armagh would get the train when Armagh are playing, I would imagine the same would happen if Down were drawn to play there

[Maguire01]

Maguire you are really missing the crux of it here which is the GAA may be getting £50M to redevelop Casement, not Clones from the British government

I'm not missing the point at all. I understand exactly where the money is going and why. That doesn't mean the pros and cons of Casement can't be debated.

Transport links in and out of Belfast simply can't be compared to the roads in and out of Clones.

Maybe not, but my main point is that you're still going to have substantial delays at games in Casement. Or anywhere where you have 35,000 people all trying to get in or out at the same time. Yes, the motorway is handy when you get out onto it - a definite plus for Casement. But this idea that you hop in your car and drive straight out after a match at Casement is largely a myth.

Also, I'm not convinced as to how many do/would travel by rail to Casement - anyone got any details? And RTF even mentioned the airports which was very amusing, but pretty irrelevant for Ulster GAA games.

Why? A good few lads would come home from England and elsewhere to see an Ulster Final

I'd imagine it wouldn't be a significant proportion of the 35-40,000. I'd also imagine they'd head home for the weekend and not fly in for throw-in and out after the final whistle.

[Rufus T Firefly]

Allow me to adopt your debating style for my reply.

...i'm sure everybody wasn't in and out in 10 minutes either.

I never said they were. 

That doesn't mean the pros and cons of Casement can't be debated.

But you don't appear to be debating pros and cons at this stage - all you appear to be saying is that Casement is at no more of an advantage or disadvantage to host big games than Clones.

That being the case, what was your rationale for querying matches where Casement Park had held 30,000?

[Maguire01]

Allow me to adopt your debating style for my reply.

...i'm sure everybody wasn't in and out in 10 minutes either.

I never said they were. 

That doesn't mean the pros and cons of Casement can't be debated.

But you don't appear to be debating pros and cons at this stage - all you appear to be saying is that Casement is at no more of an advantage or disadvantage to host big games than Clones.

That being the case, what was your rationale for querying matches where Casement Park had held 30,000?

To see how long it took people to get out of Casementr / home when there was a crowd similar to that of matches in Clones.

[Rufus T Firefly]

To see how long it took people to get out of Casementr / home when there was a crowd similar to that of matches in Clones.

I see - so the replies I have offered up here have convinced you that there is little or no difference in those respects (being discussed) between Casement and Clones!!   

Excellent!!

[mrgaa1]

Clones is a great place to watch a match with its natural ampitheatre - but the town is a kip - there ain't enough facilities such as toilets at that place and it can be difficult to get out of the town if you don't know the backroads out

However to do up Casement Park needs some investigation.

First of all £50m is far too much to do up Casement - to make it 40,000 all seater would cost in the region of £25-30m.  Where does the rest of the monies go or where is it allowed to go?  Personally I'd like to see grants becoming available to normal clubs around the counties to allow them to finish of projects at their own grounds - a new pitch, parking, scoreboards etc.....

One of the main issues I have with Casement is parking itself.  Where will everyone park?  The slip road of the M1 can not cope and leads to tailbacks.  Of course you can go on ahead and come back on yourself but all-in-alll parking is the major concern I'd have. 

Personally I thought the maze project was a better option for all sports.  A museum reflecting the past and a new stadium reflecting the future for all people.  It would have been a great legacy for the future but small mindedness from a few people can still over-rule the wishes of the many. 
The maze project would have had huge car parking, great facilities, easy access for all, a fantastic new stadium that could have been shared by all.

[RadioGAAGAA]

Personally I thought the maze project was a better option for all sports. 

No way.


1. Maze is in an area which would be mostly hostile to GAA fans - you think the clampers around Croke are bad? You'd have some fun returning to a row of cars with windows out.

2. The pitch sizes of the 3 sports are incompatible - as was clearly seen by the lack of atmosphere at Croke for all games bar the rugby v England and France.

3. There are no facilities at the maze. Such facilities would be built solely for use on match days, and would never be able to survive the rest of the year. Leading to temporary stuff which would be rubbish.

4. It would be an all-seater stadium. I do not want an all seater stadium. I am sure many, many others are of the same opinion.

5. The crowds for an Ulster final far outweigh the crowds for Ulster or Norn Iron games, tickets were available for Ravenhill last night as late as wednesday, maybe even at the gate. That is a ~15K capacity stadium which was not full for a Heineken cup game. Norn Iron, well.... I dunno what kinda numbers they would get - hard to judge based on Windsor.

6. There would be no social scene around the Maze. Many have their pre and post game social arrangements for Casement, Clones, Ravenhill or Windsor. Such a thing simply wouldn't be possible at an isolated stadium built in the middle of nowhere.

[Applesisapples]

Guys lets me realistic here the £50m must be spent in the O6C's end off. The debate about Clones is moot. Anyway Clones was chosen as the provincial ground because the Freestate Government don't tax the receipts, HQ was moved to Armagh to source funding, so the UC is really playing the game, a bit like the dealin' men from Crossmaglen, they'll strike oil next!!

[Maguire01]

Personally I thought the maze project was a better option for all sports. 

No way.


1. Maze is in an area which would be mostly hostile to GAA fans - you think the clampers around Croke are bad? You'd have some fun returning to a row of cars with windows out.

2. The pitch sizes of the 3 sports are incompatible - as was clearly seen by the lack of atmosphere at Croke for all games bar the rugby v England and France.

3. There are no facilities at the maze. Such facilities would be built solely for use on match days, and would never be able to survive the rest of the year. Leading to temporary stuff which would be rubbish.

4. It would be an all-seater stadium. I do not want an all seater stadium. I am sure many, many others are of the same opinion.

5. The crowds for an Ulster final far outweigh the crowds for Ulster or Norn Iron games, tickets were available for Ravenhill last night as late as wednesday, maybe even at the gate. That is a ~15K capacity stadium which was not full for a Heineken cup game. Norn Iron, well.... I dunno what kinda numbers they would get - hard to judge based on Windsor.

6. There would be no social scene around the Maze. Many have their pre and post game social arrangements for Casement, Clones, Ravenhill or Windsor. Such a thing simply wouldn't be possible at an isolated stadium built in the middle of nowhere.

That's the plan for Casement too.

[Maguire01]

To see how long it took people to get out of Casementr / home when there was a crowd similar to that of matches in Clones.

I see - so the replies I have offered up here have convinced you that there is little or no difference in those respects (being discussed) between Casement and Clones!!   

Excellent!!

Yes, transport links are clearly better around Casement. But you'll be stuck in traffic no matter where the match is. You won't be out of Casement in 10 minutes either.

[The Worker]

Casement would be handy for any ulster team that draws dublin in the backdoor. The game could be played outside croker for once!

[Maguire01]

Casement would be handy for any ulster team that draws dublin in the backdoor. The game could be played outside croker for once!

There is no excuse for not having their qualifier games outside Croker as it is. How many were at the Tipp and Armagh qualifier games? Would have fitted more than comfortably into any number of provincial grounds.

[put-it-up-again]

Am I the only one thinking that converting Casement to a 40,000 seater stadium is a waste of money?

Do we really need a 40,000 stadium? Look at Breffni Park, it's way bigger than it needs to be and it takes away from atmosphere in a game. Bar the Ulster Final, so one game each year, it would never be full.

Sounds stupid to do up Casement, Windsor and Ravenhill as well. Surely that money could be spent better to serve the general public

[Maguire01]

No, the money is there for sports stadia, so lets use it. We could question whether this is the best way to use it. What about the idea of 20-25,000 capacity indoor/roofed stadium - proper state of the art and something different to anything else in the country, yet not making existing grounds (and previous investment) redundant.