The IRISH RUGBY thread

[Dinny Breen]

On a separate topic, did you see the mini-maul brewing up between Portarlington and Cill Dara re a mini blitz and goggles?

Yea, Portarlington are circumventing IRFU regulations by allowing players play with goggles, although one of the players in this instance didn't even have proper goggles. Cill Dara are caught between the IRFU and the Port by upholding the regulation. The IRFU need to speak to Portarlington. No surprise at that age it's parental driven but Cill Dara are staying well out it.

But apparently this is now a new thing (that Cill Dara care about it, and they are the only club to have done so), and those goggles are going to be allowed very shortly anyway? It appears to be nuts given the age group and the the fact that it was a mini blitz? Obviously I'm only hearing one side of it i used to play football with one of the Portarlington coaches

Ha! Spin, it's not a new thing. The rules are quite explicit it on it. I coached a rep team a few years and funny enough a Portarlington player on it tried to play with goggles, the referee pulled him on it. That was 4 years ago. No referee would allow it, you would get away it occasionally at minis level as it's coaches/parents who referee the game and probably aren't aware of the regulations.

[AZOffaly]

As i said, I'm only hearing one side of it. And to put it into a GAA context, we wouldn't allow a young lad wearing a non-conforming helmet to hurl in a blitz, however you can be damn sure we'd find a helmet for him to use. We wouldn't not let him play. this is harder because if the goggles are needed, it's very hard to correct them on that morning, but it does seem as if there's a bit of inflexibility at play here. Have they been doing this since 2012, and is this the first time any club has kicked up about it? I know they objected before Christmas with the u13s as well, which seems to be the start of this latest chapter.

[Tony Baloney]

On a separate topic, did you see the mini-maul brewing up between Portarlington and Cill Dara re a mini blitz and goggles?

Yea, Portarlington are circumventing IRFU regulations by allowing players play with goggles, although one of the players in this instance didn't even have proper goggles. Cill Dara are caught between the IRFU and the Port by upholding the regulation. The IRFU need to speak to Portarlington. No surprise at that age it's parental driven but Cill Dara are staying well out it.

But apparently this is now a new thing (that Cill Dara care about it, and they are the only club to have done so), and those goggles are going to be allowed very shortly anyway? It appears to be nuts given the age group and the the fact that it was a mini blitz? Obviously I'm only hearing one side of it i used to play football with one of the Portarlington coaches

There is a trial ongoing into 2016 and even then I think players will be forced to wear the trial goggles only (Raleri). Until then they are not permitted. Leinster teams are rightly very tight on the gear worn. My middle fella had to sit out a match in Coolmine last year as he lost his gumshield in an earlier match. I don't know if he would have been pulled on it in the north.

[Dinny Breen]

As i said, I'm only hearing one side of it. And to put it into a GAA context, we wouldn't allow a young lad wearing a non-conforming helmet to hurl in a blitz, however you can be damn sure we'd find a helmet for him to use. We wouldn't not let him play. this is harder because if the goggles are needed, it's very hard to correct them on that morning, but it does seem as if there's a bit of inflexibility at play here. Have they been doing this since 2012, and is this the first time any club has kicked up about it? I know they objected before Christmas with the u13s as well, which seems to be the start of this latest chapter.

My personal opinion is that is simply parents being selfish and putting their little Johnnies needs/wants above the other players. The rules are explicit if he needs goggles to play then he can't play, until the rules change and they possibly (note the trial is only senior level) might then play a sport that allows you were goggles.

Should we circumvent concussion protocols as well because we don't agree with them?

[AZOffaly]

This particular one is tricky though, as far as I can make out. What I described in GAA (gumshields or helmets) would take place because you need to protect the child playing, so no gumshield, no helmet, no play. Same in soccer with shin guards. However this one appears to be mandating that they *remove* a protective element because it is not sanctioned. I've seen kids wearing these goggles playing soccer and gaa, and I know they are allowed in Rugby in New Zealand etc.

[AZOffaly]

As i said, I'm only hearing one side of it. And to put it into a GAA context, we wouldn't allow a young lad wearing a non-conforming helmet to hurl in a blitz, however you can be damn sure we'd find a helmet for him to use. We wouldn't not let him play. this is harder because if the goggles are needed, it's very hard to correct them on that morning, but it does seem as if there's a bit of inflexibility at play here. Have they been doing this since 2012, and is this the first time any club has kicked up about it? I know they objected before Christmas with the u13s as well, which seems to be the start of this latest chapter.

My personal opinion is that is simply parents being selfish and putting their little Johnnies needs/wants above the other players. The rules are explicit if he needs goggles to play then he can't play, until the rules change and they possibly (note the trial is only senior level) might then play a sport that allows you were goggles.

Should we circumvent concussion protocols as well because we don't agree with them?

No because Concussion protocols are to protect the player. These goggles are also supposed to protect the player.

[Dinny Breen]

As i said, I'm only hearing one side of it. And to put it into a GAA context, we wouldn't allow a young lad wearing a non-conforming helmet to hurl in a blitz, however you can be damn sure we'd find a helmet for him to use. We wouldn't not let him play. this is harder because if the goggles are needed, it's very hard to correct them on that morning, but it does seem as if there's a bit of inflexibility at play here. Have they been doing this since 2012, and is this the first time any club has kicked up about it? I know they objected before Christmas with the u13s as well, which seems to be the start of this latest chapter.

My personal opinion is that is simply parents being selfish and putting their little Johnnies needs/wants above the other players. The rules are explicit if he needs goggles to play then he can't play, until the rules change and they possibly (note the trial is only senior level) might then play a sport that allows you were goggles.

Should we circumvent concussion protocols as well because we don't agree with them?

No because Concussion protocols are to protect the player. These goggles are also supposed to protect the player.

But that hasn't been proven yet, hence the trials.

[Billys Boots]

I know in football that referees ask for a team/parent to sign a waiver on the match card, accepting responsibility for any injury arising from the use of goggles.  No waiver, the child doesn't play. 

[AZOffaly]

As i said, I'm only hearing one side of it. And to put it into a GAA context, we wouldn't allow a young lad wearing a non-conforming helmet to hurl in a blitz, however you can be damn sure we'd find a helmet for him to use. We wouldn't not let him play. this is harder because if the goggles are needed, it's very hard to correct them on that morning, but it does seem as if there's a bit of inflexibility at play here. Have they been doing this since 2012, and is this the first time any club has kicked up about it? I know they objected before Christmas with the u13s as well, which seems to be the start of this latest chapter.

My personal opinion is that is simply parents being selfish and putting their little Johnnies needs/wants above the other players. The rules are explicit if he needs goggles to play then he can't play, until the rules change and they possibly (note the trial is only senior level) might then play a sport that allows you were goggles.

Should we circumvent concussion protocols as well because we don't agree with them?

No because Concussion protocols are to protect the player. These goggles are also supposed to protect the player.

But that hasn't been proven yet, hence the trials.

Are they not in common use in New Zealand and other places?

[Dinny Breen]

As i said, I'm only hearing one side of it. And to put it into a GAA context, we wouldn't allow a young lad wearing a non-conforming helmet to hurl in a blitz, however you can be damn sure we'd find a helmet for him to use. We wouldn't not let him play. this is harder because if the goggles are needed, it's very hard to correct them on that morning, but it does seem as if there's a bit of inflexibility at play here. Have they been doing this since 2012, and is this the first time any club has kicked up about it? I know they objected before Christmas with the u13s as well, which seems to be the start of this latest chapter.

My personal opinion is that is simply parents being selfish and putting their little Johnnies needs/wants above the other players. The rules are explicit if he needs goggles to play then he can't play, until the rules change and they possibly (note the trial is only senior level) might then play a sport that allows you were goggles.

Should we circumvent concussion protocols as well because we don't agree with them?

No because Concussion protocols are to protect the player. These goggles are also supposed to protect the player.

But that hasn't been proven yet, hence the trials.

Are they not in common use in New Zealand and other places?

Only in participating trial countries, Italy being the main one. You are only allowed one brand and you have to be registered with World Rugby to use. The trial has been extended time wise.

[AZOffaly]

I just read this. does this not imply that everyone should be allowed wear them, and the IRFU have just been slow in adopting? The RFU allow u13s to use them, New Zealand allows them, Italy, as you say, allows them.


World Rugby Goggles Global Law Trial

In an effort to allow people who need to wear corrective lenses to do so safely while playing Rugby and to accommodate people with monocular vision or chronic eye conditions who wish to wear goggles while playing Rugby, World Rugby has developed specific goggles – "Rugby Goggles". Rugby Goggles have been developed with a view to posing no additional risk to the wearer and other players.


The Rugby Goggles developed have undergone a series of tests designed to ensure that they are as safe as possible for use in Rugby including tests on:

High velocity impact resistance;
Anti-fogging;
Field of vision;
Shape and size; and
Retention system properties.
The Rugby Goggles are not designed to provide extra protection for the wearer, but to allow corrective lenses to be worn without causing any greater risk of injury to any player.

In addition to the suitability of the Rugby Goggles for those requiring corrective lenses, the Rugby Goggles may also be used by people who suffer from chronic eye conditions. This includes people with monocular vision, restricted vision in one or both eyes and people with eye conditions that put them at a greater risk of eye-damage than the general population. While the Rugby Goggles are not designed to provide extra protection for such individuals, they may be worn for that purpose if the individual considers that it is beneficial to do so.

World Rugby has developed a Global Law Trial to field test the Rugby Goggles' design and obtain data for the purposes of developing a Rugby Goggles specification. The purpose of the field test is (i) to ensure that the Rugby Goggles perform as designed, namely that they provide players with a means of wearing corrective lenses safely during contact Rugby; (ii) to ascertain the suitability of the design for ease of use; and (iii) to ascertain if further specific field or laboratory tests are required.

The Rugby Goggles are only available in one size and are designed to fit anyone (by adjusting the headband). The Rugby Goggles will not be provided with prescription lenses in them. Once the Rugby Goggles have been received, the player will need to take them to his/her optician and have plastic lenses inserted in accordance with the manufacturer's instructions. If the player does not require corrective lenses, the player may remove the lens-insert in accordance with the manufacturer's instructions and may use the Rugby Goggles as provided.

It should be noted that only those Rugby Goggles carrying the official World Rugby Trial Approved logo will be permitted to be used in the trial, and all participants must demonstrate their need for the Rugby Goggles through a letter from their ophthalmologist (or similar expert) stating that there is an ophthalmic or medical need for their use. Inspections and checks may be performed by match referees to ensure that all participants have complied with these conditions.

The use of the Rugby Goggles is permitted in any game of Rugby. Any player who considers the risks inherent in playing with or against someone wearing the Rugby Goggles to be outside of acceptable levels of risk is free to choose not to participate in the game however the use of the Rugby Goggles is not grounds for preventing the wearer from playing in the game.

The success or otherwise of the Global Law Trial will determine whether Rugby Goggles will be permitted to be worn beyond the trial period and enable World Rugby to provide a Rugby Goggles Specification. It is therefore essential that World Rugby receives feedback from all those who elect to become part of the trial by purchasing and using a pair of the Rugby Goggles.

[Dinny Breen]

If registered and playing in a participating country that allows them at your age group.

Ireland have only just applied and only for senior level.

If approved great but they haven't been sanctioned. It's very black and white.

[AZOffaly]

I understand that. But it seems as if a) the IRFU are behind the curve on this and b) given the situation with this all over the world, and given the circumstances of a mini blitz, would it not have been more sensible to try and allow the lad play? It just seems so 'jobsworth'.

[johnneycool]

I understand that. But it seems as if a) the IRFU are behind the curve on this and b) given the situation with this all over the world, and given the circumstances of a mini blitz, would it not have been more sensible to try and allow the lad play? It just seems so 'jobsworth'.

Is there a concern that these goggles may injure an opponent or something?

[Dinny Breen]

I understand that. But it seems as if a) the IRFU are behind the curve on this and b) given the situation with this all over the world, and given the circumstances of a mini blitz, would it not have been more sensible to try and allow the lad play? It just seems so 'jobsworth'.

Has the trial been passed? Didn't have you down as an anarchist, the IRFU same as the GAA or FAI are responsible for governance and the IRFU are quite explicit on this.

I suppose you don't believe in clinical trials for drugs, sure don't be a jobsworth just give me the pills 

Wearing of glasses/ Sports goggles
In the interest of safety (of the player wearing the goggles and other players) and best practice the wearing of glasses or goggles when participating in the contact format of rugby cannot be allowed. Regarding "approved eyewear" like boots, shoulder pads and head gear it must be IRB approved before it can be used when playing rugby and as this has not been approved by the IRB it is against the regulations.

SPORTS GOGGLES /GLASSES IN RUGBY

ON 10 NOVEMBER 2013.
Sports Goggles /Glasses in Rugby The IRFU Medical Advisory Committee meeting of 25th January 2012 deliberated on the matter of wearing sports goggles/glasses in rugby. This discussion included input from an expert in Ophthalmology. It was agreed that wearing sports goggles/glasses of any type does pose a potential injury risk to both the wearer and to other players. The IRFU does not decide to 'approve' goggles for participating in rugby – this is a role for the International Rugby Board. The decision was made that goggles/glasses should not be worn while playing rugby in Ireland. The Domestic Game Committee subsequently endorsed this decision.