The IRISH RUGBY thread

[Premier Emperor]

Kidney failure.
Once the Munster team of the last decade broke up, Ireland were always going to go into decline.

[cadence]

Who is on the National Team Review Group ?



Declan Kidney's tenure as Ireland head coach has come to an end.

The IRFU announced this afternoon that it would not be renewing his contract - Les Kiss will take charge of the summer tour to North America.

Kidney's contract was due to expire on 30 June but the IRFU issued a statement this afternoon saying that his role as head coach ceases today.

"We would like to sincerely thank Declan for his commitment to Irish Rugby" - Philip Browne

IRFU chief executive Philip Browne said: "We would like to sincerely thank Declan for his commitment to Irish Rugby.

"His contribution and involvement across the spectrum of Irish rugby delivered Under Age, Provincial, Grand Slam and Triple Crown success, and epitomises his passion, belief and commitment to the game.

"With a host of new and emerging talent at every level, and despite the clear challenges ahead, we are confident of securing another world-class coach to work with this talented and ambitious group of players."

The IRFU said the decision was made after a in-depth review carried out by the National Team Review Group.

The group will now begin the process of "identifying suitable candidates" for the job.

the national team review group may well be a hastily convened thing to give kidney a fair appraisal, or make it appear like he's been given a fair appraisal, as far as his performance goes. everyone knows he's getting the road after the results this 6n. i suppose there has to be some semblance of decorum to proceedings before they sacked him.

my own opinion on ireland's woes is that they have become narcissistic, believing in the golden generation media hype bs.. much like eng did for years in the mid to late 90s before that squad got their house in order. a wee bit of humility goes a long way and there was an arrogance about this ireland team that stopped me really warming to them as much as i wanted to. the problem we have is we don't have a large enough pool of quality players to be able to ditch the old lad who's acting like he's hot shit all the time without producing the performances consistently.

i'd rather we lost showing a level of humility rather than think we're top drawer and bemoan the golden generation getting beat yet again, how could this possibly happen to the golden generation? oh, it must be the coach's fault.

players were never good enough in the first place.

Looking at it with a GAA hat on, if the players had been from Kilkenny or Kerry with that noblesse oblige mentality they would have won maybe 3 or 4 GS.
It was more like Armagh or Wexford . One title and they knew a few slipped  away. Players learn how to win. It  is not written in stone to always be the bridesmaid.

Seb Coe said it about the Ashes in 05. The Aussies wouldn't have gone around in an open top bus. That is why they win in the last minutes of matches. Ireland were never that ruthless. But there are teams in Ireland that are.

bod was class, but since his first game in 1999, ireland have one slam, wales four, england four and france five. after 2003 eng were rubbish, wales and france were not miles ahead of us either, but we still only have the one slam. we've never beaten a southern hemisphere side down there either. came close the odd time, but we've had some almighty humpings.

it's rarified air the top and ireland got closer than we ever have to it with the noughties team. but we had plenty time to get there and couldn't do it. it's not a coaching failure. despite all the proclaimations that we were, we just weren't good enough i think.   

[nrico2006]

Has Ferris definitely decided on going to Japan?

[Crete Boom]

Who is on the National Team Review Group ?



Declan Kidney's tenure as Ireland head coach has come to an end.

The IRFU announced this afternoon that it would not be renewing his contract - Les Kiss will take charge of the summer tour to North America.

Kidney's contract was due to expire on 30 June but the IRFU issued a statement this afternoon saying that his role as head coach ceases today.

"We would like to sincerely thank Declan for his commitment to Irish Rugby" - Philip Browne

IRFU chief executive Philip Browne said: "We would like to sincerely thank Declan for his commitment to Irish Rugby.

"His contribution and involvement across the spectrum of Irish rugby delivered Under Age, Provincial, Grand Slam and Triple Crown success, and epitomises his passion, belief and commitment to the game.

"With a host of new and emerging talent at every level, and despite the clear challenges ahead, we are confident of securing another world-class coach to work with this talented and ambitious group of players."

The IRFU said the decision was made after a in-depth review carried out by the National Team Review Group.

The group will now begin the process of "identifying suitable candidates" for the job.

the national team review group may well be a hastily convened thing to give kidney a fair appraisal, or make it appear like he's been given a fair appraisal, as far as his performance goes. everyone knows he's getting the road after the results this 6n. i suppose there has to be some semblance of decorum to proceedings before they sacked him.

my own opinion on ireland's woes is that they have become narcissistic, believing in the golden generation media hype bs.. much like eng did for years in the mid to late 90s before that squad got their house in order. a wee bit of humility goes a long way and there was an arrogance about this ireland team that stopped me really warming to them as much as i wanted to. the problem we have is we don't have a large enough pool of quality players to be able to ditch the old lad who's acting like he's hot shit all the time without producing the performances consistently.

i'd rather we lost showing a level of humility rather than think we're top drawer and bemoan the golden generation getting beat yet again, how could this possibly happen to the golden generation? oh, it must be the coach's fault.

players were never good enough in the first place.

Looking at it with a GAA hat on, if the players had been from Kilkenny or Kerry with that noblesse oblige mentality they would have won maybe 3 or 4 GS.
It was more like Armagh or Wexford . One title and they knew a few slipped  away. Players learn how to win. It  is not written in stone to always be the bridesmaid.

Seb Coe said it about the Ashes in 05. The Aussies wouldn't have gone around in an open top bus. That is why they win in the last minutes of matches. Ireland were never that ruthless. But there are teams in Ireland that are.

bod was class, but since his first game in 1999, ireland have one slam, wales four, england four and france five. after 2003 eng were rubbish, wales and france were not miles ahead of us either, but we still only have the one slam. we've never beaten a southern hemisphere side down there either. came close the odd time, but we've had some almighty humpings.

it's rarified air the top and ireland got closer than we ever have to it with the noughties team. but we had plenty time to get there and couldn't do it. it's not a coaching failure. despite all the proclaimations that we were, we just weren't good enough i think.   

  I hate to be pedantic Cadence but since 1999 England have one Grand Slam and Wales and France have three each. I think what you mean is England and Wales have won the six nations championship four times and France have won it five times. Also we did mange to beat Australia at the World Cup in New Zealand.Taking into account that we only lost out on points difference to that controversial last minute Elvis Vermullein try in 2007 we would have been six nations champions or the last minute Vincent Clerc try in Croker the same year where we would have been Grand Slam winners. We are third in the table for overall wins behind England and France and I think (although I'm open to correction) that we finished second in 2001 , 2003 , 2004 , 2007 along with winning in 2009. That consistency is impressive (especially after the 90's) but the annoying thing about those years we finished second was our record against France where we only beat them in 2001 , 2003 ,2009  and lost to them in 2002, 2004 , 2005 , 2006, 2007 , 2010 , 2011 with our sole victory in Paris in 2000 , the rest being at home. This for me is the most glaring statistic that we have to address over the next decade of Irish rugby as well as trying to replace a few heroes from our first successful team of the pro era.

[muppet]

bod was class, but since his first game in 1999, ireland have one slam, wales four, england four and france five. after 2003 eng were rubbish, wales and france were not miles ahead of us either, but we still only have the one slam. we've never beaten a southern hemisphere side down there either. came close the odd time, but we've had some almighty humpings.

it's rarified air the top and ireland got closer than we ever have to it with the noughties team. but we had plenty time to get there and couldn't do it. it's not a coaching failure. despite all the proclaimations that we were, we just weren't good enough i think.   

What did we do in the 14 years prior to BOD's first game and how does 1 slam and the Triple Crowns compare? Also did we not beat Australia 'down there' in the World Cup? We do seem to under perform at the 4 year events but that seems to be down to wanting to peak each year in the 6N instead of planning for the longer term like, say, France.

The Heineken Cups and Grand Slam might seem an awful long way off in a few years. I wouldn't be too critical of the Golden generation.

[Walter Cronc]

Apologies if this has already been posted!

Ewen McKenzie (Paddy Power odds 1/2)

Installed as the early front-runner in the betting to be the full-time successor to Kidney, the 47-year-old, 51-times capped former Wallabies prop will leave his current job as head coach with the Queensland Reds, whom he guided to a first ever Super Rugby title in 2011, at the end of the season and expressed a preference to coach at Test level.

Having been an assistant to Rod Macqueen and Eddie Jones in the Australia set-up, he took the Waratahs to two Super finals in his five years there, and he has coached in Europe, even if he was sacked in his second season with Stade Francais.

Les Kiss (13/2)

Given he's already embedded it would make for a smooth enough transition, but that's not to say he isn't primed for promotion anyway. Close ties with the current squad, he gets most of the credit for evolving Ireland's archaic gameplan since the 2011 World Cup, unshackled by Kidney when switched from defence to attack coach.

Decent bloke, devoid of an over-bearing ego, he has picked up the best traits of some highly progressive Australian coaches, in both League and Union, and tailored them to the smaller Irish player, only to be cursed by atrocious weather conditions this season. Think Argentina in November and Wales in February, rather than England in the monsoon.

Joe Schmidt (8/1)

The outstanding candidate. Having cut his teeth as Bay of Plenty coach, Schmidt enjoyed impressive stints as backs/assistant with the Auckland Blues (2004-07) and Clermont Auvergne ('08-10), where along with Vern Cotter, they reached their holy grail of a first ever Bouclier de Brennus in his last of three years there. In part on the recommendation of Isa Nacewa, Leinster chose him to succeed Michael Cheika and he guided the province to back-to-back Heineken Cups in 2011 and 2012 with an exciting brand of rugby. Is also hugely well regarded by the Leinster players and has an insider's knowledge of the Irish players and system.

Mike Ruddock (12/1)

Ticks many boxes as a Grand Slam-winning coach with Wales (2004-06), previously overseeing Leinster's entry into the professional era (1997-00) and is currently working in the system as Ireland under-20s coach. He has worked in the schools system with Castleknock College and at club level, leading Lansdowne FC to the AIL Division 1A title last Saturday.

All that considered, the sudden split from his native Wales was hardly amicable and he's another that may see his current coaching gigs, safely below the radar, as the more sensible, secure option.

Conor O'Shea (16/1)

Ideal candidate for director of operations type-role, equivalent to Rob Andrew in the RFU, that is apparently about to be created within Irish rugby. That would mean the Ireland head coach would report directly to him. Also, O'Shea is not your usual hands-on coach, having guided Harlequins to the Premiership as director of rugby. An astute man, he may even see a more enticing role will be available at Leinster come the summer of 2014 – or even sooner if Joe Schmidt goes the recommended Kiwi route of managing another country before taking the All Blacks job and brings Ireland to the 2015 World Cup. Anyway, why give up leading the Quins' quest to become a European force? Seems like bad timing.

Best of the rest

A la McKenzie, rumours circulated a few months ago that Vern Cotter (14/1) had been sounded out by the IRFU, but this appears unlikely and in any case he intends seeing out the last year of his current contract with Clermont Auvergne at the end of the next season.

Jake White (9/1) , South Africa's World Cup winning coach, is only in the second year of a burgeoning three-year deal with the Brumbies, which looks like a work in progress, and likewise Wayne Smith (30/1) is happily ensconced with the Chiefs as assistant to Dave Rennie (66/1) .

Nick Mallet's (30/1) status has possibly diminished given Jacques Brunel's work with Italy while a Heineken Cup and/or Premiership titles would enhance the cv of Mark McCall (66/1) .

[AZOffaly]

Who is on the National Team Review Group ?



Declan Kidney's tenure as Ireland head coach has come to an end.

The IRFU announced this afternoon that it would not be renewing his contract - Les Kiss will take charge of the summer tour to North America.

Kidney's contract was due to expire on 30 June but the IRFU issued a statement this afternoon saying that his role as head coach ceases today.

"We would like to sincerely thank Declan for his commitment to Irish Rugby" - Philip Browne

IRFU chief executive Philip Browne said: "We would like to sincerely thank Declan for his commitment to Irish Rugby.

"His contribution and involvement across the spectrum of Irish rugby delivered Under Age, Provincial, Grand Slam and Triple Crown success, and epitomises his passion, belief and commitment to the game.

"With a host of new and emerging talent at every level, and despite the clear challenges ahead, we are confident of securing another world-class coach to work with this talented and ambitious group of players."

The IRFU said the decision was made after a in-depth review carried out by the National Team Review Group.

The group will now begin the process of "identifying suitable candidates" for the job.

the national team review group may well be a hastily convened thing to give kidney a fair appraisal, or make it appear like he's been given a fair appraisal, as far as his performance goes. everyone knows he's getting the road after the results this 6n. i suppose there has to be some semblance of decorum to proceedings before they sacked him.

my own opinion on ireland's woes is that they have become narcissistic, believing in the golden generation media hype bs.. much like eng did for years in the mid to late 90s before that squad got their house in order. a wee bit of humility goes a long way and there was an arrogance about this ireland team that stopped me really warming to them as much as i wanted to. the problem we have is we don't have a large enough pool of quality players to be able to ditch the old lad who's acting like he's hot shit all the time without producing the performances consistently.

i'd rather we lost showing a level of humility rather than think we're top drawer and bemoan the golden generation getting beat yet again, how could this possibly happen to the golden generation? oh, it must be the coach's fault.

players were never good enough in the first place.

Looking at it with a GAA hat on, if the players had been from Kilkenny or Kerry with that noblesse oblige mentality they would have won maybe 3 or 4 GS.
It was more like Armagh or Wexford . One title and they knew a few slipped  away. Players learn how to win. It  is not written in stone to always be the bridesmaid.

Seb Coe said it about the Ashes in 05. The Aussies wouldn't have gone around in an open top bus. That is why they win in the last minutes of matches. Ireland were never that ruthless. But there are teams in Ireland that are.

bod was class, but since his first game in 1999, ireland have one slam, wales four, england four and france five. after 2003 eng were rubbish, wales and france were not miles ahead of us either, but we still only have the one slam. we've never beaten a southern hemisphere side down there either. came close the odd time, but we've had some almighty humpings.

it's rarified air the top and ireland got closer than we ever have to it with the noughties team. but we had plenty time to get there and couldn't do it. it's not a coaching failure. despite all the proclaimations that we were, we just weren't good enough i think.   

We beat Australia in 2011 in the World Cup in New Zealand. That's 'down there'.

[Crete Boom]

Who is on the National Team Review Group ?



Declan Kidney's tenure as Ireland head coach has come to an end.

The IRFU announced this afternoon that it would not be renewing his contract - Les Kiss will take charge of the summer tour to North America.

Kidney's contract was due to expire on 30 June but the IRFU issued a statement this afternoon saying that his role as head coach ceases today.

"We would like to sincerely thank Declan for his commitment to Irish Rugby" - Philip Browne

IRFU chief executive Philip Browne said: "We would like to sincerely thank Declan for his commitment to Irish Rugby.

"His contribution and involvement across the spectrum of Irish rugby delivered Under Age, Provincial, Grand Slam and Triple Crown success, and epitomises his passion, belief and commitment to the game.

"With a host of new and emerging talent at every level, and despite the clear challenges ahead, we are confident of securing another world-class coach to work with this talented and ambitious group of players."

The IRFU said the decision was made after a in-depth review carried out by the National Team Review Group.

The group will now begin the process of "identifying suitable candidates" for the job.

the national team review group may well be a hastily convened thing to give kidney a fair appraisal, or make it appear like he's been given a fair appraisal, as far as his performance goes. everyone knows he's getting the road after the results this 6n. i suppose there has to be some semblance of decorum to proceedings before they sacked him.

my own opinion on ireland's woes is that they have become narcissistic, believing in the golden generation media hype bs.. much like eng did for years in the mid to late 90s before that squad got their house in order. a wee bit of humility goes a long way and there was an arrogance about this ireland team that stopped me really warming to them as much as i wanted to. the problem we have is we don't have a large enough pool of quality players to be able to ditch the old lad who's acting like he's hot shit all the time without producing the performances consistently.

i'd rather we lost showing a level of humility rather than think we're top drawer and bemoan the golden generation getting beat yet again, how could this possibly happen to the golden generation? oh, it must be the coach's fault.

players were never good enough in the first place.

Looking at it with a GAA hat on, if the players had been from Kilkenny or Kerry with that noblesse oblige mentality they would have won maybe 3 or 4 GS.
It was more like Armagh or Wexford . One title and they knew a few slipped  away. Players learn how to win. It  is not written in stone to always be the bridesmaid.

Seb Coe said it about the Ashes in 05. The Aussies wouldn't have gone around in an open top bus. That is why they win in the last minutes of matches. Ireland were never that ruthless. But there are teams in Ireland that are.

bod was class, but since his first game in 1999, ireland have one slam, wales four, england four and france five. after 2003 eng were rubbish, wales and france were not miles ahead of us either, but we still only have the one slam. we've never beaten a southern hemisphere side down there either. came close the odd time, but we've had some almighty humpings.

it's rarified air the top and ireland got closer than we ever have to it with the noughties team. but we had plenty time to get there and couldn't do it. it's not a coaching failure. despite all the proclaimations that we were, we just weren't good enough i think.   

We beat Australia in 2011 in the World Cup in New Zealand. That's 'down there'.

And if you really want to be an anorak about it we beat Australia down there in 1967 (becoming the first northern hemisphere team to win a test in the southern hemisphere) and again in Aus in two tests in 1979 in the amateur era.

[lynchbhoy]

surprised mark mccall so far down the pecking order....

[rodney trotter]

Johnny Sexton to be the biggest earner in French Rugby next season

   
http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/sexton-set-to-be-france-s-best-paid-rugby-player-according-to-midi-olympique-1.1353040










   
   
   




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[highorlow]

After watching that lad Joe Smidth a few times in interviews I really hope that he doesn't get the Irish job.

Who is he to come out against a citing commissioner about POC over the last couple of days.

Obviously he had no interest in the Irish job and he is stirring things up now in the hope he will be rejected.

[AZOffaly]

Paulie was lucky. There was zero intent in my opinion. It happened about 15 yards from me. POC was very concerned about Kearney immediately afterwards as well. However he could easily have been cited for reckless or dangerous play and would have had to explain himself. As I said he was lucky. The reaction of the Leinster lads helped him enormously I'd say. No handbags , no mouthing or gesticulating, nothing. They knew it was accidental but fair play to them.

[highorlow]

Paulie was lucky.

I know that AZ. The point I made may not have been fully clear. It is more to do with Joe Smidths diplomacy which appears non-existent on the matter. Not a great sign if this guy becomes Irish manager. If you go to RTE player you can see what he said in an interview on last nights six one news. Came across as anti-munster.

[cicfada]

Of course he's anti munster, he's Leinster manager for Christ's sake! Eveyone needs to disregard statements from any Munster fans, Leinster fans and indeed any Lunsters as well! They are not going to be in any way objective. If Schmidt gets the Irish gig, he will change his tune and be all kinds of eveything to all Irish rugby fans!  I thought the incident was shocking myself, very reckless and I thought O Connell would have to answer for  it! In my opinion there is very little difference between reckless and careless but  the commissioner has deemed otherwise so he has no case to answer, lucky boy!!Schmidt's statement is coming  as the Leinster manager so I would not expect anything else, it should not have any impact on his qualifications to become Irish manager, he is an outstanding candidate but we will have to see who else the IRFU deems qualified to get the job!

[Dinny Breen]

It was a cover up. A simple disgrace. O'Connell should have been cited period, while I agree there was no intent it was reckless, dangerous and stupid.

David Kearney is still in hospital.