Messages

1. Beggan
2. McCluskey.  3. Fitzsimmons. 4. T O'Sullivan
5. O'Connell 6. J McCarthy. 7. White
    8. Fenton.  9. Rogers
10. P Clifford.  11. Basquel.  12. Smith
13. Clifford.  14. McGuigan. 15. Costello

Can't see Beggan getting in over Cluxton/Ryan/Lynch tbh.
As much as I'd like to see mcluskey in, 3 for an Semi-finalist probably won't happen.
I could see McManus getting one.
But I'd say you're not too far away in general there.

Mc Carthy of Monaghan will get one.

Very possibly, I think it'll be between him and O'Connell. If there's one from outside the semifinalists it'll be between Enda Smith and D Canavan both of whom had great seasons.

Andy Murnin was the best player outside of the 4 semi finalists. Smith had a great season as well and it would be hard to begrudge him an award though I don't think he'll get it.

A 19 year old rookie easily dealt with Murnin.

Murnin had a great year (whether that is enough to get an All-Star given how the system works is debatable) Trying to deny that is simply madness. One arm wrestle of a match does not ruin a whole season for him.

[he's one year left]

I could see this ending acrimoniously, a lukewarm vote of confidence from the clubs and McGeeney could well say let someone else at it. I really don't see the need for a vote if he's one year left but i assume it's to try and get a ringing endorsement, I'm not so sure it'll be forthcoming.

Club delegates were told that this is not the case. The agreement is on a year to year basis.

Slightly off-topic, but anyone here work closely with pensions? unsure whether to keep my old policy from previous employer, or take on the new one?

google telling me the former, but hopefully someone here knows better than I.

All depends on the respective charging structures of the plans.  You also need to check if there are any benefits inherent in the old plan that a new plan can't match.

If Geezer goes, who would actually want the gig, when likely 4-5 senior players will hang boots up too?

Tony Mac
Oisin
Jim McCory
AOR
Jim McGuinness
Malachy O'Rourke

Is Stevie McDonnell still looking after the U21's? Who manages the minors?

Of that list, I would only look forward to Tony McEntee.

no Stevie isn't over 21s ex senior manager Peter McDonnell is along with Martin McQuillan,Brendan Hughes ex ogs manager along with Chris Rafferty ex ogs player currant st colmcilles grange manager are over the minors

Peter McDonnell and Martin McQuillan aren't over the u20s any more.  Barry O'Hagan and Oisin McConville were over them for a year until Oisin went to Wicklow.  Think Barry O'Hagan stayed on??

At least one of McManus's points came directly from a goalkeeping misadventure

I've watched it back. He was fouled twice coming out with the ball.

Seriously, no messing... Armagh need to start at the bottom. Underage. They don't win enough Ulster Minor or U-20 (Whatever the grade is now) at the moment. Never mind All Irelands. Have they won 3 underage All Irelands in their history? It's not a hard and fast rule but its a good indicator. Todays Kerry side won 5 minor titles in a row. That's the calibre all teams are competing against. Develop those players.

They need a Centre of Excellence. Have they started the one that was passed in planning?

Winning on the pitch starts off it. Armagh are behind all the top counties around the country.

Can't believe I'm agreeing with you but that is precisely it.

We've neglected underage badly since 2009 and haven't even been competitive at either grade never mind competing to win Ulster titles. Thats where we need to start and we need to look at how those jobs are handed out because the development process hasn't been up to the level required. We aren't in a great place moving forward and could easily find ourselves languishing in division 3 in a few years with the lack of talent coming through and the current standard of the club game in the county.

Monaghan and Mayo have proven that you can remain competitive despite a raft of older players retiring or being phased out but the difference is that those counties have good underage systems and development pathways in place. I don't know whether Armagh will be as successful in being competitive at the top table over the next few years.

Trailer - I'm going to have to change my opinion of you. Good post.  Underage is the issue.  Like him or loathe McGeeney's been working with threadbare resources.  As yellow card says, we haven't been competitive at underage for years.  We have new guys coming onto the panel every year who've not won a championship game at underage.  it's not just about winning Ulsters or All -Irelands, it's being competitive and challenging,  winning a game or 2 each year at each level and being thereabouts.  Don't know enough about our underage set up but things were going well until around 2011 when the wheels came up.  Something isn't right. Not expecting us to be winning titles very often, but to show no signs of progress over 10 years suggests something is not working.  I see we were in the media last week with a new strategy - the second or 3rd one in the past 10-15 years.  I don't want to see any more strategy documents, just implementation.

A good chunk of our team (Rian, Turbo, Jason Duffy, Ross McQ, Conor O'Neill) were on the last u20 team that made an Ulster final in2018.  They lost it after being involved in a brawl with Tyrone in the semi.  TK and Justy Kierans were on an u20 team that lost to Tyrone (the then AI champions) due to a goalkeeping error in 2020 just before Covid struck.  Geezer has picked off whatever talent has been coming through on any of our half decent teams coming up through.  Credit must be given to him for this and I would be worried that once the lads that were on the 09 minor team hang up the boots we are in big danger of dropping down the ranks significantly.  But that makes the errors in tactics on days like Saturday all the more galling.  We have (maybe) two more years of competing at provincial and Div 1 levels and we have to take advantage of the talent we have now.

There's a strong argument for a change in management before this happens.  These older lads would have been loyal to Geezer but I'm wondering if underneath it all if they would prefer a change of voice for the last couple of years of their Armagh careers.  They're bound to know that the more conservative approach of 2023 does not suit this team.

This game was a carbon copy of the Ulster final. Eeerily similar. Same style of play from us and the opponent, same black card incident, penalties and same outcome. I don't think it's a coincidence or bad luck that we've found ourselves in two penalty situations this year, and one last year. We haven't been able to finish the job in normal time. I've found the lack of goals very frustrating. We created goal chances on Saturday but again couldn't take one. Monaghan didn't create any, unless you count the one half chance that blazed over the bar. In these kinds of matches, we take one of those chances and it's probably enough to get the win. We just are lacking that level of certainty and decision making in front of goal. It shows itself in the option to take a fisted point rather than throw a dummy and side step the keeper. We see it too when the ball is laid off to another forward who inevitably gets smothered by the keeper and gets blocked, or has to take the fisted point. It's hurt us badly this year and last. I haven't heard this mentioned much in all the post match analysis this year and last. The area that the Sunday game focused on, and all the podcasts will too probably, is the sitting deep tactic. We just don't do it very well. Sitting deep is fine in itself if it leads to turnovers and counters. But looking at the Derry and Monaghan games, we got very few turnovers, and of the ones we do, we tend not to translate them into counters that lead to scores because we can't counter quickly enough or have an out ball for us up the pitch. We don't get turnovers because we sit off too much. In the games I've been at this year, Derry, Westmeath and Monaghan all had the time to pretty much do what they pleased with their possession building out from the back and when getting into our half. If they wanted to keep the ball for 2, 3.4 minutes and then decide to take a shot, they could, and we were relying on them kicking it wide by that stage. Sitting deep keeps out the goals, but it doesn't prevent the other side kicking points. It's a tactic that's not working for us as we've been beaten (Derry/Monaghan) or been very close to losing (Westmeath). Gaelic football is about intensity and passion or as it used to be called, getting stuck in. Standing off isn't an option. Looking at Kerry against Tyrone, they sat deep, but they made bloody sure they were breathing down their necks, getting a hand or foot in to get the ball away and making life very uncomfortable for the Tyrone forwards who were playing with their back to goal and not able to get turned. Contrast that to us sitting, 2 or more yards off and letting them play in front of us. The other thing I thought hurt us badly against Monaghan was just not enough movement from our forwards when we were trying to break them down. There were times when we needed somebody to break away from their marker and try a run in behind into space for a quick ball over the top of the defender. It just wasn't happening enough.

All in all a very frustrating feel to the season and a sense that we've let key matches slip through our fingers. A lot of unknowns now looking forward to next year. Unfortunately unless you're a Kerry or Dublin most seasons end in pain for their supporters. Our's is at the higher end of the pain spectrum because of the nature of the defeats and the feeling that there is an Ulster in this team. I don't think Derry and Monaghan are particularly great (in terms of AI potential) or any better than us, and the semi finals will be as far as they can go. But the nagging feeling will be that we could and should have beaten both of them this year.

That sort of honest in-depth analysis doesn't cut it on the board any more Mike.  We're fecking useless, over-hyped media myths.

OK lads. Hands up.  Derry are miles better than Armagh. Probably by about 10 points.  Christ on a bike.

Are Armagh still unbeaten if she goes to pens?

No, we were beaten by Tyrone.

A few thoughts on the Armagh v Galway game.
Galway definitely need Comer in there. Walsh hasn't been the same player this year.
Armagh are a better rounded team without O'Neill!

Having just watched that video clip of the double punch, who ever that was will find themselves lucky if they don't get a retrospective red car and rightly so.
Dirty action.

It's really hard to like this Armagh side, too many boys running about like cubs looking a row outside a nightclub.
I still think if they focused more on the football they'd be a much better side as there are some excellent footballers there.

Most of us in Armagh couldn't care less if we are liked or not by the other counties .

It seems to be mostly Derry and Tyrone posters coming to the conclusion that they don't like us.......hardly surprising.

Are there many Derry ones who don't like Armagh? Personally I don't mind them. We have a lot in common namely our severe hatred of Tyrone!

I wasn't aware of any ill feeling between the counties but we've a few Derry ones on here spending a lot of their time giving us stick.......suppose it's better than being ignored. Hope they're giving out about us for another few weeks yet.

A few thoughts on the Armagh v Galway game.
Galway definitely need Comer in there. Walsh hasn't been the same player this year.
Armagh are a better rounded team without O'Neill!

Having just watched that video clip of the double punch, who ever that was will find themselves lucky if they don't get a retrospective red car and rightly so.
Dirty action.

It's really hard to like this Armagh side, too many boys running about like cubs looking a row outside a nightclub.
I still think if they focused more on the football they'd be a much better side as there are some excellent footballers there.

Most of us in Armagh couldn't care less if we are liked or not by the other counties .

It seems to be mostly Derry and Tyrone posters coming to the conclusion that they don't like us.......hardly surprising.

https://twitter.com/bennytierney/status/1670568213141176321

Not great viewing... I can't make out which player threw the box??

It's number 4 - Forker. They never learn. Not a likeable team under McGeeney.

It'll probably be treated the same way as McGuigan's bite on O'Neill.........

Armagh appealing that red card is ridiculous.

Your fascination with all things Armagh should be the subject of a thesis.

[14 scores to 12, not that impressive.]

The manner in which Armagh beat Down should frighten this Derry team a bit. 4 goals. Gallagher might need to make some adjustments because if it becomes a scoring match Armagh have better quality up front.

At least it should be a much better quality game than last year's snooze-fest of a final!

Putting my doubts aside Ill go Derry by 2.

14 scores to 12, not that impressive.
2 of the goals were fortunate, one a mis hit shot that dropped short.
Ok, conditions were poor which would have affected both sets of forwards and the armagh defence shut down out, but remember down were missing a few from u20s as well.

I haven't seen anything from armagh this year to suggest they have better forwards or defence.
But I could be wrong.

What I think will happen is that armagh will be able to keep it tight by being overly physical. But I think, or maybe hope, well have too much for armagh in terms of players and tactics.

You do realise that it's 3 points for a goal and it doesn't matter how they are scored. A goal from a high ball is still a goal and Derry have struggled badly defensively conceding 8 goals in their last 3 matches. Armagh will test them much more than Fermanagh and Monaghan defensively.

It's no exaggeration to say that Dublin could have scored 7 or 8 against them in the League final and for me Derry haven't improved since last year. I don't think Armagh have either though based on what we've seen to date this season and neither side are AI contenders imo. It will be close and there is no real form guide or recent history between the sides but both sides will be confident and I'd expect it to go down to the wire.

Derry haven't improved from last year??

Jesus a blind man can see the improvement! That's not to say we'll
win Ulster but to say we haven't improved is ridiculous. We got out of Div 2 this year have beaten the Dubs and massively upped our scoring average so I'd say that's a fair improvement.

Improvement from year to year is all you can ask. I don't think we're winning an All Ireland this year but after 2 years of Div 1 and Sam Maguire competition I expect us to win another!

It's all a matter of opinion but in looking better offensively Derry have also looked more vulnerable defensively. Whether that constitutes improvement or not is open to opinion but in their biggest test to date in Croke Park against the Dubs they were cut apart. In their defence they were missing McKaigue and Glass went off injured but it ended up a one sided affair.

I'm not sure why Derry fans are taking such umbrage at people questioning their credentials. Let's wait and see at the end of the season though when this improvement will be easier to measure. If Derry get to an AI final or show signs of progression against a Kerry, Dublin or Galway in the knock out stages I'll have to change my opinion.

Not taking umbridge, just curious re Armagh fans confidence. Derry, current Ulster champions and promoted into Div 1, Armagh's credentials, relegated and this same group of players being talked up haven't had a sniff of Ulster...

In the match itself, going on the last 2 years, head says Derry, heart says, anything can happen on the day.

We competed well with the best teams in Ireland throughout the league.  Arrogance in abundance from both sets of posters here. Normally pre-match banter. Nothing more. Derry rightfully favourites.  Armagh have the better attack but Derry the better midfield and defence.  I think Armagh's chances hinge on the fitness of Andrew Murnin (never a good place to be!). 

Itchy's hard on for Armagh will reach new heights over the next two weeks. He's off and running already.