America`s Gun Culture

[Eamonnca1]

The way Beto and co are trying to energize their campaigns off the back of these shootings is really sick , again the end game for the dems and the news networks is to make sure trump is not re-elected
Also I am in favor of banning any automatic weapons being sold to the public

Would you prefer them to say nothing about it?

[Chicago Hurling]

The way Beto and co are trying to energize their campaigns off the back of these shootings is really sick , again the end game for the dems and the news networks is to make sure trump is not re-elected
Also I am in favor of banning any automatic weapons being sold to the public

To be fair change is made by emotion. Were you sickened when Bush used 9/11 as a reason to invade Afghanistan? It's terrorism, it's time people stop splitting hairs between domestic homegrown terrorists vs how it's ok to invade more than 2 nations because we want to fight terrorism.

[J70]

The way Beto and co are trying to energize their campaigns off the back of these shootings is really sick , again the end game for the dems and the news networks is to make sure trump is not re-elected
Also I am in favor of banning any automatic weapons being sold to the public

Beto is from El Paso FFS. Now is exactly the time for him to stand up and make his mark and show some leadership, especially against the cynical and morally and intellectually bankrupt stance of the GOP and NRA on this issue. And Trump's appalling rhetoric and policies when it comes to those targeted there.

[sid waddell]

The way Beto and co are trying to energize their campaigns off the back of these shootings is really sick , again the end game for the dems and the news networks is to make sure trump is not re-elected
Also I am in favor of banning any automatic weapons being sold to the public

Beto is from El Paso FFS. Now is exactly the time for him to stand up and make his mark and show some leadership, especially against the cynical and morally and intellectually bankrupt stance of the GOP and NRA on this issue. And Trump's appalling rhetoric and policies when it comes to those targeted there.

There's more decency and human empathy in one of Beto O'Rourke's toe clippings than there is in the entire Republican party.

[easytiger95]

Can I just make the point (and I have made this one before, specifically) that Whitey's argument is that our perception of America having a gun crisis is erroneous because

1. Mass murder victims are a vanishingly small part of the ocean of gun victims in America
2. White people generally don't have to worry about random shootings, it only really happens in black and coloured areas
3. The murder rate in his town is less than Dublin's and other cities in Ireland...so there.

And I would respond as follows

1. Mass murders are merely the most visible symptoms of a huge psychosis at the heart of the American state - banning of guns would not only greatly decrease mass shootings, it would greatly decrease deaths by suicide and deaths in the commission of felonies.

2. This point is racist at its heart and deeply illogical - when you are talking about the rate of gun violence in a country, you don't get to go "well it is only happening to certain races and in certain areas" - because, surprise, surprise, those black and brown people are human as well, with the same intrinsic rights as those middle class whites holed up in suburban Mass. The blackest joke of our age is a political party calling itself Republican without any true insight into what that term actually means. "But I don't support Trump etc etc.." Shut the fcuk up.

3. Given his penchant for anecdotal evidence, I've been in the rundown areas of American cities, and I've been in the white middle class areas - and, without exception, the guys you have to watch out for are young, white, middle class males - especially the ones claiming to be Irish.

Someday I'll figure out what leads people to disgrace themselves on discussion boards.

[whitey]

Can I just make the point (and I have made this one before, specifically) that Whitey's argument is that our perception of America having a gun crisis is erroneous because

1. Mass murder victims are a vanishingly small part of the ocean of gun victims in America
2. White people generally don't have to worry about random shootings, it only really happens in black and coloured areas
3. The murder rate in his town is less than Dublin's and other cities in Ireland...so there.

And I would respond as follows

1. Mass murders are merely the most visible symptoms of a huge psychosis at the heart of the American state - banning of guns would not only greatly decrease mass shootings, it would greatly decrease deaths by suicide and deaths in the commission of felonies.

2. This point is racist at its heart and deeply illogical - when you are talking about the rate of gun violence in a country, you don't get to go "well it is only happening to certain races and in certain areas" - because, surprise, surprise, those black and brown people are human as well, with the same intrinsic rights as those middle class whites holed up in suburban Mass. The blackest joke of our age is a political party calling itself Republican without any true insight into what that term actually means. "But I don't support Trump etc etc.." Shut the fcuk up.

3. Given his penchant for anecdotal evidence, I've been in the rundown areas of American cities, and I've been in the white middle class areas - and, without exception, the guys you have to watch out for are young, white, middle class males - especially the ones claiming to be Irish.

Someday I'll figure out what leads people to disgrace themselves on discussion boards.

You're completely missing my point (probably intentionally)

(1) You could never "ban guns" because it's written in the constitution that people have the right to bear arms. Whether you agree or disagree with that interpretation that's a whole other discussion. You could ban every automatic weapon in the country and the overall "gun death rate" per 100,000 would probably decrease by a rounding error because the vast majority of deaths are via handguns.

(2) I have a background in statistics and  I'm merely pointing out that average statistics do not paint an accurate picture of what actually happens in real life. The town I grew up in Ireland is caught up in a traveler feud, and there have been 4/5 shootings and one murder in the past 3 years. If you looked at the statistics for that town or county (because there's other local towns caught up in it) you'd be scared to set foot in the place, but when you know the back story the average statistics become meaningless.

(3) I would generally  agree with you on point number 3.

[trailer]

Can I just make the point (and I have made this one before, specifically) that Whitey's argument is that our perception of America having a gun crisis is erroneous because

1. Mass murder victims are a vanishingly small part of the ocean of gun victims in America
2. White people generally don't have to worry about random shootings, it only really happens in black and coloured areas
3. The murder rate in his town is less than Dublin's and other cities in Ireland...so there.

And I would respond as follows

1. Mass murders are merely the most visible symptoms of a huge psychosis at the heart of the American state - banning of guns would not only greatly decrease mass shootings, it would greatly decrease deaths by suicide and deaths in the commission of felonies.

2. This point is racist at its heart and deeply illogical - when you are talking about the rate of gun violence in a country, you don't get to go "well it is only happening to certain races and in certain areas" - because, surprise, surprise, those black and brown people are human as well, with the same intrinsic rights as those middle class whites holed up in suburban Mass. The blackest joke of our age is a political party calling itself Republican without any true insight into what that term actually means. "But I don't support Trump etc etc.." Shut the fcuk up.

3. Given his penchant for anecdotal evidence, I've been in the rundown areas of American cities, and I've been in the white middle class areas - and, without exception, the guys you have to watch out for are young, white, middle class males - especially the ones claiming to be Irish.

Someday I'll figure out what leads people to disgrace themselves on discussion boards.

You're completely missing my point (probably intentionally)

(1) You could never "ban guns" because it's written in the constitution that people have the right to bear arms. Whether you agree or disagree with that interpretation that's a whole other discussion. You could ban every automatic weapon in the country and the overall "gun death rate" per 100,000 would probably decrease by a rounding error because the vast majority of deaths are via handguns.

(2) I have a background in statistics and  I'm merely pointing out that average statistics do not paint an accurate picture of what actually happens in real life. The town I grew up in Ireland is caught up in a traveler feud, and there have been 4/5 shootings and one murder in the past 3 years. If you looked at the statistics for that town or county (because there's other local towns caught up in it) you'd be scared to set foot in the place, but when you know the back story the average statistics become meaningless.

(3) I would generally  agree with you on point number 3.

f**k you talk some shite whitey.

[johnnycool]

Can I just make the point (and I have made this one before, specifically) that Whitey's argument is that our perception of America having a gun crisis is erroneous because

1. Mass murder victims are a vanishingly small part of the ocean of gun victims in America
2. White people generally don't have to worry about random shootings, it only really happens in black and coloured areas
3. The murder rate in his town is less than Dublin's and other cities in Ireland...so there.

And I would respond as follows

1. Mass murders are merely the most visible symptoms of a huge psychosis at the heart of the American state - banning of guns would not only greatly decrease mass shootings, it would greatly decrease deaths by suicide and deaths in the commission of felonies.

2. This point is racist at its heart and deeply illogical - when you are talking about the rate of gun violence in a country, you don't get to go "well it is only happening to certain races and in certain areas" - because, surprise, surprise, those black and brown people are human as well, with the same intrinsic rights as those middle class whites holed up in suburban Mass. The blackest joke of our age is a political party calling itself Republican without any true insight into what that term actually means. "But I don't support Trump etc etc.." Shut the fcuk up.

3. Given his penchant for anecdotal evidence, I've been in the rundown areas of American cities, and I've been in the white middle class areas - and, without exception, the guys you have to watch out for are young, white, middle class males - especially the ones claiming to be Irish.

Someday I'll figure out what leads people to disgrace themselves on discussion boards.

You're completely missing my point (probably intentionally)

(1) You could never "ban guns" because it's written in the constitution that people have the right to bear arms. Whether you agree or disagree with that interpretation that's a whole other discussion. You could ban every automatic weapon in the country and the overall "gun death rate" per 100,000 would probably decrease by a rounding error because the vast majority of deaths are via handguns.

(2) I have a background in statistics and  I'm merely pointing out that average statistics do not paint an accurate picture of what actually happens in real life. The town I grew up in Ireland is caught up in a traveler feud, and there have been 4/5 shootings and one murder in the past 3 years. If you looked at the statistics for that town or county (because there's other local towns caught up in it) you'd be scared to set foot in the place, but when you know the back story the average statistics become meaningless.

(3) I would generally  agree with you on point number 3.

Is it not an amendment to the constitution?

[easytiger95]

Can I just make the point (and I have made this one before, specifically) that Whitey's argument is that our perception of America having a gun crisis is erroneous because

1. Mass murder victims are a vanishingly small part of the ocean of gun victims in America
2. White people generally don't have to worry about random shootings, it only really happens in black and coloured areas
3. The murder rate in his town is less than Dublin's and other cities in Ireland...so there.

And I would respond as follows

1. Mass murders are merely the most visible symptoms of a huge psychosis at the heart of the American state - banning of guns would not only greatly decrease mass shootings, it would greatly decrease deaths by suicide and deaths in the commission of felonies.

2. This point is racist at its heart and deeply illogical - when you are talking about the rate of gun violence in a country, you don't get to go "well it is only happening to certain races and in certain areas" - because, surprise, surprise, those black and brown people are human as well, with the same intrinsic rights as those middle class whites holed up in suburban Mass. The blackest joke of our age is a political party calling itself Republican without any true insight into what that term actually means. "But I don't support Trump etc etc.." Shut the fcuk up.

3. Given his penchant for anecdotal evidence, I've been in the rundown areas of American cities, and I've been in the white middle class areas - and, without exception, the guys you have to watch out for are young, white, middle class males - especially the ones claiming to be Irish.

Someday I'll figure out what leads people to disgrace themselves on discussion boards.

You're completely missing my point (probably intentionally)

(1) You could never "ban guns" because it's written in the constitution that people have the right to bear arms. Whether you agree or disagree with that interpretation that's a whole other discussion. You could ban every automatic weapon in the country and the overall "gun death rate" per 100,000 would probably decrease by a rounding error because the vast majority of deaths are via handguns.

(2) I have a background in statistics and  I'm merely pointing out that average statistics do not paint an accurate picture of what actually happens in your real life. The town I grew up in Ireland is caught up in a traveler feud, and there have been 4/5 shootings and one murder in the past 3 years. If you looked at the statistics for that town or county (because there's other local towns caught up in it) you'd be scared to set foot in the place, but when you know the back story the average statistics become meaningless.

(3) I would generally  agree with you on point number 3.

That is the point Whitey - check back your posts. Just because you claim violence happens outside your little white enclave, it doesn't give you the right to down play it or dismiss it as not part of real life. These victims, whether Hispanics in El Paso, whites in Dayton, or black on any given night in down trodden urban centres, are all Americans, mostly citizens of your Republic, with the same basic rights as any other humans. Your failure to empathise with them is, at its core, racist.

And please don't hide behind your "background" in stats, because it is obviously piss poor. Your example of a traveller feud is not applicable as we are measuring long term trends not one-off spikes, and your insistence on measuring gun violence set against the relative peace in your town, rather than against a countrywide trend of extreme violence when set against other developed countries, would be laughed off the stage by any statistician.

As for the lack of efficacy in banning assault weapons, it took me literally 30 secs to find this https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30188421

It is a sad fact that given the level of gun violence in the States, El Paso and Dayton victims could be counted as a "rounding error" - however if the banning of assault weapons only gave back their lives alone, or maybe just the lives of Newtown, it would be worth it, wouldn't it? Even more tragic is that I have to ask you that question.

And, as pointed out, the 2nd Amendment is exactly what it says on the tin - an amendment, which can be repealed by popular consent. If it couldn't be repealed you wouldn't have the NRA and other bloodsuckers spending hundreds of millions convincing suckers like you that keeping it is central to the maintenance of democracy against tyrannies, when, in fact, it is exactly the opposite.

Poor deluded dopes.

[whitey]

Can I just make the point (and I have made this one before, specifically) that Whitey's argument is that our perception of America having a gun crisis is erroneous because

1. Mass murder victims are a vanishingly small part of the ocean of gun victims in America
2. White people generally don't have to worry about random shootings, it only really happens in black and coloured areas
3. The murder rate in his town is less than Dublin's and other cities in Ireland...so there.

And I would respond as follows

1. Mass murders are merely the most visible symptoms of a huge psychosis at the heart of the American state - banning of guns would not only greatly decrease mass shootings, it would greatly decrease deaths by suicide and deaths in the commission of felonies.

2. This point is racist at its heart and deeply illogical - when you are talking about the rate of gun violence in a country, you don't get to go "well it is only happening to certain races and in certain areas" - because, surprise, surprise, those black and brown people are human as well, with the same intrinsic rights as those middle class whites holed up in suburban Mass. The blackest joke of our age is a political party calling itself Republican without any true insight into what that term actually means. "But I don't support Trump etc etc.." Shut the fcuk up.

3. Given his penchant for anecdotal evidence, I've been in the rundown areas of American cities, and I've been in the white middle class areas - and, without exception, the guys you have to watch out for are young, white, middle class males - especially the ones claiming to be Irish.

Someday I'll figure out what leads people to disgrace themselves on discussion boards.

You're completely missing my point (probably intentionally)

(1) You could never "ban guns" because it's written in the constitution that people have the right to bear arms. Whether you agree or disagree with that interpretation that's a whole other discussion. You could ban every automatic weapon in the country and the overall "gun death rate" per 100,000 would probably decrease by a rounding error because the vast majority of deaths are via handguns.

(2) I have a background in statistics and  I'm merely pointing out that average statistics do not paint an accurate picture of what actually happens in your real life. The town I grew up in Ireland is caught up in a traveler feud, and there have been 4/5 shootings and one murder in the past 3 years. If you looked at the statistics for that town or county (because there's other local towns caught up in it) you'd be scared to set foot in the place, but when you know the back story the average statistics become meaningless.

(3) I would generally  agree with you on point number 3.

That is the point Whitey - check back your posts. Just because you claim violence happens outside your little white enclave, it doesn't give you the right to down play it or dismiss it as not part of real life. These victims, whether Hispanics in El Paso, whites in Dayton, or black on any given night in down trodden urban centres, are all Americans, mostly citizens of your Republic, with the same basic rights as any other humans. Your failure to empathise with them is, at its core, racist.

And please don't hide behind your "background" in stats, because it is obviously piss poor. Your example of a traveller feud is not applicable as we are measuring long term trends not one-off spikes, and your insistence on measuring gun violence set against the relative peace in your town, rather than against a countrywide trend of extreme violence when set against other developed countries, would be laughed off the stage by any statistician.

As for the lack of efficacy in banning assault weapons, it took me literally 30 secs to find this https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30188421

It is a sad fact that given the level of gun violence in the States, El Paso and Dayton victims could be counted as a "rounding error" - however if the banning of assault weapons only gave back their lives alone, or maybe just the lives of Newtown, it would be worth it, wouldn't it? Even more tragic is that I have to ask you that question.

And, as pointed out, the 2nd Amendment is exactly what it says on the tin - an amendment, which can be repealed by popular consent. If it couldn't be repealed you wouldn't have the NRA and other bloodsuckers spending hundreds of millions convincing suckers like you that keeping it is central to the maintenance of democracy against tyrannies, when, in fact, it is exactly the opposite.

Poor deluded dopes.

Who said I dont emphatize with them?

If you glommed the crime statistics of Blanchardstown/Tallaght together with those of Foxrock and came up with an average, Im sure it would make for very scary reading for the residents of Foxrock.


Where did I say I you couldnt ban assault weapons...they were banned before and Im in favor of them being banned again. I said, if you bother to read what I wrote, is that assault weapons count for a very small percentage of all firearm related deaths.

If you think the second amendment will be repealed, good for you. Im sure it makes you feel better

[easytiger95]

I say you don't empathize with them, after reading your posts.

Where did I say I you couldnt ban assault weapons - I didn't say you said that - I pointed out that you said banning them wouldn't bring down the statistics. You could ban every automatic weapon in the country and the overall "gun death rate" per 100,000 would probably decrease by a rounding error because the vast majority of deaths are via handguns. You should try reading yourself. Especially the report I linked to where it makes very clear that it makes a real, measurable difference to get rid of assault weapons, not a rounding error.


If you glommed the crime statistics of Blanchardstown/Tallaght together with those of Foxrock and came up with an average, Im sure it would make for very scary reading for the residents of Foxrock.
That's not how national statistics work. Which is what we are talking about. But you know how spoofing works, very well. Because you live in Foxrock and you don't give a fcuk about anyone else.


If you think the second amendment will be repealed, good for you. Im sure it makes you feel better

I didn't say that it would, I merely pointed out that it could be, hence the spending of the NRA and gun lobby. But why stop spoofing now? What makes me feel better is knowing that I'm not like you.

[whitey]

I say you don't empathize with them, after reading your posts.

Where did I say I you couldnt ban assault weapons - I didn't say you said that - I pointed out that you said banning them wouldn't bring down the statistics. You could ban every automatic weapon in the country and the overall "gun death rate" per 100,000 would probably decrease by a rounding error because the vast majority of deaths are via handguns. You should try reading yourself. Especially the report I linked to where it makes very clear that it makes a real, measurable difference to get rid of assault weapons, not a rounding error.


If you glommed the crime statistics of Blanchardstown/Tallaght together with those of Foxrock and came up with an average, Im sure it would make for very scary reading for the residents of Foxrock.
That's not how national statistics work. Which is what we are talking about. But you know how spoofing works, very well. Because you live in Foxrock and you don't give a fcuk about anyone else.


If you think the second amendment will be repealed, good for you. Im sure it makes you feel better

I didn't say that it would, I merely pointed out that it could be, hence the spending of the NRA and gun lobby. But why stop spoofing now? What makes me feel better is knowing that I'm not like you.

That's the best news I have heard all day

The tone in here actually goes a long way towards explaining how Trump got elected (and very well may get re-elected). And I didn't even vote for him-I voted for Jill stein-lol

Disagree with me and you're a racist  and a white supremacist.

Got news for you though, over here there's just as many of me as there are of you. People who work hard, obey the law, pay our taxes, contribute to our communities and raise our families. Yes, I have  sympathy and empathy for those less well off than myself, but I can't solve the worlds problems and  like the ongoing traveler feud, some people are just beyond redemptiin

[easytiger95]

I say you don't empathize with them, after reading your posts.

Where did I say I you couldnt ban assault weapons - I didn't say you said that - I pointed out that you said banning them wouldn't bring down the statistics. You could ban every automatic weapon in the country and the overall "gun death rate" per 100,000 would probably decrease by a rounding error because the vast majority of deaths are via handguns. You should try reading yourself. Especially the report I linked to where it makes very clear that it makes a real, measurable difference to get rid of assault weapons, not a rounding error.


If you glommed the crime statistics of Blanchardstown/Tallaght together with those of Foxrock and came up with an average, Im sure it would make for very scary reading for the residents of Foxrock.
That's not how national statistics work. Which is what we are talking about. But you know how spoofing works, very well. Because you live in Foxrock and you don't give a fcuk about anyone else.


If you think the second amendment will be repealed, good for you. Im sure it makes you feel better

I didn't say that it would, I merely pointed out that it could be, hence the spending of the NRA and gun lobby. But why stop spoofing now? What makes me feel better is knowing that I'm not like you.

That's the best news I have heard all day

The tone in here actually goes a long way towards explaining how Trump got elected (and very well may get re-elected). And I didn't even vote for him-I voted for Jill stein-lol

Disagree with me and you're a racist  and a white supremacist.

Got news for you though, over here there's just as many of me as there are of you. People who work hard, obey the law, pay our taxes, contribute to our communities and raise our families. Yes, I have  sympathy and empathy for those less well off than myself, but I can't solve the worlds problems and like the ongoing traveler feud, some people are just beyond redemptiin

Says it all. Pathetic.

[Eamonnca1]

The US constitution has been amended over 25 times, it can be amended again. It took a while to figure out that the prohibition of alcohol was a wrong turn and they were able to change their minds about that. The gun nuts are determined to push guns into the hands of terrorists and the mentally ill. If they keep it up for much longer then repealing 2A will become a lot easier. It would help if the Democrats would stop parroting the "I respect the second amendment" bullsh1t. It's ink on a page, poorly worded at that, and has not earned any respect.

[whitey]

I say you don't empathize with them, after reading your posts.

Where did I say I you couldnt ban assault weapons - I didn't say you said that - I pointed out that you said banning them wouldn't bring down the statistics. You could ban every automatic weapon in the country and the overall "gun death rate" per 100,000 would probably decrease by a rounding error because the vast majority of deaths are via handguns. You should try reading yourself. Especially the report I linked to where it makes very clear that it makes a real, measurable difference to get rid of assault weapons, not a rounding error.


If you glommed the crime statistics of Blanchardstown/Tallaght together with those of Foxrock and came up with an average, Im sure it would make for very scary reading for the residents of Foxrock.
That's not how national statistics work. Which is what we are talking about. But you know how spoofing works, very well. Because you live in Foxrock and you don't give a fcuk about anyone else.


If you think the second amendment will be repealed, good for you. Im sure it makes you feel better

I didn't say that it would, I merely pointed out that it could be, hence the spending of the NRA and gun lobby. But why stop spoofing now? What makes me feel better is knowing that I'm not like you.

That's the best news I have heard all day

The tone in here actually goes a long way towards explaining how Trump got elected (and very well may get re-elected). And I didn't even vote for him-I voted for Jill stein-lol

Disagree with me and you're a racist  and a white supremacist.

Got news for you though, over here there's just as many of me as there are of you. People who work hard, obey the law, pay our taxes, contribute to our communities and raise our families. Yes, I have  sympathy and empathy for those less well off than myself, but I can't solve the worlds problems and like the ongoing traveler feud, some people are just beyond redemptiin

Says it all. Pathetic.

You quote national gun statistics, but we don't just have National gun laws, we also have State Gun Laws. This leads to enormous disparities between states in terms of who has access to guns. The states with the strictest laws typically have the lowest number of deaths (although there are some exceptions). National statistics are meaningless in this discussion because there are essentially 50 different sets of laws