Down Club Hurling & Football

[Smurfy123]

Johhny why do a lot of lads not play development squad football?
Genuine question

[manwithnoplan]

Tell me this. Do you reckon lumping the ball in from 60 yards repeatedly a la 'the great Down v Derry game' (DJ Kane main culprit) is a better way of playing football than how it is played now? Because I tell you what, I watched that game recently and it wasn't exactly pretty on the eye.

No definitely not, but there is a happy medium where a diagonal ball in to a forward who knows when to make decent runs should surely be an option. Players these days are coached from younger ages, and should have the ability to aim a kick pass (even 30/40 yards) in to a forward who has learned when and where to make the runs.

[Truth hurts]

Loughisland were set up defensively against The Point and vice versa, which resulted in it being a shite game.
The Point had nobody upfront capable of taking on his man and aside from your number 14 Loughinisland were the same.

The only way it changes and it will, is a rule change because Today's Players have become robots that lack the flair or audacity to take on a percentage risk that may change a game.

I don't think it will take a rule change - just a manager somewhere to set their team out to play. I hear the county minor trials are up and running.  20 chopped from trials already which is very unfair. If ur a lad playing in the U17 C championship and are knocked out in round 2 - that was July. How are you expected to have any level of fitness 2/3 months later to compete with lads who played in the A championship at semi final or final stage. Surely making contact with schools to see what players are worth a look at would serve the purpose better. College, Abbey, St Malachys Castlewellan, St Joes, Red High, Banbridge, Acquines, all have teachers/coaches who actually care about the GAA ethos in their school and could provide Benny/Darren with information they require.

If you're an U17C football player who last played in July and had county minors aspirations, why didn't you try to maintain your level of fitness for two or three months when you knew trials were coming up?
I'm going to venture a bet that county football and county lifestyle  aren't for you.

[manwithnoplan]

Loughisland were set up defensively against The Point and vice versa, which resulted in it being a shite game.
The Point had nobody upfront capable of taking on his man and aside from your number 14 Loughinisland were the same.

The only way it changes and it will, is a rule change because Today's Players have become robots that lack the flair or audacity to take on a percentage risk that may change a game.

I don't think it will take a rule change - just a manager somewhere to set their team out to play. I hear the county minor trials are up and running.  20 chopped from trials already which is very unfair. If ur a lad playing in the U17 C championship and are knocked out in round 2 - that was July. How are you expected to have any level of fitness 2/3 months later to compete with lads who played in the A championship at semi final or final stage. Surely making contact with schools to see what players are worth a look at would serve the purpose better. College, Abbey, St Malachys Castlewellan, St Joes, Red High, Banbridge, Acquines, all have teachers/coaches who actually care about the GAA ethos in their school and could provide Benny/Darren with information they require.

If you're an U17C football player who last played in July and had county minors aspirations, why didn't you try to maintain your level of fitness for two or three months when you knew trials were coming up?
I'm going to venture a bet that county football and county lifestyle  aren't for you.

You could look at it like that, or you could have more sense and realise that under 17's have many other things going on in life and the likelihood of them maintaining playing levels of fitness for 3 months without actually having games is a fairly ridiculous thought to have. Bearing in mind seasoned senior footballers take a few games to regain sharpness after a new season starts, you expect under 17's to hit the ground running in a match environment after a 3 month break?

[Brick Tamlin]

Tell me this. Do you reckon lumping the ball in from 60 yards repeatedly a la 'the great Down v Derry game' (DJ Kane main culprit) is a better way of playing football than how it is played now? Because I tell you what, I watched that game recently and it wasn't exactly pretty on the eye.

Who suggested lumping the ball in from 60 yards was a better way to play.
Lets be honest, football is shite nowadays for a variety of reasons and a huge responsibility lies at the feet of ego-driven coaches/managers and those that appoint them.

[rosskarr]

Loughisland were set up defensively against The Point and vice versa, which resulted in it being a shite game.
The Point had nobody upfront capable of taking on his man and aside from your number 14 Loughinisland were the same.

The only way it changes and it will, is a rule change because Today's Players have become robots that lack the flair or audacity to take on a percentage risk that may change a game.

I don't think it will take a rule change - just a manager somewhere to set their team out to play. I hear the county minor trials are up and running.  20 chopped from trials already which is very unfair. If ur a lad playing in the U17 C championship and are knocked out in round 2 - that was July. How are you expected to have any level of fitness 2/3 months later to compete with lads who played in the A championship at semi final or final stage. Surely making contact with schools to see what players are worth a look at would serve the purpose better. College, Abbey, St Malachys Castlewellan, St Joes, Red High, Banbridge, Acquines, all have teachers/coaches who actually care about the GAA ethos in their school and could provide Benny/Darren with information they require.

Your boy one of the 20 chopped?

[Truth hurts]

Tell me this. Do you reckon lumping the ball in from 60 yards repeatedly a la 'the great Down v Derry game' (DJ Kane main culprit) is a better way of playing football than how it is played now? Because I tell you what, I watched that game recently and it wasn't exactly pretty on the eye.

Who suggested lumping the ball in from 60 yards was a better way to play.
Lets be honest, football is shite nowadays for a variety of reasons and a huge responsibility lies at the feet of ego-driven coaches/managers and those that appoint them.

A huge responsibilty lies with the suits in Croke park-the rule makers

Bring in rules like kicking it out past the 45 so no short kickouts, no pass back to the keeper, his job is to stop goals and kick the ball out, and once you go past your half way line you cannot play the ball back.

[Oglach]

Tell me this. Do you reckon lumping the ball in from 60 yards repeatedly a la 'the great Down v Derry game' (DJ Kane main culprit) is a better way of playing football than how it is played now? Because I tell you what, I watched that game recently and it wasn't exactly pretty on the eye.

Who suggested lumping the ball in from 60 yards was a better way to play.
Lets be honest, football is shite nowadays for a variety of reasons and a huge responsibility lies at the feet of ego-driven coaches/managers and those that appoint them.

A huge responsibilty lies with the suits in Croke park-the rule makers

Bring in rules like kicking it out past the 45 so no short kickouts, no pass back to the keeper, his job is to stop goals and kick the ball out, and once you go past your half way line you cannot play the ball back.
I agree with an earlier post stating that perhaps nostalgia gets in the way when viewing football matches in the past. Looking at scores in match programmes down through the 70s & 80s many matches never reached double digit scores.
If you're going to bring in rules that make it illegal to come back across your half way line there has to be an incentive, like allowing hand passed goals again.
Why did they do away with hand pass goals anyhow?

[Hard2Listen2]

Tell me this. Do you reckon lumping the ball in from 60 yards repeatedly a la 'the great Down v Derry game' (DJ Kane main culprit) is a better way of playing football than how it is played now? Because I tell you what, I watched that game recently and it wasn't exactly pretty on the eye.

Who suggested lumping the ball in from 60 yards was a better way to play.
Lets be honest, football is shite nowadays for a variety of reasons and a huge responsibility lies at the feet of ego-driven coaches/managers and those that appoint them.

A huge responsibilty lies with the suits in Croke park-the rule makers

Bring in rules like kicking it out past the 45 so no short kickouts, no pass back to the keeper, his job is to stop goals and kick the ball out, and once you go past your half way line you cannot play the ball back.

These 'suits' get into these positions by being club volunteers, club committee members, county board delegates, county board officers, Ulster & Central delegates, ....

There is a pathway open to any club member to these positions.
It's not like the English FA or the IRFU with its old boys network!

Get involved with your club & you can be part of the process instead of preaching & criticising. 

[bigarsedkeeper]

Tell me this. Do you reckon lumping the ball in from 60 yards repeatedly a la 'the great Down v Derry game' (DJ Kane main culprit) is a better way of playing football than how it is played now? Because I tell you what, I watched that game recently and it wasn't exactly pretty on the eye.

Who suggested lumping the ball in from 60 yards was a better way to play.
Lets be honest, football is shite nowadays for a variety of reasons and a huge responsibility lies at the feet of ego-driven coaches/managers and those that appoint them.

A huge responsibilty lies with the suits in Croke park-the rule makers

Bring in rules like kicking it out past the 45 so no short kickouts, no pass back to the keeper, his job is to stop goals and kick the ball out, and once you go past your half way line you cannot play the ball back.
I agree with an earlier post stating that perhaps nostalgia gets in the way when viewing football matches in the past. Looking at scores in match programmes down through the 70s & 80s many matches never reached double digit scores.
If you're going to bring in rules that make it illegal to come back across your half way line there has to be an incentive, like allowing hand passed goals again.
Why did they do away with hand pass goals anyhow?

It looks like nothing. No skill involved at all. The last thing you want to encourage at the minute is less kicking. I'd ban palming the ball in the net too, most dunk it so it's basically a throw.

[Lucifer]

While there's no doubt at all that Island are an infinitely more positive team since Jody Gormley was replaced, you're being a heavy touch sensitive there MR. Every team in Down football (and most of Ireland) uses long passages of skill-less ball retention as a way of minimising opposition touches, and to assist in physical recovery. Every team in Down plays regular short kick outs with no clear purpose other than to make sure their opponents don't get the ball. Every team in Down has a deficiency (and a lack of trust) in players willing to deliver 50 yards kick passes into space. Loughinisland must have been a pleasure to watch this season after 3 years of Jody's tripe, but spare us your plea.

I'm not a Down man, but this really resonated with me.  Most of the football I am watching is in Fermanagh, but I've watched football in a variety of counties over the years.  So much of the football is formulaic yet lacking any real purpose.  Players are not being developed to be intuitive or make the correct decisions, they're being developed to "not give it away" and follow the "process."  There is a real lack of trust in coaching currently, we are overanalysing, especially at club level.

[terrifictommy]

Kickout ruling wouldn't work in that guise, but hat happens when the wind prevents ball travelling over 45m or quite simply the kicker isn't fit to. Can't play ball backwards of midfield, not sure how that will achieve anything as team in possession just won't cross it u til gaps appear. A shot clock? Good luck asking referees to do that as well as manage everything else. I'm sure all options where expired and will keep being explored. The advance mark was a potential great idea if the rewards dictated it, but the person on the mark isn't maybe the best kicker. If that was tweaked to be a free that anyone could hit then that may improve the advance mark.

I think the game has to be coached and we need more coaches willing to push up on the sweeper, kick quick possession into spaces. Coach forwards back to playing as freely as early noughties. Naive maybe. Optimistic yes definitely.

[outinfront]

on kickouts:
I read an article recently saying that simply moving the kickout back into the small square would mean kicks would be airbourne for longer and this may encourage teams to press up to counteract shorter kicks as the chances of an interception are greatly increased.  Teams may then be encouraged to go longer as the risk/reward of a short kickout may no longer be worth it.  I think it said something like kicking from the square would change a kickout to a corner back on the sideline outside the 21 from c40m to c60m.  Not sure if I still have the article.

[Johnnysboys]

[/quote]
  Your boy one of the 20 chopped?
[/quote]

Nope - eldest is 14.

[Johnnysboys]

Johhny why do a lot of lads not play development squad football?
Genuine question

Society has changed a lot. The clamour of playing for a development squad doesn't appeal to some young lads, some clubs don't encourage their players to go to trials/training, and the biggest reason is because some of the lads on the squad can't get on their club team but are playing/training with the best in the county because of who they are etc. that hasn't changed in the last 20 years and won't change going forward until dads are not allowed to work with their own.